Author Topic: List topic 2019: Heavy 1 hitting hard.  (Read 988 times)

superaielman

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List topic 2019: Heavy 1 hitting hard.
« on: April 18, 2019, 11:17:17 PM »
See previous topic for rules.

Heavy:

Ness (EB)
Golbez (TAY)
Tidus (FFX)
Yulie (WA4)
Jean (EBC)
Saki Inugami (SH2)
Ike (FEs)
Kuja (FF9)
Razelux Metzen (MK2)
Worker 8 (FFT)
Serge (CC)
Fei (XG)
Seed (S2)
Fayt (SO3)
Chie (Pers4)
Blue Mage (FF5)
« Last Edit: April 19, 2019, 12:58:59 AM by superaielman »
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Pyro

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Re: List topic 2019: Heavy 1 hitting hard.
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2019, 03:00:59 AM »
1. Tidus (FFX): E&C along with intiiative Slow/Haste/QH/Overdrive shenanigans.
2. Worker 8 (FFT): Magic immune tank with solid damage.
3. Seed (S2): Rock solid damage and Silent Lake?
4. Ness (EB): Full-Healing tank.
5. Razelux Metzen (MK2): Auto-res, DoTs.
6. Fayt (SO3): Right Dhyer showed he's good.
7. Serge (CC): Rock solid damage.
8. Ike (FEs): Tanky with ranged counters and so on.
9. Yulie (WA4): Buffing, healing!
10. Saki Inugami (SH2): Energy Charge even though the other stats aren't impressive.
11. Kuja (FF9)
12. Blue Mage (FF5)
13. Chie (Pers4)
14. Jean (EBC)
15. Fei (XG): No Yamikei.

Tide

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Re: List topic 2019: Heavy 1 hitting hard.
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2019, 05:14:25 AM »
1. Tidus (FFX) - Easy call. The OG DL Speed game of doom. EC is just icing. He's held back mainly by being strictly physical and awful Mdef, but its just really tough to stop him.
2. Worker 8 (FFT) - Cooker 8's spoilage is just too good. He's not godlike, but eats up Heavy mages and can duke it out with some of the sluggers to
3. Blue Mage (FF5) - I think. Blue Mage has a huge variety of tricks so kneejerk is that in many fights he can pull out some magic and win. Could be wrong though.
4. Razelux Metzen (MK2) - Raze is weird. In practice, I think this is right. His built in auto-life is strong and he's already durable and has decent damage. Strange though I don't recall him winning many matches at all - might call for a PG
5. Ness (EB) - Ness' main weaknesses are being status bait and having very unimpressive damage unless he is willing to eat up some of his resources. Sometimes, this trade is worth it, but most of the time it won't be. Still if you don't bring huge bursting or have a match ending status, Ness just stalls you to death.
6. Ike (FEs) - I feel like both Ikes are around here? Solid all arounder overall at the cost of not having a skill-set. Aether can close up stall matches.
7. Fayt (SO3) - Next three are all pretty close. Main thing that makes them lose to Ike is not having FE style evade and countering. Fayt feels like the best of the 3. Fast, damaging, decently durable. That's a good package overall. He even has bad magic if he wants to go for some oddball status (DEEP FREEZE YESZ)
8. Fei (XG) - Probably hits harder than Fayt (?) but loses out on speed and his skillset isn't that good. So he's relying a lot on his DBlows being good enough.
9. Chie (Pers4) - Main thing holding Chie back is she needs to wait for one turn with PC. Two if she needs Taru. Would probably overtake Fei if she didn't need that extra turn. Don't allow Endure BS anymore so that reigns her in. Rest of her skillset is unimpressive. 
10. Yulie (WA4) -  More High Middle than anything, but like Ness, stalls you dead if you can't kill her in one shot. Unfortunately for Yulie, this isn't that hard (Yulie Pdur be bad guize).
11. Serge (CC) - Unlike Fayt/Fei/Chie, Serge also a damage dude but he is held back by elements being all OPB. So if you survive his regular attack string, he only has three chances to really take you out. The others can just repeatedly spam their techs and are less likely to get stallfest'd.
11. Kuja (FF9) - Kuja's durability is *awful*. It's kind of a shame because Flare Star hurts, Flare Star counters would add to that but he really can't take any advantage of them since he's just too fragile for the division.
12. Saki Inugami (SH2) - SH2 boss durability woes. EC doesn't matter when you're getting OHKO'd by like...Ness physicals.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2019, 01:24:02 AM by Tide »
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Dhyerwolf

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Re: List topic 2019: Heavy 1 hitting hard.
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2019, 01:28:57 AM »
1. Worker 8 (FFT)- I gave him a 4.8, so I would hope he'd be at the top of the list. 1.7 Pdur+Magic Immunity+Nulls most Elements+Nulls most status. Can't deal with a lot of Godlike physicals, but a very good spoiler
2. Tidus (FFX)- Slow is turn 1, but only 53% hit rate. Not like it matters much!
3. Ness (EB)- 1.72 PC HP, Can Halve Physicals (and Reflect part back), 31% Magic Damage (only usable 5 times, but still leaves enough for 6 Heals) or 19% Physical. Turn 2 Sleep/Paralysis, Turn 6 or something ID. Often needs to be statused out, but he certainly gives non Paralysis users shots at it. I suspect that if I had full status numbers for him he'd be worse his the turn 2 Sleep/Paralysis does cover him a little against some status
4. Golbez (TAY)- 112% PC HP damage that goes off around 70% speed (can boost in trade for evasion or speed), ~110% Durability, Extremely nasty evasion game, Can mess with Thunder/Ice/Thunder, Subtracts about 10% off status (which at least helps with edge cases which exist more to me since that means that 60% status is turn 2). 4.35
5. Saki Inugami (SH2)- 1.34 Physical Damage off 63% Speed, 1 PC HPish, 100% Silence, Immunes most Statuses. Her v Golbez is tough since they really have similar games, with different spoiling but his trumps a bit.
6. Fayt (SO3)- 75% Physical Damage or around 40% Physical Damage + Turn 2 Paralysis + 25% MP Damage, Good Evasion (avoids on the second turn and covers a chunk of magic), 110% HP and his 2nd turn isn't realistically coming before 105% Speed. 4.25
7. Razelux Metzen (MK2)- 110% Durability but needs to be killed twice. Averagish damage, but all Holy. Turn 4 ID which looks a lot better with that durability. Options to foil those fully reliant on Dark, Fire, Water, Ice or ID (but not any of the two)...which in fairness doesn't necessarily feel super important. I think the anti status options get him above Ike.
8. Ike (FEs)- 67% Phys Damage or 48/56% Damage that allows counters against the short ranged/projectile weapons. I'm okay with Pavise (it's very borderline, but I feel like it's a good balance for how good Nihil is in game since it's so pointless in the DL). Middling status improves against him, which does hold him down a little (also people above him tend to either have better damage, notably better status protection or more options)
9. Serge (CC)- Okay, counting the double damage from Masamune actually does give Serge an OHKO (barely. 1.04!) but almost half of it is Holy. Durability is relatively average. Complete status bait
10. Seed (S2)- Double Acts around 115% Speed, 43.5% Phys Damage (x2), Silent Lake, but probably around 50% HP. Deals with the frail and pure mages very well
11. Yulie (WA4)- 88% Speed + 66% PDur + Solves any enemies accuracy woes (if relevant). On the flip, can deal with mages (although a barrage of status may get her) pretty well. Could be an overrate, but trying not to underrate solely on the number of fights in the field that she runs from
12. Chie (Pers4)- I'm always a little sure on where I fall on Persona averages. If the evasion game is taken seriously, then she might only barely kill on turn 2, which comes around 107% speed to me. Endure isn't really useful since it means she won't have the HP for an unload
13. Kuja (FF9)- 0.8 PC HP, 125% Speed, 46.5% Damage (but 85% hit rate), Reflect, Counters...sometimes at below 50% HP. Has a lot of holes, will sometimes grab the quicker 2HKO against the frail and non-evasive.
14. Blue Mage (FF5)- What is turn 1: The Paralysis that lasts slightly more than 1 Turn, Blind, Old. The evasion is good, so Blue Mage can try and spoil with Blind (still likely taking the first hit though). That Speed really hurts since Blue Mage can't really play a defensive game giving up the first turn and doesn't have anything to the turn the tide.
15. Jean (EBC)- Lackluster damage and turn 2 Paralysis (for this purpose, I'm going to assume that her magic damage is not sufficient to chain a Sleep into a win without the opponent getting another turn. This is to say that the damage is less than 65). There is also the unknown Charm. I'm putting her here partially because there are number of question marks that are needed for her potentially to get any higher.
16. Fei (XG)- Yep, no Yamikei anymore
...into the nightfall.

superaielman

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Re: List topic 2019: Heavy 1 hitting hard.
« Reply #4 on: April 23, 2019, 12:19:32 PM »
1. Tidus- Heavy level mages tend to beat him, but he spoils so much.
2. Worker 8- Heavy level fighters tend to beat him, but he spoils so much.
3. Golbez- Yeah sure. Wishes he had status but that's true of in game as well.
4. Raze- Kneejerk that the Blessing of Light's enough to get this high.
5. Fayt- Nasty slugger.
6. Seed- HP is a problem but he slugs well enough in Heavy. SL is a good option.
7. Saki- Pretty similiar to Seed but SL is better than silence.
8. Ike- Nasty but very 1-d.
9. Serge- Nasty but 1-d.
10. Chie- More competent than you'd expect due to the evasion, but not a great Heavy by any stretch.
11. Blue Mage- Feels right? Is a Heavy but like Strago isn't a force in the division.
12. Fei- Counter Force is pretty useful. But man does he miss Yamekei being legal.
13. Jean- Bad offense in the DL. Hates Hiro getting powered up late/Leo raising the averages.
14. Yulie- Good spoiler but definitely a borderliner.
15. Kuja- Just bad at slugging. Flare Star counters help but he doesn't have the raw offense or HP to make the skillset work.
"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself"- Count Aral Vorkosigan, A Civil Campaign
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<Meeple> knownig Square-enix, they'll just give us a 2nd Kain
<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...

Cmdr_King

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Re: List topic 2019: Heavy 1 hitting hard.
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2019, 03:18:01 PM »
1. Worker 8 (FFT)
2. Ness (EB)
3. Golbez (TAY)
4. Tidus (FFX)
5. Razelux Metzen (MK2)
6. Fei (XG)
7. Ike (FEs)
8. Blue Mage (FF5)
9. Fayt (SO3)
10. Serge (CC)
11. Chie (Pers4)
12. Seed (S2)
13. Saki Inugami (SH2)
14. Yulie (WA4)
15. Jean (EBC)
16. Kuja (FF9)
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 03:19:42 PM by Cmdr_King »
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