Games you're playing: The 2009 edition.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Pfft. CoM is not terrible. It's just an entirely different type of game, that's all. I, for one, definitely preferred CoM to KH1.
The reason to play CoM is for the gameplay! It's definitely, if nothing else, a lot less repetitive than KH1. >.>

That's the problem. CoM's gameplay fails. Your worth is entirely tied to how many high-point cards you have so you can outprioritize shit. It's basically tying the basic idea of Solitaire into an ARPG. Trying to make an ARPG where you can't even use your basic physical without a finite resource that isn't elegantly, easily replenishable, really really sucks (recharging cards was a very clumsy way to deal with resources, and only made battles unnecessarily more drawn out) so you could do... basically the same as KH with less freedom of movement, so it's actually more repetitive (spend cards, charge. Lather, rinse, repeat). There is "different" and there is "I banged my head against the crib multiple times when I was a baby". CoM design falls squarely into the latter.

[Talaysen]

Item gathering may be improved by increasing the amounts, but that doesn't make the inclusion of a mini game even remotely associated with this.  I may not have seen it specifically, but I have seen enough games in my time to be able to tell the kinds of things I will like.  I can tell you I will probably like MK2.  I will play those mini games a million fucking times and seriously not care for them at the end of the game.  Fishing mini game in MK1 was atrocious just like it was in MK3.  Edit - AI3 here obviously.  Just like mini games in oh I dunno, every other fucking RPG they come up over and over again for repetitive basic actions is.

Gathering minigame flat out improves gathering because it lets you choose what items you get if you want to and you can just flat out ignore it if you don't care.

Probably best to not even reply to the rest.

[Yoshiken]

Snow: Each to their own, I guess. I found it much more interesting than KH1, at least, because of the variety of attacks that -actually had some worth this time round-, as opposed to KH1, where it was magic or attack.
And... I had no problems with the recharge either, tbh. :/

[Cmdr_King]

Actually, the reason to play Chain of Memories, if you're so inclined, is because Riku mode is fun on its own merits and answers one or two questions that KH2 itself completely glazes over.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Snow: Each to their own, I guess. I found it much more interesting than KH1, at least, because of the variety of attacks that -actually had some worth this time round-, as opposed to KH1, where it was magic or attack.

That's actually sorta funny, because I found worth in a lot of non-straight skills in KH1. Gravity/Stop spells were neat, Aero was a wonderful spell for efficiency (since it lasts long enough to be worth casting and highly lowers the amount of time you spend healing), defensive maneuvers (particularly Dodge Roll, which was godly, and the gliding, which is pretty fun) felt worth using, and there were even some attack skills that were particularly good (Sonic Edge comes to mind). In CoM, using anything but your basic spells was so cumbersome and inefficient that trying to aim for those felt more like hamstringing your offense than just spamming your basic combo or using a Cloud summon until you had to recharge. The sad part is CoM could've been as flexible as KH (which isn't saying a whole lot, mind) if it just ditched the awful card system.

[Yoshiken]

Hmm, I see what you mean about Aero and Dodge Roll - didn't really find the same with Gravity/Stop, personally, but okay - but all that does is make every fight start with Aero, and then become attack & Dodge Roll spam. Didn't really find any of the attack skills in KH1 useful except possibly Ars Arcanum, which was so late in the game and so useless on randoms as to not really matter.
CoM, I thought, was better for the attack moves. The Raid series in particular stands out to me as being good, with Reflect Raid just being total annihilation for randoms, and I thought most of the summons were actually useful this time round - again, another thing KH1 got very, very wrong.

[Shale]

I didn't get much use out of KH's secondary skills (Aero was awesome, though, and Strike Raid was great against Sephiroth), but I enjoyed the combat well enough anyway. More complication is not always a good thing.

[hinode]

The only reason to play CoM, from what I understand, is to see the Organization XIII losers start talking cryptically about random plot points sooner. Why anyone would want to do that, I have no fucking clue.

It gives fanfic writers more innuendo to play around with.

I mean, that's pretty much what Orgy XIII exists for anyway.

[Anthony Edward Stark]

Actually, the reason to play Chain of Memories, if you're so inclined, is because Riku mode is fun on its own merits and answers one or two questions that KH2 itself completely glazes over.

Are there seriously people who agonize over the plot from Kingdom Hearts?

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Actually, the reason to play Chain of Memories, if you're so inclined, is because Riku mode is fun on its own merits and answers one or two questions that KH2 itself completely glazes over.

Are there seriously people who agonize over the plot from Kingdom Hearts?

Your innocent comment just caused a flamewar over three quarters of the teenaged livejournal community. The other quarter wanks furiously to HookXSaix yaoi.

[Meeplelard]

Actually, the reason to play Chain of Memories, if you're so inclined, is because Riku mode is fun on its own merits and answers one or two questions that KH2 itself completely glazes over.

This.

Riku mode was actually kind of interesting.  The "Here's a deck, learn how to use it" aspect works a lot better than "Build your own damn deck; if don't have the right cards, you're screwed, and must go grind for better ones!"    The fact that it was 1/3rd the length made the game far less annoying too, and also meant less of the door bullshit.

Riku Mode's plot actually felt...meaningful too.  It answered a question you were left with at the end of KH1 (what the hell happened to Riku?), does actual genuine foreshadowing of KH2, and even make Riku's subplot in KH2 have a degree of sense.
Sora's plot was completely filler and nonsense.  Now yes, most of KH1's plot was filler, with the Disney Worlds...but it was handled stylishly, and you enjoyed it.  It was fun visiting Disney Worlds, and playing a full ARPG in them; you can't deny its amusing that freaking Ariel from the Little Mermaid was an ally in her world, for example!  In CoM, the Disney worlds were so...blech, they lost their charm they had in KH1.
KH2, meanwhile, was primarily new worlds.  The revisited old worlds, outside of Aggrabah and Halloween Town (the former was probably cause Aladdin is like the only Disney Movie with a half decent sequel, so it made sense, and the latter is cause there was still some good opportunity to explore that world, what with Christmas Town and all...and they took full advantage of it!), were handled in such a way that they felt new and fresh anyway; Colosseum is a big one, cause outside of the name, it really is a totally new level.

THe problem with Riku mode, of course, is that it requires Sora mode to play it.  That in itself is an issue, and while Riku mode isn't half bad, the 5 hours you get out of that is not worth the 15 you sink into Sora mode.

[Shale]

See, the entire reason I play KH is for the "filler." The overarching plot is there because Tetsuya Nomura is incapable of making something that's good all the way through. I accept that, but the idea of caring about Riku and Sora is completely alien to me.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

butbutbutbut shale canon disney shotacon *Shot.*

[hinode]

Are there seriously people who agonize over the plot from Kingdom Hearts?

This is the internet. There are people who seriously agonize over the plot/continuity of the Simpsons.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Somehow, that's more relevant than the great accusations of Civil War-like oppression suffered by the Harry/Hermione shippers in the holes of HP fandom.

[Anthony Edward Stark]

The overarching plot is there because Tetsuya Nomura is incapable of making something that's good.

There you go. Nomura makes games worse by existing.

[Meeplelard]

See, the entire reason I play KH is for the "filler." The overarching plot is there because Tetsuya Nomura is incapable of making something that's good all the way through. I accept that, but the idea of caring about Riku and Sora is completely alien to me.

Riku is somewhat more interesting in KHCoM.  Basically the entire story is him being pushed around by Ansem, and the Orgy members, until he basically says "fuck it, you guys suck, I'm just gonna kick your ass.'  Unlike Sora, he has a legit reason for going through this shit; he did kind of get eaten by a bunch of monsters, has no clue what's going on, and his only ally is not really with him physically, so he's kind of alone on this endeavor.  He also has to face the guy whose been mind raping him since KH1, so you almost feel bad for him...then he gets his act together and the "almost sympathy" transforms into "mild respect" as now Riku's just giving each villain the finger, verbally owning them, and THEN kicks their asses.

Contrast to Sora who just whines about his memories, villains mock him, pulls one of those "I don't believe you! Quit mocking me!!!" and then finally fights.  Sora's even told he's being manipulated and he still...gets manipulated.  Riku's more like Ramza; he's being manipulated, he knows that's the case, but frankly, he doesn't really have much of a choice but to go along with it, and hope for a good opportunity.  

...you know, I'm reminded about another reason why Riku Mode >>> Sora Mode.

When Riku runs out of cards?  Select Reshuffle, OH LOOK FULL DECK!  That took all of 1 second!
When Sora's out of cards?  Sits there and charges...ok, not bad.  ...wait, now I have to sit double the length when I run out? ...now TRIPLE!?

Yeah, why Sora had to keep going up (thankfully it caps at 3) I don't know.  Oh, Riku's ability to use all monster/boss cards whenever he wants was a nice boon; those things really weren't so overpowered, but at the same time, were really handy.  

In any event, I generally agree that you don't play KH for plot, and that the "filler" is more interesting, though, the War sequence in KH2 was generally well done, but that's mostly a style thing.  1000 Heartless Battle (with good music alongside it) + the FF Cameos actually DOING SOMETHING (this includes the Pseudo-Temp forms they have) + Stitch shooting some Heartless + Failure Emo Cloud getting verbally owned by Sephiroth + Mickey Mouse + Tron.  YEah, fun sequence in general.

[Anthony Edward Stark]

Sounds like moderate shittiness v. godawful shittiness to me.

[Luther Lansfeld]

FE10- Beat the final boss.

The last two bosses are pretty easy.  I will do a full assessment later. 10/10.

[Ultradude]

FE10 - Soooo up through prologue of Part 3 I R GUD AT UPDATIN. Part 1 was a lolarcoaster of random wtf. 1-9 gave me many, many resets, as all the 15 Sp enemies doubled and one-rounded level 20 Micaiah without fail, and keeping her from being attacked at all is difficult. Came down to figuring out who was least likely to kill her. Final chapter wasn't horrible, though I needed the BK a little more than I would've liked, especially because I wanted to stop the Thieves.

Part 2 was full of win. Elincia with Amiti, Marcia, Haar, the Paladins... truly glorious rushing tactics. The Endgame was all about Elincia, Marcia, and Leanne making my eastern defenses fucking impenetrable with constant healing and ranged attacks - Elincia with Wind Edge is a very good idea. Haar handled everything to the west aside from a few Sages that Calill bitch slapped until the end, when I had to pull him back a bit and give Mordecai some action. Lethe and Nealuchi also helped out to the east, though Brom and Nephenee did most of the hard defensive work there. The reinforcements never got close to Elincia or the boss, but drew lots of attention from enemy reinforcements and got some kills of there own, especially Geoffrey and Kieran; was not, however, surprised at MVP Haar, as his brief appearances so far have been made of raep.

Managed to almost get Ike killed by sub-30 hit rate Sages on the Prologue of Part 3 and Rolf and Mist picked off lots of softened foes, but you could honestly probably just sit there and watch the Laguz kill everything if you're lucky.

[Sierra]

MK2: Played through chapter 3, saw the first scenes for each PC. All I can say about Goto's is what the christ. The whole school's got a hard-on for a walking fursuit. Nuke it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure.

[Grefter]

Gathering minigame flat out improves gathering because it lets you choose what items you get if you want to and you can just flat out ignore it if you don't care.

Probably best to not even reply to the rest.

Doesn't make it good.  Doesn't make it the best way to implement resource gathering in a game that is all about resource gathering and application of said items.  Just means one more reason to question why it was implemented as a mini game.  You can do it with randomisation and having fairly prominent number of spawn points (which is something MK did quite well) with slightly more evened out percentages and still have larger number of spawns.  Gasp! it is a way to do it without a fucking minigame going "I demand that I dig up copper now".  Part of what makes really good IC systems is the gaining of the items for it being fairly natural and especially natural feeling (MK actually did a good job at that).  History has shown that mini games are generally pretty poorly built and implemented, history has shown Gust hasn't had a good record at it, history has shown that doing mini games over and over for main components of a game should either A) Be the entire game (Wii Sports style or Wario Ware) or B) tends to be bad.

So I am sorry I questioned why this is a good thing.

Being to be able to skip something doesn't improve the quality of it.

yes yes, being dismissive is the best way to approach conflict.  If we pretend it never happened then it will be just like it never did.

[Niu]

Meep, did you buy Re:CoM? If you like Riku mode, you should definitely try it. The mode is made much better and Zexion is actually an interesting fight.

The overarching plot is there because Tetsuya Nomura is incapable of making something that's good.

There you go. Nomura makes games worse by existing.

That's an overstatement. One must not forget that Kitase is the REAL idiot that make things suck. Really, compare to Vincent May Cry, Nomura's crack are actually healthy to your psyche in comparison.
And if anything, Nomura prevented FF7CC into becoming another Vincent May Cry.

[Anthony Edward Stark]

No, there is no overstatement at all. There is nothing Nomura has ever made that was worth the six cents of raw materials that it takes to make a DVD.

[Niu]

...........I don't know I should be horrified that you are trying to say that Nomura is no worse than Kitase or be mad at you that you think even Subasekai worth less than 6 cents.