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Author Topic: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!  (Read 2730 times)

Cmdr_King

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Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« on: June 20, 2010, 08:37:05 PM »
Delita's Betrayal (FFT)- i  vs. Might vs Right (SH2)- iiii
"Go talk to a wall" (FFVIII)- i  vs. Squall's pep talk during garden fight (FFVIII)- viii

Tantalus Airship Escape Exploding (FF9)- i vs. Mission 1 Opening (DMC3)- vii
Drakengard 2 (Caim's entrance) vs. Chess Battle (ShF2)- iiii

UNGAAAAAH!!! (Dissidia)- i vs. Badrach's Story (VP)- v
Tranny Kyle (LSSSC)- viii vs. Lizard People Ending (Chrono Trigger)- i

Intro (King's Field 2) (Link provided)- i  vs. WHAT AM I FIGHTING FOOOOOOR (MMX4)- iii

Bye, bye, Butterfree (Pokemon)- vi vs. Gourry saves Lina (Slayers Next)- i


Standard rules apply.  Closes in one week.

Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_EY77s9S5Y )vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbuepIBm9Bw&feature=related#t=5m27s to 8:47.  Apoligies for the voice over.)
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BheU4MyJUwA#t=17m40s )* vs Bad End (Persona 4) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inDg_fIxqho  AND  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCodLLVVVNQ&feature=related .  There is no post-credits scene.)

*same disclaimer as last time.  Scene goes to 31:55.  From 21:00 to 28:00 is just the player showing off and may safely be skipped.

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyOG8LUx46Y#t=2m35s ) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfTgboLV81o#t=2m15s )
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GemT2kn1TC0 ) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_80uOp_PN0U&feature=related )

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jZmtTQNae4 ) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwuizCVeEcU )
Love Hotel (Persona 3)  ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WzO9hNRqeoY  'til about 4:20 ) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera (Digital Devil Saga) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=De6HsU7wJKA#t=4m20s til about 6:40)

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qf-Lb1ahBk ) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night) (  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMTizJemHO8 )

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kHFRASv8Q4&feature=PlayList&p=0C7AB3E87DE7B780&playnext_from=PL&index=95&playnext=1 ) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)  (  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dqu-O9NqPNA&feature=related AND http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxvkLdhp-nI )
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRnZdSthpZc ) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss) ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-E24RZhYAM&feature=related )


Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF)
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III)

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)
« Last Edit: June 20, 2010, 08:42:10 PM by Cmdr_King »
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Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2010, 09:04:09 PM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears): Definitely both worthy entries. Teo's death scene is good at making you feel like garbage, at really making you feel how bad Tir's fate is. It definitely helps S1 set the somber mood that it does. But... I remember this XG scene just generating a total "whoa" reaction from me when I played the game. So much comes full circle here; the entire relationship with Fei and Id and their past, Fei's traumatic memories involving the crucifix and the image of him covered in blood, it just... works. Quite heartwarming in its own strange way, too.
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4): Yeaaah I won't be watching either here.

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF): Life being so deliciously unpleasant for Edna brings a smile to my face like little else. Soooo deserved. Don't really think too much of the TWEWY scene, it's um a combo attack?
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III): I don't like voting for openings normally, but I do like S3's; it's very pretty and definitely lets you know what to expect from the game. I'll still vote it over things I find really stylish (see above), but Alexander the barely explained, won't be mentioned again after this ever is not a scene I'm a terribly big fan of.

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III): Pure hilarity. I like the other scene, though, although I didn't find it overly funny?
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera: ...............................

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night): Oh come on, you can't beat the epic of the memetastic SotN scene.

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII): As a general rule, Elfboy will be less bothered by people being emotionally stupid than most in the DL. Yeah what Shion's lines are wallbangers, and yes Cec/Cathe badly needed more backstory for this scene to have the impact it was aiming for. Yes it's a bad scene. But the orphanage had me in one fell swoop utterly rolling my eyes at FF8 plot, FF8 characters, and everything both stood for. There's a reason it's a Board 8 meme for terrible plotting.
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss): Oh fuck I don't know. Someone argue me on this.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2010, 11:11:14 PM by Dark Holy Elf »

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superaielman

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2010, 09:09:59 PM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)

Style

Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III)

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)- Orphanage was my standard for infinite failure in RPG plotting until XS.
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)
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Dhyerwolf

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2010, 10:19:53 PM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)- "Tir is thinking of Master Teo." Haha, yeah, no. Also hell, I know I say this every week, but every video LP seems to be a pile of steaming crap. I'm completely baffled that every comment isn't to that effect underneath the videos.
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF)
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III)- Damn, these are both awesome. Won't mind whichever moves on, and I'm fairly torn on voting. Going with the FF 9 scene since it's actually in the game (And because Transcending Love built my expectations up way too high for S3 and the game didn't deliver on em!)

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)- Baffling that S3 didn't have a minigame fully revolving around Mel
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera- Neither of these are funny. I suppose the second one at least had one second of almost making me smirk?

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)- I don't have a problem with either of these scenes.

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)- Now I thought this division was what the above division was supposed to be! Orphanage is bad, but the XS 2 Scene is...horrible, horrible Shion crap, nonsensical villain rambling, and gross bodies!
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)- Vote just bad on the fact that uh...Anise didn't really kill Ion. Mohs made him read the score and he agreed.
...into the nightfall.

Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2010, 02:49:02 AM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden)
vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF)- Looooove this.
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III)- Don't really like the S3 opening.

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera - I uh don't really get the first one and barely think the second one is funny!

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)- Ahahahaha.

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)- My god this is a terrible scene. It's being emotional about something that is just totally freaking stupid. The problem is that if the game is going to try to sell you on this having emotional impact, then they need to tie Shion to them in some way. As is, it feels like a really stupid reason to make Shion self-righteously bitch as well as an excuse to try to portray Shion as this puppy-hugging saint in the face of all of her other bullshit and being a totally terrible human being. It makes absolutely no sense for her to want to risk killing uh an entire planet to save two people that she's a) never met and b) clearly aren't alive anymore. It just makes you wish the  game was written by Rob and the scene ended with her saying "NO! I WILL NOT LET YOU KILL THEM KOS-MOS" and then KOS-MOS guns her down. That would make the scene so much better. You know, I completely hate the Orphanage scene but it doesn't even compare to this pile of bullshit.
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)- This on the other hand I will abstain from ranting about. >_>
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SnowFire

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2010, 06:05:18 AM »
Don't normally vote in this since aside from pure style points, judging a scene independent from a game's overall plot strikes me as a bad proposition.  Plenty of ways for a scene to be "bad" stand-alone but be fine in the grand context of the plot.  Anyway, the failure bracket is interesting...  mostly in a "defend at least some of these scenes" way.

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)
* C&C: I don't see the complaints here.  Shion is traumatized by finding out the horrible fate of "sisters" to her childhood friend.  Afterward, she hesitates and wants to see if there's some way to save them, but with Febronia's prodding she does the right thing.  Yes technically Shion should probably be a more cold-blooded killer but plenty of RPGs pretend random encounters don't exist.  It's entirely a plausible response to be hesitant to pull the trigger here.  Now, that's not to say this plot point is perfect - it's not until XS3 we find out more about Shion's relationship with Febronia (and I'm unsure, but it's possible she DID meet C&C before?  Not sure they ever confirm or deny this), so it is kind of out of nowhere in XS2, and while a lot can be excused by "don't try to logic out futuristic fanta-tech" it's pretty weird what actual job nigh-unconscious Realians are actually performing here in the system.

* Orphanage: People always claim this plot point was out of nowhere, but it's really not.  It's not a *coincidence* that the FF8 cast hang out and were friends, they were already friends and all hung out together and just forgot the reason behind it.  They tell you as much, too (Quistis saying she must have been trying to replace Ellone, etc.).  And obviously Edea & Cid decided to recruit at least some of their kids into their new project, the Garden.  The opening song is "Liberi Fatali," fated children, after all.  The merits of the use of mass amnesia, an overused plot trope, are obviously questionable, but the Orphange scene fits.  I mean, what are the odds that the crazy AVALANCHE guy who inherited Zack's memories happens to fall into just the right church to meet Zack's old flame and the only Ancient left?  Low.  What are the odds that a bunch of childhood acquaintances whose leader became a mercenary school leader would all get recruited to mercenary school and stay friends?  Comparatively far better.  Now, there is a problem in this FF8 plot point, and that's that the "GF steals your memories" thing is *way* too subtle early on.  They should have brought it up directly and unavoidably in early Chapter 1 and laughed it off, rather than hiding it in optional background Help files.

No vote, neither one's a failure to me.

Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)

* Anise: Yes, this plot point is very frustrating.  But...  it's supposed to be.  Yes, ideally Anise would have told the party, and they'd have come up with a plan to kidnap Anise's parents, but they were established as stupid and gullible, so they'd probably have to be stuck in a prison in Keterburg or something to keep them from cluelessly wandering back.  And the Church is kind of everywhere in the world of TotA.  So...  it's frustrating she didn't try for a better solution, but not completely and utterly irrational.  And yes, Arietta comes off as more sympathetic than Anise here.  Again, I think it's intentional.  Arietta helping to try and save Ion was good, it's part of TotA's fine villain motivation and in-fighting backplots.  So yeah.  Not a failure, nice drama here, and the PCs aren't perfect.  This is a good thing.

* Justin: Okay, the one actual failure in the group.  Though I'd mostly say so with regards to expanding the scene to include the *stupidity* afterward.  I realize that they were trying to give some depth to Justin's character here, but him falling in the mud and despairing is kind of wildly out of his established character.  It's very sudden.  Get a grip, Feena's gone missing before!  The "everyone shows up to cheer Justin up" part is sappy but would be fine.  The real crime is that after all the harrumphing about how there should be another way, the characters don't actually do or think anything to find that other way!  Look, you can't just say "we need to find a new path!" and then have the new path appear literally by magic in front of you!  It has to be something you earn!  This was a deus ex machina of the worst kind.  It's no fun if the answer - which nobody in the party even has any evidence what said answer is, mind - just comes, well, because.   I'm not a fan of that entire plot thread philosophically, either.  There's no shame in searching for a better way that doesn't involve Feena sacrificing her life, but there's no guarantee there's one to be found.  This attitude held too strongly is basically just reality denial - sometimes you DO need to bite the bullet and do the bad but necessary thing, and trade one life for, um, millions.  So, yeah, fail.  In comparing Game Arts games, I always felt that Lunar managed the transition from light & fluffy plot -> serious plot better.

Dhyerwolf

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #6 on: June 21, 2010, 07:22:56 AM »
My problem with the Shion scene is that she was basically crying about bad things happening to her. She may have even said near that exact line! She's completely funneling the scene to be all about Shion when it actually doesn't have anything to do with her! All she has to do is stay out of KOS-MOS' way, but instead she whinges and sobs and initially blocks her. Even the potential context you could possibly weave into it more than dissolved by Feb flat out saying that she wants her sisters put out of their misery.

Also, Patriarch is also a giant pile of fail in this scene, as is Margulis (with only about 6 seconds of screentime!), and I find the visuals for Cecile/Cathe to be a bit gut-turning.

I agree with the other two though (But I'm guessing anyone could have at least guessed that based on what I wrote for the Anise scene. Well, the FF 8 scene is stupid by other games have far, far more improbable meetings of PCs and don't try to explain it all...like Xenosaga!!)
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Cmdr_King

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #7 on: June 21, 2010, 09:24:07 AM »
Votes later, but hey, it's 4 am and I'm not terribly tired, may as well explain the reasoning behind the Failure Bracket.  While, obviously, I took suggestions for the games here (the first match is taken from Snow and Jim, respectively, while the latter is me picking and choosing from a half dozen or so solid contenders chat gave me), I wouldn't have taken a scene I couldn't see the reasoning behind, since this is just a bonus match I picked out, not a tourney I took noms for.

So, in order.

Cecily and Cathe- I honestly didn't remember what was in this scene when I was looking for it.  When I watched it, I honestly couldn't think of a scene I thought was worse on its own merits (some manage to be worse due to being wildly out of place, or sheer cliche, or outright trolling people, but anyway).  Quite apart from the game not laying out enough story to justify Shion's actions here on an emotional level (ie why the fuck does she care THIS MUCH about two little realian girls she hasn't seen in 10 years), the real offensive bit here is that it's the culmination of Shion's immense attention whoring self pity act.  Her insistence on acting like a victim, bitching out people for the slightest offense, and doing everything in her power to hinder what any sane person knows has to be done, is a continual plot thread throughout the game.  the trick being, of course, that it's all bullshit; she CHOSE to go to Miltia, to bust KOS-MOS out of Vector's lab and reunite with the party, to dig deep into truths she was warned, repeatedly, would be difficult.  Essentially, she's not a person having an emotional reaction to an understandably difficult time, she's a spoiled little girl pouting because the universe isn't bending to her whim.
(though yes, Sergius's speech there is pretty indulgent and I consciously chose to leave it in for maximum suffering.)

Orphanage- I like the idea behind this scene.  Not only a chance for characters, seemingly tossed together by the whims of fate, to bond before a full out war that may well be... if not the END of the world, then certainly of society as they know it, should they fail.  The added level that their enemy is, in fact, a women who was like a mother to all of them reinforces the themes of the game and could be played for a great deal of story worth (they do less with it than they could, but we don't know that during the setup.)  the coincidence of it all is, ultimately, not that much greater than them being a team to start with; after all, it's well established that Garden is made up primarily of orphans from the previous Sorceress War, so why shouldn't a bunch of Garden mercenaries have lived together in their youth?  No, the part that fails is the GF stuff.  Even if you'd established it harder earlier on, it's just a stupid plot point.  Why even bother with it?  It's brought up here, then never really used again.  The idea of finding new weapons that don't eat your brain is immediately dismissed, it's never brought up significantly later, it's just this random thing in the middle of a scene that, for a lot of people, was already a bit too much.  the really bad part here, though, is that it could so easily have been done without it.  Y'know what you have to do?  Have quistis go off to the White Seed ship as a kid and come back as an instructor later.  That's it.  I mean, really.  A majority of people form few significant memories at age 5.  Friends you had that young, if they subsequently leave, are not people you'll recognize as a teenager/young adult.  And half the crew already WAS shipped off ridiculously young.  Zell was adopted, Selphie and Irvine went off to the other gardens, and... well.  Squall and Seifer already act like people who've been fighting and making peace and butting heads since they were small children.  Deleting the silly memory games just lets you write in that much more to their rivalry and complementary nature.  So as long as you don't randomly have Quistis being there, the scene can play out more or less the same but with natural human memory patterns, not random magical bullshit.

Justin Pity Party- Nothing to add here.  The start of the sequence is entirely out of character and tosses the only positive aspect of Justin's character (his optimism/pro-active nature) in favor of moaning over a girl it took him 15 hours of gameplay to realize was attractive, and the latter bit is, as some have put it, the world bending over to reward idiots.

Anise- In a vacuum, the Anise stuff makes sense.  She's all of 12, a powerful man has her parents under her thumb, she's in a very bad position.  The trouble is, Anise at no other point in the game acts 12.  She's not only mature and competent for her age, but mature and competent in general.  She's capable of handling herself in dangerous territory, acting on her own initiative to help the party, etc.  Note how she's basically Jade's go-to person when he needs to know something will get done.  So, basically, the whole thing is, again, highly out of character, and coupled with both the easy forgiveness the party shows her (while, earlier in the game, a crime of similar scope and consequence resulted in massive shunning, despite having reasons no less valid in a vacuum and considerably more reasonable when considering Luke's character) and people rather liking the character she got killed... yeah.
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dude789

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #8 on: June 21, 2010, 03:34:49 PM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF)
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III)

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #9 on: June 21, 2010, 11:02:35 PM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF)
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III)

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII) - ......
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)
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AndrewRogue

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2010, 09:03:42 AM »
Drama
Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)

Style
Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF)
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III): Nom solidarity. Honestly, while AvB had some solid action and cool effects, the general compositional elements of Transcending Love just blow it completely out of the water. It is probably my number one game opening, too. Its just awesome.

Humor
Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!
Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)
Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)

Tide

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2010, 07:56:13 PM »
Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII) - My GOD, both of these scenes are horrible failure. I mean, if these scenes went up against any other scene, they pretty much have an auto-win since they pretty much define what you should pretty much never do when story-telling. This is definitely finals worthy level failure.

Orphanage: This is largely already touched by both CK and Snowfire, and I'm largely echoing what their thoughts are regarding why this scene fails. The idea of a bunch of adopted children getting back together and fighting together isn't the part that sucks. In fact, if done appropriately, this probably would've been at least some what decent. The big issue of course was that they had to fight with someone who was like a mother to them, so setting this up in this way (and going back to Snowfire's point regarding Fated Children) is somewhat logical. On top of that, it sets a good question and the theme of 'fate' which the game even touches on I think during one of character's speech.

Where the utter failure and the eye rolling really occurs is the explanation for WHY they all forgot. I mean, its like Square pretty much went, yeah we like this idea, but how do we explain that they all forgot. And some guy, who probably smoked 2 pounds of bong went, "Let's all blame teh GFs, hurp derf". Then everyone else passed around the vodka and hired hookers and forgot to look at the scene again. My god, did that singlehandedly ruin this scene horribly.

First off, not only is this non-sensial gibberish, but it is never hinted at during the normal course of the game. It's pretty much a random plot point that you would only know if you searched around on the Help files/background files of FF8. Second, this point is never touched upon ever again. It's not like this point appears somewhere else and redeems itself. It's just literally "a wizard did it". They could've done something interesting since it was a question of whether or not it was a worthwhile trade for power. And finally, the characters also don't act like they care. The only one that does is Selphie. There is a bit of a problem here in that if you expect the player to care, you should probably make the characters act like they care too. When your main character goes, "lol, so?", you are probably not going to sell the idea. In Chinese, there is an idiom that goes, "Drawing feet on a snake". This scene is exactly that. If they just left it and said the characters forgot because of natural memory, this scene would be less of lolfest. Still, there was some semblance of hope as opposed to...


Cecily and Cathe: This mess. Jesus. I had to remind myself about this scene because the failure is just so great that I simply refuse to remember it. It doesn't matter if you watch this scene IN context, or out of context. It still sucks. They wanted to play off of Shion and try to make it seem that this was such a huge important emotional decision and they come off with nothing but a bitchy, whiny, attention-seeking whore of a main character as a result.

What I really don't like about this scene is that not only does it fail at selling to you the idea, it would still be pretty shitty even if it does succeed. The problem is they keep trying to make Shion seem like this almighty goddess of a matyr. And kinda failing horribly at it. As a result, this scene comes off as nothing but a bunch of whining from Shion. There's little explanation for the player to understand Shion's supposed attachment. And just when you thought it couldn't get any worse, she bawls on the ground crying about how nothing goes her way because she wanted these two people to live at the expense of everyone else. All these with little explanation. Fail XS writers.

You know, the scene failing is one thing, but even if it succeeded, the only thing it would've done to me is make Shion appear more of the ^_^ goddess that the game keeps trying to sell you on. And that just makes me sick, because if anything XS2 solidifed Shion as a horrible human being from that first scene she has with Jin.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2010, 08:03:13 PM by Tide »
<napalmman> In Suikoden I, In Chinchirorin, what is it called when you roll three of the same number?
<@Claude> yahtzee

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Cmdr_King

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2010, 08:46:29 PM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)- Well y'know.  In the absence of my true favorites, I'm probably going to vote Xenogears over other games.
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)- Bad end didn't do much for me.  Mostly... hm.  Like, the way the scene plays out, Souji being angry enough to do it doesn't feel right; Namatame is just so utterly terrified it's pathetic, it's too obvious that SOMETHING isn't adding up, y'know?

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF)- Not even the coolest fusion!
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III)- All else being equal, better music.

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)- I kinda feel bad, both for forgetting to nom this scene in the first place and because I essentially set the Gau scene (which is cute in its own way) a completely lopsided opponent due to the quirks of this division.
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera- Eh.  Since both of these are tsundere lashing out, I'll just go with the character I like more.

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)- Eh, Rasputin's hamminess deserves better than a TOTAL shutout (plus I nommed it.)

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)- See above rant.
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)- So these both fail for more or less the same reason.  Difference is, Anise was something I just sorta went with when actually playing the game, but when other people commented I thought "huh, yeah, that was pretty stupid".  Justin's angstfest meanwhile I remember offending me at the time.
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Excal

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2010, 09:36:57 PM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears) - This is close enough to me that I have no issue saying that nom solidarity and LP Voice-Over hate are tie breaking for me.
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4) - For all that I like Persona 4, it's endings are pretty bad.  Especially since the way everyone goes on, and on about 'Nanako-chan' means that she has managed the impressive feat of being a character I dislike despite not only being likable, but also being a freaking vegetable with no character revelations in the span of time I started disliking her.

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF) - Erm...  is there something to the Four Way Fusion beyond just a big X?
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III) - It says something that this is probably my least favourite Suikoden opening.  Definately fighting with 5 for that honour.

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III) - Deserves love.
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera - Not an especially strong match.

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII) - Orphanage never bothered me much.
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss) - Y'know, I never had an issue with Justin being depressed here.  After all, not only has he generally been a pest and useless, but by this point he's also screwed up their best hope for stopping Gaia.  He should be depressed.  My issue is with everyone saying that no, he is in fact utterly awesome, just because he is who he is, and then lo and behold a magical gate shows up and lets him save the world, despite things being as bad as they are partially because of him.  And the only thing with the sense to say otherwise is the damn bird.

DjinnAndTonic

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2010, 01:30:23 AM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears) - I've never really formed any kind of attachment to Teo, despite his importance to the plot and to Tir. Fei, while angsty, I at least was able to see where he was coming from and really appreciate the impact of this scene and how it all fits into the game's twisty Freudian plot. More simply, both scenes protray the same thing, but XG's focus is more suited to this kind of scene.
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF) - Just as a style thing, TWEWY is chock full of it. This final fusion scene is the culmination of the entire game's theme of depending on your comrades. So yes, on its own, it's a little meh, but there's a lot leading up to it that gives this scene a lot of style and meaning.
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III) - As much as I love S3's opening, AvB was like the coolest thing I'd ever seen in a video game up to that point. And it still ranks pretty highly to me. Dragon versus Sword-Castle with fire and pretty white feathers everywhere. It's pretty.

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III) - The Gau scene is funnier than I remembered, but... Branky's strangest is just too much.
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera - I remembered being really amused by this scene while playing DDS. I think a lot of it has to do with the juxtasposition of DDS's always-serious mood with this out-of-nowhere lighthearted scene. The game really needed a few more lighthearted moments (that didn't involve random Jamaican stereotype jokes).

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night) - (in SMBM voice) NO CONTEST!

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII) - Just wanted to add that XS1 made a fairly big deal of C&C during the encephalon dive of flashbacks. Feb shows up and gives the cast the hint that they need to save C&C to advance the plot find the Zohar. This scene is so unimportant to the outcome of XS1 that it's really easy to forget, but it's basically Shion's only 'mission' going into XS2. It just takes them another game full of family drama to finally let her complete the mission. However, Shion fails at her one real mission in XS2, as evidenced by this scene. The fact that Jr. is the main character during this game really doesn't do Shion any favors, since it makes this whole scene seem out of place (it is). Honestly, this scene might have worked if it was part of XS1 and they let Jr. continue his job as main character for all the Space-Pope-related things in this scene.
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss) - Both have been talked about at length.

Talaysen

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2010, 02:01:57 AM »
Drama

Teo's Death Scene (Suikoden) vs Karen's Sacrifice (Xenogears)
Zack's Last Stand (Crisis Core: Final Fantasy VII) vs Bad End (Persona 4)

Style

Four Way Fusion (The World Ends with You) vs Edna meets Fear (Wild ARMs XF)
Alexander vs Bahamut (Final Fantasy IX) vs Transcending Love (Suikoden III)

Humor

Gau Dressup Party (Final Fantasy VI) vs Branky is a bad boy (Suikoden III)
Love Hotel (Persona 3) vs Argilla Cosplays Sera

This ends HYAH!  IN-DIG-WRONGNESS!

Asmodeus, King of the Demons (Shadow Hearts: Covenant) vs What is a Man?! (Castlevania: Symphony of the Night)

Utter Faiure Double Bonus Division (Standard Failure rules apply.  Vote for the suckier/more offensive video)

Cecily and Cathe (Xenosaga: Jenseits von Gut und Bose) vs Orphanage (Final Fantasy VIII)
Justin's Pity Party (Grandia) vs Anise (Tales of the Abyss)

Meeplelard

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Re: Best Scenes Round 10: Three... two... one... GO!
« Reply #16 on: June 28, 2010, 01:05:27 AM »
VOTING CLOSED TALLYING UP SCORES LONG LIVE DAIRY PRODUCTS
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A