Anyone up for a DL podcast?

[Tide]

Just trying to see if there is any interest, especially now that we have a Dischord set up. It would just be a way for people to talk about certain DL matches, conventions, interesting battles and so on by being able to talk about in real time. We've spoken about having a round table before, and this is a similar idea, just a bit more informal I guess. I realize that the DL's glory days are over, but there is clearly some of us who are still up for fantasy type battles and who knows - maybe there are others out there that like this sort of thing.

If there is some interest for it, I'll see if I can find some information on how to set one up and we can do a couple of test runs. Some things people can talk about IMO:
- Concept of scaling
- DL History and past changes. What's different now
- New/Unseen DL matches
- DL team matches. What are some differences from a duel in a team fight
- Ranking idea, how we decide on ranks
- How the divisions work
- Character profiles/strengths/weakness of the dueler

So don't worry about that. I'd say interest is more important at the moment.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Hmm... I quite like the idea of a podcast. I'd definitely be at least a listener if someone was to make one! I still eagerly read all CKDL threads, even if I don't always vote.

Those topics are some of my favorites, too.

I think the relevance of stuff like Death Battle proves that there are definitely nerds out there who would love this kind of thing. But as usual, we're talking about a niche group of a niche audience for a niche genre.

You'd probably have the best luck with this kind of podcast by cherry picking one or two really interesting matchups from the most relevant of JRPGs and heavily examing all possible interpretations for match outcomes. You could expand that to three matches if one of them is like a 'control' match that is overwhelming uncontestable. (This would give some exposure to popular, but one-dimensional, duelists, without taking up too much time per episode. Also makes the more in-depth discussions stand out more in contrast!)

[Tide]

The most interesting matches are often in Godlike because of the variety of options, stats and power that Godlikes have. Problem related to that of course, is that Godlike is somewhat limited because its the upper echelon of the DL. So you might start running into repeat duelers (which is an active problem at the time when the DL was running).

One DL season can probably be broken down into a 6 episode span because week 1-3 have the most matches to talk about. Week 4 might go well with something that's another topic to talk about and Week 5 would be the Finals + team battle. That's kind of how I imagine DL seasons would be analyzed.

And yes, this is a pretty niche thing. But the idea I original had wasn't to make this like big prime time popular. Just a way for those of us that are still into DL discussion to get a chance to talk/hash it out. Reading the analysis was always my favourite part of the normal DL.

One final thing is that I imagine someone needs to take up the "host" position if this goes forward. I don't mind doing it, but I imagine someone with a broader RPG knowledge or more ingrained into the DL's fundamentals should be that person (so Dhyer, Super, NEB, Pyro probably make more sense to name a few). That's something we can work out down the line though.

[SnowFire]

Who is the intended audience for this?  Or just a personal project you want to do 'cuz it's cool?

I'd suggest including a brief history of the DL & RPG gaming - e.g. the era when a ton of RPGs came out on the PSX & PS2, and various well-regarded RPGs came out on SNES with high playership (thanks to emulation if nothing else).  And that was kinda ground zero of the DL, and it's a bit trickier nowadays because there's fewer AAA RPGs coming out in general.

I'd also start from an even higher perspective than the likes of scaling: why do this at all, why is it cool.  e.g. start with Cloud vs. Squall, who'd win in a fight?!  And go for the following methods of voting:
A) Voting based on popularity (Cloud is the coolest and I like him, so he beats everybody!)
B) Voting based on flavor (Suikoden 5 Prince has the Dawn Rune, which is a child of the Sun Rune, so clearly he beats vampires like Hilda.  this actually happened as a reminder.)
C) Voting based on in-game effectiveness (Respecting characters like FF6 Relm or Grandia 3 Miranda Dahna; disrespecting characters like, well, a lot of bosses who face extreme broken in-game, or have their tricks usually immuned - SH2 Kato say.  or PC status-slingers in games where randoms all suck anyway and bosses immune status.)
D) Voting based on "unique" abilities (e.g. FF6 Edgar gets hype for Tools, but Aeris doesn't get hype for a good magic score to use Materia with)
E) Voting based on "unique" abilities, scaled relative to the cast with math rather than enemies, and scaling all other stats as well (the mathiest and most complicated version, and also the one that the people still remaining at the DL usually use...  this can lead into the discussion of scaling.)


For "sample matches" to discuss, I agree that picking 3-5 examples and deep-diving them is a good idea, ideally starting from some that are cut-and-dry in a manner that doesn't require any math to understand, and then ending on ones that are truly close and down to interp splits or random chance.  Also focus on games with extremely high playership.

A few suggestions:
* Tidus vs. Ephraim.  (Also happened in the DL.  At first glance: Ephraim destroys Tidus!  Oh wait, Caladbolg has Evade & Counter, never mind.  Can hypothetically win on counterattacks, but not after 5x Cheer and possibly Overdrive spam.  Can even mention Haste & Slow possibly interacting with double attacks.)
* Some Persona 4 character vs. Somebody who has an elemental attack that would hit weakness.  Yukiko vs. FF13 Lightning or something, anything works.  Should be a very understandable example of something cool that doesn't require checking the math.  Can even mention the P4G version issue which has Evade (element) passive skills and the like for an example of a version split.
* Some final boss vs. final boss slugfest, pick your favorites from the stable of Godlike champs.  This one ends up mathier, but can be an excuse to talk about boss scaling.

[Grefter]

An oral history is probably more interesting than individual matches?   Also depends on if you want an ongoing or a limited run I suppose.

[Tide]

The history aspect of it is definitely something worth breaking down. Although I'm not that well versed in it, since I've only been with the group around Season 23 I think. I still think new match ups or a new CKDL matches may be worth going into though. In a way, think of it as like having it on record in another way. With the great purge in Season 40, a lot of stuff beforehand is gone so I think putting our thoughts down on a medium would preserve future history too.

Intended audience - mainly just us. That way we are free to produce it on our own time or really when there is something interesting to kind of talk about. No potential end really since the number of matches/team matches not explored is huge. But sprinkling in the history/previous match ups might be a better way to start.

If we want to focus on some sample matches (which I'm okay with), some personal favourites that come to mind:

1) Citan v Raquel - This happened in CKDL. It's a very good case of "this looks very obvious on paper but ends up going the different way" once you look into it. Also looks at double turning/EXAs since the speed split between the two is *massive*
2) Georg (S5) v Squall - Main DL. It's Snowfire's second suggestion but not really looking at weakness. Just a fight where the answer is obvious, doesn't really require checking numbers. Squall's only shot of winning this is if Georg ends up hitting on a very precise range and then he rolls for the limit at 1/3 chance. Which on the average, is not happening. Can be a case to talk about limit scaling and version splits as well (since you have Georg2 and Georg5)
3) Lady v Ghaleon - Would be my vote for final boss v final boss. Both relatively lesser known final bosses that have really strong DL records. Not sure if they had an official clash.

Some additional match ups that I think would be fun to go into:
4) Wugui v Auron - Main DL. Goes into the concept of a Spoiler
5) Jeremy v Gau - CKDL or Proving Grounds I think? Explores AI controlled behaviour and random chance
6) Arnaud v Clarissa - Main DL, Season 59. This is a really good fight that ultimately is like a 50/50 and really depends on interpretation. A case where your respect something certainly matters cause it can go either way.

[Dark Holy Elf]

I'm no podcast consumer but I'm interested in this anyway for obvious reasons.

[Dhyerwolf]

I'd be interested! Especially if it's just for us and it might go into concepts of scaling/view formulation.

[Tide]

Seems like we've got some interest. Let's try to figure out a time we can talk more about this. When are people generally available?

[DjinnAndTonic]

Well, I personally have the most free time on Fridays, from 5 PM to whenever. (5 PM in Japan is... 8 AM UTC, which is... 1 AM PST.)

So sometime in that window seems good for a weekly Discord voice chat if nothing else?

[Dhyerwolf]

My schedule is pretty flexible at the moment. Should we open up a discord channel for this?

[superaielman]

Wouldn't mind listening in/commenting on this, ping me about it.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Well... I guess I'm gonna plan on being on Discord in the DLcord in about 3-4 hours from now. I dunno if we're gonna record anything, but we could certainly talk about some DL matches in real time over voice chat?