Nyarlathotep's Dungeon: Week 13

[Nephrite]

"Ahh... you can't get far in life without a little bit of stress. I suppose it was too much for you..."

Team Tonfa vs. Ramza and Vandalier Ash, 7-1
Team Captain K. vs. Ramza and Vandalier Ash, 9-0
Team Snowfire vs. Lufia 3 Gades and PC Fou Lu, 3-5

Team Tide's Matches

Floor 1: An Introduction (The Beginning)

Battle #1: FF1 Garland and PC Bowser.

Garland: I, Garland, will knock you all down
Bowser: ...What kind of insult is that, idiot?! You should say something like 'I, Lord Garland, will steal your princess!!

Battle #2: Kwanda, Humphrey and Onix

Kwanda: You won't get past us! Iron Wall Kwanda will stop you here!
Humphrey: ............yep.
Onix: ONIX ONIX!


Battle #3: Jogurt, Ramus, Euram Barrows, Big Joe, Gobi and Kelvena

Euram: While I may not have my elite guards with me any longer... I, the great Euram Barrows, will put you out of your misery! Let us go, friends!
Ramus: I need to go back to my shop...
Big Joe: I AM AWESOME!!
Kelvena: ...

Battle #4: Luna, Ricardo, SH2 Lucia and Nara

Luna: I do not wish to fight you, but I have no choice. Please, run while you still can.
Ricardo: This shall be where I sing your dirge! Adios, amigos!

Boss Battle #1: Viper Manor Lynx, PC Harle and Boss Gafgarion

Lynx: You're all fools to have entered this place. I won't let you get your grubby little hands on what awaits you at the bottom. Both of you, I expect you to help me.
Harle: Oui oui monseur Lynx.
Gafgarion: Ugh, I can't believe this... am I still getting paid?

Team Captain K. and Team Tonfa's matches

Floor 3b: Multiples (Before Midgame)

"So you want to try multiple foes? Let's see how you like this, then!"

*All ST is MT for this floor. ALL of it.

Battle #11: Nino

Nino: I'm sorry... I just can't let you through here.

Battle #12: Alakazam and Chansey

Pokemon Trainer:  GO, ALAKAZAM! DON'T GIVE UP, CHANSEY!

Battle #13: Flik, Viktor and Edge (S3)

Flik: Hmph, this isn't even worthy of us.
Viktor: Ha ha! Let's go... we'll show these kids!
Edge: Umm... I don't think this is such a great idea.

Battle #14: Alma and Nils

Alma: I will protect my brother no matter what!
Nils: I'm not her brother, but she seems to think I am.

Boss Battle #3: Dhoulmagus and Tidus

Dhoulmagus: What a pity... to have to fight me!
Tidus: This is MY story!


Team Tide | Sasarai (TER), Ephraim, Garnet, Arnaud, Duran
[Floor 1]
Team Tide vs. FF1 Garland and PC Bowser
Team Tide vs. Kwanda, Onix, Humphrey and Leo (S3)
Team Tide vs. Jogurt, Ramus, Euram Barrows, Big Joe, Gobi, Kelvena
Team Tide vs. Luna, Ricardo, Lucia (SH2), Nara
Team Tide vs. Boss Lynx, PC Harle and Boss Gafgarion

Team Tonfa | Cloud, Chemist, Aika, FFX-2 Songstress
[Floor 3b]
[Materia: Cover (M), Revive (M), Barrier]
*All ST is MT
Team Tonfa vs. Nino
Team Tonfa vs. Alakazam and Chansey
Team Tonfa vs. Flik, Viktor, Edge (S3)
Team Tonfa vs. Alma and Nils
Team Tonfa vs. Dhoulmagus and Tidus (w/ Caladbolg)

Team Captain K. | Kyogre, Gau, FF5 Redmage, Marcus, Mint
[Floor 3b]
*All ST is MT
Team Captain K. vs. Nino
Team Captain K. vs. Alakazam and Chansey
Team Captain K. vs. Flik, Viktor, Edge (S3)
Team Captain K. vs. Alma and Nils
Team Captain K. vs. Dhoulmagus and Tidus (w/ Caladbolg)

[Magic Fanatic]

Team Tide | Sasarai (TER), Ephraim, Garnet, Arnaud, Duran
[Floor 1]
Team Tide vs. FF1 Garland and PC Bowser
Team Tide vs. Kwanda, Onix, Humphrey and Leo (S3)
Team Tide vs. Jogurt, Ramus, Euram Barrows, Big Joe, Gobi, Kelvena
Team Tide vs. Luna, Ricardo, Lucia (SH2), Nara
Team Tide vs. Boss Lynx, PC Harle and Boss Gafgarion - I can't see Tide's team having too much of a problem here.

Team Tonfa | Cloud, Chemist, Aika, FFX-2 Songstress
[Floor 3b]
[Materia: Cover (M), Revive (M), Barrier]
*All ST is MT
Team Tonfa vs. Nino
Team Tonfa vs. Alakazam and Chansey
Team Tonfa vs. Flik, Viktor, Edge
Team Tonfa vs. Alma and Nils
Team Tonfa vs. Dhoulmagus and Tidus (w/ Caladbolg) - Talking it over with Dhyer...  Tonfa probably has the resources to deal with basically everything on this floor.  I can't find anything that would really give him problems.

Team Captain K. | Kyogre, Gau, FF5 Redmage, Marcus, Mint
[Floor 3b]
*All ST is MT
Team Captain K. vs. Nino
Team Captain K. vs. Alakazam and Chansey
Team Captain K. vs. Flik, Viktor, Edge - Flik goes first and casts Ball Lightning, hitting a weakness on Kyogre (and I'm pretty sure that kills him), and at least everyone else is heavily damaged.  Unless the FFV Red Mage is fast, Edge comes in with Swing instead of Magic Resist or Armor Protect and finishes off the Red Mage, nullifying the rest of the threat that this team has.  I'm completely open to argument however, as I'm not very sure that this is what I believe.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Team Tide | Sasarai (TER), Ephraim, Garnet, Arnaud, Duran
[Floor 1]
Team Tide vs. FF1 Garland and PC Bowser
Team Tide vs. Kwanda, Onix, Humphrey and Leo (S3)
Team Tide vs. Jogurt, Ramus, Euram Barrows, Big Joe, Gobi, Kelvena
Team Tide vs. Luna, Ricardo, Lucia (SH2), Nara
Team Tide vs. Boss Lynx, PC Harle and Boss Gafgarion - Floor 1, and the team is finely equipped to deal with it. GG.

Team Tonfa | Cloud, Chemist, Aika, FFX-2 Songstress
[Floor 3b]
[Materia: Cover (M), Revive (M), Barrier]
*All ST is MT
Team Tonfa vs. Nino
Team Tonfa vs. Alakazam and Chansey
Team Tonfa vs. Flik, Viktor, Edge
Team Tonfa vs. Alma and Nils
Team Tonfa vs. Dhoulmagus and Tidus (w/ Caladbolg) - Delta Shield saves Tonfa's ass in some of the matches here. Otherwise, Unlimited Resource Works and the added durability of Barrier help.

Team Captain K. | Kyogre, Gau, FF5 Redmage, Marcus, Mint
[Floor 3b]
*All ST is MT
Team Captain K. | Kyogre, Gau, FF5 Redmage, Marcus, Mint
[Floor 3b]
*All ST is MT
Team Captain K. vs. Nino
Team Captain K. vs. Alakazam and Chansey
Team Captain K. vs. Flik, Viktor, Edge (S3)
Team Captain K. vs. Alma and Nils
Team Captain K. vs. Dhoulmagus and Tidus (w/ Caladbolg) - Okay, so this is against the sucky Edge. Yeah, I guess I agree with Sage. MT Kyogre damage just slays the universe.

[Nephrite]

I'm not sure if it matters, but that's Suikoden 3 Edge and not Final Fantasy 4 Edge. My apologies, should have made that more clear.

[superaielman]

 I think Delta Shield is floor 4. (Either the berries or the SP. ) Feel free to prove me wrong but that's my definite knee jerk.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Is that so? A votechange for Tonfa may be in order, then. Also, based on Neph's statement, I may have to relook Cap'n's matches.

[Dhyerwolf]

I'm not sure about SP, but since Delta Shield is usually considered around the Southern Seas area (Since it gets the hype against enemy MT ID), and that's really not all that far into the game (It's also only about 25% of the Moonberry total she needs to learn all her moves). Granted, I seem to remember Aika gaining the 2nd SP point after not that much. She nearly gains 3 SP points in game, so at a battle a tad before the exact midgame point, it seems there would be a decent chance she's at least gained 1 SP.

[SageAcrin]

Team Tide makes it(Lol Floor 1!1 Actually, it's not such a joke anymore, but he can still handle it, with some excellent early-oriented characters(Sas is pretty darned good that early, Eph is good too. Don't think this needs a mathing out.).

Tonfa...yeah, I see him having Delta Shield from what I recall, so he makes it.

Team Captain makes it, Kyogre's Speed relative to this early should still be monstrous since it's compared to Tier 2 Pokeymans by and large. Completely saves his ass, since I agree with the Flik assessment otherwise, but as it is, MT Kyogre is too much for puny mortals to bear I think.

*spins~*

[Cmdr_King]

Team Tide passes.

Team Tonfa passes.  I poked around some FAQs after seeing super's comment and thinking it silly, and both Alpha Storm and Delta Shield cost 1 moonberry (seems like you had to learn things in order, if not, point is even more moot).  The game throws 3 at you by the first town and Aika should very much be getting them, because Delta Shield is considerably more valuable than anything but Pirate Wrath and the temp's bread and butter moves, all of which are unsuable at this stage in the game anyway.  SP is more questionable, but I figure floor 3 is roughly the South Sea, which I recall Aika getting her second SP by (L16 or so rings a faint bell.)
So yeah.  Aika>everything but the boss fight, and with no resources spent or damage taken that's very managable for this team.

Cap'n K... not feeling Kyogre > Flik on speed.  He loses here.

[Nitori]

Team Tide makes it(Lol Floor 1!1 Actually, it's not such a joke anymore, but he can still handle it, with some excellent early-oriented characters(Sas is pretty darned good that early, Eph is good too. Don't think this needs a mathing out.).

Tonfa...yeah, I see him having Delta Shield from what I recall, so he makes it.

Team Captain makes it, Kyogre's Speed relative to this early should still be monstrous since it's compared to Tier 2 Pokeymans by and large. Completely saves his ass, since I agree with the Flik assessment otherwise, but as it is, MT Kyogre is too much for puny mortals to bear I think.

*spins~*

[Dhyerwolf]

Tide's team of excellent balancing deals with Floor 1 easily.

Tonfa has Delta Shield and passes.

Captain doesn't pass, since I think Kyogre comes in when everything is mostly evolved (But if I'm wrong there, tell me), so I wouldn't see his stats as getting an extra uberness early on.

[superaielman]

Far as I know, all PC's get Ancient Cave style scaling (Dropped to level 1, scaled to the time), making him pretty uber.

Edit: Tide passes. Earlygame Ephraim is unholy.  Thinking on the other two.

Edit: Captain passes, Kyo doesn't get OHKOed by Flik and that is that. (He should beat Edge to the punch easily). Tonfa fails, I don't think he can beat the Dhouly boss fight offhand.

[SageAcrin]

Captain doesn't pass, since I think Kyogre comes in when everything is mostly evolved (But if I'm wrong there, tell me), so I wouldn't see his stats as getting an extra uberness early on.

Yes and no.

He comes in late, but with an overleveled edge IIRC of around five to ten levels, in the Sapphire maingame. (Emerald he's aftergame but with a 15-20 level over endgame edge and absolutely no dungeons or anything between him and you after clearing the game.) Don't necessarily say this is enough to change your mind or anything(He comes in with no EVs, too, dunno how you hash that out.).

So yeah, judgement may vary, anyways.

[Dhyerwolf]

What effect do EVs have?

And it makes a big difference if one is taking the full evolutions at level 1, or having them scale them, which definetely affects his level of uberness.

[Captain K.]

EVs can generally be ignored in this setting.  It's less than 30 points in two stats at endgame levels.  Fewer points if you spread them around in more than two stats (which is what happens when you play the game normally).

As for the Flik floor, Kyogre is +.75 SDs in speed, Flik is +.17.  Kyogre goes first, uses Calm Mind on his entire team.  His magic defense goes from ridiculous to "u can't touch this".  Red Mage can MT heal whatever damage they take, then Kyogre can kill the opposing team on its next turn.  If they're still alive after eating MT Marcus and Gau attacks.

Someone could make a good argument for me losing to Dhoul and Tidus, but I am not losing on the Flik floor.

[dude789]

Tonfa and Tide make it, Captain K doesn't.

[Mad Fnorder]

All Pass.

[Nephrite]

Updating this Wednesday, get your votes in WHILE THEY'RE HOT.

[Captain K.]

All pass.

[Taishyr]

Tonfa... tonfa abstain, that final match gives me headaches with his massive low-offense team.

Cap'n K and Tide both pass.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Tide's team makes it easily enough.

Tonfa... It's really iffy on Delta Shield, but I'm not unreasonable. SoA definitely hinted that Vyse/Aika were permanent party members, giving the player incentive to build them up the most. That's reason enough for me to allow that Aika might have an edge on her castmates and have Delta Shield by now. Tonfa passes.

Cap'n K? Hmm... My Kyogre respect is pretty high today. Pass.

-Djinn

[Captain K.]

Reverse status floor next if I pass.