Author Topic: Discworld Mafia is go!  (Read 115188 times)

Shale

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #75 on: January 03, 2008, 04:18:11 AM »
Yeah, I've been reading along and hoping for something to catch my thoughts enough to give me enough substance for an actual post, but so far nothing has. Soppy/QR could be any combination of roles, plus the fact that I still don't have a clue how QR plays town. I do think I side with Soppy in that little tiff, just because the dig she took at Otter seemed pretty confrontational this early on, but hell if I know what that says.

Tom has been acting with customary awkwardness, but has at least a passable point in his second vote for Carthrat ("Looks like scum trying to avoid lurker detection."). I fully agree with getting Unoriginal to move his vote to someone other than him; inasmuch as jokevoting has any point, it's to pressure people to talk; you can hardly pressure yourself into much of anything.

Otter needs to post too, hypocritical as that is coming from me.
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EvilTom

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #76 on: January 03, 2008, 04:34:41 AM »
If we really have no leads... maybe we should lynch the last lurker (Otter)?
Otherwise, we could vote for a No Lynch... which looks best at this point. If we have nothing, then a mis-lynch will only hurt us.
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Smodge13

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #77 on: January 03, 2008, 04:44:13 AM »
If we really have no leads... maybe we should lynch the last lurker (Otter)?
Otherwise, we could vote for a No Lynch... which looks best at this point. If we have nothing, then a mis-lynch will only hurt us.

Otter i feel we should at least give a chance to speak first, regardless of what happens.

As for No Lynch, whoever gets killed overnight probably wouldn't reveal much so we would be totally reliant on Night powers, also keep in mind that upon death name and alignment is revealed not roles (or so El Cid's first post shows), so a vote for no lynch would protect us from harming one of our own, we'd just be in the same situation the next day.

So in the end, we have no idea what roles are out there, we won't know until people claim it, even when they die we won't know the truth of the matter, so no lynch is possibly a bad idea, but it would be best i think to at least give everyone we lynch a chance at role-claim, especially considering we won't even know the truth when their dead.

EvilTom

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #78 on: January 03, 2008, 04:52:19 AM »
As for No Lynch, whoever gets killed overnight probably wouldn't reveal much so we would be totally reliant on Night powers, also keep in mind that upon death name and alignment is revealed not roles (or so El Cid's first post shows), so a vote for no lynch would protect us from harming one of our own, we'd just be in the same situation the next day.
That's a meaningless factor; knowing the role of a dead townie doesn't help us at all. A mis-lynched vanilla is just as useless as a mis-lynched cop.
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Smodge13

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #79 on: January 03, 2008, 05:00:43 AM »
Otter: 0
Tai: 1
Bobbin: 2
Corwin: 2
CPU: 2
Unoriginal: 2
Shale: 2
Strago: 3
Nitori: 3
Excal: 3
Kilga: 3
Rat: 4
Sopko: 4
Yakumo: 4
QR: 4
VSM: 7
Smodge: 9
CMDR: 9
Tom: 12

Ok not sure if theres an Electronic way to calculate this, but this is the post count so far.

Interesting thing here though, Tai has only posted once and it was in Joke vote.

Shale

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #80 on: January 03, 2008, 05:02:44 AM »
Quote
Otherwise, we could vote for a No Lynch... which looks best at this point. If we have nothing, then a mis-lynch will only hurt us.

No no no no no no. We get nowhere without lynching. Day 1 is always a crapshoot, but we can look back on it and learn something if we know whether people were bandwagoning town or scum. Unless you want to let the scum choose who flips for us, in which case we'll just get a long string of deaths that don't tell us much of anything.

I can't vote for you because I'm already voting for you, but consider this a declaration that the joke vote is now semi-serious.
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EvilTom

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #81 on: January 03, 2008, 05:05:57 AM »
I guess we should start at the top and work our way down.

##Unvote: Carthrat (I'll come back to him after LAL)
##Vote: Otter (To be followed by Tai if Otter posts and Tai doesn't.)

If we need to, then we should LAL.

Shale: I'm not convinced we'll get anything out of a lynch if we don't already have leads. It means the scum are lurking, or they havn't slipped up. If we can't find their slip-up right up till hammer, what makes you think we'll work it out after cardflip?

Anyway, let's see how this goes.
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Smodge13

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #82 on: January 03, 2008, 05:09:38 AM »
That's a meaningless factor; knowing the role of a dead townie doesn't help us at all. A mis-lynched vanilla is just as useless as a mis-lynched cop.

No it isn't, knowing if a dead townie was cop or not gives us a reason to look closely at who they voted for in case they die before they reveal their investigations.
Knowing a dead townie is Doc will mean we know not to go roleclaiming unless absolutely necessary.
A Dead Vig could help determine who is a Scum kill and who is a Vig kill.

There are countless situations where knowing a dead townies roll is very useful.

EvilTom

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #83 on: January 03, 2008, 05:26:00 AM »
No it isn't, knowing if a dead townie was cop or not gives us a reason to look closely at who they voted for in case they die before they reveal their investigations.
Knowing a dead townie is Doc will mean we know not to go roleclaiming unless absolutely necessary.
A Dead Vig could help determine who is a Scum kill and who is a Vig kill.

There are countless situations where knowing a dead townies roll is very useful.
But not on day 1! You're still wrong.
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Taishyr

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #84 on: January 03, 2008, 05:41:27 AM »
Mmmrf, why must I be on a different schedule from most of you. Ah well. Out of class, on to talking.

Re: the Sopko/QR tiff... eh, no. Could be any combination of anything, as Shale noted, yeah, and as such isn't anything major from either of them, I don't feel. The commentary/sarcasm on QR's part is... interesting, but thus far it does not seem to state much - it's a simple observation of Otter's playstyle and the results, for good or ill. Sopko... mmm. I can see why Excal would jump on such a thing, but this... mmm, feels like a Sopko being Sopko moment. Want to hear more from both Sopko and QR just in general, regarding things that are not QR and Sopko, respectively.

Otter not being here... mmm. It is interesting he hasn't commented on anything, but even from him, I'm not sure I'd consider it telling for another day or so without commentary.

Unoriginal... ... ...Yeah, feels like my "Ax Up The Arse FoS: Taishyr" line. I don't see any real reason for it either way other than a silly comment, which given the Day 1 factor doesn't seem bad. Duly noted, naturally, but I can't help but feel it's harmless, here.

And yes, my posts thus far have been minimal. I usually miss you guys leading out of the joke vote phase in general, even assuming I've been around.

Strago/Evil Tom -> Smodge/Evil Tom discussion on page 5 is interesting in general; Evil Tom... why did you make the post voting for Unoriginal so late? The timing feels weird in general on that.

Smodge: Mmm. So quick to vote for Nitori, kept the vote on until a little while after Nitori posted, and then dropped the vote. Okay, nothing bad there... except he does not then use his vote to pull others out (Otter). A... bit peculiar, to me.  However, his arguments toward Evil Tom page this page are far more solid (re: No Lynch), I feel, so...

For now: ##Unvote: QuietRain and ##Vote: EvilTom. Yeah, for now, the No-Lynch comment paired with the few other oddities seems most telling thus far to me. Then again, lots of people (including me, yes, I've never been afraid of hypocrisy if it's true) also aren't talking so much, which is naturally bad - we can't get reads, good or ill, on people if they aren't discussing anything. Don't make me break out super's whip and staple a chainsaw to the end of it.

(P.S.: Smodge, it's role. Not roll. You're making me want a cinnamon roll, and that's not a good thing since I can't find any here.)


Aaaand while I was typing this, the nice forum decided to notify me that EvilTom replied still further! Okay, let me boil this down. No Lynch, unless you really think something completely bizarre is going on in general (i.e., Bastard Mod situation), is a really bad idea. Firstly, as Otter would say but paraphrased, the lynch is the tool of the town to kill the scum. Period. We can't trust the power roles to kill or find the scum for us. We can't anticipate scum slipping up; waiting for that may take the whole game if not more. Bad move. If the scum are good enough or even just lurky enough, they won't give themselves away fast enough for a no-lynch stratagem to work.

...Let me put it this way. The town? The town is Mario. The scum? That Kazio Mario World patch. We have however many lives to get our way through whatever pitfalls, abilities and methods the scum may have, and only our ability to see through the puzzle will get us anywhere. But if we see a part that looks impossible, should we wait? No! The timer runs out, and we have accomplished nothing! We need to push forward and try to solve the puzzle before us, else we will not win here. Yes, we may guess the wrong answer. But it is better than waiting and doing nothing, letting the game kill us.

Day 1, day 3, day 5 or 7 or blippetyboo100. Doesn't matter. We need to try each time or we will not proceed any further. Does this make sense?

While waiting for reply, I'm going to quick reread everything, make sure I didn't miss anything that merits commentary.

QuietRain

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #85 on: January 03, 2008, 05:45:22 AM »
Yeah, I've been reading along and hoping for something to catch my thoughts enough to give me enough substance for an actual post, but so far nothing has. Soppy/QR could be any combination of roles, plus the fact that I still don't have a clue how QR plays town. I do think I side with Soppy in that little tiff, just because the dig she took at Otter seemed pretty confrontational this early on, but hell if I know what that says.

Reminder, I did play town in the FFT game for awhile.  And my own personal brand of affection for the water mammal extends from that first foray into the mafia world.  After being on the damaging end of those teeth and claws in the FFT game, I take them seriously.  And I saw what a good job he's done with them in other games.

Now, to change the joke vote to a serious one based on a simple gut reaction.

##Unvote Tai
##Vote EvilTom


His comments have seemed very odd to me and after reading back through his attempts to explain his reasoning to others, I didn't find myself moved to belief.  And he's been really defensive in his responses which really could go either way, but I tend to err on the side of my gut reactions when it comes to Day 1 votes.  Because, really, what else is there in Day 1?
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EvilTom

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #86 on: January 03, 2008, 05:50:57 AM »
Quick response: I already said why I voted for Unoriginal, it's because self-votes never benefit town, therefore it's something that only benefits scum, so I wanted him to stop. As for the timing? I did it when I felt the joke phase had ended.

Onto serious matters:

Actually Tai, I completely agree that we should lynch. I made the comment to see if there were any abnormal reactions, since we had so little else to go on. Yes that's right, I was baiting. Smodge seemed to dive on the bait with a heap of logical fallacies. His flustered comments such as "We should lynch because there are no roleflips" and "we should lynch on day 1 because we can find out who the cop voted for" are.... inexplicably wrong.

There are countless situations where knowing a dead townies roll is very useful.
And this doesn't make sense, even when you factor in correct spelling! He's saying a lot of things that make zero sense, while trying to keep the heat on me for "we must lynch!!!!!"

It looks to me that Smodge is trying to push the "LYNCH!" thing against me, and rushing to do so; in the process he's making a lot of mistakes. How does this look to everyone else?
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EvilTom

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #87 on: January 03, 2008, 05:53:18 AM »
And he's been really defensive in his responses which really could go either way,
Um... really? I didn't notice that. Where, might I ask? People have asked why I made comments/votesm, and I answered them. Then people asked me a few more times, and I referred them to previous posts >.>
Technically defending yourself when being asked to is being defensive, but I hardly think I've been defensive in the context of "ZOMG DONT KILL MEE!!"
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Smodge13

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #88 on: January 03, 2008, 05:54:56 AM »
Smodge: Mmm. So quick to vote for Nitori, kept the vote on until a little while after Nitori posted, and then dropped the vote. Okay, nothing bad there... except he does not then use his vote to pull others out (Otter). A... bit peculiar, to me. 

2 Reasons i didn't place a vote on Otter

1. This is my 2nd Forum game of mafia and last game it was quite obvious i jumped from vote to vote a bit too much, i'm slowing down and being a lot more thoughtful with my posts (or trying to be).
2. Otter seems incredibly aggressive from the 1 game i've seen him play and i can't see him deliberately not posting, so for now i believe there is probably RL issues of some-sort and am giving the benefit of the doubt

As for removing it from Nitori, Well as i said after i placed the vote i was going to sleep.

P.S - Sorry about the misspelling i'm so focused on fixing my Grammar/Punctuation i must have missed it.

Hunter Sopko

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #89 on: January 03, 2008, 06:00:50 AM »
If Otter hasn't posted by now, he's probably not going to post at all today. It's either strategic or part of his role.

I can see people questioning my questioning of QR, but to consider it "being hard on her" is a stretch by any imagination. It's not like I put her in the stocks and had you guys stone her, I merely pointed out, in a reasonable tone, that saying stuff we already know and throwing sarcasm into it does not help town. The vote was thrown in to, as always, provoke a reaction. A justifiable move, day one.

The Corwin thing looks to me like a possibly scum move, for the reasons Yakko stated in that he is trying to push Rat out for past games and late jokevoting is the perfect non-threatening time for scum to vote. EvilTom doesn't exactly help Corwin in stating that Cranbud is just as bad as Corwin for putting the vote to three when... Cranbud didn't do anything of the sort. It actually makes both Tom and Corwin look pretty bad.

Smodge13

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #90 on: January 03, 2008, 06:01:12 AM »
Quote
And this doesn't make sense, even when you factor in correct spelling! He's saying a lot of things that make zero sense, while trying to keep the heat on me for "we must lynch!!!!!"

It looks to me that Smodge is trying to push the "LYNCH!" thing against me, and rushing to do so; in the process he's making a lot of mistakes. How does this look to everyone else?

Pushing "Lynch" onto you?, where do i do that?

Also knowing townie roles was for future reference, day 1 it might not mean as much, but it could still come in handy, hence voting for otter with absolute 0 posts is something we have to seriously think about, because if it is RL issues, he can't even roleclaim.

If he Roleclaims and we lynch him anyway and turns out to be town, at least we know what we lost.

We can safely assume Town won't often Lie, hence everyone we lynch should get the option of roleclaim, that way if they are innocent we know what we lost.


EvilTom

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #91 on: January 03, 2008, 06:03:59 AM »
EvilTom doesn't exactly help Corwin in stating that Cranbud is just as bad as Corwin for putting the vote to three when... Cranbud didn't do anything of the sort. It actually makes both Tom and Corwin look pretty bad.
ArgH! Sorry! I screwed up..
"Taishyr (2): Quietrain, Bobbin Cranbud"  I thought Bobbin and Cranbud were two seperate votes *facepalm* my bad, sorry >.<
It was late and I was tired...
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EvilTom

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #92 on: January 03, 2008, 06:08:43 AM »
Quote
It looks to me that Smodge is trying to push the "LYNCH!" thing against me
Pushing "Lynch" onto you?, where do i do that?
Not onto, against. Ie. Pro-lynch.

Also knowing townie roles was for future reference, day 1 it might not mean as much
But we're talking about day 1. This is day 1.
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Nitori

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #93 on: January 03, 2008, 06:15:12 AM »
First of all, Otter does need to post soon. It may be characteristic of him to do this, but it's...not exactly good. Uno hasn't really done anything either, except vote for himself and then unvote.

From what I can read so far, a lot of the day's events seem to center around the initial burst of votes for Rat, and in this light, neither Corwin/Dread Thomas look good for stacking multiple joke votes, as it has been observed. Corwin has far less content to go on than Dread, though. Dread has been a little odd himself, mind. Even baiting the idea of No Lynch for odd responses doesn't feel productive to me at all since anyone will rally against it. And for what Uno did...I figure such an odd move would have pressure coming in on it immediately, not so far after the fact.

Soppy/QR feels like a bit of a townie tiff, although I am less confident of the label on day 1 than any other day. Neither of them have particularly done anything odd past this, which means I probably won't turn to them for the moment.

I'll stay trained on Otter for the time being. With no content, no judgment can really be made. I'm sure he'll show up, and I can look to other vote possibilities like Cor/Dread Thomas, but for now I'll keep my vote on the devil that no one knows~





<Ko-NitoriisSulpher> roll 1d100 to grade Nitori?
<Hatbot> ACTION --> "Ko-NitoriisSulpher rolls 1d100 to grade Nitori? and gets 100." [1d100=100]

Excal

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #94 on: January 03, 2008, 06:18:01 AM »
So, in translation, you're trying to convert a mistake in an argument, where you're arguing in specific re: Day 1, and he's arguing in general, and trying to turn that into a scum tell?  Tom, I'm not sure what pot of gold you're looking for at the end of this rainbow, but I don't think this fishing expedition's gonna pan out.  Especially given he doesn't seem to be tripping up, you're just staying in a dog fight where Smodge can rebut your arguments with rote townisms.

That said.  Getting overwrought over the teeniest tiniest things, oddly enough, seems to be something of a town trait.  So, I'm oddly thinking that Tom is also safe.  At least for now.

Which means my suspicion for the moment has to go elsewhere.  First off, there's Otter.  If he's not going to post, he of all people shouldn't be getting a free ride.  Let him talk, or let him hang.  If he has nothing up by the time twelve hours remain, I don't think we can justify letting him stick around.

Corwin, hasn't really said much, and he did stick on a late third vote on Rat, as has been pointed out.  Honestly, I'd love to hear some further justification of this decision.

VSM, you've got a lot of posts, but I can't recall a lot of content from you.  And it's content and what isn't said that'll trip someone up.  Let's hear your thoughts, man.

And since I can't seem to justify keeping my vote on Soppy, let's stick it on the person I find scummiest of the three I mentioned here.

##Unvote: Hunter Sopko,  ##Vote: Corwin

This is just to place some pressure man, so let's hear your thoughts.

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #95 on: January 03, 2008, 06:20:35 AM »
My my.  Suddenly so very lively in here.  It would seem that once again, Dread Thomas has found himself under the notorious Day One Gun.  Admittedly, the passing reference to No-Lynch is an understandable and useful flag, so really he's probably the best target so far.

That said, we've now past 24 hours with no word from one of our players, so I don't want to get a serious wagon going either.  We could really use a resolution of that issue.

Otherwise... Tom, could you... post... more... calmly?  It's almost like reading a younger version of Meeple and it's hurting my head a little <.<  Though understandably you do need to post decicively since you're definitely getting the most heat so far.
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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #96 on: January 03, 2008, 06:22:05 AM »
Update!

Carthrat (1): Cmdr_King, EvilTom, Corwin, EvilTom
Cmdr_King (2): Yakumo, IhatethisCPU
Corwin (1): Excal
EvilTom (4): Shale, Strago, Taishyr, QuietRain
Hunter Sopko (1): Nitori, Kilgamayan, Excal
IhatethisCPU (0): Cmdr_King
Kilgamayan (0): Hunter Sopko
Nitori (0): Excal, Smodge13
Otter (2): Strago, Nitori, EvilTom
QuietRain (1): Taishyr, Hunter Sopko
Shale (0): Carthrat
Taishyr (1): Quietrain, Bobbin Cranbud
Unoriginal (1): Unoriginal, Carthrat, EvilTom
VSM (1): Cmdr_King
Yakumo (0): Smodge13

With nineteen alive, it takes ten to lynch.

There are 19 hours until the deadline.

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #97 on: January 03, 2008, 06:55:58 AM »
On Otter: Otter is *really* starting to freak me out with his not posting.  I can't imagine he would do it as scum unless his role demanded it, though, so while I'm tempted to do a "Post More" vote on him, it feels wrong when I can't see him doing it scumilly.  Of course, I don't understand why it would be in his Townie interest, either, save for a role that demanded it.
(Incidentally, that's some truly evil modding/hatbotting if Otter, one of the main champions of discussion over night roles for Town, got stuck with a night role that makes it hard for him to participate in the discussion!)

On EvilTom: Bringing up No Lynch is a proven no-no, his explanation seems awfully risky, and I'm not seeing Smodge's alleged misconduct in response.  However, it's in keeping with how I've seen EvilTom play other games, and he's already at four votes on a rapidly developing train.  I know it takes a lot more to lynch, but I'm worried this will become our sole avenue of discussion.

On QR and Sopko: My read on this is that it is a simple misunderstanding.  I didn't interpret QR's post as *any* kind of an attack on Otter; it appeared complementary.  I can also see how Sopko could have read it the other way, though.

So far, I haven't seen anything vote-worthy and am still hoping to see an Otter post.  Tai seems to have good reasons for his EvilTom vote, though, so I am for now just going to ##UNVOTE: Taishyr.
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Corwin

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #98 on: January 03, 2008, 06:59:51 AM »
You people all live on the wrong continent, I swear.

Justification for a third vote, Excal? "With nineteen alive, it takes ten to lynch." So yeah, calling it a bandwagon is pointless. Now I'll just need some time to read rather than skim the new posts and I'll respond with actual content.

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Re: Discworld Mafia is go!
« Reply #99 on: January 03, 2008, 07:25:14 AM »
Well, yes.  I know it's not likely that you'd be pushing him over any barriers.  However, it is odd that you'd pick someone with two votes for a random pileon.