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Author Topic: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.  (Read 692471 times)

Shale

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4050 on: August 13, 2009, 03:09:54 PM »
You're supposed to fight him before Bakor's arc. He's not hugely different in the remake IIRC, just generally damaging and can put pressure on you.  Though yeah, if he's being a bitch (And he can be if he's cute and spams ice attacks), come back later. He's doesn't have a ton of HP. You may be able to silence him too? That might only be  Arsene Lutrin/Bakor though!

Tried silence, didn't work (and yeah, the Crackle spam was the largest part of his bullshittery). I ended up getting the Zenithian Helm and Armor first, then coming back and smiting him.
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superaielman

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4051 on: August 13, 2009, 03:19:06 PM »
Oh, you didn't have that armor? That'd hurt, the ice resistance really helps out your durability there. Kiryl should have ice resisting gear at this point as well (Magic vestment from Rose town or whatever).

I usually make sure I have either midheal on Kiryl or Metal babble armor at that point or you're in for a bit of trouble. And use Borya, you know you want Oomph!
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Strago

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4052 on: August 13, 2009, 03:27:22 PM »
Exit Fate - Just entered Gaia's Heart. Oh, great, another inane difficulty spike requiring me to grind my ass off. I think I'll just play Suikoden II again.

Wow, I don't remember needing to grind very often in Exit Fate.  Certainly not for levels.  The only thing I was ever really short of was money (and that lasted until the final dungeon).

What kind of party setup are you using?

Typical party is Daniel (unfortunately), Klaus (kitty!), Carson, Griever, Shiro/Bast/Ayara/Jovian (slot changes a lot), and Yan Angwa (though I just got Orlando, who seems pretty badass but I don't feel like using because of the annoying character design).

I don't think I need to grind for levels, per se. It's just that keeping even six characters outfitted in the most up-to-date armor and fully-sharpened weapons has been consistently impossible all game, even with some grinding, and it seems like every dungeon punishes me a little bit more for that.

Shale

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4053 on: August 13, 2009, 03:30:26 PM »
Yeah, my first tries I had no ice resistance whatsoever. That didn't help much.

Edit: also, my go-to party is Solo/Ragnar/Alena/Kiryl. I'd rather have Kabuff than Oomph, and even without the attack boost well-armed physical fighters beat out offensive mages for damage so easily it isn't funny.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2009, 03:35:07 PM by Shale »
"Sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology."
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Meeplelard

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4054 on: August 13, 2009, 03:52:50 PM »
Borya's good for Sap, Oomph, and Accellerate, though I agree that on turns he's not doing that, he's kind of worthless (gets a little better when you get some Item Casts that heal, so he can do something meaningful on his team.)

This is the point where I punt DQ4 Offensive Magic for being LESS RELIABLE than Physicals.  Honestly, what the fuck?  Magic misses far more often than physicals, and things can resist it, and it can't crit, and the MT aspect isn't enough to make up for its less damage in this case.  Last I checked, if anything, Magic in most games DOESN'T miss (or has much better accuracy) which is one of its big advantages over physicals (or it will be your only way around high defenses like in FF2, or it'll have some quirk attached like "Common 1-2 range attack that doesn't fail at accuracy or weight!" like in Fire Emblems)

It doesn't help that just about every boss mocks Offensive Magic in some way or another -_-
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Shale

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4055 on: August 13, 2009, 03:55:34 PM »
Yeah, that's pretty much what I meant. Magic having a miss chance isn't that horrible, but magic having a miss chance an order of magnitude higher than that of a free physical attack is.
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Bobbin Cranbud

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4056 on: August 13, 2009, 04:33:30 PM »
Typical party is Daniel (unfortunately), Klaus (kitty!), Carson, Griever, Shiro/Bast/Ayara/Jovian (slot changes a lot), and Yan Angwa (though I just got Orlando, who seems pretty badass but I don't feel like using because of the annoying character design).

I don't think I need to grind for levels, per se. It's just that keeping even six characters outfitted in the most up-to-date armor and fully-sharpened weapons has been consistently impossible all game, even with some grinding, and it seems like every dungeon punishes me a little bit more for that.

That seems very mage-light to me.  I know Daniel is stuck in the middle and the fighter slot is fighty, but I never used Carson or Griever.  Are either of them casters?

My party for most of the game was Daniel, two front-liners (Bast and Jovian at that point, IIRC) and three mages.  Upgrading spells is much more important than upgrading armor and weapons.  I didn't have upgraded weapons for the vast majority of the game, but had the top of the line spells whenever remotely possible, along with the casters to use them.

Three casters should kill any enemy in Gaia's Heart in one round with AoE spells (the dark tree, I think?), unless GH is one of the few dungeons with majority-Dark enemies.  Then use fire. >:)

(Which mages do you have, BTW?  Yan Angua... kind of sucks, from my recollection.)
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superaielman

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4057 on: August 13, 2009, 04:35:26 PM »
Yeah, I never use Borya/Mara for the attack magic, just the support stuff. Ragnar? He's okay, just found having another mage to be a superior option. The lack of speed sucks, as does the lack of base defense. HP is awesome though! The chapter two trio+Solo's the best team in the game until you get the uber PC in C6.
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Strago

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4058 on: August 13, 2009, 04:46:25 PM »
Uhh... Yan Angwa (what sucks about him? he seems fine), Myst, Midian, Deus, and Orlando? They seem like the ones with high enough MAG scores to be considered primarily mages. The way magic works sort of puts me off focusing on it. Ought I do so, then? Blerg the current top-level of spells are so absurdly expensive.

Carson and Griever are pretty rad fighter-types. But I guess those aren't worth bothering with?

Strago

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4059 on: August 13, 2009, 04:47:49 PM »
Oh, and maybe Deke counts as a decent mage? I actually have no idea how he's intended to be used. Weird stat block, but he does have that Gain-Extra-MP ability.

Meeplelard

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4060 on: August 13, 2009, 05:11:33 PM »
I ended up using Ragnar for good deal of DQ4r honestly.  Solofia/Kyril/Alena feel like no brainers; Kabuff is an auto win against so many randoms, and healing, so he makes up for his lack of offense that way (and there's a few things that (Th)whack really helps against), Solofia is a tank with good damage, and Alena just hits too hard to ignore off good speed.

Generally, Borya just...really lagged in randoms.  Yeah, Oomph would be nice...but I'd rather have a 3rd physical attack to spread my hits against Frail opponents, especially on a character with High HP, good defense, and can resist elements (Ragnar can use Dragon stuff, which I found really useful.)  His low speed felt *shrug* worthy cause not using him meant less offense per-turn ANYWAY,  so enemies generally got those actions.

Bosses, though?  Yeah, Borya's quite good there due to his support stuff, won't deny that; Ragnar's still a good choice just to insure you have an extra meatshield, but the comparison is somewhat closer here.  On randoms, Borya only felt useful against those pricks that use (Ka)buff, who'd make me either wait for it to wear off, hope for a crit, or just poke them until they die.
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Shale

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4061 on: August 13, 2009, 05:20:42 PM »
Kyril's got his own use against those jackasses, because (Th)Whack suddenly starts being a viable option. Plus I can itemcast if I really need magical offense. (Magma Staff, Staff of Divine Wrath, Fire Claw....)
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superaielman

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4062 on: August 13, 2009, 05:37:21 PM »
Fair enough Meeple. Borya I used just because I rather stick to one team, especially w hen I have a pretty good idea about what be hit by ID and what won't. Slot ST damage doesn't impress me that much in DQ4 by the time C5 rolls around. Thwhack I found to be solid, but you had to know what to use it on.
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Shale

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4063 on: August 13, 2009, 06:20:29 PM »
I'd agree if MT damage wasn't completely unreliable.
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Bobbin Cranbud

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4064 on: August 13, 2009, 06:27:14 PM »
Uhh... Yan Angwa (what sucks about him? he seems fine), Myst, Midian, Deus, and Orlando? They seem like the ones with high enough MAG scores to be considered primarily mages. The way magic works sort of puts me off focusing on it. Ought I do so, then? Blerg the current top-level of spells are so absurdly expensive.

Carson and Griever are pretty rad fighter-types. But I guess those aren't worth bothering with?

IIRC, when they're at the same level, Yan Angwa has the lowest MAG of any of the mages you have.  I was using Myst-Midian-Deus at that point, then swapped Midian for Orlando when he became available.  Myst and Deus stayed in my party through the final battle.

At least two fighters are worth bothering with.  I used Jovian when available, and at the point you're at Bast, but the non-Jovians fighters you have should be pretty interchangeable, so just take your favorites.  For a long time I used... Derek?  The skeleton you get with Myst.  Anyway, used him as a third fighter and often went without Daniel in the active party.  Derek is a great tank.  So three fighters is by no means a bad idea at this point, especially since Jovian is equivalent to a mage in single target damage until the late-late game.  Four is DEFINITELY overkill, and even three is pushing it if you have Daniel in the active party.

The biggest problem with fighters is actually the expense - mages are much cheaper.  Keeping ALL your mages in top level spells costs about the same as keeping one fighter with a fully upgraded weapon, and the best fighters (JOVIAN) pop in and out of the party at times, which makes all your investment worthless until they return.  By contrast, every mage you have benefits from the spells (albeit some are, obviously, weaker than others).  This is important at the stage you're at, and will only get more so as you go on - especially when you have to make multiple parties and use fighters with largely unupgraded weapons.

By the endgame the mages drastically outdamage the fighters, as well (the only way fighters can keep up is when... buffed by mages. >_<)  It's rather like 3e D&D in this respect, except fighters CAN actually tank (and mages actually need them to).

Also, are you swapping characters in battle?  Some of the status effects (Freeze!) make this very important.

ALSO also, I had a thief in the active party the whole way through unless I was either in a dungeon with nothing worth stealing or where I needed a fully-kitted-out combat force just to survive randoms.  Having and aggressively using a thief makes a big difference money-wise.  (Handily, you'll fairly soon be able to get a character who is both the best thief and best mage in the game, so this becomes no question at all. ^_^)
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Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4065 on: August 13, 2009, 06:35:34 PM »
Apparently I had much better luck with Brey's magic. Ice, compared to other elements, didn't seem resisted tooo often, and MT makes up for running into periodic resistances. Brey's also fast, which is nice. I definitely got more overall use out of him than Ragnar, though I did use Ragnar some certainly, particularly around the part of the game Shale's in right now?

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Fudozukushi

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4066 on: August 13, 2009, 08:49:48 PM »
ALSO also, I had a thief in the active party the whole way through unless I was either in a dungeon with nothing worth stealing or where I needed a fully-kitted-out combat force just to survive randoms.  Having and aggressively using a thief makes a big difference money-wise.  (Handily, you'll fairly soon be able to get a character who is both the best thief and best mage in the game, so this becomes no question at all. ^_^)

Avalon is also coming up for him.  That place is great to make money with a thief.

Jo'ou Ranbu

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4067 on: August 13, 2009, 11:06:36 PM »
VPDS - Arngrim came out of absolutely nowhere and ate an Orbital Maid Laser and died.

The SG sorta has to be seen to be believed.
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Twilkitri

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4068 on: August 13, 2009, 11:46:37 PM »
Rogue Galaxy - Back to the desert

The fight with Gale was kind of ludicrously easy. Intermittent shooting that can't break Deego's defend defence and a kick that can, but he only uses it if you get up in his face? And Deego appears to not have to deal with running out of clips mid-battle like the rest of the characters do, no less.

Fight with Paul the Ripper was not. Unsure whether I was underlevelled for that fight somehow or whether it's supposed to be as difficult as it was. Right out of the gate he hp->1ed Kisala and Deego and then killed them off with another attack. It was not the best fight for maintaining a high supply of resurrection items. Fortunately they did a better job of keeping out of his attacks afterwards. Secondarily, we were only doing low double-digit damage per swing.

Anyway we have now meandered back to the Desert Planet where I was able to get the bounty on Statue Dogs and fill in the hole in the bounty list that had been there for far too long. Happily a new page of enemies has shown up in town, but unfortunately the original enemies seem to be far more common than the new ones so progress on them is low. There's also an enemy that shows up near the church that comes from several pages later; unsure what the deal with that is. It's possible that the new enemies here are the same set as in the area I'm going next, but who can say whether it is worth risking that.

Being back here also allows me to collect a bunch of low-end weapons that I need for a bunch of combinations I have had to skip over doing. Good times.

Currently the rank 14 hunter. I kind of wish that the ranks had been paced more evenly, considering how much of the game there appears to be to go and by the fact that the distance between each rank is starting to step up.

Yoshiken

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4069 on: August 14, 2009, 12:14:52 AM »
BoF4: Seriously, how do games always get away with grammatical errors? I mean, being an FF fan, I'm somewhat used to them, but it's still annoying. "You must journey to the the Place of Summoning" - gj there.

Jo'ou Ranbu

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4070 on: August 14, 2009, 12:16:46 AM »
BoF4: Seriously, how do games always get away with grammatical errors? I mean, being an FF fan, I'm somewhat used to them, but it's still annoying. "You must journey to the the Place of Summoning" - gj there.

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[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> HEY
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[01:08] <Laggy> YA!!!!!!!!!1111111111
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> OMG!!!!
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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4071 on: August 14, 2009, 03:52:20 AM »
CotP - Seraphic Gate, 3rd Cycle.

> *GabrielPossessed is now GabrielDepressed

He also needs to learn to stop failing, but then again, what doesn't.

Shale

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4072 on: August 14, 2009, 04:10:23 AM »
SW4: Got all the Zenithian gear, and powered up the sword. I tried using my reserves for a while, and it didn't go very well. Meanwhile, Ragnar has the Miracle Sword, so I've got two fairly badass tanks in the lineup.
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Meeplelard

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4073 on: August 14, 2009, 04:58:24 AM »
Apparently I had much better luck with Brey's magic. Ice, compared to other elements, didn't seem resisted tooo often, and MT makes up for running into periodic resistances. Brey's also fast, which is nice. I definitely got more overall use out of him than Ragnar, though I did use Ragnar some certainly, particularly around the part of the game Shale's in right now?

This is DQ4r though; stuff has changed.  Borya is not fast like Brey is, for example; somewhat less reliable in that regard.  Unsure about the original, but Attack Magic, his included, is pretty damn unreliable so...
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Niu

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Re: Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.
« Reply #4074 on: August 14, 2009, 06:22:11 AM »
VPDS - Arngrim came out of absolutely nowhere and ate an Orbital Maid Laser and died.

The SG sorta has to be seen to be believed.

You use Ailyth? But.. but she sucks!!