Author Topic: Simpsons Mafia GAME OVER - TOWN WIN  (Read 39916 times)

SnowFire

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #50 on: March 05, 2009, 01:52:50 PM »
Hmm.  Some blowback on my post.  To respond to that first...

EvilTom: I had a trip off to Google-land to look up WIFOM, and...  okay, I see what you're saying, this kind of logic can turn into sophistry to mislead people.  That said, I think/hope that a certain amount of logical "let's examine the possibilities" is fine - I learned Mafia at Math Games Night in college for the math majors & friends, and this kind of logic was used by all sides.

Bardiche: The comment I made about Andrew was a joke, to clarify.  And panic-mongering?!

El Cid / Cathrat In general: I'm sorry if I restated what you found obvious, but it seemed like a relevant issue at the time when the only train going was against Delta and it wasn't clear to me if people would listen to El Cid's post poo-pooing it.  And it's a perfectly legitimate town move to throw "light" votes just to get things going, especially on Day 1.  Speaking of which...

##UNVOTE: Cathrat

Also I need to get to work, out of time to offer a good vote myself, so can I ask for like a 1-hour extension?  Not sure if I'll  be back from work at 6:00 if that's when voting closes, but 7:00 should be fine.

EvilTom

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #51 on: March 05, 2009, 02:59:21 PM »
Ok so I had a re-read (between playing L4D), and I can see why people are annoyed with Meeps. But for me the worst thing isn't the Delta vote, it's the attempted justification:
Ok, so it seems my little prod has gotten suspicion.  Should have seen this coming, but my general thought was that I was trying to get SOME discussion going.  And well, it worked! ...even if the discussion ended up directed mostly at me, I'm apparently good at painting myself a target.
'Har har, I totally meant to do that!' = sounding pretty lame.
However, taking into account how Meep has played previous games, Xanth's actions look a lot worse. So choosing between the two of them, I go with:
##Vote: Xanth

That said, Bard & El Cid are looking pretty good to me.
Bard has been clear, cutting and concise (go alliteration). If I had to pick most towny, he'd be up there. http://www.rpgdl.com/forums/index.php?topic=3003.msg52474#msg52474 - found a good point on Meeple I hadn't noticed.
El Cid also though - http://www.rpgdl.com/forums/index.php?topic=3003.msg52478#msg52478 in particular is a good post; he looks at a bunch of angles, some original - ie. following up Andrew.

I'm obviously unsure about people I haven't played much with before - Snow/Ryogo - so trying to figure them out still.
Snow:
Quote
I think/hope that a certain amount of logical "let's examine the possibilities" is fine
Have some thoughts on Delta.  I'm not sure if he's the best lynch.  Yes scum like to lurk, but for scum to skip the first day entirely?  That's actively suspicious, and would mean - assuming Delta IS scum - one of: he was busy for plain vanilla reasons, is not a very good scum player by lurking too blatantly, or is pulling some kind of double bluff to insulate himself from this very logic.  I'm inclined to just think "he's busy" myself.
WIFOM because: it took you about 5 sentences to come to the conclusion that Delta hadn't posted yet so there was nothing we could do. Useless conjecture = fluff.
It was a minor point, but anything is good in the early game.

I'm off to bed, bye!
This is your life and it's ending one minute at a time.

Bardiche

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #52 on: March 05, 2009, 03:06:05 PM »
Bardiche: The comment I made about Andrew was a joke, to clarify.  And panic-mongering?!

I toss around panic-mongering a bit too quickly I suppose. I meant that your post read, to me, like, "Oooh this and this could be all the possibilities and we'll never know!!"

And the Andrew comment? I am a massive idiot. I cannot seem to recall where I read that and why I mentioned Andrew. I'll get back to you if I can on that, but for now consider the argument null and void until I can clarify it. I don't quite understand it myself anymore either.

Sierra

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #53 on: March 05, 2009, 04:05:44 PM »
Not entirely sure how I feel about Cid either, given he basically did the same thing as Andy did, and used that as a reason to stay on him.  His most recent post, especially the bit about Xanth, does make me feel better, since he did put some of my worries into words.  But, eh.  Still watching him, and, just because I suspect someone doesn't mean they're not making valid points.

Where did I do "the same thing as Andy?" I'm not sure what you're referring to here. Perhaps you mean this--

##Unvote: Meeple

Jokevote and all. Instead:

##Vote: Andy

For demanding serious votes and not doing anything to help produce them. It was probably a joke on his part, but I don't see much else to go on right now.

--in which case I maintain that it was as solid a reason as could be found at that point in the game. However, contrary to your analysis, it was never a reason to "stay on" Andy. Note that Andy's Deltavoting became a much stronger reason to suspect him once he did it (all of two posts later) and that I focused on that thereafter.

~

Response to Xanth:

El Cid: no, it wasn't metagaming. That part was in defence, if anything, and I guess from this response I shouldn't have mentioned it at all. It was meant as 'I find this aggressive behaviour unsettling (in and of itself for what it is, no player context or metagaming attached). Before someone informs me, I do know this player plays aggressively anyway, but that context doesn't ease me.'

Thanks for the clarification. However, I'm forced to ask: what is intrinsically wrong with "aggressive behavior?" I don't mean to start a whole playstyle discussion here, it's just that you question one course of action and offer no real alternative to it.

Also:

Haven't actually read all of the longer posts, sucks.

Comments like this aren't encouraging. Setting aside your admitted proclivity for self-deprecation (which by itself is not the problem here) all the talk about how much time you have, about you being lazy, etcetera, would be much better spent actually scumhunting. Your posts have contained quite a lot of fluff this game. Talking about your schedule and whatnot is fundamentally useless. It doesn't help us hunt scum and it doesn't really tell us anything about your alignment. You might not have all the time in the world, but I'm sure something useful could be posted in place of these comments if you wished to do so.

~

Other stuff:

-Delta is back, yay and so forth. Still need him to say stuff about the game itself, but I'm still inclined to consider a train on him to be nonviable barring something highly egregious in whatever content he eventually provides. It's just too late in the day to start focusing on someone who just got here.

-Strago hasn't posted since the jokevote phase. This is bad.

-Vote stays on Meeple for the Delta vote, the poor attempt to justify it, and him having nothing useful to say in response to the pressure. "I'm apparently good at painting myself a target." Sure, but being Meeple doesn't give you a free pass to make scummy errors. Meeple and Xanth look like our best options for lynching today.

Strago

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #54 on: March 05, 2009, 04:21:46 PM »
##UNVOTE: Andrew

*waves*

Cowabunga, dudes. Only time I really get to post is as work. Usually this is fine and dandy, but things have been busier than usual this week. Stupid gainful employment.

Main suspects right now are Meeple and Tom.

Meeple for reasons that people have covered pretty well: his immediate flip from... what would be a fairly solid (if lazy) scum tac of trying to get momentum going on a non-present player... to "WELL GOOD THING I ONLY DID THAT TO GENERATE DISCUSSION" looks bad. It’s such a lovely scumscreen of a phrase, especially when it seems like as much of a retcon as it does right here.

Tom's tac-nuke on Xanth... well, this is metagaming, and that is horrible, but I feel like I've seen Tom do this before: http://www.rpgdl.com/forums/index.php?topic=3003.msg52509#msg52509

Specifically, what he does is take note of a person who’s already caught at least some amount of flak, and acts all innocuous while he lists a fairly long and exhaustive set of bullet points against them. And then by the end of the post he’s apparently convinced himself that yeah, huh, they look sort of bad; but given the length and form of the post, it sure seems to me like he’s been pretty effectively gunning for them since the beginning.

Given the Day1ness of Day 1, I’m not sure which of them looks scummier to me. Probably Meeple, since my problem with Tom has a fair bit of meta-analysis wrapped up in it, of a kind that I generally try to avoid.

El Cid: no, it wasn't metagaming. That part was in defence, if anything, and I guess from this response I shouldn't have mentioned it at all. It was meant as 'I find this aggressive behaviour unsettling (in and of itself for what it is, no player context or metagaming attached). Before someone informs me, I do know this player plays aggressively anyway, but that context doesn't ease me.'

Thanks for the clarification. However, I'm forced to ask: what is intrinsically wrong with "aggressive behavior?" I don't mean to start a whole playstyle discussion here, it's just that you question one course of action and offer no real alternative to it.

Argh no not this discussion I agree with El Cid let's not get sidetracked by this nonsense oof kill it with fire.

I need to work some more right now, but I'll be around throughout the day and expect to have more thoughts.

Deltaflyer

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #55 on: March 05, 2009, 04:37:50 PM »
Okay. So, now that school has ended, I am free until the end of the game day. Go me.

Meeple worries me, for flipping rather quickly from arbitary 'tactics'. He seemed to try and focus on me (no, I am not OMGUS'ing) when there was actually a multitude of reasons I may not be present. But focusing on me, when nobody knew if I was able to get on before the end of the day is worrying. Meeple appeared to want to waste town's vote, when as someone else said, a Modkill would work just as well.

Tom has metagamed in the past, however to pass this off as being Tom behavior would also be metagaming in itself. I think Tom is less suspicious than Meeple at the moment to me, since I am almost afraid of metagaming against Tom.

That said, Xanth also looks slightly suspicious. He appears to be playing quite strangely, for him at least. (metagaming, I know, but...) He said that he is a 'lazy b******' when actually, he posted, as someone else mentioned, 1/7 of the posts on the page.

Currently, I believe that Meeple is more suspicious. Being able to paint yourself as a target doesn't justify painting yourself as a target, and your poor justifications are not helping.

Xanth's behavior is worrying. He may be attempting to set himself up to lurk later. In any case, ##FoS: Xanth

Also, ##Vote: Meeple

Oh, and yes.

Thank you, come again!
Do I really look like I have a clue?

Hunter Sopko

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #56 on: March 05, 2009, 05:25:53 PM »
Meeple (4): Cid, Bard, Andy, Cid, Delta
Eviltom (1): Bard, Xanth
Carthrat (0): EvilTom, Alex, Snowfire
Snowfire (1): Xanth, Alex
El Cid (0): Meeple, Excal
Xanth (3): Ryogo, Excal, EvilTom
AndrewRogue (0): Strago, Cid
Delta (0): Andrew, Meeple
Bardiche (0): SnowFire

There are 6 hours left in Day One!
« Last Edit: March 05, 2009, 05:34:49 PM by Hunter Sopko »

Ranmilia

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #57 on: March 05, 2009, 05:44:54 PM »
I'm here again, and will likely be around more or less till deadline.  Currently I am willing to vote Snowfire or Xanth. 

- Everything I said about Snowfire earlier still holds, and is amplified by his unvoting, not talking about anyone he finds scummy and leaving a note that he may not even be back or have a vote down at deadline.  Whaaaaat?  Snow, who do you think is scum?  Everyone else, why do I see him getting a free pass for this?

- Xanth... Tom makes a really good point about him not actually voting Meeple.  Meeple stands out to me as the stupid-not-scummy day 1 case, and while I'm not happy with the train in that direction I'm REALLY not happy about Xanth seeming to egg the train on without actually getting on it.  Posts like Strago's latest kinda weird me out on the subject as well, in fact it does indeed seem to me like Strago's dismissing the case because it comes from Tom.

I'm not in support of a Meeple lynch at all.  The whole discussion about him still seems to revolve around him voting Delta, which is something I can actually see as more likely to come from town than scum, and a really poor case even for day 1.  Dumb thing to do, yes, and his attempts justifications don't read well since it is pretty unjustifiable, but the action itself isn't scummy to me, nor are his defenses considering how he's being trained for it. 


Xanth

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Machine Waltz Drama
« Reply #58 on: March 05, 2009, 05:59:53 PM »
Right, back with just under an hour to spare for this.

I like how now several people have jumped on to the 'lazy bastard' thing as some sort of key evidence. El Cid was talking about how I keep on listing my schedule, so I was explaining that I do it to motivate me to post more.

Cid: I don't want to derail conversation by going into it much, but it wasn't the aggressive nature in general (which I support for at least the most part), it was what looked like setting fires in as many places as possible to see what would burn fastest. That's to say it felt like you were hitting people for damn near anything rather than with a method behind it.


Quickly on Tom's rather taxing attempt:

1) As above. Misreading and blowing it up, grand.
2) First half is the rather acidic fluff I'm getting used to. For the actual point here, surely I don't need to get into the concept of flying under the radar, right? If scum are to fly under the radar, it's from posting minimal content rather than not at all. You had fit the model of actually trying to post without actually saying anything. Your second post here reeks of 'hey guys, I'm trying' whilst not actually posting anything. Is that so hard to understand?
3) Fluff. If anything, given that you've decided to rely so much on meta-gaming already, you might want to refer yourself to the My HiME game where you made the exact same 'this isn't the pro-town Xanth I know' argument against me when I turned out to be, in fact, a relatively lazy member of town (yes, before you remind me, I know you were town there as well).
4) a) if there are multiple trains at the end, it is important people know ahead of time which I'm likely to follow. So yes, announcing my stance on Meeple is rather important (although not as things stand, given it's looking like me versus him at the moment).
b) I expected (and received) far more for a new train of thought than I could have got for stalely dropping another early vote on Meeple.


So with this probably being my last post of the day it'd probably be most sensible for me to just swap my vote to Meeple and be done with it, but now Tom's jumped off the deep end enough for me to keep it on him and push for that.

After initial worries from his second post, dare I call his third post a rather exasperated OMGUS? As much as it's been padded, it's mostly minor fluff or random (and outdated) metagaming, and it's all told in a rather acidic tone to make it seem more concrete and my own case baseless. I'd care less if the volume matched the content, but it reads far worse when it reads like it's been buffed up as much as possible. It's like you care far more about getting me lynched than you do about being sure you're right.


I do, however, agree with his assessment of Bardiche. One of the things I was in a rush to say as I was flying out of the door this morning was that he's performing far and beyond what I remember from the previous couple of games.


Delta still reads like zero impact, and now seems to have a free pass.

Meeple hasn't been back.

Snowfire is the other outlier, marking what would be a clumsier scum attempt at low content than my initial claim of Tom, given little direct game offerings.

Alex ninja: I'm also willing to leave things open to bring Meeple back from the lead if possible at this point (assuming he does show up again), even though it risks my own neck at this point.


I'll try my best to be back in time for the deadline, but I'll probably miss it by like ten minutes unless we get a short extension. I'm not asking for it unless people are desperate for my opinion in particular.

Bardiche

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #59 on: March 05, 2009, 08:41:39 PM »
Not moving my vote off Meeple until he's satisfied me with a response.

Since we are nearing the deadline, I've taken the liberty of examining the other cases which seem most prevalent to get a lynch, namely Xanth and Snowfire.

Snowfire:
I can accept a lynch on Snowfire based on how useless he's been so far. However, inactivity grades lower to me on the MUST LYNCH radar than someone who's confusing and befuddling. Snowfire, I really, really, really cannot say with good conscience that I think you have been any bit productive to Day 1. Please either change this with all rapid haste or I'll shift my undivided lynching attention to you.

Xanth:
Please stop referring to previous games and whatnot. It is not relevant to this game, and arguments like "OH BUT LAST GAME" just don't work for me. If you want to get lynched today, by all means continue with it. Also stop using sarcasm. "I like how people jump on blah blah lazy bastard blah blah key evidence". Well shit, it's Day 1 and you're constantly excusing yourself, what are you thinking? Ridiculing people with sarcasm because they find an act of yours suspicious doesn't sit well with me. For all that, I find it pretty ridonculous as well that we need so many updates on your sparse schedule; others post less than you do and they don't keep excusing themselves!

At this point,

Meeple > Xanth > Snowfire on my "suspect of scum" list. Other candidates aren't listed as it isn't pertinent right now, but I do feel Delta's being his usual confusing self. The others haven't left a strong enough impact on me for me to pursue something actively. I'm not interested in throwing around minor suspicions so strongly on Day 1, I'll save that for after the flip and Day 2.

Meeplelard

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #60 on: March 05, 2009, 10:24:26 PM »
First off, sorry for being away for a while, but school + suddenly feeling sick + other minor crap...well, you know the drill.

Anyway, first off, Wall's of Texts already? Geez, I've been purposely trying to avoid them and I thought it was stated "keep them limited!"  Argh!

...ok, that's out of my system.

I was trying to justify, for lack of a better word, Xanth's actions on calling El-Cid the aggressive one mostly cause that was how I perceived it.  I'm not strongly defending him the way I jumped to Shale's defense (where neither of us was scum, mind) in Suicide Mafia.  I'm mostly saying "I think by this he means this" and hoping that wasn't Excal's only reason.  Yes, yes, Xanth can explain himself, but

Excal has submitted a reason for voting Xanth since I requested one...and his reason is basically "I don't have a good one cause its day 1."  Hate to say it, but I really can't argue that; I'm guilty of the same thing and its hurting me cause I chose a worse target, it seems, but yeah, on day 1, who goes first is pretty random.  Someone does something remotely "suspicious" and it escalates from there.  You have to spark conversation somehow.  Apparently, my act that made me suspicious did exactly that...no, this does NOT justify my actions, I'm just indicating the irony of the situation I put myself in.

No, I didn't mean to get people to target me, I just wanted to break the joke phase; I just apparently went about it in the dumbest way possible.  I can't justify my attack on Delta beyond "Meh, lets go after the guy who hasn't posted" and it was a bonehead move, and has gotten me painted.  I'm not trying to paint myself as a target (if I'm reading Delta's post right)

As I noted, Wishie Washieness was more me having odd train of thought, and deciding post it down.  I mean, Marge did that same thing in the episode with Jay Sherman and this is Simpson's Mafia!

*letter to Jay*
"Marge, is this a pimple or a boil?"
"Homer can't you see I'm...oh, darn, now you just made me write that!"
*continue letter*

...ok, joke aside, I probably should have worded my entire post better.

Anyway, defense off, onto other stuff!

Xanth's standing out to me right now partially cause of what looks like finger pointing.  No one else at the moment really sticks out in an particular way. I don't know how he plays in the past, but...well, I can't really much to what Tom said.  I'm really not liking this "Meeple's more suspicious, but I'm voting for Tom!" thing.  If I truly DID feel suspicious to him, more so than Tom, why isn't the vote on me?

That and the fact that I have a survival instinct...

##Vote: Xanth

And no, Xanth; scum can fly under the radar in a variety of ways.  One such way is Smoke screening, as in, post a lot, but say very little.  I feel like your posts are, as Tom noted, mostly fluff.

Other stuff:

Delta Posting = Good! Also seems like he had legit RL issues to boot.  Also good to know he's working on a somewhat irregular (no offense) time zone, so yeah.  His one post doesn't really give me much of any vibes; he came in late to the game, and has to work from there, so its understandable.

Alex hasn't said a lot, but from what I recall, Alex tends to not say a lot on Day 1 cause there isn't much to say.  Day 2 is when he starts to actually do stuff.  What he has said, though, doesn't stick out.

I don't like Strago saying "Meeple's Post si a retcon to generate discussion!" Um, shit, yes, it was done for that purpose?  What do you think the point of a "pressure vote" is?  Why do you think I said "Its as good a place to start as any" (even if it apparently was a horrible place to start)?

Cid bugs me for claiming I had poor reasons to justify my votes:

Quote
-Vote stays on Meeple for the Delta vote, the poor attempt to justify it, and him having nothing useful to say in response to the pressure. "I'm apparently good at painting myself a target." Sure, but being Meeple doesn't give you a free pass to make scummy errors. Meeple and Xanth look like our best options for lynching today.

That's not what I said.  That "I'm good at painting myself a target" is just a side point.  Great way to strawman the post.  I explained why I did it, and again, how do you justify a "lets get the ball rolling" vote beyond that?  In fact, you've in the past slammed me for not taking any sort of initiative, and voted me on it in the past.  Metagaming? Yes, but now you're contradicting your own advice.  I really don't follow this logic here; I try to do SOMETHING, and now suddenly I feel suspicious cause I did it poorly?  This feels more like "Meeple's playing idiotically, therefor scum!" rather than "Meeple's playing scummy."

How am I suppose to justify a vote that, as I stated in the post I voted on him, existed purely to help pressure him?  Bad tactic, maybe!  But I said why I did it, and you're saying "Not good enough, SCUM!"  Its putting someone's back against the wall for a minor slip, I feel.
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

Bardiche

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #61 on: March 05, 2009, 10:50:36 PM »
Okay, so wall of text with a lot of jokes, personal feelings, dramatizing etcetera.

Can you dumb down for me why I should move my vote off of you and satisfy myself with another target instead? At the very least, can you dumb down why I should not here and now use our last remaining hour or so to push for your lynch with zeal?

AndrewRogue

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #62 on: March 05, 2009, 10:59:42 PM »
Meeple: Hasn't really done anything to make me feel better about him. When put under pressure, he backs off of Delta and proceeds to do... nothing but make excuses, ignore my question and not really add anything to the debates. He off-handedly addresses some stuff that came up, but doesn't really do anything to advance discussion or make any impact whatsoever. This kind of play really isn't reassuring, and I think he's still one of the strongest candidates given he's really... not made an effort to do anything or try to dispel any doubts.

Xanth: ...mrm. He's drawing a lot of attention to his very limited posting time, which yes, at one level is fine and dandy. On the other hand, though, it simply provides room to make excuses for problematic actions over the course of the game and, frankly, feels like you are preemptively trying to bring your excuses to the forefront so that you can just point back at them later. This sort of thing does NOTHING to help town. Further, given the earlier comment about agreeing in principal with Cid on Pressure votes, and then opting to vote Tom over Meeple (despite agreeing that the latter seemed worse to him). He does explain this, but at the same time... that vote really feels more fillery than anything, given Tom wasn't the only individual lurking at the time.

Snow: Uh... yeah. Alex pretty much sums this one up perfectly. Half-heartedly trolling for low content posters (and failing at it too, mind) and then unvoting and leaving nothing of substance in the wake. This a townie read does not make. At all. I'd put him right there with Meeple for lynchability.

Carth: The massive date flub he made stands out to me, but that's really all I have there. Not enough to really run with today, but certainly something to keep an eye on in the future.

At this point in time... mrf. All three of Snow/Xanth/Meeple are solid candidates in my opinion. Each has some pretty major flaws in their day one posting. I'd be satisfied with a lynch of any of them, really, but I'd probably put it at Meep => Snow > Xanth at this point.

Ninja'd: Blar. Meeple post. Honestly, I'm not seeing a lot here. General excuse for being MIA, a moderate defense of his actions (that doesn't really cover anything important, like why he didn't really do anything but unvote Delta), jumping on the most likely opposing bandwagon and a bit of scattershotting to hit on as much as he can in as thin a way as he can. At this juncture, wasting a good chunk of posting on a joke doesn't really fill me with confidence either. Just... blar. This post really doesn't do anything to alleviate my suspicions, nor does it really provide any new and exciting insight to the table.

My opinions stay pretty much exactly as stated pre-ninja, with Meep maybe gaining a bit on Snow in lynchability. Definitely staying where I am for the time being.

Sierra

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #63 on: March 05, 2009, 11:00:03 PM »
Cid: I don't want to derail conversation by going into it much, but it wasn't the aggressive nature in general (which I support for at least the most part), it was what looked like setting fires in as many places as possible to see what would burn fastest. That's to say it felt like you were hitting people for damn near anything rather than with a method behind it.

At that point in time I'd really only begun making serious accusations, and they both stemmed from Delta votes. I don't see how this qualifies as throwing everything against the wall to see what sticks. This is pretty flimsy, Xanth.

Okay, not a lot of time left here. Meeple fights back with Drama, which is ineffectual but still warrants a response. Will try to get one out before the day ends, but in the interest of saving time I will say that everything in Bard's last couple posts is spot-on in my opinion.

Hunter Sopko

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #64 on: March 05, 2009, 11:03:51 PM »
Meeple (4): Cid, Bard, Andy, Cid, Delta
Eviltom (1): Bard, Xanth
Carthrat (0): EvilTom, Alex, Snowfire
Snowfire (1): Xanth, Alex
El Cid (0): Meeple, Excal
Xanth (4): Ryogo, Excal, EvilTom, Meeple
AndrewRogue (0): Strago, Cid
Delta (0): Andrew, Meeple
Bardiche (0): SnowFire

There are 0 hours left in Day One!

We are now in SUDDEN DEATH! The choices are Meeple and Xanth! GO!

Meeplelard

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #65 on: March 05, 2009, 11:04:03 PM »
Since the day is almost over, I might as well just say this:

ROLE CLAIM TIME!

I'm Chief Wiggum.  Unsurprisingly, I'm the cop.  I...don't have much else to say, unfortunately.
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

Ranmilia

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #66 on: March 05, 2009, 11:09:39 PM »
ASDF

"Deadline at 6," right, so I take a nap and wake up at 5.  Except that's Soppy's 6, not my 6. 

Rant goes here about how Meeple and Snowfire did the exact same thing today, except Meeple admitted he was wrong and tried to get away while Snowfire just walked off whistling and everyone ignored it.  What in the heck, people.

Stating Intention to hammer Xanth for obvious reasons.

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #67 on: March 05, 2009, 11:09:48 PM »
Ack!  Quick post now: Please give us an hour extension like I asked for earlier?  Literally just got home from work.  Will finish post shortly, want to have at least some chatter before we hammer someone.

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #68 on: March 05, 2009, 11:12:03 PM »
Yeah, I'm fine with a Xanth hammer, Alex.

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #69 on: March 05, 2009, 11:13:11 PM »
Sudden death already, so no extensions.  I'll wait for Snow to say what he wants to though.  (HEY SNOW MEEPLE IS CLAIMING COP DO NOT HAMMER HIM THANKS)

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #70 on: March 05, 2009, 11:14:20 PM »
... Fascinating. I am rather annoyed you went all shenanigans on us when you're our cop, but I guess it can't be helped now.   Not sure if I believe you, not sure if leaving you alive will not bite us in the arse later on; you'll forgive me if my trust in you has been mortally damaged some. (with regards to this game anyway)

I'm around, thrown off my momentum by this announcement. Want to hear Xanth if possible.

I do not understand why SnowFire is desperate to post for the end of today. I'll withhold further opinions on it until the post or something, I don't know.

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Grave Atom Manacle
« Reply #71 on: March 05, 2009, 11:19:08 PM »
Just back. Grand. So much for that gambit to give people a chance.

Well, I'm not going to kill the copclaim. I have nothing to match that, but am town. Won't hammer myself in case there's crap people have to say first.

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #72 on: March 05, 2009, 11:19:35 PM »
I don't like Strago saying "Meeple's Post si a retcon to generate discussion!" Um, shit, yes, it was done for that purpose?  What do you think the point of a "pressure vote" is?  Why do you think I said "Its as good a place to start as any" (even if it apparently was a horrible place to start)?

You seem to have missed the point here. The "retcon" is obviously what Strago was critical of, not attempts to generate discussion. Semantics perhaps, but the post with the actual vote (at the bottom of page one) did contain more waffling than justification. Sure, "get the ball rolling," etcetera, but I've gone on at length about how you can't pressure someone who's not active in the game and I'm not up to repeating myself right now.

Cid bugs me for claiming I had poor reasons to justify my votes:

Quote
-Vote stays on Meeple for the Delta vote, the poor attempt to justify it, and him having nothing useful to say in response to the pressure. "I'm apparently good at painting myself a target." Sure, but being Meeple doesn't give you a free pass to make scummy errors. Meeple and Xanth look like our best options for lynching today.

That's not what I said.  That "I'm good at painting myself a target" is just a side point.  Great way to strawman the post.  I explained why I did it, and again, how do you justify a "lets get the ball rolling" vote beyond that?  In fact, you've in the past slammed me for not taking any sort of initiative, and voted me on it in the past.  Metagaming? Yes, but now you're contradicting your own advice.  I really don't follow this logic here; I try to do SOMETHING, and now suddenly I feel suspicious cause I did it poorly?  This feels more like "Meeple's playing idiotically, therefor scum!" rather than "Meeple's playing scummy."

How am I suppose to justify a vote that, as I stated in the post I voted on him, existed purely to help pressure him?  Bad tactic, maybe!  But I said why I did it, and you're saying "Not good enough, SCUM!"  Its putting someone's back against the wall for a minor slip, I feel.

You make it sound like I've got a vendetta against you, Meeple. Drama doesn't help us, chill out. It's not the fact that you did something that I object to, it's the specific course of action. I've already explained why I found the particular vote both useless and a textbook scum fakecase.

EDIT: Ninja'd by Meepleclaim. Argh what, sharing Bard's exasperation here. Satisfied with a Xanth hammer given the circumstances and my longstanding doubts about him.

Excal

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #73 on: March 05, 2009, 11:21:10 PM »
Eh...  Regardless of which side he's on, Xanth's best bet is still possibly Hammer, Stop Talking.  That way he's sure that a member of his team survives, while if he's town, he has no clue if Meeple's lying through his teeth.  Hell, if it had been Xanth coming in with that proclaimation, I'd probably be announcing my willingness to swap sides, since leaving this in the hands of the people in question will muddy things a bit more in the future.

Also known as, I don't want this decision to be in the hands of someone who can very easily claim survival as his reason.  (That said, I also don't want to off the cop claim, so my hands are pretty much tied)

EDIT:  I'm, uhhh....  gonna leave all of that up there, cause hey, I typed it all and want to leave it on record.  But, damn does Xanth ninjaing leave me feeling a bit foolish.  And, generally pessimistic with how Day 1 is going to end.

EDIT2: Oh, hey, Cid ninjaing as well...  will leave that alone and post without reading for now.

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Re: Simpsons Mafia DAY ONE
« Reply #74 on: March 05, 2009, 11:26:23 PM »
... Fascinating. I am rather annoyed you went all shenanigans on us when you're our cop, but I guess it can't be helped now.   Not sure if I believe you, not sure if leaving you alive will not bite us in the arse later on; you'll forgive me if my trust in you has been mortally damaged some. (with regards to this game anyway)

See this is what I just don't get.  What are these "shenanigans" Meeple has done, other than vote Delta early on and then try to fend off the vicious attacks he got from doing so?  How is voting Delta an action indicative of scum alignment rather than a stupid townie move?  What could he have said that would actually satisfy folks?  What the heck is with people letting these debates snowball and then going "Well he's so defensive he MUST be scum now!"

Excal, the answer is "cop claim."