Author Topic: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!  (Read 8918 times)

Meeplelard

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Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« on: January 09, 2008, 02:42:18 AM »
Yeah, yeah, this useless silly topic is back, but I'm bored and want to kill time and don't feel like playing anything...ok, you get the point.

The original topic stated that Fire and Holy are the most common elements, followed by Darkness, blah blah blah.  Frankly, no one cares about that, lets just get to the meat of things! I'm only covering main characters from games I've played, naturally; feel free to add in things I forgot, dispute points I made, what have you.
Also, this is going by the "If a character has an element, its one of these" so being Non Elemental doesn't really count as an element, just puts you in the N/A Category.  Also trying to keep it as much to main 8 (Fire, Ice, Lightning, Wind, Water, Earth, Dark, and Holy, and anything that can be considered equivalent, ie Chrono Cross White = Holy)

Anyway...WE'RE OFF!

NOTE: A lot of these were just C+Ped from my ratings topic, and then put in alphabetical order, hence why some are so...specific on their names, going into great detail with subtitles and everything...yeah.  I did try to shorten things by condensing some games that could be used collectively (See Pokemon), but...<_<
Oh, furthermore, deleting games that don't really fit and are just obscure (See Legend of Ghost Lion), mostly cause if they don't have an element, and no one has played the game, who cares?

If someone wants to tally these up, feel free!

7th Saga: Start off with a game where you choose your own main! Anyway, while some characters have obvious elemental alignments, like Wilme = Fire or Esuna = Ice, some are...less so...someone who knows more about this game can cover this.
Anachronox: Boots was Ice, no real arguing this, at least as far as I remember people mentioning this.
Arc the Lad: Arc is...not...really...aligned.  He gets like all elements and...yeah.  Well, he starts with Burn Ground! But don't think that counts as making him fire.
Arc the Lad 2: Meanwhile, Elc was explicitly Fire Elemental, so no real arguing this.
Arc the Lad 3: Alec had no elemental alignment, so yeah.
Arc the Lad: Twilight of Spirits: Both Kharg and Darc were wind aligned, if only obvious through their skill sets and how Drakyr were the Wind Race of Deimos.
Bahamut Lagoon: Byuu's main Dragon, Salamando, is the Fire one, and its his main dragon in plot.  Probably makes him Fire aligned.
Beyond the Beyond: I think Finn is like the only person with Lightning so he's that element? I could be wrong, and I don't remember.  I know he gets Fire too, but several other people get...oh screw it, its BtB, I'm sure most people just don't care.
Breath of Fire: Probably Fire.  Dragon thing, best equipment resists it, etc.  Light might work based on the whole Light Dragon thing though!
Breath of Fire 2[/b]: See above, really.  Worth noting though that it was the Fire Shaman that awakened his powers.  Also, Light Dragon vs. Dark Dragon kind of doesn't exist in BoF2.
Breath of Fire 3: Holy elemental.  The fact that he is your best Healer, and how his best Dragon form requires the Radiance Gene hints this. ON THE OTHERHAND, Fire is one of his personal genes, so there's room for argument.
Breath of Fire 4: Ok, clearly Fire.  He resists it (and more so than standard resistance), and he's weak to Water. FURTHERMORE, he's suppose to be Fou-lu's opposite, and Fou-lu has a strong affinity to Water.
Breath of Fire 5: Ryu's probably Darkness, based on the whole Destroyer thing.
Brigandine: Multiple main character time! Ok, Lance is Fire since he has Flame as one of his spells and gains 1 Red upon promotion to King, Cai is effectively Non Elemental (1 of each element cancels out and such.) Vaynard is Ice, due to the whole Blue elemental thing, Lyonese is Holy due to White, Zemeckis is Fire, I believe, though I could be mistaking, and Dryst is Darkness (with some Fire on the side, but clearly more attuned to Darkness.)
Chrono Cross: Serge = White Aligned = Holy.  No real arguments.  Ok, fine, for half the game, he's Black, thus Darkness, but that's for weird plot reasons.
Chrono Trigger: Crono is Lightning elemental...unless we start going into the whole translation of his element being Heaven but...umm...doesn't change the fact that most of his magic is in fact Lightning <_<
Digital Devil Sagas: Putting the games together for obvious reasons.  Anyway, Serph is Ice, kind of hard to argue this. 
Disgaea: Hour of Darkness: Laharl is probably fire, since Demon tends to imply Fire or Darkness, and Laharl does have a Fire elemental attack, Fire type personality (like he's short tempered, for example), and his Non Fire Moves are clearly very...explosive <_<
Dragon Ball Z Collective: No.
Dragon Quest: Also no.
Dragon Quest 2: More No.
Dragon Quest 3: Hero learns Lightning magic and is the only one who does so (not even Sage gets them), so yeah, Lightning.
Dragon Quest 4: Solofia are pretty much in the same boat as the DQ3 Hero, so Lightning.
Dragon Quest 5: You'd THINK the Hero is Lightning based on the DQ Main logic, right? Well he's not, as its his Son who is the legendary hero; the main in this game actually uses primarily Wind magic, hence Wind elemental.
Dragon Quest 6: Gets Zap from a plot sequence, enough to make him Lightning elemental.
Dragon Quest 7: Game play wise, Aluse has nothing (and he doesn't even have Short Cut To Hero Class like the DQ6 Main does). Plot wise, however, he's probably Water elemental.  Whole Raised as a Fisherman thing combined with his likely parents and how his big legendary sword is called the Aquagoon Sword or whatever...yeah...Water works <_<
Dragon Quest 8: Guv's unique magic is Lightning and such, feels pretty obvious what his element is!
Dragon View: Was going to skip this, but the forces of Tonfa hype are strong...but Alex really doesn't have anything that'd fit, unless someone wants to prove me wrong.
Drakkhen: See above, and this game doesn't really even HAVE a main.
Earthbound: Ness is kind of lacking in elemental affinities too.  Despite how SSB games give him Fire and Lightning attacks <.<
Final Fantasy: I don't have to explain why they lack elements.
Final Fantasy 2: Same here for Frionel/Firion!
Final Fantasy 3: Ok, so the original Onion Kid Quartet lacked elements.  Now, FF3DS Luneth? He has a very...shakey...argument for Fire.  See, in one scene, Doga/Unei are saying how they each hold a spirit of something or other, and Luneth's is Courage, and that is often represented by Fire (see FF5!), and...yeah, you can ignore this if you want <_<;
Final Fantasy 4: Ok, Cecil now is easy! Obviously starts off Dark, becomes Light/Holy/White.  Probably counts as the latter mostly, granted!
Final Fantasy 5: Assuming Bartz is the main, if based only on the whole "In your party more than the other characters" combined with the "He is the first character you play as and the ONLY ONE YOU NAME" thing (not to mention the character scene riding a chocobo in the title screen)? He's Wind.  Pretty clear if you've played the game, further proven in FF5a where his element on Elemental Attack is Wind from a Gladiator!  FF5 has some debate as to Bartz being the main hence the little paranoia defensive measures, mind <_<;
Final Fantasy 6: Ignoring the "FF6 has no Main character!" argument? I...want to avoid starting an argument, but frankly, no matter what I say here will start one. Though, really, if you had to choose one character, it'd probably be Terra based on...a crap load of factors (and thus I smell an argument starting ;_;) and based on her innate skillset and the fact that Red Dragon in Dragon's Den drops her new weapon, she's pretty clearly Fire.
Final Fantasy 7: I wanna kneejerk Darkness for Cloud based on the general messed up of his plot, plus how his whole past was deceiving him and Deception feels darkness and...oh screw it, this is one is up in the air.
Final Fantasy 8: Squall, meanwhile, I wanna kneejerk as Ice.  Mostly just fits his personality if little else (the whole apothetic, hates socializing thing feels Ice), but...yeah, again, up in the air.
Final Fantasy 9: Zidane...is also up in the air.  One hand, Thief, which often associates with Wind.  On the otherhand, Angel of Death nonsense, which would imply Dark...frankly, this one is also up in the air.
Final Fantasy 10: Tidus, now, is a lot easier.  See, his trademark weapon, Brotherhood, is Water elemental.  Combine that and the whole Blitz Ball thing (a sport in the Water), Water seems to fit him well enough.
Final Fantasy 10-2: Ok, first off, if you think Yuna is the main of FF10, apply what I say here up above in a logical fashion.  THAT said, Yuna lacks an element in this game, despite being so obviously Holy aligned in the previous one.
Final Fantasy 12: I...wind, I guess? Adventurous Attitude with "I wanna be a Sky Pirate!" thing, and...ah hell, its another hard to cover elemental alignment nonsense.
Final Fantasy Adventure: I think his only attack spell offhand is Fire? Could be wrong!  Also probably should be ignored and skip straight to Sword of Mana.
Final Fantasy Legends Collective: These games are the epitomy of Build Your Own Characters However Damn Well You Please, and in FF1/2, they don't even have canon genders or race!  Yeah, best ignore these <_<
Final Fantasy Mystic Quest: Holy.  Yes, I have reasons for this.  First off, Ultimate weapon is Excalibur.  Now, that's a silly reason, so we'll ignore that.  The MAIN reason? Every character has an obvious element aligned to them, as you use each PC for one of the elemental bosses (Like Phoebe = Water/Ice), and you meet a Crystal with each.  Benjamin is constantly guided by the Old Man, and at the end of the game, a 5th Crystal, the Crystal of Light, appears. Seems like it fits rather well.
Final Fantasy Tactics: Kneejerk Light for Ramza, I have no real justification for this.
Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced: Nothing fits for Marche...like, at all.
Fire Emblem 4: Geneology of the Holy War: Nothing really fits Sigurd off hand. For Celice? Umm...his mother was a druid and she was Light aligned, so I guess he's Light too? Anybody who knows more about FE4, please help out here!
Fire Emblem 6: The Sword of Seals: Ok, here's an easy one. If you check Roy's stats, he's explicitly labeled as Fire.
Fire Emblem 7: The Blazing Sword: Despite the whole "Blazing Sword" thing, Eliwood's element is Nature (same symbol as Anima, but I seem to recall the game calls it Nature), which...yeah, not touching what THAT means.  Hector is Lightning, meanwhile, and Lyn is Wind, both clearly labeled as such.
Fire Emblem 8: The Sacred Stones: Eirika is Light and Ephraim is Fire, both labeled!
Fire Emblem 9: Path of Radiance: Yet again, labeled! Only this time, Ike is Earth.
Fire Emblem 10: Radiant Dawn: Ike's still Earth, and is still one of the many mains of this game (This game is all over the place in that regard.) Micaiah is...weird.  Her Element is labeled as Dark...yet she clearly uses Light Magic.  I guess Dark wins for plot reasons though <_<;.  Elincia, whose kind of the 3rd Main, is Heaven...which apparently is *NOT* Light as there's an element labeled that too, so DAH!
Front Mission Collective: From what I've played and the little I know of the ones I haven't played, this game lacks tradition elements, so...yeah, no.
Great Greed: Want to skip this one, but I know a certain group of people would lynch me for it, so...umm...yeah, there's nothing that'd fit Sierra Sam (that was his name, right?)
Golden Sun: Isaac is the Earth Adept, so take a guess what his element is.
Golden Sun 2: The Lost Age: Felix is the OTHER Earth Adept, so...yeah...
Grandia: There is nothing that really fits Justin; he uses like every element in some fashion in his attacks, and his personality just translates to "Idiot" which can fit in for just about every element <_< >_>
Grandia 2: Ryudo is Lightning. I base this on how his one unique Elemental Attack is Purple Lightning. Worth noting that every character gets a different element (or something that has a symbol implying an element when it really isn't, mainly for Millenia and Elena) so this does actually fit.
Grandia 3: Yuki is wind.  If the fact that he's a Pilot, thus sky, thus often associated with Wind didn't give it away, the fact that a lot of his Moves are wind elemental (Whirlwind and Blade Storm come to mind), or easily associated with Wind should give it away (yes, even Flash fits; remember this game treats Lightning as Wind, so...<_<)
Hoshigami: Ruining Blue Earth: Fazz starts the game off under Amu, which is the Fire Deity, so...yeah.
Kingdom Hearts Collective: Sora is Light.  Pretty clear given his foil, Riku, is pretty clearly Darkness, and the whole holding onto Light thing...or something...
Koudelka: Dark seems to be my kneejerk for Koudelka, given the Shadow Hearts plot behind her as well...but I'm open for arguments as well!
Legaia 2: Duel Saga: Lang's Origin is Fire elemental, so yeah.
Legend of Dragoon: Everything about Dart is Fire elemental...outside of his Dragoon Form in the final battle.
Legend of Mana: Not touching this one with a 50 mile pole.
Legend of Legaia: Vahn's Ra-Seru is very distinctly Fire Elemental.  Now if only I could remember its name.
Live a Live: I would go over this but there's not only a crap load of mains, I don't feel confident about ANY of them...barring Cube, who just kind of doesn't work.
Lufia: Dual Blade plot thing would make peg him as Holy.
Lufia 2: Maxim too for that matter!
Lufia 3: Wain is...odd.  His Color is Red, so originally knee jerking Fire...yet, that's the exact kind of Magic he doesn't get.  So I think he's Holy as well, based on how big evil IP of Doom is Holy Elemental, and I wanna say he gets Dual Blade as well? Again, NOT CONFIDENT ON THIS AT ALL.
Lufia: Ruins of Lore: No.
Lunar Eternal Blue Complete: Hiro is Wind.  Pretty clear given all his Magic is that way.
Lunar Silver Star Story Complete: Despite what most people claiming him as Holy, I still think he's Fire.  Considering he has Several Fire type attacks (Red Dragon Anger and Explosion Staff come to mind), and how its the only element he resists consistently throughout each game (and Hiro's Dragon Armor which is a clear reference to it resists Fire to boot), then the whole usual association of Dragons w/ Fire...yeah, really think Fire fits better than Holy for him.
Mega Man Battle Network Collective: Knowing how these games work, I can safely say "NO" to Elements here for Megaman.exe or Lan.
Mega Man Starforce: Geo's Element is basically dependent on which version of the game...IOWs, lets ignore this.
Mega Man X: Command Mission: X is Fire Elemental. His first Hyper Mode is X-Fire, which is Fire elemental and such.
Mother (aka Earthbound 0): I think Ninten was similar to Ness, so...avoiding this one for now.
Naruto RPG: Uketsugareshi Hi no Ishi: Based on the Manga and time jump, he's Wind. Now I won't go into Details.
Ogre Battle: Element depends on which form you get, SUPPOSEDLY his/her canon is the Ianuki form which is...Wind I guess?  According to a semireliable source, Destin is Fire Elemental in OB64.
Okage: Shadow King: Despite being Non Elemental gameplay wise, there's only 3 elements in this game, so I don't think I take that COMPLETELY seriously.  I'd sooner label him as Darkness due to the whole Stahn aspect.
Paladin's Quest: Chezni starts off with Fire Magic only, and that's the only magic he gets that the only other permanent character who joins him doesn't get!  Yeah, I guess Fire works.
Persona: Naoya's first Persona is Wind Elemental, I believe.  His Ultimate is...uhh...closest thing is Fire according to some people? Um, yeah, head ache!
Persona 2: Maya seems to be Ice/Water aligned for the most part, based on her unique Personae. For the OTHER Persona 2, sounds like Tatsuya is Fire.
Phantasy Star: I...guess...Fire for Alis since that's the only Attack spell she learns <_<? Oh give me a break, its Phantasy Star 1.
Phantasy Star 2: Holy.  Based on Megid and Tsu-series elements in PS4, and Rolf was the only one to get this.
Phantasy Star 3: I think its best we just back away from this one...for a variety of reasons.
Phantasy Star 4: Given the argument I used for Rolf is a lot more straight forward and clear for Chaz given they ARE that element? Yeah...
Pokemon Collective: No. For the love of god, *NO*.  Well, ok, I guess I COULD say that Pokemon Colosseum's is Dark and Light aligned based on the forced Umbreon + Espeon Combo <_<? Or you know, not.
Radiata Stories: Jack is basically whatever you damn want him to be! So no, no real element.
Ranma 1/2 RPG: The Treasure of the Red Cat Gang: Ranma's Moves were wind if anything, I think?  Yeah, Hiryuu Shoten Ha comes to mind mainly.
Rudra no Hihou: Don't think anyone had any real elemental associations in this game, despite there being *4 MAINS*
SaGa Frontier: Multiple main times! OK, Red feels like Fire given his big moves are all Firey and such (even if they are technically multi elemental.) T260G is...umm...something, I dunno, she's a freaking Robot.  Asellus feels as though Dark would fit well given the mood of her story and the mysteriousness aspect (plus one of her endings <_< >_>.) Emelia doesn't really work with anything, Blue feels Dark based on his presence, I guess? Lute...no.  Riki doesn't really fit with anything...and yes, argue this all you want, I'm really reaching here!
Sailor Moon: Another Story: Light feels right for Moon in this, but feel free to argue otherwise!
Secret of Mana: If you had to give Randi an element, it'd be Dryad's due to the whole Mana Tree connection thing, I guess?
Secret of the Stars: Ray is Fire Elemental.  Pretty obvious all things considered.
Seiken Densetsu 3: Based on their home towns, Hawk = Fire, Duran = Earth, Lise = Wind, Carlie = Holy, Angela = Ice, and Kevin is...uhh...MOON! <_<;
Shadow Hearts: Yuri is Dark Elemental. Kind of hard to argue this one!
Shadow Hearts Convenant: Yuri still is Dark Elemental! The only argument you can make here, and it'd have to be one hell of an argument too given how shakey it is, is that Karin is the FRUE MAIN and she's Fire...yeah, good luck with that though.
Shadow Hearts: From the New World: Johnny's Void. And unlike Ari from Okage, he's in a game with a variety of elements and none really fit him, SO...
Shining Force: I wanna say Holy based on the Chaos Breaker...until I remembered its a combination of Light and Darkness.  Then again, I think the Sword of Light was Max unique while Sword of Darkness was not? Eh, Holy works.
Shining Force 2: Lightning. Yes, based entirely on how he learns Bolt spells.
Skies of Arcadia: Legends: Default Element is Red, so Fire works for him.
Slayers: Darkness works for Lina, I guess, given most of her big awesome scary spells require channeling Dark energy and...yeah...though her personality does imply more of a Fire character.
Star Ocean: Don't remember seeing anything that'd give Ratix an element.
Star Ocean: 2nd Story: Hard to say; don't want to give Claude an element though lest I shoot myself, someone else can field this one!
Star Ocean: Til the End of Time: Fire offhand, given the whole Destruction thing and what not.  Also, his best spell is Explosion and the first element he gains is Fire...yeah, its a reach, what are you going to do about it???
Suikoden: Tir is Darkness.  Seems pretty clear cut.
Suikoden 2: Riou is Holy.  Also pretty obvious.
Suikoden 3: 2 ways to look at it! First is your ultimate main you choose in the end always gets the True Fire Rune, thus is Fire Aligned regardless.  The other way is that the 3 have their canon elements with their runes, so Hugo is still Fire, but Geddoe is Lightning and Chris is Water.
Suikoden 4: While Lazlo is Wind in Suiko Tactics, the game also lacks a Darkness Element...which is very much more fitting of him in this game (Punishment Rune's element is even the same as the Soul Eater's IIRC)
Suikoden 5: I guess...oh god, how the hell do you translate Freyjadour's Dawn Rune exactly? Maybe just give the obscure SUN element to counter Kevin from SD3's MOON Element <_<?
Suikoden Tactics: Kyril's base element is Fire, and that's that.
Super Mario RPG: Mario has Jump, which isn't a real element, and Fire, which is one.  Yeah, Fire works for Mario, especially since he gets it in a lot of his other games <.<
Sword of Mana: Ok, the girl, whatever the hell her name is, is clearly Holy; she starts with Wisp, can use it while being an Ally for the Boy's side, and some plot reasons.  The Boy...umm...think his first is Salamando offhand? Could be horribly wrong, and I have no real direction to go with him!
Tactics Ogre: Denim's element is determined on your own choices, which is to say, doesn't really count for him <_<
Tales of Destiny: Dymlos is the Fire Swordian, its Stahn's Swordian, so Stahn is Fire.  Plus all his big moves are Fire too.
Tales of Eternia: Aurora Arts being the opposite of Dark Artes (I think that's what they were called), and the name as well, kind of give Reid a nice claim to Holy.
Tales of Phantasia: Eternal Sword means Cress is Light, I guess? No, I can't really back this up.  I guess those Sacred Skills fit too or something? ...yeah, I'm just gonna back away slowly...
Tales of Symphonia: Lloyd is kind of...all over the place and...yeah, no to him having an element.
Terranigma: Ark is Darkness.  Game kind of explicitly states this on several occasions.
Thousand Arms: No clue what Meis would work with, someone who remembers this game better, feel free to analyze/give info/etc.
Vandal Hearts: Ash is...umm...umm...yeah...
Valkyrie Profile: Lenneth is Holy. Kind of hard to argue with that given the game's status screen.
Valkyrie Profile 2: Silmeria: Alicia is Ice. A few things make this clear, like her innate 20% Ice resistance, and "Gather Crushing Ice" and how Photons freeze things.
Wild ARMs (Alter Code F): I'll let someone else deal with this; don't feel like figuring out Rudy.
Wild ARMs 2: Ashley is Fire based on Knight Blazer and such.
Wild ARMs 3: Virginia's holding the Fire Medium + her first tool being Fire elemental I guess were hinting at her being Fire?  Said logic works with Jet and Gallows at least, I guess (not completely convinced that Bombs are Earth though <_<)
Wild ARMs 4: Jude is Wind.  Its his innate element he resists, so yeah.
Wild ARMs 5: Talked about it a bit in chat, people were trying to convince me that "Idiot" is an element and should be applied to Dean <_< >_>
Xenogears: Believe that it was generally agreed that Darkness fits Fei well enough.
Xenosaga Collective: Cause its easier this way than saying "Shion" three times. Anyway, she's either Fire or Lightning. I know in XS2, pretty much all but one of her attacks is Lightning and in XS1, she uses both...can't remember XS3 though.  Leaning Lightning for now though.
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

Anthony Edward Stark

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2008, 12:44:14 AM »
I'm just going to roll through my list and comment on games that stand out to me.

Final Fantasy VI- Terra is Fire, Locke is either Wind (he gets two of the game's three Wind-elemental weapons, the Air Lancet and the Zwil Crossblade) or Fire (association with the Phoenix), Celes is Ice. I always pictured Edgar as Lightning, but that's just because of the machinery thing, and also, I give him Ramuh at the beginning most of the time.

EarthBound- Ness I would consider Light, because his only attack that's got an attribute that can be defended is Flash (well, and Hypnosis/Paralysis).

Shadow Hearts: Yuri is Darkness. Duh.

SO3: Fayt is Light-element. His first attacks are fire, but his special ones at the end? Like the one that's Plot-power based? Light.

ToS: Lloyd's only elemental attack is Wind. He also does a lot of flying attacks and things. Also, he's got names like "Rising Falcon" and "Tempest" for some of them. So that's the feeling I get.

And... uh, in WoW, Thrall is Nature-elemental.

FFIV- Cecil. Paladin. Holy. Duh.

VtM:BL- Eight different clans you can select and you're STILL Darkness-elemental no matter what!

Suikoden III: Fire. No matter who you pick as the main.

SotN: See VtM:BL. If you're a vampire, you're stuck with Darkness.

SO2: Claude is the Warrior of Light. He uses a raygun. His last weapon shoots out stars and shit. Light. Or I guess you could argue Star, since he's from SPACE and the Eternal Sphere also absorbs that element.

WA: Rudy I would consider non-elemental. Not that he has no element, but his element is neutral on account of being a construct and using technology.

SoA: I realize he doesn't start with it, but I consider Vyse to be Wind-elemental. It's the flying, sailing, sky thing.

XS1: Shion is Stupid Cunt element.

XS2: Junior is fire-elemental on account of the Red Dragon. Or maybe thermonuclear elemental, since he's basically a planet-killing bomb made of meat.

XS3: See XS1.

XG: Fei has the yin/yang thing going. Dark and Light. On the one hand, he's got light-elemental abilities, but if you look at the history of the Contact's powers, they're not a force for good in general.

BoF5: Ryu? Darkness. He's the Destroyer.

KotOR: Canonically, Revan was Light-side. And male.

KotOR2: Canonically, the Exile was Light-side. And female.

Mario(s): Fire. Also, Jump.

Chrono Trigger: Lightning. Dur.

Star Ocean: Ratix? If I recall he's got light-elemental attacks. Otherwise I'd consider him "FUCKING STAB YOU" element.

Suikoden: Tir is Darkness.

WA4: Jude? Wind. The resists are pretty much the only hint given.

dude789

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2008, 02:33:46 AM »
In WA it seemed to me that all three of the characters were main or pretty close. Cecilia's water and Jack's wind. Rudy's the only one who doesn't have an obvious one.

Anthony Edward Stark

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2008, 02:54:34 AM »
In WA it seemed to me that all three of the characters were main or pretty close. Cecilia's water and Jack's wind. Rudy's the only one who doesn't have an obvious one.

In the original, yeah. In the original WA, Rudy also has a couple of fire elemental attacks, I believe. In ACF, it's Rudy's game. The Japanese don't like ambiguity in their mains.

Meeplelard

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2008, 03:17:11 AM »
Eh, WA1, Rudy felt like they were clearly trying to make him the main (being primarily silent is a strong indicator), just WA1's story isn't much to begin with, and since the cast is really small, the other two characters actually talking while Rudy not will make them stand out more.

ACF just wanted to confirm that Rudy clearly was the main, and that WA1 didn't intend to do it that way, it felt like.  Again, a Silent Protagonist loses his entire purpose in a game if s/he is not the main (well, you could argue Nina 4 is the true main of BoF4 and Ryu is more just the central character (or the Hero if you prefer), but lets not get into that.) Its things like which make me go a bit "..." to things like the FIRE EMBLEM TACTICIAN!!! who is just a stupid way to let you start the game with only Lyn in your team and no other characters, and serves absolutely no purpose in the game other than to be an Imaginary Friend for the Lords to talk too.
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

Anthony Edward Stark

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2008, 07:51:26 PM »
I need to flip through my "art of WA" book that came with WA5 (and was the best part of WA5) but I believe it refers to Rudy as the main character of WA1 a couple times.

Meeplelard

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2008, 08:48:03 PM »
*checks*

"The hero and main character in Wild ARMs."

It also gives a brief description afterwords saying "Hero" but that seems more like using the term Hero in the sense of "He saves the day and helps everyone!" rather than the literary term, which it clearly meant the first time they used it.  Pretty much seals it that that Rudy was, at very least, intended to be the main, especially considering ACF.
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

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Shihali

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2008, 03:33:30 AM »
7th Saga:
Kamil: Fire, he doesn't get ice.
Valsu: Brokenation. (Okay, ice.)
Lux: Lightning - he's the only one to get lightning magic.
Esuna: Ice, she doesn't get fire, and it's not a bad fit.
Wilme: Fire, I guess.
Olvan: Fire, I guess, he doesn't get ice.
Lejes: Gets fire before ice; I'd say darkness on thematic grounds with zero mechanical support, if you have to have a 7th Saga element it's Fire.

Arcana: None.  The game has a well-defined element system and all humans are classified as having no element.

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2008, 11:17:30 AM »
This seems fun. Adding in some newer games that didn't make Meep's list.

Tales of the Abyss: Luke is kind of a tricky case. Story-wise, he's clearly stated to be 'Sound'-elemental, as he is a Seventh Fonist and the Seventh Fonon is the Fonon of Sound (stated multiple times in-game). He's also one of only two people in the world who can create a Hyperresonance with himself. In the battle system, he has no spells which utilize his Seventh Fonon (healing spells, well, he has ONE skill which heals him, but it doesn't really seem like he's using the Seventh Fonon for it). He DOES use his Hyperresonance ability in the animation for Radiant Howl, his Mystic Arte, which is related to the Seventh Fonon, so one can argue that Luke's element is 'Sound', if you're allowing rare elements like that. You might argue he's "Light" by that same line of logic, only disallowing 'Sound' as an element. Luke has a handful of low-level elemental skills as well, but this effectively makes him 'multi-elemental' instead of really determining his alignment. Side note, his name's meaning conjures images of "Light" and "Fire", if you really want to go down that road.

Jeanne D'Arc: This game has one of the most fun elemental systems I've played with in a while, but unfortunately for Jeanne herself, she has no starting claim or plot claim to any one of the customizable elements (Sol/Luna/Stella, respectively Fire/Ice/Lightning). However, Jeanne -does- have the neat plot claim to "Holy" by being one of the Holy Armletbearers. All of her transformed skills have a clear leaning towards "Light" (despite it counting in the battle system as 'non-elemental damage'). By that same token, the game's male lead, Roger, has only parasitic healing skills in his transformed state, making him something akin to SO2's "Vacuum elemental"? Alternately, the plot-based demonic power probably makes him 'Dark-elemental'...

Hmm... that was fun to ponder over.

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #9 on: February 11, 2008, 09:28:17 PM »
Umm yeah, I can think of only one game that Meeple doesn't have that I've played.

Disgaea 2- Hour of Darkness.  Adell is obviously fire.  Forget is he gets anything else period, but Crimson Flame, Soaring Fire, Vulcan Blaze are all fire.
Oddly enough, only Yukimaru is elementally alligned other than Adell.  They all get elemental attacks, but based on their weapons IIRC.  As for their special attacks Yuki is Water, although Yuki is obv. not the main.

As for FF7,8.  Cloud starts with Lightning and Ice?  Although the game in no way leads towards the fact that you should stick with this.  Kinda figure he has none.  Squall also can go any route, and even though he specifically goes in and gets Ifrit, doesn't really mean too much.

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2008, 09:59:09 PM »
Boredom FTW.
-I combined Light/Holy as they generally mean the same thing only in different games. 
-Was tempted to make Sun/Moon Light/Dark, but as I haven't played those games I dunno if they were super specific or something.  Heaven also could be light? 
-Also nature/Earth could be the same, but I forget if FE specifically had both or not, so kept em seperate for now.
-Games with multiple mains I just fractioned em, as opposed to giving certain games 7 votes and others 1

None/Undecided 49
Fire 24.46
Holy 15.37
Lightning 10.30
Wind 9.50
Dark 8.20
Ice 3.65
Earth 3.50
Water 2.33
Nature 1.33
Sun 1
Heaven .33
Moon .17

So yeah fire rapes, followed by holy, followed by light/wind/dark.  After that all of them drop off, so they're the big 5 for main character elements.  Also I didn't do some games that A. I haven't played/don't remember well enough and B. Meep didn't seem 100% about.  Those include

Lufia 3
OB/TO
Persona
Persona 2
PS1
Pokemons- (Could do all of them and say .33 for Fire/Water/Grass for RB.  Lightning for Yellow etc.?)  I haven't played past Gen 2 so would need someone else to do it.
SF
Sailor Moon
Sword of Mana
ToP
XS3
SO3
« Last Edit: February 12, 2008, 09:08:24 PM by Chapin »

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #11 on: February 12, 2008, 12:10:36 AM »
Quote
-Was tempted to make Sun/Moon Light/Dark, but as I haven't played those games I dunno if they were super specific or something.  Heaven also could be light?

Heaven in FE9/10 is not Light.  They are two completely different elements.  Think its suppose to be Heaven vs. Earth type ordeal, which is odd as there's a Wind as well.  Naturally, you'd say Wind exists since that's one of the elements they use...except there's also an Ice element which is *NOT* one of them (Ice spells, namely Rexcalibur and Blizzard, are both Wind.)

Sun and Moon things are also not Dark.  For example, SD3, there's a spirit of Dark *AND* of Moon.  Moon is the opposite of Grass (...don't ask), Dark is the Opposite of Light. (The elements being Luna = Moon, Shade = Dark, Dryad = Grass, and Wisp = Light.  If you're really picky, I believe Wisp was called Lumina in Secret of Mana.)

Similarly, in Suikoden 5, Sun is its own element; there's a Holy elemental equivalent, if its not called Holy, which works with the Resurrection Rune and Shield Rune, IIRC.  Sun exists for 2 Runes only (on the PC end anyway), those being Dawn and Twilight.  Similarly, there's a Star element in S5, which belongs to the Star Rune, and no, its not equivalent to Dark elemental attacks, given there's a Dark element as well (covers Sin Rune and one of the Pale Gate spells.)

<i>-Also nature/Earth could be the same, but I forget if FE specifically had both or not, so kept em seperate for now.</i>

Note quite.  Nature and Earth aren't the same, and they even use completely different symbols.  Nature's symbol is the same as Anima; its 3 different colored circles. I think the point of it is to show balance and such (IIRC, the characters who are Anima/Nature are typically level headed, and are lacking in any real personality quirks or trends, but I could be remembering wrong.)  Earth shows a picture of a rock.  Its meant to be Earth as far as the Greek Elements go, quite obviously.
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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #12 on: February 12, 2008, 05:03:40 AM »
Meep, Aurora Arts are actualyl elemental element, not light.
And Eternal Sword's element is time, not light either.

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #13 on: February 12, 2008, 05:21:56 AM »
Isn't Eternal Sword just a random weapon you get from Cless, which has absolutely no plot baring for him whatsoever (Cless, now, is a different story; that's clearly his canon sword), so I don't know what that has to do with anything; only reason its Time Elemental is cause it fits ToP's plot and you know it.  Ultimate Weapons gotten from side quests that have little to no plot worth are not indicative of...well, anything, at least as far as this is concerned.  Now Last Fencer, IIRC, was Reid's Canon weapon (...which isn't even his best in game since a random chest in the final dungeon hands you a stronger weapon anyway, though probably best vs. Shizel due to lacking an element which she likes to resist, I guess?), though that was Non Elemental anyway, so its indicative of nothing (GRANTED, IIRC, you had to defeat Rem, the Craymel of LIGHT to get said weapon anyway, so...<_<)

Anyway...
You kind of missed what I was getting at with Aurora Artes.  Think about it for a second.

The original meaning of "Aurora" was the Roman Goddess of Dawn.  The Scientific definition has to do with special light display and all that of various colors, not getting into specifics.  Its safe to say the term Aurora likely refers to one of these two things (and the Scientific use of it, which is often the case, probably was directly derived from the Mythological Origin, just cause its easier to name things after pre-existing named objects and all that.)

Anyway, its safe to say Aurora has something to do with Light, which naturally extends to Aurora Artes.  Now, consider the flip side of the Aurora Artes, its opposite, are called Dark Artes...I think its pretty clear why Aurora, despite its lack of element in game, is has Light applications to it, if through plot.

Similarly, Black Sword Rune in Suikoden I'd call a Dark Rune, even though its non-elemental, since its suppose to be the opposite yet equal half to the Bright Shield Rune, which was clearly a Light/Holy/Whatever Rune.

You can't always apply game play logic to plot is the thing.  Furthermore
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
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[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #14 on: February 12, 2008, 09:52:07 AM »
Uh.  "Aurora Artes are Elemental elemental."  "Elemental"  is an element in ToE.  Reid would then be Elemental elemental.  If you want to be nitpicky and say it was supposed to be translated as "Nonelemental", it's still not purely nonelemental like, say, Last Fencer's attacks or anything like that.  I would say that in-game elemental attribute takes precedent over Roman goddesses and Dark is the opposite of light arguments.

EDIT:  I regret posting in this topic, less because of anything I said and more because of the result of it.  Encouraging Meeple is dumb bad dumbad.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2008, 09:24:01 AM by Zenthor »

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #15 on: February 12, 2008, 10:45:21 AM »
Quote
-Was tempted to make Sun/Moon Light/Dark, but as I haven't played those games I dunno if they were super specific or something.  Heaven also could be light?

Heaven in FE9/10 is not Light.  They are two completely different elements.  Think its suppose to be Heaven vs. Earth type ordeal, which is odd as there's a Wind as well.  Naturally, you'd say Wind exists since that's one of the elements they use...except there's also an Ice element which is *NOT* one of them (Ice spells, namely Rexcalibur and Blizzard, are both Wind.)

Sun and Moon things are also not Dark.  For example, SD3, there's a spirit of Dark *AND* of Moon.  Moon is the opposite of Grass (...don't ask), Dark is the Opposite of Light. (The elements being Luna = Moon, Shade = Dark, Dryad = Grass, and Wisp = Light.  If you're really picky, I believe Wisp was called Lumina in Secret of Mana.)

Similarly, in Suikoden 5, Sun is its own element; there's a Holy elemental equivalent, if its not called Holy, which works with the Resurrection Rune and Shield Rune, IIRC.  Sun exists for 2 Runes only (on the PC end anyway), those being Dawn and Twilight.  Similarly, there's a Star element in S5, which belongs to the Star Rune, and no, its not equivalent to Dark elemental attacks, given there's a Dark element as well (covers Sin Rune and one of the Pale Gate spells.)

<i>-Also nature/Earth could be the same, but I forget if FE specifically had both or not, so kept em seperate for now.</i>

Note quite.  Nature and Earth aren't the same, and they even use completely different symbols.  Nature's symbol is the same as Anima; its 3 different colored circles. I think the point of it is to show balance and such (IIRC, the characters who are Anima/Nature are typically level headed, and are lacking in any real personality quirks or trends, but I could be remembering wrong.)  Earth shows a picture of a rock.  Its meant to be Earth as far as the Greek Elements go, quite obviously.


Seperate they stay then, and damn I need to find a way to play FE9 and 10,

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2008, 11:12:00 AM »
Isn't Eternal Sword just a random weapon you get from Cless, which has absolutely no plot baring for him whatsoever (Cless, now, is a different story; that's clearly his canon sword), so I don't know what that has to do with anything; only reason its Time Elemental is cause it fits ToP's plot and you know it.  Ultimate Weapons gotten from side quests that have little to no plot worth are not indicative of...well, anything, at least as far as this is concerned.  Now Last Fencer, IIRC, was Reid's Canon weapon (...which isn't even his best in game since a random chest in the final dungeon hands you a stronger weapon anyway, though probably best vs. Shizel due to lacking an element which she likes to resist, I guess?), though that was Non Elemental anyway, so its indicative of nothing (GRANTED, IIRC, you had to defeat Rem, the Craymel of LIGHT to get said weapon anyway, so...<_<)

Anyway...
You kind of missed what I was getting at with Aurora Artes.  Think about it for a second.

The original meaning of "Aurora" was the Roman Goddess of Dawn.  The Scientific definition has to do with special light display and all that of various colors, not getting into specifics.  Its safe to say the term Aurora likely refers to one of these two things (and the Scientific use of it, which is often the case, probably was directly derived from the Mythological Origin, just cause its easier to name things after pre-existing named objects and all that.)

Anyway, its safe to say Aurora has something to do with Light, which naturally extends to Aurora Artes.  Now, consider the flip side of the Aurora Artes, its opposite, are called Dark Artes...I think its pretty clear why Aurora, despite its lack of element in game, is has Light applications to it, if through plot.

Similarly, Black Sword Rune in Suikoden I'd call a Dark Rune, even though its non-elemental, since its suppose to be the opposite yet equal half to the Bright Shield Rune, which was clearly a Light/Holy/Whatever Rune.

You can't always apply game play logic to plot is the thing.  Furthermore

Yes, Eternal Sword is for Cless.

Anyway, Tales multiverse has their own heiarchy of elements: Time and Elemental element being the top tier, with only 3 elemental spirit occupying those two elements (Sekundes, Origin, Maxwell). Light element is a tier below. And elemental element is Aurora Art's actual element, saying it is light is kinda downgrading it. Further more, there is nothing Divine about Seifret in the first place. Aurora Arts were originally is the power to generate material power (For Seifret's purpose to steal Nereid's world). The generationg of material relates to the domain that Maxwell and Origin govern (creation out of nothingness and molecular functions). Aurora Arts really have nothing that matches light element besides the name. But Elemental element has two seperate type, Origin's Minamoto and Maxwell's Moto. Consider Origin is not present in the ToE world, it'll make Aurora Arts fell specifcly to the Moto element. The two elements are functionally the same, but represents the different domain the spirits presides over.

BTW, Laharl has ice weakness and fire resistence in Disgaea3, I think this add tot he evidence that Laharl is fire aligned.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2008, 11:13:32 AM by Niu »

Meeplelard

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2008, 06:26:41 PM »
Elemental and time don't really *EXIST* outside of Tales of Eternia, so really, that argument kind of falls short, frankly.

The name thing is a big deal, and how the Artes are treated in game.  Again, further more, the fact that Rem also guards the item that gets you Last Fencer ultimately is a further bonus aspect to Reid = Light.  Again, the whole Dark Artes vs. Light Artes, the way Seifert vs. Nereid was treated, etc. it really hints that Aurora Artes were intended to be the Light aligned stuff.

Furthermore, the animations produced by these attacks

And no, don't go pulling this "heirarchy of elements!" thing; Elemental and Time are just oddball elements that have no baring in this topic.  Its not "downgrading an element" to call it something based on how it is treated in gameplay.  There is nothing in game that said "These are attacks derived from Maxwell!" which would be the only plot connection; the game just basically says its the opposite of Dark Artes.  Its not "downgrading" anything; that's just looking at it from one very weird PoV that applies to a game wiht 2 very screwed up elements that don't really fall into the grand scheme of things.  It was chosen as Elemental in game cause Elemental is resisted far less than Light, they wanted these moves to be as good as possible, is my guess.  From what I recall, wasn't, say, Eternal Finality Dark elemental?  Reid's moves are suppose to be equal yet opposite of that, the Elemental aspect feels like it was meant to be a quirk to make them better in game, and little else (much like making an attack Holy element in Phantasy Star 4 was done to inflate the raw worth of some abilities, like for example, making the Elsydeon the obvious Best Weapon in the game, despite how its not really THAT much higher, statistically, than other PCs ultimates, the Holy elemental aspect makes it far better in practice.)

Again, the Elemental Element thing doesn't seem to actually fit in with Aurora Artes plot much at all, especially considering the whole Opposite of Dark Artes thing they bring in.  Feels more like a gameplay quirk and little else.
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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2008, 07:24:44 PM »
Eh, translating the niuese, I think he's saying that Elemental would be sort of a creation element, which is something you could plausibly describe in plot terms for any particular game.  That only Lenneth would fall under it, and that she has another element anyway, do make it pretty worthless for most purposes though >.>
Time as an element you could probably find other people for, though.  I mean, it's as sensible as water for Tidus, as an example.
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Meeplelard

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #19 on: February 12, 2008, 08:29:58 PM »
I suppose, though its still something that doesn't really translate to anyone, its more its own monster altogether, etc.  Plus that connection doesn't really fit with Reid much anyway, or how Aurora Artes felt like they were used anyway.

Time...doesn't fit Reid at all, is the thing.  Argue it for Cless if you want, ok, that has some merit, but Reid doesn't fit Time in any sense.  Again, Eternal Sword has no plot baring on him, its just his strongest weapon gotten from a side quest that involved a cameo, and the Eternal Sword's plot in ToP only made it logical to be Time Elemental.  Otherwise, doesn't really fit Reid in any sense, feels like its kind of pointless to bring up.

And...Tidus w/ Time only fits on a gameplay level, no?  Don't think he really fits it as a character.  Remember, he didn't skip time at all (if anything, he skipped reality, which is a different thing), no real connections with time aspects, what have you.  His Time Magic felt more of a "Fits his fighting style more than the others."  Water just feels stronger in general for him, considering the Blitz Ball aspect, and the Brotherhood's  (his canon weapon) element.  (See? In this case, weapon element can matter cause it actually has some plot baring and its a weapon the character gets linked with.  Eternal Sword on Reid is very much NOT that <_<)
« Last Edit: February 12, 2008, 08:32:17 PM by Meeplelard »
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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #20 on: February 12, 2008, 09:04:10 PM »
Tidus skipped time/space which we know to be the same thing.

And uh how can you just ignore that giant chunk of Niuese that Niu and Zenny spat out?  That is a giant fucking plot disection right there.  The key factor is that the powers Reid demonstrates are in the same vein as that of Maxwell, Lord of the Elements.  So technically he functions "Elemental" element, which in game is treated as non-elemental because well yeah that is what the combination of all elements in that kind of system should pan out as.
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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #21 on: February 12, 2008, 09:13:23 PM »
Partially cause Origin doesn't exist in ToE from my recollection, Zenny's not a "giant chunk"  and just a simple "Oh look its its elemental Element you're wrong!" (read what he said, its not really a counter point at all, I didn't even notice he said something until now cause the post is small, so please don't give credit to something where credit isn't due), and I don't recall Aurora Artes being linked to Maxwell in anyway.

Calling Reid non elemental works too I guess, when all is said and done.  Calling a character his own unique element cause a game has a screwed up element that makes no freaking sense ("Its elemental! Oh yeah, Elemental is technically non-elemental!")...yeah...
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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #22 on: February 13, 2008, 05:11:07 AM »
Elemental and time don't really *EXIST* outside of Tales of Eternia, so really, that argument kind of falls short, frankly.

The name thing is a big deal, and how the Artes are treated in game.  Again, further more, the fact that Rem also guards the item that gets you Last Fencer ultimately is a further bonus aspect to Reid = Light.  Again, the whole Dark Artes vs. Light Artes, the way Seifert vs. Nereid was treated, etc. it really hints that Aurora Artes were intended to be the Light aligned stuff.

Furthermore, the animations produced by these attacks

And no, don't go pulling this "heirarchy of elements!" thing; Elemental and Time are just oddball elements that have no baring in this topic.  Its not "downgrading an element" to call it something based on how it is treated in gameplay.  There is nothing in game that said "These are attacks derived from Maxwell!" which would be the only plot connection; the game just basically says its the opposite of Dark Artes.  Its not "downgrading" anything; that's just looking at it from one very weird PoV that applies to a game wiht 2 very screwed up elements that don't really fall into the grand scheme of things.  It was chosen as Elemental in game cause Elemental is resisted far less than Light, they wanted these moves to be as good as possible, is my guess.  From what I recall, wasn't, say, Eternal Finality Dark elemental?  Reid's moves are suppose to be equal yet opposite of that, the Elemental aspect feels like it was meant to be a quirk to make them better in game, and little else (much like making an attack Holy element in Phantasy Star 4 was done to inflate the raw worth of some abilities, like for example, making the Elsydeon the obvious Best Weapon in the game, despite how its not really THAT much higher, statistically, than other PCs ultimates, the Holy elemental aspect makes it far better in practice.)

Again, the Elemental Element thing doesn't seem to actually fit in with Aurora Artes plot much at all, especially considering the whole Opposite of Dark Artes thing they bring in.  Feels more like a gameplay quirk and little else.

Elemental element DOES exists outside ToE. ToW has them plenty of time if you wonder. And despite ToS has no functioning Elemental element in game mechanics, the game still stated that Origin is the Minamoto element and Maxwell being the Moto element (Though, I do not know what they tarnslted Minamoto and Moto into in the English vesion). Further more, Tales of Fandom2 has clearly established that all the elemental spirits in Tales verse are one and the same just in different avatars, that makes all the elements in each game the same just under different name. So no, stop saying Elemental element being an odd ball or not in the grand theme of thing, or else they wouldn't restate it in ToS (If you wonder, ToW2 is the first game that divides Elemenal element into Minamoto and Moto, and ToS followed up on that concept).
The only way I can see you treat Aurora Arts being light related is to find evidence that light element in Tales verse has a function in spontenously creating material energy out of nothingness (Which is what Aurora Arts does exactly), but as far as I have gathered, that is a specific domain of the Elemental element.
Also, if you toss game mechanics all out and regard only plot. Both Aurora arts and Darl Aurora Arts are both Elemental element, As both type of Aurora Arts are achieved by fringing all elements of Craymels together through the Fibril. And Elemental element is basically what you got when you squash all the elements together.

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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #23 on: February 13, 2008, 07:51:55 AM »
And yeah this stuff Niu is talking about is very old plot points for the Tales series instigated ever since ToPo itself in one form or another.  Origin may not be in ToE, but Maxwell certainly is and he is presented in exactly the same manner as he always has been, representing the exact same thing.

Edit - Straw man over Zenny.  Zenny brought it up, Niu fleshed out the massive plot points in detail.  The way Zenny presented it does not stop it from being a theme throughout the entire series, ala, a massive plot point.
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Re: Main Character elemental quirks: THE RETURN!
« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2008, 11:51:02 AM »

And...Tidus w/ Time only fits on a gameplay level, no? 

He's from an artificial parallel universe that's also a recreation of the distant past.

AND BLITZBALL HAS A TIMER.