Futurama 2019 Week 2

[Cmdr_King]

Godlike

Tibarn (Fire Emblem Series) vs Goro Akechi (Persona 5)
Fou-lu (Breath of Fire IV) vs Leonhardt (Lorence Belgar) (The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky)
Reicher Wallach (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Rean Schwarzer (The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel II)
Chris Lightfellow (Suikoden III) vs Chezni (Paladin’s Quest)

Heavy

Tana (Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones) vs Leo (Fire Emblem Fates)
Yuffie Kisaragi (Final Fantasy VII) vs Rita Mordio (Tales of Vesperia)
Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millennium) vs Hawke (Romancing SaGa)
Rose (Legend of Dragoon) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)


Middle

Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together)
Jeane (Suikoden Series) vs Ursula (Final Fantasy IV: The After Years)
Bowser (Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars) vs Nightburn Acklund (Wild ARMs 5)
Chloe Hertzog (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Shulk (Xenoblade Chronicles)


Light

Tear Grants (Tales of the Abyss) vs Primrose Azelhart (Octopath Traveler)
Lilianne Valendorf (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Kamil (The 7th Saga)
Miriel (Fire Emblem Awakening) vs Otome Yanagiya (Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor 2)
Ft. Hurricane (Xenogears) vs Cyrus Albright (Octopath Traveler)

[Pyro]

Godlike

Tibarn (Fire Emblem Series) vs Goro Akechi (Persona 5)
Fou-lu (Breath of Fire IV) vs Leonhardt (Lorence Belgar) (The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky): Fou gets past all his tricks and smites him.
Reicher Wallach (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Rean Schwarzer (The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel II): I wonder if Reicher was immune to delay.
Chris Lightfellow (Suikoden III) vs Chezni (Paladin’s Quest): Kinda feels like cheating, but bottle and spells and physical slugging.

Heavy

Tana (Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones) vs Leo (Fire Emblem Fates)
Yuffie Kisaragi (Final Fantasy VII) vs Rita Mordio (Tales of Vesperia): Immune to Fatal Strike and 2HKOs? Don't know what I think of ToV thesee days
Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millennium) vs Hawke (Romancing SaGa): ID?
Rose (Legend of Dragoon) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)


Middle

Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together)
Jeane (Suikoden Series) vs Ursula (Final Fantasy IV: The After Years)
Bowser (Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars) vs Nightburn Acklund (Wild ARMs 5)
Chloe Hertzog (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Shulk (Xenoblade Chronicles)


Light

Tear Grants (Tales of the Abyss) vs Primrose Azelhart (Octopath Traveler)
Lilianne Valendorf (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Kamil (The 7th Saga)
Miriel (Fire Emblem Awakening) vs Otome Yanagiya (Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor 2)
Ft. Hurricane (Xenogears) vs Cyrus Albright (Octopath Traveler)

[Dark Holy Elf]

Godlike

nope

Heavy

Tana (Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones) vs Leo (Fire Emblem Fates): Evade + hitting the right defensive stat.


Middle

Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together): Crono 3HKOs with magic, Mirdyn obviously doesn't 2HKO first... but he can probably sneak in a Heal on turn 2, which pushes Crono to a 4HKO. But Crono surely 4-3's so Heal doesn't matter.
Jeane (Suikoden Series) vs Ursula (Final Fantasy IV: The After Years): I mathed this out and figured out Jeane would win, then noticed Ursula resists lightning by 70%. Never mind.
Bowser (Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars) vs Nightburn Acklund (Wild ARMs 5): Faster and more durable, and no less damaging. It's a more interesting fight if Fear is seen as working but I think Nightburn still pulls it out even then.

Light

Tear Grants (Tales of the Abyss) vs Primrose Azelhart (Octopath Traveler): I think Primrose falls juuust short of OHKOing on turn 3, but of course manages it if she tosses in any damage before, which forces Tear to stay healed. So Tear tosses in one shot of damage and one shot of healing, and Primrose can then heal-lock her... except she needs to rebuff since once Peacock wears off she can't effectively heal-lock any more. And if Tear sneaks in one more shot of damage she wins. If Primrose reaches 5 BP she can 2HKO through the healing if buffed with 3-charge Waltz + 4-charge Waltz buut that's turn 5-6 and requires she buff a second time.
Ft. Hurricane (Xenogears) vs Cyrus Albright (Octopath Traveler): The giant mobile aerial battleship should have studied harder.

[Dhyerwolf]

Godlike
Fou-lu (Breath of Fire IV) vs Leonhardt (Lorence Belgar) (The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky)- Physical wall versus physicals
Reicher Wallach (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Rean Schwarzer (The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel II)- Uh, right, that delay thing is a good question.

Heavy

Yuffie Kisaragi (Final Fantasy VII) vs Rita Mordio (Tales of Vesperia)
Rose (Legend of Dragoon) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)- Huh, Rose in Heavy? Unless you let her start with SP...


Middle

Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together)
Jeane (Suikoden Series) vs Ursula (Final Fantasy IV: The After Years)
Bowser (Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars) vs Nightburn Acklund (Wild ARMs 5)
Chloe Hertzog (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Shulk (Xenoblade Chronicles)- I can vote on this...but XB gives me a headache (both playing the game and trying to remember how it really shakes out DL wise)

[Random Consonant]

Godlike

Tibarn (Fire Emblem Series) vs Goro Akechi (Persona 5) - Tibarn doesn't one-round but it doesn't matter unless you see Tetrakarn stopping both hits of a double and honestly I find that a hard sell, Akechi going for offense is problematic between Tibarn's evade+Pavise and Heat Riser can only get him so far.
Fou-lu (Breath of Fire IV) vs Leonhardt (Lorence Belgar) (The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky) - Yeah this isn't Loewe's match.
Reicher Wallach (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Rean Schwarzer (The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel II) - I don't recall Reicher being particularly delayable or breakable.  I don't doubt that you COULD do it, but I have problems seeing him as vulnerable enough.  On the other hand, Rean doesn't cope well with Remote Mine and Reicher's durability is a bit much for Valimar to chew through.
Chris Lightfellow (Suikoden III) vs Chezni (Paladin’s Quest) - So I don't think I allow bottles but Chezni honestly may well outslug anyways since Chris needs to put up SL to not die to Spirit and his physical hits weirdly hard due to PQ's gloriously fucked up averages, plus he's faster than her when they're both straight attacking.

Heavy

Tana (Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones) vs Leo (Fire Emblem Fates)
Rose (Legend of Dragoon) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)


Middle

Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together)
Jeane (Suikoden Series) vs Ursula (Final Fantasy IV: The After Years)
Bowser (Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars) vs Nightburn Acklund (Wild ARMs 5) - Unfortunately the King of Awesome is no match for Hank Scorpio.


Light

Lilianne Valendorf (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Kamil (The 7th Saga) - Don't think Kamil can take this unless there's something I'm missing?  He's bad against magic, Vacuum should fail pretty hard against Lily's magic stat, her SP should be able to outlast his MP, and his damage is a fair bit below average so he shouldn't be 2HKOing (and he's got accuracy issues and isn't fast to boot).
Miriel (Fire Emblem Awakening) vs Otome Yanagiya (Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor 2) - 2HKOs, isn't 2HKO'd back, shouldn't be triggering counters with dances, and being two points of AGI below average really shouldn't be enough to get doubled by Miriel.

[superaielman]

Heavy

Yuffie Kisaragi (Final Fantasy VII) vs Rita Mordio (Tales of Vesperia)
Rose (Legend of Dragoon) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)- Don't allow SP. Rose is barely a Middle, let alone a Heavy.





Middle

Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together)
Jeane (Suikoden Series) vs Ursula (Final Fantasy IV: The After Years)- Thunder defense.

Light

Lilianne Valendorf (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Kamil (The 7th Saga)- Lily can block ID, not that she really needs to do so. His ID fails hard against magic defense and he's slow. On top of that he's weak to ice! Yeah, not happening.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Tibarn (Fire Emblem Series) vs Goro Akechi (Persona 5) - Tibarn doubles, goes first and rips over 70% of Akechi's health off the first turn alone. The only way Goro even remotely has a chance is if you see Tetrakarn stopping the double and I'm honestly not inclined to.

Heavy

lolnope

Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together) - yep

Tear Grants (Tales of the Abyss) vs Primrose Azelhart (Octopath Traveler) - Burping Elfboy!
Lilianne Valendorf (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Kamil Dowonna (The 7th Saga) - Kamil, Kamil, Kamil. His skillset looks Heavy-calibur, but then you get to look at his actual stats. The status is actually awful because his Magic is junk (it gets even worse against Lily, since her magic is actually close to game-best), his magic durability is Tidus-level, his damage has potency and accuracy issues and he's also kind of slow. Lily just 2HKOs him first and lasts long enough to break the heal-lock: Kamil has four shots of healing total.
Ft. Hurricane (Xenogears) vs Cyrus Albright (Octopath Traveler) - It's time machines learned their lesson.

[Tide]

Godlike
Reicher Wallach (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Rean Schwarzer (The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel II) - Reicher can definitely tank through a Valimar assault, so Rean's main chance here is opt for Delaying. Problem is, I'm pretty sure Reicher has Delay resistance (it's pretty hard to push him back) and as noted by Random, Rean really doesn't like Remote Mines. If he had more evade, maybe. As is though, I doubt Rean manages to get a big enough Delay number to stop Reicher from getting a turn.

Heavy
Tana (Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones) vs Leo (Fire Emblem Fates) - Tana kinda counters Leo's build.
Yuffie Kisaragi (Final Fantasy VII) vs Rita Mordio (Tales of Vesperia) - If nothing else, Yuffie is faster and definitely 2HKOs. Rita has to worry about dodging a limit too. Even a L1 Clear Tranquil is bad.


Middle
Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together) - Pretty sure NEB's right. Mirdyn gets 4-3'd so Crono overwhelms on a double by casting Lightning 2 twice.
Bowser (Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars) vs Nightburn Acklund (Wild ARMs 5) - Nightburn is faster. I think I do see Fear working here (since Nightburn gets hit by stat downs in his game), but I think losing turn 1 is too much here.
Chloe Hertzog (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Shulk (Xenoblade Chronicles) - Unless you allow Chloe the ID weapon, she has no way to bust pass Shulk's limit. Given the fact that Shulk has a couple of ways here to shut Chloe down from doing any damage at all (Monado Shield reduces unique skill damage to 1 and  Armor cuts all damage by 75% - which means she's a sitting duck during this time), she has to actually be able to survive a Shulk attack string and I'm not sure about that. Chloe has no way to heal, has bad P.dur and even assuming she can survive one, Glorious Future instantly fills up Shulk's meter. So unless you see Chloe doubling at some point it's possible she just puts Shulk back into another limit, meaning he just wins through defensive stalling. Blame MK2 base physicals being awful for this one.


Light
Miriel (Fire Emblem Awakening) vs Otome Yanagiya (Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor 2) - I was all set to vote Miriel, but then got reminded Dances are AoE and avoid counters. Whoops. And yeah, minor speed below average should prevent a doubling which is all Miriel has if she hopes to win.

[SnowFire]

Tibarn (Fire Emblem Series) vs Goro Akechi (Persona 5)
I'm not quite so sure as everyone else, and that's with being quite happy disrespecting the hell out of Tetrakarn (maybe make it reflect 1/4 of an attack or something).  P5 bosses are pretty darn tanky, and if seen as tanky enough, Heat Riser strats start getting pretty potent.  That said, eh, whatever, let's assume Tear kicks in fast enough.
Fou-lu (Breath of Fire IV) vs Leonhardt (Lorence Belgar) (The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky)
Yeah, Fou is like the perfect Loewe spoiler.  Powerful MT damage and resists physicals to stop clone shenanigans from geting anywhere.  Loewe does have non-elemental magic but it's slower than his other moves and not really that damaging anyway.

Chris Lightfellow (Suikoden III) vs Chezni (Paladin’s Quest)
I didn't play Paladin's Quest, but insert skepticism about taking the stat topic averages naively here, seems like including pre-evo Pokemon in averages which sure, makes endgame characters godlike.  (Same issue as Radiata Stories, although Jack would make Godlike anyway at least.)

Heavy

Tana (Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones) vs Leo (Fire Emblem Fates)


Middle

Crono (Chrono Trigger) vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together)
Lightning > Knights in heavy armor.

Light

Tear Grants (Tales of the Abyss) vs Primrose Azelhart (Octopath Traveler)
Elf's argument sounds right to me.
Miriel (Fire Emblem Awakening) vs Otome Yanagiya (Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor 2)
Random's argument sounds right to me.
Ft. Hurricane (Xenogears) vs Cyrus Albright (Octopath Traveler)
Lightning > Robots.

[superaielman]

Lilianne Valendorf (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Kamil Dowonna (The 7th Saga) - Kamil, Kamil, Kamil. His skillset looks Heavy-calibur, but then you get to look at his actual stats. The status is actually awful because his Magic is junk (it gets even worse against Lily, since her magic is actually close to game-best), his magic durability is Tidus-level, his damage has potency and accuracy issues and he's also kind of slow. Lily just 2HKOs him first and lasts long enough to break the heal-lock: Kamil has four shots of healing total.

Kamil is so bad. He's got cast worst durability in practice due to that wonderful AGI/HP combo and also is weak to ID because of bad vacuum defense. Lejes might be worse in the DL due to no healing and appalling physical defense, but at least he has decent accuracy. When a naked orange alien who is at the L/M borderline is better than you by a notable margin, you done fucked up.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

P5 bosses are pretty darn tanky

Nnnnnooooot really by the time you fight Akechi. His duelling form has like 5k HP and that's frankly not impressive by Palace 7 standards (OK pinpoints average damage at the 400+ benchmark, which feels pretty accurate to my experience and may well be a bit under the radar, since Auto-Taru/Mataru and Debilitate both exist at this point and Charge/Concentrate both are factors as well) - I think it's pretty telling that I vote on FE9 Tibarn and I see him having a very comfortable victory here, no real need for skill procs. They have a bunch of forms parsed by formchains of very sketchy legality, mainly, but I'm not going to toss Persona bosses any bones when they already translate obnoxiously well and are kneejerk overrated historically. In P5 particularly, you can stack damage boosts insanely enough that their durability in practice comes more from cutscenes that take years than the actual fights.

Kamil is so bad. He's got cast worst durability in practice due to that wonderful AGI/HP combo and also is weak to ID because of bad vacuum defense. Lejes might be worse in the DL due to no healing and appalling physical defense, but at least he has decent accuracy. When a naked orange alien who is at the L/M borderline is better than you by a notable margin, you done fucked up.

Giving Kamil HP barely better than Esuna/Valsu was a CHOICE to begin with, but the overall stat spread is a tragedy. Olvan does the jack of all trades schtick a lot better in spite of being meant as more of a physical build/tank just because he actually had the sense to reroll when the dice gave him junk bases all over. Kamil's build is just inexplicable, they decided palpably below average across the board was good enough for a balanced build.

[Random Consonant]

P5 bosses are pretty darn tanky

Yeah no, this doesn't apply to Akechi, who has half the raw HP of either the Masses Transformer or Shirtless Char formchains and close to half that of Palace 6's boss after scaling is applied and no reason to view any part of his ingame formchain as valid in the DL.  Lategame nu-Persona offense gets pretty high and there's very little reason to pretend it's lower than the cited 400 figure (which, as Snow says is pretty accurate) in a world where Mataurkaja (in Auto- form, no less) exists.  The durability is (probably) good enough that he at least belongs in Godlike in spite of going second against basically everything (which is more than you can say for the nu-Persona boss he more or less copies) but there's a clear level of damage+durability combo he simply can't handle.

I didn't play Paladin's Quest

And yet you feel qualified to make an invalid analogy here.

hint: it's not putting un-evo'd pokemon into the averages, it's putting evo'd pokemon who never get a moveset worth a damn into the averages (which is pretty much exactly Gen1 right there), PQ is about as balanced as ko.

[Dhyerwolf]

Same issue as Radiata Stories, although Jack would make Godlike anyway at least.

The funny thing about this is that RS keeps throwing scrub damage PCs your way right up until the end (Adele! Thanos! Patrick! Putt! Star! Ursula! Genius!), although certainly not as frequent as at the beginning so there still would be some effect at cutting off at some point.

[Cmdr_King]

Godlike

Tibarn (Fire Emblem Series)- iii vs Goro Akechi (Persona 5)
Fou-lu (Breath of Fire IV)- iiii vs Leonhardt (Lorence Belgar) (The Legend of Heroes: Trails in the Sky)
Reicher Wallach (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy)- ii vs Rean Schwarzer (The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel II)
Chris Lightfellow (Suikoden III) vs Chezni (Paladin’s Quest)- ii

Heavy

Tana (Fire Emblem: Sacred Stones)- iiii vs Leo (Fire Emblem Fates)
Yuffie Kisaragi (Final Fantasy VII)- iiii vs Rita Mordio (Tales of Vesperia)
Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millennium)- i vs Hawke (Romancing SaGa)
Rose (Legend of Dragoon)- i vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)- i 3:26 PM] BOTRPBot: @CmdrKing rolled 2.


Middle

Crono (Chrono Trigger)- iiiiii vs Mirdyn Walhorn (Tactics Ogre: Let Us Cling Together)
Jeane (Suikoden Series) vs Ursula (Final Fantasy IV: The After Years)- iiii
Bowser (Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars) vs Nightburn Acklund (Wild ARMs 5)- iiii
Chloe Hertzog (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy) vs Shulk (Xenoblade Chronicles)- i


Light

Tear Grants (Tales of the Abyss)- iii vs Primrose Azelhart (Octopath Traveler)
Lilianne Valendorf (Mana Khemia 2: Fall of Alchemy)- iii vs Kamil (The 7th Saga)- i
Miriel (Fire Emblem Awakening) vs Otome Yanagiya (Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor 2)- iii
Ft. Hurricane (Xenogears) vs Cyrus Albright (Octopath Traveler)- iii