Season 44 rankings- FE9 and Disgaea 2

[VySaika]

FE9 Boyd - High middle.
FE9 Ena - Heavy.
FE9 Ike - Heavy.
FE9 Jill Fizzart - Middle.
FE9 Mia - Heavy.
FE9 Mist - Light.
FE9 Nephenee - Heavy.
FE9 Oscar - Middle.
FE9 Soren - Middle.
FE9 Tibarn - Low Godlike.
FE9 Titania - Light
FE9 Volke - Middle

[Monkeyfinger]

And then there's the broad problem with downvoting someone with high all-around respect because of a personal problem you have. If your downvoting costs them a rank... congrats. You just handed them a free title.

Remember when posting on these forums worked properly? Shit was so cash.

[ThePiggyman]

Hmm...

Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance

FE9 Boyd - 3.5
FE9 Ena - 3.75
FE9 Ike - 4.5
FE9 Jill Fizzart - 4.0
FE9 Mia - 4.0
FE9 Mist - 2.25
FE9 Nephenee - 3.5
FE9 Oscar - 3.25
FE9 Soren - 2.75
FE9 Tibarn - 4.625 (Right between that wedge of a slaughtering Heavy and a rather subpar Godlike)
FE9 Titania - 2.5
FE9 Volke -  3.25

[Sierra]

Reasonable analysis.

Yeah, I know. In the end, it's just another reason for me to bitch about Fire Emblem in general, I guess.

[Dhyerwolf]

Dis2 Taro- 3.3. Low Light? Okay, that's based on wrong damage numbers. Damage is average, HP is good, Healing+Counters isn't great but it's there. Buffing isn't uber, but take at what it does. It's still damn useful.

This may or may not because said "wrong damage numbers" are the ones pointed to in your stat topic index.  You should really list both topics there, so people know that there IS another one (but don't remove the other one, please).

And I don't blame them for thinking Taro sucks.  His damage isn't that stellar in-game.  Even on your damage numbers, he only has a 3HKO, counters ain't scaring anyone (especially mages/ranged people), and I laugh at the buffing/healing.

Dis2 Zenon- 5. The hell? He has like 3 PC HP durability and solidly 2HKOs. Not a heavy especially off of boss resists. Halving elements at the start and a magic backup is awesome. Near OHKO at below 25% HP (About 0.75 PC HP then) is good too.

HP of 20,000, PC damage of 1000, you have like 10 PCs?  Correct me if I'm wrong, but by normal conventions that's not even close to 3 PCHP.  I mean, if you use a different scaling, that's cool, but being surprised at other people not thinking he's 3 PCHP?  Kinda weird.

Taro's damage isn't stellar in game, but it's obviously in the same range as everyone else's (It's Disgaea, and exceptions to this tend to be very, very notable). None of his strategies are worth much, but put them together...HP+mediocre healing w/ counters+Defense buffing+Breaking Opponent's Attack is solid overall. In game, Taro is also pretty awesome (50% Attack boosting w/ support spells being very solid for EXP gain is great on anyone running off attack).

On Zenon, you can't really rush him with a full PC complement. Axel, who has support, is more rushable to me.

[RadLink5]

PCHP is based on the assumption that you took them out with a total offensive and no need to heal or anything, isn't it?

[Dhyerwolf]

Yes, but how often can you attack something with all 10 PCs in Disgaea? (Or most strat RPGs). If you could, there would be a lot of bosses that would deserve far more mocking for their sliver of PC HP.

[Cmdr_King]

Disgaea 2

Dis2 Adell- Heavy.  Ehhh.  The SP thing does make me pause, but on the whole he's also packing the badass evade and I expect he'd just slaughter a Middle field if he ended up there.
Dis2 Axel- High Light.  eh, I'm not sold on the temp form but Lights can be pretty bad and it's not his damage that's at issue, boss-wise.
Dis2 Hanako- Light.
Dis2 Rozalin-  Light.  Guntechs help but not enough to cover the HP.
Dis2 Taro- Middle.  Cool to see Dhyer's notes reflecting my kneejerk so well.
Dis2 Tink- Light.
Dis2 Yukimaru- Middle.
Dis2 Zenon- Godlike.

Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance

FE9 Boyd- High Middle.  2HKOs (surprisingly solidly), isn't doubled by everything, but the Res is just ugh.
FE9 Ena- Light.  Boss form not so much.
FE9 Ike- High Heavy.  Murders things.  Not quite definitively enough for Godlike.
FE9 Jill Fizzart- Low Middle.  Doesn't really stand out.
FE9 Mia- Middle/Heavy.  Hates FE9's evade nerf with a burning passion.  30% isn't quite enough to compensate her questionable defenses.
FE9 Mist- Light.  Mage spoiler!  Still, 4HKO, Pdur of fail, 20% evade is nice but not enough.
FE9 Nephenee- Low Heavy.  Average damage buuut has a pretty badass limit.  So close to being a scarier version of Ike too.
FE9 Oscar- Low Middle.  Like dead average at everything.  Cool.
FE9 Soren- Light/Middle.  Defense fails, 3HKO, but some healer-busting prowess due to Adept and does well against mages at least.
FE9 Tibarn- Heavy/Godlike.  Ike, trading AETHER and Crit immunity for better durability and Pavise.  Winning trade, enough for the border.
FE9 Titania- Light/Middle.  Oscar-, ever so slightly in a bunch of areas.
FE9 Volke- Middle.  2HKOs thanks to doubles, but off crummy durability on both fronts.  Hates FE9 evade and Lethality being functionally useless.

[Nitori]

Disgaea 2

Dis2 Adell - Middle/Heavy.
Dis2 Axel - Middle.
Dis2 Hanako - Light.
Dis2 Rozalin - Light.
Dis2 Taro - Middle.
Dis2 Tink - Light.
Dis2 Yukimaru - High Light.
Dis2 Zenon - Godlike.

[Talaysen]

Yes, but how often can you attack something with all 10 PCs in Disgaea? (Or most strat RPGs). If you could, there would be a lot of bosses that would deserve far more mocking for their sliver of PC HP.

Uh, pretty often?  Ranged attacks exist.

[Dhyerwolf]

You'd have to sink up the ranges/make sure there weren't PCs in the way/make sure there weren't height issues (which can come up with a lot of Disgaea maps).

Trying to rush Zenon with all the PCs in game is such a bad strategy in game. He criticals on a massive range Dark Revenge and wipes out most of your force if you put your PCs at all close together. If it doesn't, it still has better range than any similar healingIt says something that he's probably the least rushable boss in game even if all the other bosses have better support. Note that this may change if you do a ton of extra stuff, but I definetely consider that power-levelling.

[Talaysen]

You'd have to sink up the ranges/make sure there weren't PCs in the way/make sure there weren't height issues (which can come up with a lot of Disgaea maps).

Trying to rush Zenon with all the PCs in game is such a bad strategy in game. He criticals on a massive range Dark Revenge and wipes out most of your force if you put your PCs at all close together. If it doesn't, it still has better range than any similar healingIt says something that he's probably the least rushable boss in game even if all the other bosses have better support. Note that this may change if you do a ton of extra stuff, but I definetely consider that power-levelling.

Rushing counter whore bosses is also a bad idea.  You also need to heal in boss fight.  For DL scaling, we ignore these factors.  No giving doublecredit for bosses having good offense or counters.  Bad.

[Dhyerwolf]

If straight up rushing a boss will get you very dead very quickly, I'm not going to consider that (Similar to how their are a number of SRPG bosses where you can basically clear out all the support before really even broaching the boss, but I don't scale their HP to assuming every PC is attacking them).

[RadLink5]

You'd have to sink up the ranges/make sure there weren't PCs in the way/make sure there weren't height issues (which can come up with a lot of Disgaea maps).

Trying to rush Zenon with all the PCs in game is such a bad strategy in game. He criticals on a massive range Dark Revenge and wipes out most of your force if you put your PCs at all close together. If it doesn't, it still has better range than any similar healingIt says something that he's probably the least rushable boss in game even if all the other bosses have better support. Note that this may change if you do a ton of extra stuff, but I definetely consider that power-levelling.

Rushing counter whore bosses is also a bad idea.  You also need to heal in boss fight.  For DL scaling, we ignore these factors.  No giving doublecredit for bosses having good offense or counters.  Bad.

This. Not that I don't support Zenon durability hype mind you, but I do feel the need to point out your concept of PCHP is different from the norm like the elitist bitch I am.

[Hunter Sopko]

Dis2 Adell- Low Heavy. Great evade, good damage, but Fire is pretty common to block. Still good though.
Dis2 Axel- Middle. Decent respect. Better than a PC, but not much.
Dis2 Hanako- Light. Is Hanako.
Dis2 Rozalin- Light/Middle. Not terrible, Gun techs take her this far, but thats not saying much.
Dis2 Taro- High Light. Is Taro, slightly better than Hanako, has a bit more going for him.
Dis2 Tink- Light. Is Tink.
Dis2 Yukimaru- High Light. Gets sword techs (I think), counters well, but thats about it.
Dis2 Zenon- Low Godlike. Generally rough to fight for a single PC regardless, can't see him in heavy, but can't see him winning Godlike.

[superaielman]

Dis2 Adell- High Middle. Great evade, good damage, but Fire is pretty common to block. Still good though.
Dis2 Axel- Middle. Decent respect. Better than a PC, but not much.
Dis2 Hanako- Light. Is Hanako.
Dis2 Rozalin- Light/Middle. Not terrible, Gun techs take her this far, but thats not saying much.
Dis2 Taro- Middle. Is Taro, slightly better than Hanako, has a bit more going for him.
Dis2 Tink- Low Light. Is Tink.
Dis2 Yukimaru- High Light. Gets sword techs (I think), counters well, but thats about it.
Dis2 Zenon- Low Godlike. Generally rough to fight for a single PC regardless, can't see him in heavy, but can't see him winning Godlike.

Pretty much agree here besides for Adell.

[Meeplelard]

FE9 Boyd: Middle/Heavy - Its an FE Warrior without the usual Warrior flaws!
FE9 Ena: Heavy - Given her PC form is split path and her boss form is a forced fight (unlike Naesala whose a bit super bossy...;_; to him not getting in), I'm inclined to allow the boss form so...
FE9 Ike: Heavy - Midway point between Lyn and Hector, all things considered.
FE9 Jill Fizzart: Middle/Heavy - Tank with good stats overall, but nothing else stands out, doesn't like magic.
FE9 Mia: Middle/Heavy - Swordmaster with less avoid offset by Vantage, and no Killing Edge option. Losing trade overall.
FE9 Mist: Light - Wants Sonic Sword.
FE9 Nephenee: Middle/Heavy - Nothing really stands out...unless you let her get a turn at 50% HP, then things can get ugly.
FE9 Oscar: Middle - A dramatically worse Ike (go figure, he's one of the best PCs in game ;_; )
FE9 Soren: Light - FE Mage who dies to a sneeze with low damage.  Adept helps some, but not enough.
FE9 Tibarn: Heavy/Godlike - Hits hard, and a tank!  However, he's easy to stop doubling, and pure physical, and has Wind and Arrow weakness.  A godlike he is not in this form; FE10 form, admittedly, is pretty sick, but here, he's just really good!
FE9 Titania: Light - Oscar...with 5 less defense and worse stats otherwise.
FE9 Volke: Middle: Knives suck, but doubling offsets that some!  He really wishes Lethiality wasn't crit based.

[Twilkitri]

Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance

FE9 Boyd - High Middle
FE9 Ena - Heavy
FE9 Ike - High Heavy
FE9 Jill Fizzart - High Middle
FE9 Mia - Heavy
FE9 Mist - Light
FE9 Nephenee - Middle/Heavy
FE9 Oscar - High Middle
FE9 Soren - High Middle
FE9 Tibarn - High Heavy
FE9 Titania - High Middle
FE9 Volke - High Middle

[Luther Lansfeld]

Edit: Elfboy's rankings!

FE9 Boyd: Low 2HKO and melee counters. Hand Axe option is a help. High Middle.
FE9 Ena: Middle/Heavy. Gut.
FE9 Ike: Heavy 4.1. Hector+. Not much Aether respect since I'd consider it against other occults, but the healing helps.
FE9 Jill Fizzart: Boyd trading damage for defence. Feels like a losing trade overall? Middle 3.4.
FE9 Mia: Her damage is one point below average and she doubles. So yeah, 3HKO, murders melee whic should keep her out of Middle, but... Middle/Heavy. Lacks SM evade to do any better.
FE9 Mist: Light.
FE9 Nephenee: Heavy. Giving her a turn below half HP means you're likely dead, thanks to forged Javelin counters. Shreds the slow as a bonus.
FE9 Oscar: Pretty sure I allow the Paladins Sol, which helps a bit. High Middle. Ike with less speed/def/range, but the overall package still feels solid.
FE9 Soren: Light/Middle. Average damage, awful pdur, good mdur. Standard enough FE mage.
FE9 Tibarn: High Heavy. Not really seeing Godlike hype, but he's good.
FE9 Titania: Light/Middle. Oscar minus a bunch of durability, which hurts her game.
FE9 Volke: Light/Middle. Bad durability, Lethality is useless. Doubles let him scrape a low 2HKO though. He's a lot like Rennac, except his doubling is more reliable. Lacks crits granted.

[mia~]

Dis2 Adell - H. Middle
Dis2 Axel - Middle
Dis2 Hanako - Light
Dis2 Rozalin - Light/Middle
Dis2 Taro - Middle
Dis2 Tink - Light
Dis2 Yukimaru - Middle
Dis2 Zenon - Low Godlike

[Luther Lansfeld]

Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance

FE9 Boyd- Middle
FE9 Ena- High Middle
FE9 Ike- Heavy
FE9 Jill Fizzart- Low Heavy
FE9 Mia- High Middle
FE9 Mist- Light
FE9 Nephenee- Heavy
FE9 Oscar- Middle
FE9 Soren- Light/Middle
FE9 Tibarn- Low Godlike
FE9 Titania- Middle
FE9 Volke- High Light

[Ultradude]

Changing my Ena vote. Was underestimating her tankiness (and damage to a degree) I think.

[RadLink5]

Yeah, I've changed most of my rankings too in case I have to announce that.

[Pyro]

Upping Nephenee because I forgot Javelins existed.

Also, could someone give some stats or something on Boss Ena? She seems to be getting a lot of Heavy hype, and I don't remember much about her.

[OblivionKnight]

NEB needs to do the FE9 bosses!  Or maybe I'll just kick in and do it!  Or something >_>

Anyway, Ena is fought in chapter 21 of 29.  Stats are as follows:

HP - 52
STR - 27 (25)
MAG - 9
SKL - 22 (20)
SPD - 20 (18)
LUK - 14
DEF - 27 (25)
RES - 27 (25)
Weakness to lightning (2x weapon power)

Skills: Renewal (10% HP regen), Miracle (LUK% chance to reduce fatal damage to half of user's current HP), Boon (Heals status of adjacent characters)

Breath: 10 Mt, 90 Ht, 1 Rg
Demi-band: Permanent transformation, but loses stats (-2 to STR, SKL, SPD, DEF, RES)
Elixer: 3 shots of full healing

Pwr - 35
Hit - 137
Avo - 50

I think by this point she's just shy of EXA'd by average?  I'd peg SPD around 20 or so right now, probably (if endgame is assumed 23), though that's with higher levels, so she's actually probably close to average overall?  Not certain without checking.  Defenses reduce damage by a decent amount on both sides (I'd...expect 35% via DEF, 50% via RES?).  IIRC, she's in a position where you'd have to rescue characters to have multiple ones hit her (due to her placement with wall structures jutting out) on the same turn.  Granted, 1 range weapon. 

Think that's most of it.  This is a bit beyond halfway, gameplaywise?  Probably 70% final stats?