Season 56 Site Rankings: Prelminary stage

[Lance]

Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn
Persona 4 bosses

[SnowFire]

It's obviously not happening, but for the record I still would support a bunch of various FWs.  It's come up before and I know that lots of people are strongly against FWs, but eh.  Rig the season so that they go up against a top 25% drawer, if they don't receive X% of votes they're a guest dueler passing through and have to be reranked later if they want to return.  Off the top of my head, that means Prier / Jack Russel / Allen / Larsa / Staraptor.  Not enough support this season, though, at least.  I'd also support ranking DQV but it seems like that's the plan for next ranking season.

Anyway, I'll go with instead:

Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn
Wild Arms XF

The DL needs to take the plunge some day and rank next-gen systems, even in spite of draw issues.  Either ToV or FE:RD seem the best test cases but RD is getting more support.

XF...  ugh.  PSP is definitely a weird system, so definitely worries there.  But they *are* interesting in the DL.  Don't think the WA5 comparison is too relevant, since WA5 got a wave of "meh" everywhere while XF seems to have better buzz.  It's worth a shot, at least.  For now, I'll call this a PCs only rank.  I'm playing through the game now and am in Chapter 4 (the desert capital) so will check back later, but the bosses so far translate wonkily to the DL.  If we rank any bosses I'd lean Rupert, you fight him a whole bunch and he's fairly memorable.

[Meeplelard]

Wild ARMs XF: ...yeah, no excuse.

Pokemon FW Starmie:  Was talked into it by an anonymous source.

Not really thrilled or convinced on P4 bosses honestly, especially since some people seem to be unable to use a good deal of restraint on bosses (rank all shadows? What? **** no to that.)

[Luther Lansfeld]

Forgotten Warrior Sora -I still wont give up on him! External vote draw is amazing!
Star Ocean 1- sure, this seems well played


Big NO to Persona 4 as I want to play it eventually and the DL will spoil it for me if the killer gets ranked.
Since WA5 failed, I dont really want to see XF ranked unless we are sure its better. Star Ocean is a better PSP ranking to me.

XF has had much better reviews than WA5, is more well-liked among DLers and has been more widely picked up because people actually give a damn about it. SO1 is a horrific idea, a game with two divergent versions that split between SNES and PSP people quite nicely. Soul Nomad is probably a better idea and it's a bad idea too.

I changed my vote to Starmie because it's awesome.

[VySaika]

P4 Bosses: 8-Bit Hero, Hippie and Killer. Abstain on Eye and no on Izanami. EDIT: And as I didn't mention them but apparently it needs mentioning, blanket NO to all PC Shadows.

Second game...I'd like to shoot for the Common Pokemon Package, but I'm going to hand it to XF purely to see how rankable PSP games really are.

On that note, I should probably get back to playing XF.

[superaielman]

Wild ARMs XF: ...yeah, no excuse.

Pokemon FW Starmie:  Was talked into it by an anonymous source.

Not really thrilled or convinced on P4 bosses honestly, especially since some people seem to be unable to use a good deal of restraint on bosses (rank all shadows? What? **** no to that.)

The point of having ranking topics is to talk about what makes a good rank, and P4 bosses as a whole are a good idea. Though yeah, we could very well just end up ranking one or two bosses from it and that's fine! It still deserves to hit the second stage.

Edit: Gate and others, we aren't picking out which specific bosses to rank at this stage; just taking a P4 boss ranking to the next stage.

[alanna82]

Edited Sora to Starmie!

I like that idea!

[Dark Holy Elf]

The point of having ranking topics is to talk about what makes a good rank, and P4 bosses as a whole are a good idea.

If people are going to support shit from a certain rank it makes the rank as a whole less palatable (just as people hyping bad pokemon ranks rightly made people shy away from the ranking idea as a whole). I'm definitely reconsidering my support, though I doubt it will matter much ultimately.

[superaielman]

The point of having ranking topics is to talk about what makes a good rank, and P4 bosses as a whole are a good idea.

If people are going to support shit from a certain rank it makes the rank as a whole less palatable (just as people hyping bad pokemon ranks rightly made people shy away from the ranking idea as a whole). I'm definitely reconsidering my support, though I doubt it will matter much ultimately.

There is a good deal of room to argue with what's good in terms of P4 bosses. It's like WA4 in that regard; we won't rank as much as the fans want but several bosses are worth arguing over and worth consideration.

[Nephrite]

The point of having ranking topics is to talk about what makes a good rank, and P4 bosses as a whole are a good idea.

If people are going to support shit from a certain rank it makes the rank as a whole less palatable (just as people hyping bad pokemon ranks rightly made people shy away from the ranking idea as a whole). I'm definitely reconsidering my support, though I doubt it will matter much ultimately.

Then it would behoove both sides to make more substantial arguments regarding the support they have one way or another rather than just saying "no it's stupid."

I am just as guilty of this and will do a better job of presenting my ideas in the future.

[OblivionKnight]

This is more designed for next topic, but to pull people to a previous topic where this was discussed (http://www.rpgdl.com/forums/index.php/topic,3578.msg65116.html#msg65116):

GIANT FREAKING SPOILERS, DUH

As for the 4 (5) big bosses getting support (or no support):

1) Mitsuo Kubo (Shadow Mitsuo, 8-bit Hero, whatever): So...really don't think we'd be ranking him - just the shadow form.  They really aren't the same person (not that I'll object too much, but...).  Mitsuo denies the shadow, much like the other characters do, causing the shadow form to be born.  It's separate from him, similar to the other shadow forms (different voice), especially due to the fact that Mitsuo doesn't accept it (still denies it), unlike the other characters, so, plot-wise, it is still separate from him.  Now, if you just want to rank the Shadow Form, that's a different story, just noting that the Shadow Form...isn't the person, for whatever that's worth.

2) Taro Namatame (Kunino-Sagiri): I think I explained this a while ago somewhere to someone.  From what I remember reading on interpretations, the plot in him is as follows.  Kunino-Sagiri is the Goddess of the Fog (Ameno being the God).  Taro was given the power of persona and the ability to enter the TV from Izanami.  For the battle, it is him - while he doesn't fight like Adachi does, it is him (voice, attitude, he's drained after the battle, hence why he's put in the hospital afterwards).  He merges with his Shadow (i.e., as the game plot puts it, his persona) to become Hippie Jesus (i.e., the peaceful saviour).  He's fully in control of it, and as the game states, those given the power can mold it however they want to achieve what they believe is the true answer.

3) Tohru Adachi (The Killer): Really doesn't need much explanation.  Only issue here is the spoilerness (which, due to the deal made about it...makes it a bigger spoiler than it would have been :/).  Do note that he states he is entirely in control of his actions, though, which matters when we get to...

4) Ameno-Sagiri (Big Fucking Eye): A being Izanami created secondary to Adachi's motivations (she was watching to see how a few random people with power would use it - since Adachi was first to enter the town and make use of it, she put him at the forefront of everything, giving form to Ameno-Sagiri to create the world Adachi was aiming for).  Once Adachi is beaten, Ameno-Sagiri recognizes this - others with similar power are trying to change the original paradigm, and so he tests whether the new aims of the party can overcome him (i.e., those of the original "creator", as it were).  Of all the bosses (excluding Mitsuo), Ameno is the most Necron-like (not that he really is, but most like), and has the shortest exposition (and requires some digging and thought), so probably the least important to rank, to me, on a plot aspect.

5) Izanami (The Goddess): See a lot of the above.  She comes out near the end, but is technically the 4th character you meet in the game (Soji - Nanako - Ryotaro - Izanami in Drag).  If you talk to people often, you get this from her as the Gas Station Attendant, and she's alluded to many times (and, if you look closely at the Fog Battle at the start of the game, you can make out the Gas Station Attendant Outline - she actually reminds me of Beatrice a lot).  She is the orchestrator of the game, though is a little obscure, but honestly, I think everyone fights her, and knows about her existence.  Definitely support ranking her - she's arguably the least spoileriffic of all the above, so would be fine to rank now.

I really only support the latter 4, and of those, I'm fine not ranking the Visine Commercial.  Hippie, Sociopath, and Arkham Asylum Inmate are good, strong ranks, with enough presence and interest.  You could argue the latter is too powerful, I suppose?  Anyway, small group, but important group.  

Again, this is more for the next topic, but just so people see it and it's out there...

[Sir Donald 3.2]

What's with the sudden support for Starmie?   I mean, sure, it's a solid dueler, but my rubric would be best expressed as "near-mandatory encounter" or "Boss" Pokemon.  And while Starmie is Misty's signature Pokemon, I'm not sure that we should give it full props due to the fact that the "Boss" version was nerfed.  Besides, Water is well represented anyway.

EDIT: Still,  looking at Super's Earlier Comment:  I'm going to go ahead and nom Kanto Elite & Gym Leader Signature Pokemon + Snorlax & Golem (the latter because he'd be the only Trade-Evol out and the former for reasons of being a mandatory encounter.  Lapras is already covered by "Kanto Elite 4 Signature (Lorelei)")

For my 2nd nom, Golden Sun 2 PCs.  Firstly because they likely deserve to be ranked before Gen 4 Pokemon and Second, we've got Golden Sun 3 rumors up the wazoo so they could get interest again.

[hinode]

P4 Killer (FW)
Wild Arms XF

[Cmdr_King]

Wild ARMs XF
"Killer" (Adachi Tohru), Persona 4

While I like Izanami a lot conceptually, reading up on how people have been treating her in board tourneys, I'm less confident than I'd like she'll be treated as beatable.  The rest of the bosses range from cute but probably not objectively good (Mitsuo) to having issues (everyone else, really)

[superaielman]

This closes thurday night when the site closes (Bit over a day), so get your votes in now!

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Wild ARMs XF - 12 writers? Yeah, think it's acceptable to make it to stage 2 at least.
P4 Killer - The only thing I'll support from P4 bosses. Straight no to everybody else: the combo of SMT boss (which already has insane respect splits off votedraw and interest that's never higher than amenable, and even P4 can't eke beyond those)+crazy weirdness with plot shenanigans is thoroughly indigestible to me. Especially not when half the bosses that would be sensible to rank could be somewhat sensibly seen as bordering on Bluelike (Izanami certainly gets some nods like that). I'll pass.

[AndrewRogue]

Out of curiosity, why are people favoring the Killer as the sole P4 boss rank? Just wondering.

[DjinnAndTonic]

OK linked to the big topic where they discussed it.

Personally, I'd be happier just ranking 8-bit Hero simply because he fits so well with theme of this site. Not ranking him feels like we're ignoring why this whole tournament is set up. He's just fun.

Of course I'd throw my support to WAXF and SN before P4 bosses, but if P4 bosses end up on the table, I'd like to see 8-bit Hero ranked. Killer, Izanami, and Bad Ending Final Boss (whatever we're calling him to avoid spoiling) are also pretty good ranks. Giant Eye... Not a bad idea, but I wouldn't argue for it.

By the way, 'Visine Commercial' is a particularly inspired nickname. I still chuckle whenever OK mentions it.

[Yakumo]

I would personally go with Radiant Dawn and P4 bosses.  Specifically including PC shadows that aren't Rise(plot fight and all).  They're separate from the characters as shown from the scenes around the fights, even if they are kinda born from them, and they're important.  Mostly not terribly boring duellers either.  Would also be fine with Killer, Kunino-Sagiri, and Mitsuo.

[Excal]

P4 Bosses
Specific Support going to 8-Bit, Killer, and Hippy.  Endboss...  I am less sure of, rest I am apathetic towards, though generally against the shadows as I cannot remember most of them.

Radiant Dawn


Picked these two because XF looks like a safe bet.  Will likely tally numbers before things close tomorrow, which may mean a switch in votes, though it will end up as two among those three.

[Lord Ephraim]

Starmie FW
Radiant Dawn

Persona 4 bosses seem like a lock and fuck WAXF

[Sei]

Wild ARMs: XF
Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn

About time we test out some of the next gen consoles/handhelds in the DL. <<

[Talaysen]

Wild ARMs: XF
Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn

[superaielman]

This is closed. Thanks to everyone who took the time to vote! Next round will be posted briefly.