Grand political roundup

[Grefter]

Both candidates did exactly what they needed to do. Obama picked someone who is experienced and white, and McCain picked someone that both ties him to evangelical voters and puts serious pressure on the female block of the Democrats, more than a few of whom are upset by not having Hillary anywhere on the ticket. Both come with some issues, but considering the list of hopefuls for both sides everybody has at least a couple drawbacks. All in all this was a solid move on both parts.

To paraphrase, both people picked token gestures that will place pressure or mock reassuring comfort on people over single vapid pathetic shallow hyperfocussed smoke screens to catch out retards instead of voting on policies.

Fuck humanity.

[Hunter Sopko]

Both candidates did exactly what they needed to do. Obama picked someone who is experienced and white, and McCain picked someone that both ties him to evangelical voters and puts serious pressure on the female block of the Democrats, more than a few of whom are upset by not having Hillary anywhere on the ticket. Both come with some issues, but considering the list of hopefuls for both sides everybody has at least a couple drawbacks. All in all this was a solid move on both parts.

Not quite on McCain's part. His choice is missing key experience that people were looking for since everyone is afraid he's going to keel over at any minute despite probably being healthier than all of us. My Mom has been a registered Republican for pretty much all her voting life, and she said that his choice made it impossible for her to vote for him on that point. I don't particularly think that McCain's going to woo any Democratic women over to his cause with this, but it may work to stem a tide of Republican women from voting Obama. Though, if my Mom is any indication, who knows?

Not that Palin is a terrible person. I'm not a pro-life or an evangelical guy, but I like the anti-corruption initiatives she's been pushing in Alaska. But... it's just not enough for a VP.

[Taishyr]

Both candidates did exactly what they needed to do. Obama picked someone who is experienced and white, and McCain picked someone that both ties him to evangelical voters and puts serious pressure on the female block of the Democrats, more than a few of whom are upset by not having Hillary anywhere on the ticket. Both come with some issues, but considering the list of hopefuls for both sides everybody has at least a couple drawbacks. All in all this was a solid move on both parts.

To paraphrase, both people picked token gestures that will place pressure or mock reassuring comfort on people over single vapid pathetic shallow hyperfocussed smoke screens to catch out retards instead of voting on policies.

Fuck humanity.

Amen. Pretty much the entire feeling I had on it, except I couldn't vocalize it.

[AAA]

Not quite on McCain's part. His choice is missing key experience that people were looking for since everyone is afraid he's going to keel over at any minute despite probably being healthier than all of us.

Well, right, like I said both of them have their weak points, and that's Palin's main problem. And I imagine Democrats will probably hammer them on Palin not having much experience if McCain croaks (which is a valid point, he's not getting any younger and has a history of cancer), and the Repubs will probably have to backpedal at least a little on the "Obama is inexperienced" soundbites, but I still see this as a net gain on the McCain side.

Aw, rats.

[Ultradude]

he's not getting any older

Finding the fountain of youth might seem a little suspicious...

Making fun of typos aside, anyone else know what I mean when I say "Southpark Hobo episode"?

[NotMiki]

Palin has more weaknesses as a pick than were immediately apparent, especially the way she was picked, i.e. with very superficial vetting.  McCain has met her only one time, and there's not a lot of evidence he talked to her more than twice before choosing her.  She's currently under investigation over the firing of a public safety commissioner.  McCain's campaign has never even talked to said commissioner.  McCain's people haven't even gone through the archives of her hometown paper.  Not that there's probably much there, but...it's not a good sign when the democratic operative doing opposition research gets told he's the first guy to want to look at the paper archives.

She talks about canning the 'bridge to nowhere,' and she did, but only (to paraphrase her at the time) because it was apparent the senate wouldn't fund it.  That's pretty far from what she said friday about cutting it because it was corrupt and wasteful.  In 2006, when running for governor, she explicitly supported it.

[metroid composite]

Obama's acceptance speech for those who haven't heard it:

http://dosomething.org/blog/chatterbox/obamas-acceptance-speech-dnc?gclid=CKDkwKTruZUCFRNOagodWi_BQg

I'm going to ignore all the "I will spend money on Tax Breaks/Education/Health Care/Environment"--these are election promises, and at the end of the day if the budget doesn't add up, it doesn't add up.  Here's what I did take notes on:

* Again and again he comes back to veterans--which seems like a reasonable issue; I've heard statistics that something like 40% of America's homeless are Vietnam War veterans who got no support when they returned home, so just stayed fucked up in the head.  Given the current state of Iraq, I think now's a good time to get the basic infrastructure that every other first-world country has for its veterans.
* Stop giving tax breaks to companies who ship jobs overseas--interesting.
* Focus tax breaks on tech industry startups rather than established businesses; again, interesting.
* Focus on Afghanistan and the Taliban and Bin Laden, start pulling out of Iraq.
* He was sort-of promising not to run a smear campaign--at very least he promised not to attack McCain's patriotism.
* He's for Abortion
* He's for Gay Marriage
* He's for some kind of Gun control (keeping AK47s out of the hands of criminals).


Hmm...well he's scoring 8/8 with me.  Openly supporting gay marriage and gun control are going to get him slammed in some states, though.

Here's what I didn't hear:
* I will kill the debt.  (Not too surprising.  I don't expect to hear it from McCain either.  Ron Paul was the candidate for that one; granted, Obama did mention the debt, but more as a way to criticize the Bush administration).
* I will kill the Patriot Act.  (Huh?  Seems like such an obvious target).
* I will give videogames the same legal parody rights as TV and Movies.  (Okay, so I'm dreaming here).
* I will make it illegal for someone to be fired due to being LGBT (currently it's legal in something like 30 states for Sexual Orientation, and 40 states for Sexual Identity.  Granted, seems like the general kind of thing Obama would believe in, and he did say a lot of anti-discrimination stuff).

[Dhyerwolf]

I didn't hear the speech, but he's not for gay marriage (Openly at least). He's for civil unions. Even if he was theoretically for gay marriage, he wouldn't say it.

[Grefter]

* I will kill the Patriot Act.  (Huh?  Seems like such an obvious target).

Obvious target but one people in power will not want to give up for a multitude of reasons.  1) Primarilly, people in power tend to function on very classical models of power.  People in this kind of power do not give up power.  They dispense privilege instead.  This act is something incredibly powerful and much more likely to be left dormant than withdrawn.  2) Patriot act is incredibly well named to withstand being shitcanned in a country with such strong patriotism, especially with as has been demonstrated, people are swayed by stupid bullshits and semantics where they are in fact irrelevant (which is also a reason not to throw it out there that you are going to do it while running, just do it later maybe even on the sly, you know assuming my cynicism is wrong and it won't just stay in effect forever).  Edit - This is just the start of what would degenerate into a rant on power and this thread doesn't need Foucault.

* I will make it illegal for someone to be fired due to being LGBT (currently it's legal in something like 30 states for Sexual Orientation, and 40 states for Sexual Identity.  Granted, seems like the general kind of thing Obama would believe in, and he did say a lot of anti-discrimination stuff).

That this isn't already in place is all kinds of fucked up.

[AAA]

Huh. Seems I've jumped the gun a little on stating Palin was a good pick.

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/2008/08/30/Poll_Confidence_in_Palin_low/UPI-90361220128026/

Lowest confidence rating in a VP since Quayle. That's not good.

She also, apparently, is the least experienced VP since 1907. That has to gall some people.

Then again, her appointment did seem to Help McCain at least a little, so right now it's all good.

Lots of people seem to think she's going to get creamed in the debates. Is Biden that good of a debator? Or is it just a kneejerk assumption because she's pretty green?

[superaielman]

Biden's a veteran member of congress. Odds are damned good he knows how to debate.

[Dunefar]

Biden's a veteran member of congress. Odds are damned good he knows how to debate.

This. I don't doubt Biden will be able to debate. How well Palin does will be most interesting. I'm wondering if she's a fast learner now.

[Strago]

So Palin's 17-year-old daughter is apparently five months pregnant. That's... not going to be good for the GOP.

Also, this: http://www.minnesotaindependent.com/6109/palin-is-suing-federal-government-to-reverse-listing-of-polar-bears-as-endanger-species.

I'm definitely not a fan of hers.

[AAA]

So Palin's 17-year-old daughter is apparently five months pregnant. That's... not going to be good for the GOP.

Is she married or what? Also, link?

[Strago]

Nope. The official response from the McCain camp is that they were aware of it when they chose, Palin, but... really? Seems doubtful to me.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26496189/

[Dark Holy Elf]

The polar bear thing is pretty psyduck. I know sometimes endangered species don't really belong on that list, but a quick few minutes of online research revealed that yes, polar bear populations are still fragile. Why try to get them off the list? Is it to appease some idiotic hunting lobby in Alaska or something?

EDIT: Also it is incredibly sad that the irrelevant fact that her daughter is a pregnant teen will probably be more important with many voters than her policies. Grah.

[Yakumo]

The link Strago posted said that she wanted them removed because having them on there would screw with oil and natural gas drilling in the area.  Yeah.

[metroid composite]

EDIT: Also it is incredibly sad that the irrelevant fact that her daughter is a pregnant teen will probably be more important with many voters than her policies. Grah.

Certianly sad but...at the same time strangely karmic.

Everything I've been hearing about her has ranged from inexperience to incompetence to hasty-pick, including conversations I've had with republicans recently.  She's going to be seen as an image pick, and all evidence we've seen in this topic suggests she WAS chosen for image.  Live by the image, die by the image.

[Dunefar]

The link Strago posted said that she wanted them removed because having them on there would screw with oil and natural gas drilling in the area.  Yeah.

See, considering out energy situation, I don't view that as a bad thing. While we do need to work out other energy sources, we also have to exploit what we currently have.

[Dhyerwolf]

Drilling up their really isn't going to have a major effect, especially since it's still going to be the same major oil companies who get the oil (And ergo, decide where to sell it, when, and at what price). However, apparentally each Alaskan gets a check from oil companies, and these checks are larger if there is more drilling, so even if drilling didn't really net any benefits, they'd still have reason to push for it.

[Grefter]

Also it is incredibly sad that the irrelevant fact that her daughter is a pregnant teen will probably be more important with many voters than her policies. Grah.

To paraphrase, both people picked token gestures that will place pressure or mock reassuring comfort on people over single vapid pathetic shallow hyperfocussed smoke screens to catch out retards instead of voting on policies.

Fuck humanity.

The link Strago posted said that she wanted them removed because having them on there would screw with oil and natural gas drilling in the area.  Yeah.

Did anyone expect any different reasoning behind it other than financial?  Also Dhyer's statement again shows all kinds of fucked up.  Seriously?  The companies just bribe an entire fucking state?  Holy fucking shit that system is ludicrously corrupt and broken. FREE MARKET IS PURE AND CLEAN hahaha no.

See, considering out energy situation, I don't view that as a bad thing. While we do need to work out other energy sources, we also have to exploit what we currently have.

And you can go about doing that without you know, getting a species removed from the endangered list so that you can fucking kill some for it.  Bullshit up some fucking reserve for them or something, don't just go kill them.

[Dark Holy Elf]

That explains much.

Regardless, the endangered species list isn't something that is mutable based on convenience. If we decide that drilling puts polar bears at risk and that we want to go ahead with it ANYWAY because it's worth the cost (which I don't agree with, because Dhyer is in fact entirely correct, but that's not the point), then so be it. But don't try to sugarcoat it by pretending that endangered species aren't endangered; man up and admit exactly what it is you're doing.

[NotMiki]

the endangered species list isn't something that is mutable based on convenience.

welcome to the Bush administration.  I'm not saying that just to be pithy; they're currently trying to revise gov't rules so that Fish & Wildlife scientists don't need to be consulted for gov't approved construction, notably military and I *think* energy construction.  In other words the Bush administration and Palin are on the same page, but from the Bushies it's a 'fuck you' to ALL endangered species.

As for the thing with Palin's daughter, the voters it turns off are the same voters that would vote for her based on the idea that a president is a symbol rather than an executive (in her case a symbol of good Christian values).  That's not a horrible thing to consider when voting, as long as you make competence in leading a higher priority.  I voted Obama over Clinton based on the same thing.  In that case, the fact that people the world over see Obama as a symbol of a new America, whether they're right or not, means that our country will be in a better position with him at the head of it than with Clinton.

For me, the Palin's daughter thing is most concerning because it seems clear to me that the McCain camp didn't know about it.  It says nothing good about McCain's executive ability that his people can't even properly vet a VP choice.

[metroid composite]

For me, the Palin's daughter thing is most concerning because it seems clear to me that the McCain camp didn't know about it.  It says nothing good about McCain's executive ability that his people can't even properly vet a VP choice.

Yeah; generally I tend to just throw out information on politician's private lives as irrelevant, however the more I look at this the more relevant it seems.

First because it casts a bad light on McCain's people and their selection process.
Second because it does seem to relate  to her policies--namely she's apparently a strong supporter of Abstinence-only sex education, which tells teenagers not to have sex but doesn't educate them about safe sex and birth control.
Third because it kinda shows bad parenting--it's not like the kid was caught drinking at 17 (who cares?) or having sex outside of marriage (who cares?)  Teen pregnancies tend to seriously mess with the lives of high-schoolers, and hence well past the threshold of "parent should intervene/warn kid beforehand".

[Grefter]

Do you see?  This is what legalising abortion brings the world to with its filthy disgusting morals.  No longer can people go to a reputable illegal abortionist to keep everything quiet.  It puts good people out of jobs and leaves a paper trail.