Nyarlathotep's Dungeon: Brainstorming Topic!

[SnowFire]

dude: Millenia might have gravity as well?   The awful move that just stuck all the enemies together.

Anyway, not sure if it's been proposed before, but since it seems WA:XF is a bit better played now, and not many people have used Sacred Slayer, another idea for the dungeon....

Alexia (Wild Arms: XF)
Pros: Initiative!  Good accuracy!  Status Lock! (ST, but still...)  Single-handedly defeats the 1337 Jogurts with the blade she gets on Floor 6 and beyond!
Cons: Horrible, awful, miserable, no-good speed after turn 1.  Raw damage / defense is okay but not amazing.  Sports two common elemental weaknesses and bad magic defense.

Feels like a 1.5 to me?  She's not great but you can never discount initiative entirely, and has some great options for postgame bonuses (like "take the Extremist skillset").

[Talaysen]

Tibarn would level up like normal I would assume and wouldn't be QUITE as amazing... Although perhaps I don't fully understand.

Not really possible.  Unless you try to extrapolate L1 stats from his growths, base stats, and base level.  I'm not sure what kind of psyduckery you get from that (maybe negative stats!!).

Personally, stuff like this is why I hate the scaling used for late joiners.  You scale them in a way that can't even possibly happen in-game.  It's probably better to just scale all characters to when they join until the point where they would join in-game, then you could scale them normally (so like the new Fogel).

Of course that comes with point overhaul for people already in, so I don't know how practical it is.

[Yoshiken]

Dude: Just a couple of things from a skim-read. Firstly, neither Tibarn is interesting - both are basic FE attackers. Secondly, FE10 is less played than FE9, as far as I know. Lastly, the average speed is just one interp of FE - another common one is movement, and Tibarn's movement, IIRC, is pretty damn high. Probably not enough to outspeed Orlandu, but still not average speed, and 'above average' compared to 'average' is already such a boost that I really don't see Tibarn happening any time soon.

Besides, for interesting Laguz, it'd be best to pick someone like... say, Ranulf. Have him start each floor with a full Laguz gauge - still probably not worth much, thanks to having his frail, skill-less untransformed form come into play aaand having that weakness to Fire. Both forms have good evasion and he can deal decent damage, though, as well as almost always doubling.

[Nephrite]

Tibarn would level up like normal I would assume and wouldn't be QUITE as amazing... Although perhaps I don't fully understand.

Not really possible.  Unless you try to extrapolate L1 stats from his growths, base stats, and base level.  I'm not sure what kind of psyduckery you get from that (maybe negative stats!!).

Personally, stuff like this is why I hate the scaling used for late joiners.  You scale them in a way that can't even possibly happen in-game.  It's probably better to just scale all characters to when they join until the point where they would join in-game, then you could scale them normally (so like the new Fogel).

Of course that comes with point overhaul for people already in, so I don't know how practical it is.

Point overhauls isn't hard. It's what I have the channel for.

[Taishyr]

Everyone's a 1.0 because they can be killed. A fatal flaw in the Dungeon. *nods*

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Rika/Souji/Virginia/Cecilia/Yuri1 team gogogogogogogo

[Taishyr]

*/Nall.

Although I'd probably drop Yuri1 for Fogel or Deis1 just for more offense, but hey.

[Nephrite]

Rika/Souji/Virginia/Cecilia/Yuri1 team gogogogogogogo

Floor 1 boss fight: Margaret and Elizabeth.

[Taishyr]

Yeah, pretty much!

Though I still say we need SnowFire's Mega Man concept in.

Mega Man: 3.0 (Chooses one stat, one ability, and one innate trait to obtain from defeated enemies after each floor)
Pros: Insanely customizable! Can gain some of those shiny boss-only skills... if Neph allows them.
Cons: Holy shit he starts off really bad for a 3.0. Takes a while to get going, has to specialize.

[dude789]

Dude: Just a couple of things from a skim-read. Firstly, neither Tibarn is interesting - both are basic FE attackers. Secondly, FE10 is less played than FE9, as far as I know. Lastly, the average speed is just one interp of FE - another common one is movement, and Tibarn's movement, IIRC, is pretty damn high. Probably not enough to outspeed Orlandu, but still not average speed, and 'above average' compared to 'average' is already such a boost that I really don't see Tibarn happening any time soon.

Besides, for interesting Laguz, it'd be best to pick someone like... say, Ranulf. Have him start each floor with a full Laguz gauge - still probably not worth much, thanks to having his frail, skill-less untransformed form come into play aaand having that weakness to Fire. Both forms have good evasion and he can deal decent damage, though, as well as almost always doubling.

Tibarn in either of his forms isn't going to be as interesting as some of the other duellers. Ranulf or someone may be more interesting, but Tibarn fills a void that the team roster currently has. FE 10 Tibarn does a better job of this and I'd say that he's interesting enough to put him in over his more played form. Also, I'd say that FE 10 mechanics are near enough to FE9's for people to feel comfortable voting on them even if they haven't played the game. 

Neph, if that team started with endgame stuff they would probably have a pretty good chance of beating them if you ignore Elizabeth's 9999 Megidolan if you bring more than one person.

[Talaysen]

Neph, if that team started with endgame stuff they would probably have a pretty good chance of beating them if you ignore Elizabeth's 9999 Megidolan if you bring more than one person.

Parasol'd lol.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Reiterating suggestions for comment:

Nils (FE7)

Clarissa (WAXF)

Levin (WAXF)

Alexia (WAXF)

Gadgeteer (WAXF)

Taro (Dis2)

Penelo (FF12RW)
Okay, this one is new because I started play RW, but Penelo is a really interesting heal battery with cooldown-style infinite skills. Could be worth looking into. Working on stat topic now. She also has a bunch of buffs and some decent Holy damage endgame. Lots of nice passive boosts for a whole party too (Magic up, Auto-Esuna, etc.)

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Practically nobody has played FF12RW, though...

[DjinnAndTonic]

Yeah, I figured she doesn't stand much of a chance, but it was something that I wanted to discuss. She -does- make for an interesting choice after all.

[Clear Tranquil]

CT bait! Dancer ^_^

Lucia, Meru, Penelo, Peppita, Pericci, Na*shot*

Is it just me or can Wild Arms XF Gadgeteer only Mystic berries and not revival fruit or gems?

I've just picked up the spoiler PC so I can see how she'd be an interesting choice so far with Royal Cheer/Status Lock off initiative. Awesme sword? Well I'm looking forward to that ^_^

Levin and Clarissa ... meh they won't get Elementalist gear for magic twinking Blast and Sacrifice in the dungeon =-(

Ehhhh ...

Dorothy
Claude/Angelo
Peppita (Life)
Sacred Slayer
Seifer/Meru (Life)

Don't know what I'm thinking >.>

[Random Consonant]

I dunno, Nils doesn't sound like a great idea given how easily he can be killed off, especially early on when his evasion isn't that impressive.  Giving people extra turns is cool and all, but it's pretty much all he can do until he gets the buffs, which aren't until... floor 4, I want to say?  And even when his evasion does get good, it's not like the dungeon lacks means to deal with the evasive.  Again, I dunno, maybe I'm selling the kid short, but he seems like a novelty 0.5-1.0 pick at best.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Nils is definitely not impressive in a dungeon setting. Taking a full slot to only give other people turns and one-turn duration buffs isn't really making waves in this kind of setting, even off the evasion when it gets going.

[DjinnAndTonic]

So make him a 1.0 pick. It's an alternative to Sacred Slayer. And he's iconic and well-known and easy to interpret.

Also.... Nils + Dorothy = GG

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

... would that give her a fifth turn or would that give her four more actions? ohgod

[DjinnAndTonic]

I think I'd see it as four more turns personally. Dorothy + Sacred Slayer might be different though? Since Sacred Slayer is more about 'giving' a turn to another ally, whereas Nils is more like 'restoring' a turn to a character who has already acted.

But it also depends on how you would view Dorothy's turns in the Dungeon, so it's more of a Dorothy interp headache than anything Nils or Sacred Slayer do.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Welcome to Wizard of Oz turn interp headaches.

[Bardiche]

I dunno, Nils doesn't sound like a great idea given how easily he can be killed off, especially early on when his evasion isn't that impressive.  Giving people extra turns is cool and all, but it's pretty much all he can do until he gets the buffs, which aren't until... floor 4, I want to say?  And even when his evasion does get good, it's not like the dungeon lacks means to deal with the evasive.  Again, I dunno, maybe I'm selling the kid short, but he seems like a novelty 0.5-1.0 pick at best.

You should get a Nini's Grace in the Lyn mode, right?

[Random Consonant]

No.  Ninis's Grace isn't available until... Chapter 20, I want to say.  (assuming Eliwood route)

[Clear Tranquil]

So make him a 1.0 pick. It's an alternative to Sacred Slayer. And he's iconic and well-known and easy to interpret.

Hey I'm all for cheaper options ^_~

I've had Alexia for a while and good lord the speed is bad. Good, good lord.

* Clear Tranquil shakes head

Need to experiment with her offence a bit more before giving my final opinion on her. I have the awesme sword but haven't really done anything with it yet. My Alexia basically does nothing but use Royal Cheer off the bat, uses it again when her next turn eventually does come around or use the odd Quicken/Remain off High Cavalier and so on >.>

[dude789]

Like Djinn, I'll also post some of the ideas I had earlier so we can reevaluate based on playership and filling dungeon niches.

FF6 Ghost
Lufia Aguro
PKMN Butterfree
KH Goofy: These first 4 mainly are there to add more punies which I think aside from godlike is the smallest division we have. They all have various roles that so far haven't been filled in puny (IDer, physical tank and damage dealer, status whore, and mp restorer respectively)

DQ5 King Cureslime: I still don't think we have a healer who doesn't have any weaknesses and he fits the bill. (Good MT healing, Full Revival, everything is gained early, solid durability, speed and resources.) Since dragon Quest 5 since to be gaining momentum for ranking I think he could be a good fit.

FFT Viera: Probably the best option from the FFTA series. Good skillset, but has some weaknesses that counter act them.

Paper Mario: Very very unique character with an interesting form of buffs. Playership is a problem though.

Lucas: He has a very cool skillset and covers his bases well. The counter shields are neat, but I don't think too many people have played M3.

FE 10 Elincia: She's probably one of the most interesting FE characters around due to Amiti, skills and staves. When I first suggested her FE10 playership wasn't that good, but it's risen a bit and their seems to be a lot of interest in it.