Author Topic: Halloween battle: lost hope  (Read 732 times)

DragonKnight Zero

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Halloween battle: lost hope
« on: December 03, 2018, 02:40:33 AM »
The conclusion of the series of battles draws near with the last four teams still in.  Puppeteers get the short straw of fighting the undefeated ghosts so if they win, there may be a 3-way faceoff in the future.

Ghosts: Pamela Ibis (MK), Wraith (VP), Auron (FFX)
vs
Puppeteers: Elize (ToX), Gepetto with Spikes and Mind's Eye (SH2), Mel with Lightning Rune (Suiko3)

Robots: Asgard (WA3?), Tio with option of Tight Robe (Grandia2), Zero (MMX: CM)
vs
Pirates: Rufus (VP2?), Pirate (BD), Aika with Purity Shard (SoA)

Bonus: Malik's Story Time

  Wild Arms 3 players may remember Malik as the prophet who loved his mama to such an extent to be disturbing and creepy.  To further reinforce the image of a psychopath man-child, he summons bosses based on fairy tales, nursery rhymes, and kid's stories to battle Virginia's crew.  This is the crew the four defeated teams will be facing in the DL simulator.

  The opponents will be fought as a series of continuous battles without a break in between fights.  First up will be the Bremen town musicians consisting of Donkey, Hound, Cat, and Flier.  They've dropped the musical act and have decided to stick to brawling.  Next up are Humpty and Dumpty and it will take more than dropping them off a height to crack them.  Following them are twisted versions of Dorothy's companions from the Wizard of Oz: Scarecrow, Steamgear, and Lionheart.  Don't confuse them with their competent forms from the Wizard of Oz game.  Teams that make it through the series will have the privilege of giving the psychopathic man-child himself a well-earned spanking.

  Malik's summons are scrubs and the teams will be more than a match for them.  Thus, victory in the bonus match will be based on which team wins the series of fights most decisively.  Use your own criteria for what constitutes decisive.

Teams, for reference
Werecreatures: Rei (BoF3), Bob with Water Rune (Suiko2), Kevin (SD3)
Demons: Beatrice (WA3), prinny Kurtis (Disgaea), Laharl (Disgaea)
Witches: Lulu (FFX), Thage (EP), Arche (ToP)
Vampires: Hida (SH3), Joachim (SH2), Asellus (Saga)

- Werecreatures growl, rip, and tear their way past the storybook brigade.
- Demons demonstrate why they're the top of the netherworld food chain.
- Witches work their arcane spells to dominate the field.
- Vampires drain the opposition dry and give Malik even more reason to fear the night.
- Malik.  All four teams meet defeat in the special battle.

Random Consonant

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Re: Halloween battle: lost hope
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2018, 11:42:48 PM »
The main event:
well rip my ability to vote

Bonus: Malik's Story Time

Well the good news for The Really Terrible Version of the Orchestral Army That Actually Came First is that they're all on the right side of average speed.  The bad news is uh everything else.  ~10HKO damage and basically oneshotted by average damage, no one struggles against these things.

Werecreatures, that said, have their issues of backloaded damage on full display here, as none of them can actually oneshot on their first turn, so they have to focus fire.  To boot, they're pretty much locked to single target.
Nightmare inflicts perfect accuracy sleep, you say?  As the animals only heavily resist it, Beatrice goes to town here and carries Team Demons.  She might be getting outsped here but who cares?
Witches are all capable enough here, they're getting outsped but certainly aren't lacking offense.  Arche can take them out all at once with Meteor Storm which is enough to put them in a tie with the demons, it's not like any resources were taxed here.
So there's a bit of a problem with Team Vampires in that I don't actually recall the extent of their AoE skills (well, also they're all close to average speed at first).  So they might not be able to claim the same level of annihilation Teams Demons and Witches can.  They still have AoE capable enough of putting down the opposition though, so they're still ahead of Team Werecreatures.

(Demons(3.5)=Witches(3.5)>Vampires(2)>Werecreatures(1))

Okay since apparently we don't have Humpty stats, they're apparently literally the same as Dumpty's but with reversed resists (so, weak to Dark, nulls Light) and he has Shield, Protect, Critical Heal, and Reflect.  So about average durability and slightly below average speed.  Anyways Dumpty 4HKOs and is MT.

Werecreatures will take some licks which will prompt some Water Rune useage but don't seem too bad here apart from the risk of Rei fucking up?  They'll want to blitz down Dumpty first but they should be able to do that.
Demons have a stronger start, as their combined offense can take out one of the two, but it's a question as to whether or not Beatrice outspeeds Humpty and Dumpty.  If she can, Demons are pretty much top here, if not, they'll have to take a hit.  Still, in worst case this is a better performance than Team Werecreatures.
So Humpty can throw up Reflect, and while WA3 reflect is, IIRC, not great, Team Witches are not a fan of it.  Lulu certainly isn't fast enough and Arche doesn't have dark damage so... Thage to the rescue?  Looking at the stat topic EP's practical speed spread is probably weak enough that I'd respect Thage beating out -0.05 SD speed and it looks like some form of Malus blows up the 3x Dark Weak Humpty nicely enough.  So they eat one Dumpty spell which doesn't harm Thage at all and shouldn't drop anyone else.  I'll actually give Witches the nod here, since I don't think Beatrice actually does outspeed.
(Slim, which I assumed in the previous fight as well) Hilda and Asellus are both faster, and their combined offense should take down one of the eggs.  So, they suffer exactly 0 attacks.  Yeah, the best here.
(Witches (6.5) > Vampires (6) > Demons (5.5) > Werecreatures (2))

Determining WA3 boss durability is a rather dark art at this point, but personally I'd rate the Wizard of Oz rejects in roughly the same ballpark as the musician animals (okay Steamgear is a bit above and Leonhardt somewhat below).  They do have better tricks, but still, they're on the wrong side of the speed average.

Werecreatures do not like confuse, so Steamgear is probably their first target.  They should be able to focus them down one at a time, but they'll still take a few hits, as usual.
Beatrice just scoffs at any attempt the Wizard of Oz rejects make to be relevent.  Laharl and Kurtis do things because why not, it's not like their SP was taxed considering they rode off of Beatrice carrying.
Leonhardt has auto-reflect!  But is he durable enough that Thage can't say "fuck it" and smack him to death with a book?  Honestly, to me, he's probably not.  Which leaves the other two.  Scarecrow has terrible accuracy and is probably putting Reflect up on himself first thing.  Meteor Storm might outspeed but it might not, I dunno, ARPGs, man.  Anyways Thage blocks confusion apparently even if Psychedelicor bypassed her magic immunity and it's not turn 1 against Lulu so this feels like the team has things in hand.  I mean, Thage will still probably have to hit Scarecrow with a book multiple times, but with how inaccurate he is, it hardly matters.
Vampires are just straight up better than the witches here, I think?  Asellus just straight up takes out Steamgear first thing and then nothing ever matters.
(Vampires (10) > Witches (8.5) = Demons (8.5) > Werecreatures (3))

We all know and love to mock Malik.

Well Rei has Slow, at least.  A pity then, that it's not even remotely 100% accurate and if he actually gets tagged with Misery before sticking it, well, that's going to be terrible.  As in, could concieveably lose terrible.
If she gets here in good enough shape, Beatrice should have no problems trolling the fuck out of Malik beating Malik in a slugfest, even with Malik trying to be annoying with confuse and turning the MIGHT OF DISGAEA BASIC PHYSICALS against her.  Which she'll have to do, since her teammates are useless here.  However, the enemies beforehand would probably just focus fire on Beatrice and that damage does add up.  So that is a bit of an if.
Thage probably doesn't give a shit about anything Malik can do, and even if she did, Malik can only screw over one PC at a time and the other two are more than capable of blowing his ass up six ways to Sunday.
Lifesprinkler ignores evasion, you say?  Anyways, the Valentines both have magic damage, so even if Malik takes Asellus out of the fight first, it doesn't really matter much, at worst it just takes longer than the Witches would so...
(Vampires (13) > Witches (12.5) > Demons (10.5) > (Werecreatures (4)).

While I could be argued since some of these are quite close and is somewhat based on my lowish WA3 boss respect, Vampires take it, if barely.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2018, 11:45:16 PM by Random Consonant »

SnowFire

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Re: Halloween battle: lost hope
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2018, 03:31:14 AM »
Ghosts > Pupeteers.  You have to see Elize & Mel killing Wraith before it goes, but I really doubt that even without Auron breaking something inconvenient, and Elize's defensive shenanigans if she goes that way will be enough to save her but not her teammates.  Zombie Slash also an interesting option if the defensive stuff is really feared.

Random's kneejerk looks fine to me except I might be inclined to go for Witches instead off general more respect?  Vamps or Witches, not Malik, basically.

DragonKnight Zero

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Re: Halloween battle: lost hope
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2018, 03:46:59 AM »
Ghosts vs Puppeteers

That naughty Auron, initiative breaking someone's offense when the other side wants to take out Wraith fast, fast, fast.  It seems the only way ghosts will lose this is if Pamela decides she doesn't want to be around her uncute teammates any longer and leaves, inducing a loss by forfeit.

Robots vs Pirates

Tio's most likely ditching the Tight Robe since her opponents' damage is mostly physical.  I'll get back to you on this one.

Bonus

Some scattered thoughts:

The musician animals are all fragile.  They tend to spend most of their turns on effect magic and I'm inclined to hold their wacky AI against them, including the tendency for Hound to cast Decelerate and Flier to dispel it.  Decelerate can be a nuisance if you see it sticking around in further fights but even at that worst it wears off on its own.

Werecreatures: I'm assuming Warrior Monk for Kevin though maybe God Hand is better.  Main tradeoffs are MT healing and Leaf Saber or Aura Wave and MT Lv3 tech.  If the animals were smart, they wouldn't bother damaging Kevin and triggering werewolf attack up but I don't think they're that smart.  Anyways, punch out Donkey, then the rest ending with Flier.  Takes a few rounds, longer if stalling for speed down to fade, but no risk of losing.

Demons: I see the sleep resistance checked after Nightmare's accuracy so not as potent for me.  Still, odds favor Beatrice tagging someone.  Donkey dies to a Blazing Knuckle and most likely hurts someone else.  Kurtis + Beatrice damage will finish off at least one more.  Disgaea demons do need to conserve SP; they'll need it more in later rounds.

Witches; Blows them up.  Quick and easy.

Vampires: See Random's comments.  Nothing to add.

I give Humpty and Dumpty a bit more durability due to a different upgrade progression when I play.  Humpty has his Critical Heal, Shield, Protect, and Reflect.  I'm holding Humpty to his AI so he'll only cast support spells on himself and Critical Heal only when Dumpty falls below a certain HP threshhold.  Which is not fully known but guessing somewhere in the 50-60% range.

Werecreatures: Kevin should have a tech ready to rip.  At worst, they take one Dumpty attack to trigger werewolf's attack boost and then blow him up.  Between Kevin and Bob, they have enough healing.

Demons: May need to use the costlier moves to put out enough burst damage.  Kurtis is going to get hurt worse if Dumpty gets an attack off due to his random elemental weakness and Dumpty's elemental coverage.

Witches: Do any of them have light damage?  Lulu's Dualcast is well suited to unloading lots of damage in a short span so they have no trouble taking out Dumpty.  Humpty's Reflect is a nuisance but it's no danger alone.

Vampires: Refer to Random again.  Nothing to add and draining attacks on Humpty put them in a healthy state for the next round.

Wizard of Oz reject squad up next.  Leonhardt has Critical Heal and appears to be able to use it at will.  Has auto-reflect but is also weak to every element and has low HP.  Scarecrow's AI prioritizes putting Reflect on itself over all else and I'm holding it to that.  Given how inaccurate it's ID is, I see it as turn 3 on non-evasive opponents.  Any opposition with dispel magic can troll it for ages.  Steamgear is less dangerous only having single target confuse and I'm not inclined to see it as usable on turn 1 either.

WA3 Reflect is pretty good, turning away harmful magic while letting beneficial spells through.  In game, only works on Arcana.  Enemy unique skills fly right past it.  Will still reflect MT Arcana.

Werecreatures: They can muster up the damage to put down Leonhardt.  Not sure if they have the offense to down the others quick enough.  Confusion is bad but going after Steamgear gives Scarecrow time to down someone.  Probably still win but with a member KOed.

Demons: Blazing Knuckle may be enough to take out Leonhardt but if that's not enough, adding Kurtis' Nuclear Fusion and Nightmare will do it.  There's no damage listed for Nuclear Fusion but it has the same base power as a regular physical, just fire element and MT.  Could conceivably lose if they blew their SP on earlier rounds but otherwise win in 1 or 2 sets of attacks.

Witches: Surely Arche and Thage have reflect-piercing magic.  Lulu can't do much against reflect so she blows up Steamgear with dualcast Thundaga.

Vampires: Not familiar enough to gauge their performance here.

Malik needs a spanking.  For once, I'm not holding him to AI.  I'm leaning Yggdrasil form here which does nothing but spam Tri-Disaster on Gallows over and over if he's not hit with speed down.

Werecreatures: As Random noted, silencing Rei shuts them down.  God Hand Kevin can still hurt Malik with Aura Wave + Lv 3 tech but he's getting statused next if he's still alive at this point.

Beatrice: Also could lose here.  Malik's better off ignoring confusion tricks and just slugging down Beatrice.  She'd win if healthy but has taken some hits from previous rounds.

Witches: Magic damage, you say?  Boom.

Vampires: Have enough offense to blitz, status protected or not.

Undecided for the moment, either Witches or Vampires.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2018, 11:28:49 PM by DragonKnight Zero »