Nyarlathotep's Dungeon: Week 110

[Nephrite]

"Oho! I see we are trying a repeat performance. Let us see if you've learned anything since last time..."


Link to the Dungeon Wiki!

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**Full Heals reset limit and other types of gauges when teams pass through them.
**Characters that join after the start are locked into the relative stats they have at that time until they would officially join.

Team Random | Yuna (MT), Lucian, Shiho, Rune and Mew
**Lucian has been granted Level 8 Guts! (60% chance)
**Shiho has been granted a Unicorn Horn and the spells Mystic Cross and Shadow Servant!
[Mew: Psychic, Flamethrower, Reflect, Safeguard]
Floor 8: Maze of Trials
**Each enemy takes 35% less damage until they have acted.
Team Random vs. Mascot Yuna (FFX-2)
Team Random vs. Rika, Chaz, Raja and Wren
Team Random vs. Fenrir, Bloodbane and Genevieve
*Full Heal
Team Random vs. Ryu1, Ryu2, Ryu3 and Ryu4
Team Random vs. Fou-lu (When defeated, CT is reset, and is replaced with Profound Darkness, then with XORN, then with Orphan)


Team dude | Rika, Elincia, Mew, Yukiko, Nall (Elemental Advance)
[Mew: Light Screen, Swords Dance, Explosion, Psychic
Floor 6b: Overachievers
Team dude vs. Ashera and Dheginsea
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Katrina and Charlton Blunt (XF)
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Castle Exdeath and Gilgamesh
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Loki and Surt
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Izanami and Adachi


Team Snowfire | Elincia, Yuna (MT), Arnaud, Stocke, Hawk
[Floor 2b: Magical Mystery]
Team Snowfire vs. FFT Wizard, Priest, Summoner and Time Mage
Team Snowfire vs. Sarah (S3), Estella (S3) and Piccolo (S3)
Team Snowfire vs. Lemina, Ronfar and Borgan (EBC)
Team Snowfire vs. Lyon and Riev
Team Snowfire vs. Narshe Kefka

Team Yoshiken | Shadow, Ramza, Tidus, Elincia, Moulder (Vantage)
[Ramza: Oracle, Item, Auto Potion, Move HP-Up]
Floor 3b: Divided we Stand
**40% of all damage done by the player team is returned to the character who dealt it as ITD damage, based on whatever damage would be done to the target after all reductions.
Team Yoshiken vs. Rand, Ox and Momo
Team Yoshiken vs. Shadow Yukiko & Shadow Naoto
Team Yoshiken vs. Ike, Soren, Titania & Mist (FE9 forms)


Multitarget - One person on the team's actions all become Multitargetted. However, the damage of regular attacks, the healing of all spells that restore HP or MP, the status rates of status spells or attacks and the effect of buffs or debuffs (rounded down to the nearest half point in the case of Pokemon) is reduced by 33%. (Deadly Fingertips has a 67% chance of inflicting ID for example) Moves that were originally MT are not affected by this. This sealstone may be moved. In the case of revival, this affects the amount of HP restored, not the chance of revival occuring. Moves that have two types of effects (healing + buffing) are both decreased.

Elemental Advance - Elemental weaknesses are removed for both the player and enemy team. Elemental spells and attacks cannot be absorbed, resisted, or nullified by enemies. If an elemental weakness were normally hit by a player character, that character may cast that same spell again against ONLY the targets that are weak to that spell.

Vantage Effect - Counterattack abilities activate before being attacked and also increases the chance of any counter attack activation skill to 100%.

[SnowFire]

Team dude | Rika, Elincia, Mew, Yukiko, Nall (Elemental Advance)
[Mew: Light Screen, Swords Dance, Explosion, Psychic
Floor 6b: Overachievers
Team dude vs. Ashera and Dheginsea
Um.  Mew's Explosion better be seen as OHKOing Dheginsea.  Ashera & Dheggy both have MT physicals which are hard to interp because their power goes up the closer you get to them in-game, but they can probably MT KO everyone if left alive for a turn (Yes, it's evasion-subject, but from earlier discussions, it doesn't sound like Saner should be hyped vs. things that aren't basic physicals.)  Elincia can't really damage Dheginsea in-game (Stat topic claims her endgame Str in 25, +15 for Amiti, is 40 damage...  not cutting it vs. Dheginsea of the 50 Def without both Ena AND a support), and I doubt Rika does much against that crazy DEF either.  So it really does have to come down to Explosion OHKOing Dheggy.  On the bright side, with Dheginsea's all-defense no-HP build, a single shot of huge damage is indeed what the doctor ordered, so maybe.  (And there's reason to tiebreak against Dheginsea when in doubt since Kurth is a free win over him in-game which makes him questionable in the DL.)
EDIT: So Kurth doesn't solo Dheginsea after all (which is good, because if that was allowable that would mean he's quasi an unlosable plot fight if you want, BUT Rika has thunder damage, which means she can probably break defense, which should be enough to ensure Explosion is fatal.)
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Katrina and Charlton Blunt (XF)
Light Screen & blitzing for Katrina.
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Castle Exdeath and Gilgamesh
Can Gilgamesh status out Mew before he blows up?  I doubt it.
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Loki and Surt
Explosion -> Elincia 4x physicals Surt -> lol Loki can't solo vs. Yukiko healing.
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Izanami and Adachi
This is another status blitz...  except checking, the Restore staff is storebought in RD, and Yukiko presumably has some status healing, so Izanami's status blitz shouldn't really work.

Leaning pass for dude but will wait for other arguments.
EDIT: Eh sure pass for dude but it's a trainwreck.

Team Snowfire | Elincia, Yuna (MT), Arnaud, Stocke, Hawk
[Floor 2b: Magical Mystery]
Team Snowfire vs. FFT Wizard, Priest, Summoner and Time Mage
They get shredded and don't really accomplish anything.  Especially if you hold spell charge times against them.
Team Snowfire vs. Sarah (S3), Estella (S3) and Piccolo (S3)
This is probably the most dangerous fight if the team somehow drops the controller and lets them get turns.  However, they're slow and frail so get shredded by Elincia & friends as usual.  MT Nulfire also defangs both Sarah & Estella.  (Reminder: Only Sarah's crappy ice magic is fast, or Silent Lake if she feels suicidal.  Her fire damage is slow.)
Team Snowfire vs. Lemina, Ronfar and Borgan (EBC)
They don't get turns.
Team Snowfire vs. Lyon and Riev
They're doubled and die horribly.  (Fun fact: Lyon is already slow, so Arnaud might well cast FRAGILE on him instead of Slow Down, since he is a tank and multi-hit Elincia would like to do more than just barely not tink.)
Team Snowfire vs. Narshe Kefka
Kefka at least has some speed and some offense!  But it's the last fight and he can be blitzed, and it's questionable if he can OHKO Elincia which he really, really wants to do.  And he can't even kill Elincia first, because if he does, Yuna just revives her (she gets Life really fast, it's surely F2 if not F1).  So even if you see Kefka as both going first and insta-killing Yuna, Slow Down-> massive beatdown from Elincia / Stocke / Hawk.

So yeah, I pass.


Team Yoshiken | Shadow, Ramza, Tidus, Elincia, Moulder (Vantage)
[Ramza: Oracle, Item, Auto Potion, Move HP-Up]
Floor 3b: Divided we Stand
**40% of all damage done by the player team is returned to the character who dealt it as ITD damage, based on whatever damage would be done to the target after all reductions.
Team Yoshiken vs. Rand, Ox and Momo
Team Yoshi has to take this slow, but the other team can't really threaten Team Yoshi at all, Tidus has buffs, and Ramza has annoying status.
Team Yoshiken vs. Shadow Yukiko & Shadow Naoto
Well, Elincia isn't lasting long, Magarudyne hits weakness and triggers a One-More, and Yoshi will probably just want to leave her dead.  Still, other than that, what's the plan?  Silence blitz?  Except that Ramza's item healing still works fine, and Tidus will be stacking on Hastes and eventually Slows once Elincia is dead (since Dekunda is apparently a Once-More only skill).  Team Yoshi still fears dying from floor quirk backlash -> enemy turn, but the turnsplit should help fix that, and Ramza might be able to stick P4 bosses with the odd status (both FFT & P4 have the occasional status hole in their bosses).
Team Yoshiken vs. Ike, Soren, Titania & Mist (FE9 forms)
Does Tidus have any MP left?  He probably had to spend almost all of it, but if he can save a single Slow for Ike, it'd help immensly.  The main problem here is not dying to the FE counters + floor counters, but Oracle should help with that - did FFT Don't Act turn off FFT Reaction skills like Counter as well?  It's definitely a problem, though, if Shadow tags Ike with a Shuriken, the backlash + Ragnell hit will hurt a lot.  So Shadow will probably settle for trying to murder Soren (don't let him get a turn that would let him murder the hell out of Elincia with Wind magic), which means Ike is getting a turn, and let Ike get too many turns and it's bad times.  Hence the importance of saving a Slow for him.  If the team comes to this fight in good shape they win, if they don't it could be rough.

Leaning pass, but will let others who know P4 bosses more comment on the second match, which affects whether the third match is winnable or not.
EDIT: Yeah, pass for reasons I note below.

[Dhyerwolf]

Team Random | Yuna (MT), Lucian, Shiho, Rune and Mew
**Lucian has been granted Level 8 Guts! (60% chance)
**Shiho has been granted a Unicorn Horn and the spells Mystic Cross and Shadow Servant!
[Mew: Psychic, Flamethrower, Reflect, Safeguard]
Floor 8: Maze of Trials
**Each enemy takes 35% less damage until they have acted.
Team Random vs. Mascot Yuna (FFX-2)- Well, the key is still getting enough damage to get her at once. At base they have
Yuna- 0.5 PC HP damage
Lucian- 1 PC HP damage
Rune- 0.5 PC HP damage
Mew- 0.65? PC HP Damage
Shiho- About .35 PC HP, and then .5ish perhaps

So they can pump out 3 (more when Might Reinforce comes into play). I think this should okay due to the standard horrible FF X-2 charge times that effectively make Mascot until to do anything before turn 1.7. She really needed Cure not to be effected by Shell.
Team Random vs. Rika, Chaz, Raja and Wren- Dangerous fight. Rika IDs Rune. Yuna can revive Rune now, but his turn is gone. She may choose to just MT Holy. Chaz can gets off Shiho on average. Lucian will take out Raja. Mew STs whoever. But now Rika comes around. This...well, to me, Rika and Yuna are the same speed turn 2 and Rika is faster 1 regardless since Yuna is only 119% turn 1. This just seems like it will be an endless problem.

Team Random vs. Fenrir, Bloodbane and Genevieve
*Full Heal
Team Random vs. Ryu1, Ryu2, Ryu3 and Ryu4- Most teams by this point should be slaughtering this fight. Just a note since not really sure the team gets here, but they just aren't a great combo. Not enough base HP+not fast
Team Random vs. Fou-lu (When defeated, CT is reset, and is replaced with Profound Darkness, then with XORN, then with Orphan)-

Team Yoshiken | Shadow, Ramza, Tidus, Elincia, Moulder (Vantage)
[Ramza: Oracle, Item, Auto Potion, Move HP-Up]
Floor 3b: Divided we Stand
**40% of all damage done by the player team is returned to the character who dealt it as ITD damage, based on whatever damage would be done to the target after all reductions.
Team Yoshiken vs. Rand, Ox and Momo- Wow, punishing floor for anyone relying on MT damage. Momo is the danger in the first fight since she's status immune and has MT status herself. But Elincia+someone else should get her at the very least. I don't think either Rand or Ox got revival (If they don't, the fight becomes kind of trivial in effect because a lot revolves around just getting Momo out, which isn't hard. Hard one to balance)
Team Yoshiken vs. Shadow Yukiko & Shadow Naoto- Mute Ray is dangerous
Shadow Yukiko has 3 PC HP area. At 3/4 HP, she can summon an enemy with nearly as much HP who can do nasty status and debuffs. At half HP she has MT fire magic.
Shadow Naoto has 3.5 PC HP area. She has borderline 2HKO at start that also is 100% Silence and .18 MP damage. She also has 30% MT Magic (can hit Elincia's weakness!!!!)

So does Tidus have Hastega by now? Post Bevelle makes me lean...no, but...maybe. Obviously that's a major game changer. Either way, Shadow Naoto is the first target as she doesn't get notably better as her HP lowers and Yukiko does. Shadow Naoto just spams Magarudyne since the team isn't great on MT Healing, avoid Elincia's counters, and doesn't do horrid damage to Elincia all things considered. But I think the team should be okay getting her out (Moulder and Ramza will just stick with healing). I guess HP to 1 is cute since she and Yukiko go at the same time so Yukiko can actually sweep someone up right afterwards (but Elincia and Moulder also go at the same time). Not going to overthink this because in game Shadow Naoto was absolute trash.

Team Yoshiken vs. Ike, Soren, Titania & Mist (FE9 forms)- Well, charge times for Ramza, so they all have a chance at a turn. I'm assuming that Elincia is a better threat advantage than Soren. Ike has a chance to get Ramza out. Doesn't feel like it would be overly difficult for them to take this though. Not voting yet because want to think it over some more because this floor gets chaotic very quickly.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Um.  Mew's Explosion better be seen as OHKOing Dheginsea.  Ashera & Dheggy both have MT physicals which are hard to interp because their power goes up the closer you get to them in-game, but they can probably MT KO everyone if left alive for a turn (Yes, it's evasion-subject, but from earlier discussions, it doesn't sound like Saner should be hyped vs. things that aren't basic physicals.)  Elincia can't really damage Dheginsea in-game (Stat topic claims her endgame Str in 25, +15 for Amiti, is 40 damage...  not cutting it vs. Dheginsea of the 50 Def without both Ena AND a support), and I doubt Rika does much against that crazy DEF either.  So it really does have to come down to Explosion OHKOing Dheggy.  On th ebright side, with Dheginsea's all-defense no-HP build, a single shot of huge damage is indeed what the doctor ordered, so maybe.  (And there's reason to tiebreak against Dheginsea when in doubt since Kurth is a free win over him in-game which makes him questionable in the DL.)

Rika has a thunder elemental claw, which both in PS4 and FE10 provides a defence-piercing boost, so chances are Dheg fears that a lot.

Also not sure how Kurth is providing a free win in-game, the DL stat topic has him at 48 atk = 4 damage with Ena's help and a C or B support, with bad hit, against his 30 regen. lol Kurth. At least hype Caineghis if you want to talk about why Dheg gets owned in-game. (with Ena does 21x2 damage at base, so him + Ena + a heron + someone else half-decent allows you to one-round).

[SnowFire]

I've never actually cheesed E-3 via Kurth, but presumably once he can break defense on Dheginsea, he can power grind to SS strike & level 40, though, right?  And since nothing does any damage to him on that map, if you are really bored, there's technically nothing stopping you from doing that.  (to be clear I do not hold this too deeply against Dheginsea, was merely throwing it out there as a tiebreaker thing since at least with Caineghis, he can fear an Ire counter or something + healers all dead for a theoretical loss, while Kurth literally can't lose.)

Dhyer: I seem to recall Hastega as being F6 for Tidus, or F5 if generous?  So no.  He only has Haste & Slow.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Even at SS strike (oh god, 150 attacks, and since he can't counter anything this is going to take over 100 turns unless you got in a stupid number of attacks in E-1 and E-2) and max stats he still doesn't break the regen due to no doubling so he will need some sort of help. And even if he didn't, what would this prove? Strategies that defeat bosses with an hour of grinding are a dime a dozen in RPGs, it's like saying a foolproof way to beat ____ is to run around their dungeon for 5 hours before engaging the fight with the boss. It's true, but kinda silly to bring up. I guess the difference here is that you can do the grinding mid-battle but eh, not really large enough to even merit discussion in tiebreaks IMO.

And yeah, F4 is too early for Hastega most likely. Feels like F5 to me.

[SnowFire]

Good to hear that Kurth can't actually solo Dheginsea, then.

The difference for if Kurth could solo Dheginsea is that he's literally invincible (even at lower levels with no grinding), something that isn't usually true for "what if I powergrinded."  If Tidus was totally invincible to Jecht, I'd definitely hold that against Jecht!  (Unless invinci Tidus can't break Yu Pagoda regen, in which case you don't have a foolproof "put the controller down on auto" method of winning 100% of the time and need to involve the rest of your team which might die and thus you might theoretically lose the battle.)

[Nephrite]

Rand has Renew, which is 25% HP Revival which works 70% of the time.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Heh, well, on the Jecht note... I believe an Auto-Potion (X-Potion) / Stoneproof / Zombieproof armour, coupled with a Counterattack / Magic Counter weapon and stats high enough stats to deal with Yu Pagoda Power Wave regen, would allow you to beat Jecht with the controller down (well, it wouldn't because FFX is CTB and you'd need to hit attack or defend every so often, but yeah, the point is, you can't lose). The time involved in making such a setup isn't even that high (mostly some monster catching), although of course you'd need considerable knowledge of where to obtain all these things.

Probably not the only game this is true for. Invinco setups in highly customisable games are often quite attainable.

[SnowFire]

Also, for Team Yoshi's fights.  I notice that Shadow Naoto's Mute Ray deals 50 SP damage as well.  It seems that's ~.15 average max SP at endgame, so maybe .20 max SP by the time of Naoto's dungeon?  Except...  Tidus has cast-worst max MP at .58 average PCMP, and he's already tossed around 3x Slow if he's sane, and there's a not a lot he can do to stop at least one Mute Ray going off, most likely two unless SN is really blitzable (despite the floor's backlash suggesting caution!).  So yeah, quite possible that Tidus will have 0 MP for the FE9 fight, which may now require YOLO suicide strats into the floor backlash to get rid of Ike.  Which might still work, to be clear!

Elf: Yeah, just the difference between "I twinked the system and now can't lose" vs. "plot armor and I can't lose."  (Talk is hacked to mean Jecht always does 0 damage to Tidus?!)  Willing to hold both against a boss a little, of course.

[SnowFire]

Except, to talk to myself, I now recall that Ramza has Ethers, so so long as Shadow Naoto is killed before Shadow Yukiko, Tidus can be given some MP back for an initial Slow in the FE9 fight.  And with the help of even a single casting of Tidus's brutal Slow, that should be enough to slowly let Team Yoshi safely win the P4 Shadow fight.  So Team Yoshi passes.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Dorothy Beoulve can also heal Silence without spells!

[Random Consonant]

Tenative fail for myself right now.  Second fight is something of a doozy.  Rika Elims Rune, Yuna revives.  Explode isn't turn 1 against anyone but Lucian, so Chaz nails him, forcing Shiho to revive, Mew *has* to use Safeguard first turn or else Raja uses Seals, and Safeguard does nothing to solve the ID problem, and in the meanwhile I'm not making much headway and am in a pretty good position to get polished off.  Alternatively I could try to blitz the fight but... no, same problem.  A team full of ID vulnerables isn't what people want here.

[Dhyerwolf]

Dhyer: I seem to recall Hastega as being F6 for Tidus, or F5 if generous?  So no.  He only has Haste & Slow.

Boss topic has it kicking in around Calm Lands, which strikes me as F5 (maybe mid 5).

For Neph, I guess Renew is a theoretical thing...but probably worthless. 25% revival off that speed and doesn't restore turn order doesn't ever help. Nyarly revival is generally good when it's either strong, off someone very fast or the team can stall and restore on an off time. None of these apply in this case (let alone that the revival doesn't always work!). Fight probably needs some reworking because it's just generally going to come down to knocking Momo out first and then not really facing any danger unless their healing ability is completely anemic (and they lack any status too).

[Nephrite]

I think you're right. I'll probably make that first fight a bit harder, but reduce the backlash damage a hair.

[Dhyerwolf]

Team dude | Rika, Elincia, Mew, Yukiko, Nall (Elemental Advance)
[Mew: Light Screen, Swords Dance, Explosion, Psychic
Floor 6b: Overachievers
Team dude vs. Ashera and Dheginsea- So, while Dheggy might normally fear Rika's Thunder Claw, Elemental Advance kills that. So she probably doesn't do any damage, but she doubles and then does it again! So Explosion might be the strategy (And yeah, definitely that gets Dheggy). This works well because Yukiko has Endure. And Elincia may evade. But...Ashera may evade. So there's a chance this works, but there's a larger chance that this backfires...
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Katrina and Charlton Blunt (XF)-
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Castle Exdeath and Gilgamesh- Gilgamesh is fast, so, Mew is statused. X-Death can open with fatal damage which he'd use against Elincia. I don't...see this one resolving well overall since Gilgy will come around with another turn. Either way, I think the first fight or this fight get them.
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Loki and Surt
*Full Heal*
Team dude vs. Izanami and Adachi


Team Snowfire | Elincia, Yuna (MT), Arnaud, Stocke, Hawk
[Floor 2b: Magical Mystery]
Team Snowfire vs. FFT Wizard, Priest, Summoner and Time Mage
Team Snowfire vs. Sarah (S3), Estella (S3) and Piccolo (S3)
Team Snowfire vs. Lemina, Ronfar and Borgan (EBC)
Team Snowfire vs. Lyon and Riev
Team Snowfire vs. Narshe Kefka- Sure, deals with this floor easily enough overall.

[SnowFire]

re Team dude: Yeah I totally forgot that using Explosion blows the team up if Rika bothers using Thunder Claw since no Saner then.  That said, good point, Elemental Advance screws over the team here since while normally 2x actions is better, in this case hitting the dang weakness is far more important.

I don't think MT can possibly wipe Ashera too, even if you disrespect her HP.  She isn't targetable and is invulnerable until her Auras are cleared.  So Mew uses Explosion, and even if Dheginsea bites it, only Ashera's Auras get blow'd up (and one might even evade - there are eight of them!).  Yukiko auto-revives, BUT Yukiko is below average speed, so Ashera can try to smite Yukiko.  If Yukiko evades, then she can probably solo (heal self, wait for Nall revial to kick in), but if not, that's a party wipe unless Elincia evade saved the day for someone.  On the bright side, since Thunder Claw is useless, Rika can now safely use Saner, which...  may or may not help evade Explosion.

So in order to win, dude needs to have Explosion OHKO Dheginsea, and his odds go up a lot if Saner is seen as working on Explosion.  I think I'm willing to buy both arguments, but it's still a tad unstable.

For the FF5 bosses...  okay, actually, I see that Gilgamesh's status suite is more badass than I thought.  Freaking MT *Blind* is actually pretty dangerous here (although maybe there's Illusion counterhype?!), but even worse there's *Charm* as well.  Charming Rika or Mew seems like badtimes, because IIRC, charmed FF5 characters can do more than just basic physicals.  I dunno about the Exdeath OHKOing Elincia hype, it's a risk off Vacuum Wave, but Elincia evade isn't bad, and Exdeath is in big trouble if it misses.

So probably leaning fail now, although does anyone remember the details of FF5 charm?  Is it "unload with your best" or "pick totally randomly" or "basic physicals"?

[Dark Holy Elf]

Ashera's attacks are ITE.

FF5 charm only causes basic physicals against self/allies UNLESS an attack was already cued, in which case it reverses that attack instead.

[SnowFire]

Got it.  Okay, Charm isn't quite so deadly then (Rika murdering Mew would be bad times).  I still think that it's *Rika* who needs to get statused not Mew, unless you see Castle Exdeath as OHKO'd by Explosion (probably happens post Swords Dance, at least, if that can be pulled off), Rika has various nasty buffs that the FF5 bosses don't want to resolve.  (And is probably why the Blind play, while cute, is probably suboptimal.)

Anyway, let's assume Gilgamesh goes for Frog or something.  Frog Rika -> Ribbit -> Psychic Gilgamesh -> attempt to Vacuum Wave Elincia.  If it hits, then Yukiko goes for her MT fire move.  And...  Gilgamesh is surely dead, at least to me, not inclined to overhype Gilgamesh durability.  But Exdeath might solo here, Mew Psychics him, Exdeath kills him with Vacuum Wave, Yukiko spams her best Fire again, Exdeath rams into evade potentially but at least Yukiko's autorevive, then Yukiko uses her fire again.  Maybe the double-act at low HP gets around this?  But equally so, there's also Nall revival that might randomly kick in, Yukiko can just spam revival and hope Nall revival kicks in before she's doubled.

...buuuuuuut I am reminded that PS4 Psy equipment exists, which probably cuts Gilamesh's status success rate, which combined with Elincia dodging Exdeath, could spell trouble.  On the other hand apparently the Psy equipment doesn't quite stop every PS4 status, and Gilgamesh has a bunch of obscure statuses that he can argue that one of them gets past it.  Blargh.

Actually back to leaning "pass" but will keep waiting and see if anyone else has anything to offer.

[Dhyerwolf]

Psy equips get mental statuses, so Gilgy definitely has a few that get around it.

[Pyro]

x-Death's vac wave is an OHKO only if you assume that all FF5 PCs want to be in the front row, which is highly inaccurate.

[Dark Holy Elf]

VacWave itself (and all FF5 enemy physicals) are themselves highly inaccurate, to boot. And face a gaggle of ways to shut them down in-game (Golem's the biggest, but also Blink and its variants). I'm pretty much all for a "assume they miss first turn against anyone with remotely notable evade" view myself.

Also Gilgamesh has more HP than Exdeath (55k to his 32k, though he also dies after a certain number of turns, but that's not relevant if you need one of them to die NOW NOW NOW).

It should be noted that due to MEvade, the only Gilgamesh statuses above 67% (if you use that as your threshold) are sleep, blind, confuse, and level halving; the ones which would shut down Rika are less accurate. She can also scrounge out more MDef (possibly enough to lower everything below 67% and Frog below 50%, but headaches there) if she equips two shields, but that means no offence whatsoever.

edit: well confuse vs. psy equips is also pretty debatable, I'll leave that to individual judgement.

[SnowFire]

Elf: Yeah, I definitely remember Vacuum Wave's inaccuracy, especially by the time of NeoExdeath, but totally willing to buy it as still inaccurate even with World 2 equips.

Gilgamesh's HP is...  ooooookay, now I see Elf's post later in the topic that 13K is merely the "trigger eventual escape" threshold.  Holy shit, if given credit for it that makes Gilgamesh really scary, 4 extra turns or else considerably more tankiness.  Next time Tonfa is in chat we need to thwack him to edit the Gilgamesh 4 writeup directly to note that.  That said, you're saying that the status hit rates given are assuming 0 MEvade?  Bah, wish the topic mentioned that or had an average PC MEvade then.  Weird, that makes this a very unstable fight - very swingy on if Gilgamesh hits with his *first* status attempt, even if he's much more likely to survive to a second status attempt.  Rika getting even a single turn to throw up Saner or Deban is bad times.  So the fight is probably more about Gilgamesh's status blitz, and he isn't easy to just crush.  (Although I'd like to point out an amusing alternate strategy for Gilgamesh - let Rika Saner, but open with Rocket Punch vs. Elincia instead.  If it isn't seen as "pure" status due to the 50% cHP hit, then he should double Elincia and thus get 2 shots of Charm while also reducing Elincia to critical, and basic physicalling Elincia is still pretty dang scary.)

Pyro: Elincia's tankiness at endgame is mostly in evasion.  Pretty sure that even with half front / half back, Vacuum Wave OHKOs both Elincia & Yukiko, if it even hits them, which is the problem.

In general: This be a mess, so I'm just gonna vote pass for Team Dude, bah Gilgamesh surprise HP hype.  Interesting trainwreck though.

[Dark Holy Elf]

I do list average PEvade/MEvade later in the thread for what it's worth. I'll go edit them into the Gilgamesh/Exdeath entries later.

[Yoshiken]

Kneejerking a Pass for myself. Between Ramza having all the healing in the world, Shadow basically being a giant nuke to the physical attackers on the floor (even if he needs to be healed/revived afterwards) and Elincia dodging forever, the floor kinda collapses. Throw in Tidus being able to Haste up the important parts of the P4 fight to keep it under control (a.k.a. take out Naoto) and Slow the relevant FEers and.. yeah, I don't really see an argument that means I can lose.