PokeMafia - Day 4

[QuietRain]

VOTECOUNT

Yoshiken(0): Bardiche
Snowfire(0): Xanth, Snowfire
Carthrat(1): OblivionKnight
OblivionKnight(0): Excal, Carthrat
Kilgamayan(0): Nietz
Sylon(4): SirAlex, EvilTom, Excal, Carthrat
Deltaflyer2k8(3): Sylon, Snowfire, Yoshiken
Xanth(2): Kilgamayan, Meeplelard
Meeplelard(2): Bardiche, Xanth

VOTES FOR EXTENSION (9 needed for majority)
(3) : SnowFire, Yoshiken, Nietz

[Strago]

Mrff. Most of the actual arguments being leveraged against those with multiple votes seem pretty graspy and forced, to me. Of the trains or semi-trains that we have rolling, a vote against Meeple right now would make the most sense to me, I suppose, for the reasons Bard presented. Then again, Meeple also didn't seem to realize the game had started for some time, which jives with the idea that he hadn't really fully considered that we don't need a majority to lynch, which makes his action seem less malicious. I love it when I talk myself out of doing what I'd intended a sentence ago!

Fuck me, I really don't have a read on anybody.

[Kilgamayan]

I find it amusing that SnowFire talked about how Day 1 sucks right after voting to extend it.

I'm not sure I understand exactly what Xanth is saying in his response to me but I don't have the time to read it closely right now. I'll get to it after my short shift today.

Can we get Deadline ETAs in post counts?

[Sylon]

First off, ##Unvote Deltaflyer2k8

---

Can't really say anything about the train on myself- It does consist entirely of joke votes, after all.

Sylon: can we actually hear from you? I've seen you lurking the board repeatedly through the day, but not a peep out of you here. I know there's not much you can say in your defence of a roulette lynch on you, but it's an odd time to be silent nonetheless.

My apologies. I haven't been feeling well these few days, and thought I would put off posting until I could think coherently.

So yeah, why not, I don't have much else to go on, though "Vote on Sylon cause he has votes" just to get a lynch in doesn't seem like a bad idea if the day stretches out a little longer, but for now...

I'm curious about this part. Assuming you missed the rule about no no-lynches, why would my lynch not be a bad idea if the day stretches out a little longer?

---

I don't see any reason to hold Snowfire's self-vote during the random voting stage against him(?), and Delta's post in reply to Snowfire didn't seem particularly offensive to me. I don't see the reasoning behind the 'Why didn't Delta vote' argument, though, when I think about it, as his post seemed more along the lines of being annoyed at Snowfire's non-serious attitude as opposed to finding him suspicious. At the very least, it didn't seem so to me.

---

I'll hold my vote for now, until I hear from Meeple with regards to my above question.

Also, ##Extension.

[Meeplelard]

First off...

##Extension

I missed a good deal of the day, etc.  seems a logical idea at this point.

OK, ONTO ACTUAL CONTENT!

I did indeed miss the fact that a Plurality is enough in this game.  It tends to swap between games I've played, and I thought I read that you need to hammer, but if a Plurality at end of the day is enough?  Then yeah, I take back that comment.  I only wish I could have gotten on earlier before Strago mentioned it, since now it probably seems like I'm using it as an excuse, but that is really what happened :\

Next off, I'm still not quite so sure WHAT'S wrong with Snowfire's vote on himself that he immediately retracted.  Is it just cause someone called for serious Mafia discussion and he went on with the joke phase?  I just don't see that as meaning particularly much, can someone please elaborate for me, cause I'm still confused just WHY it looks so bad.  I mean, I've seen people pull stunts like this in the past; its not really so much a scum tell as just as "*smack*, get serious damn it!" moment.  Don't mean to Metagame, but if that's really all Snowfire did, I'm not sure just how BAD it can be.

Though, if that's why it looks bad, then paired with the almost useless Wall of Text (which had a seemingly useless Roleclaim; useless in the sense that it tells us nothing of what side he's on, I mean), yeah, I can see that not looking too hot, but I'm honestly not sure that's quite enough. 

I'm gonna have to look back at Delta's behavior now that Yoshiken brought it up; I remember him mainly just attacking Snowfire's post for being mostly useless, but that doesn't say much to me.

Vote stays on Xanth for now, mostly cause I still don't quite understand what Snowfire did so wrong.  Maybe I should go back and reread the reasons (if someone gave one) cause its possible I just missed it (having to seeve through a lot of posts = your mind wanders at inopportune times)

---

However, looking back again, he then complains about a lack of serious posting & the fact that Snow made a long post to say very little, yet then gives us an Encore, saying the same thing two or three times in that post.

You had to capitalize Encore in a Pokemon Themed game, didn't you <_<?

[Meeplelard]

Ok, just re-read the reason for the "Snow's Vote on self looks bad!" thing and...I honestly can't say I agree.

"Joke phase, schmoke phase"?  Uh, people will jump on anything then, I'm aware, but at the same time, people will say anything at the same time cause there's nothing.  Example? Clue Mafia, Soppy voted on me just cause I hadn't said anything in like 12 hours between my posts, just to get the ball rolling, with a shakey as hell comment.  It started discussion too, but it wasn't a serious vote.

The "He's not interacting with people!" thing?  Its still too early in the game for it to MEAN ANYTHING.  I don't think he would have actually did that if there was actual serious discussion.

I do understand Excal's point that it looks worse with ANOTHER strike on his record (the near useless Wall of Text), so that's something, but I'm not seeing you arguing that.

Rereading, I realize Snowfire's Self Vote was STILL COMPLETELY IN THE JOKE PHASE, as stuff like "Excal is calling OK out on using meme's this early!" in a facetious manner screams joke phase.  It didn't seem like there was a lot of serious stuff going on by the time of his second post though.  The most we have is Excal voting on Sylon to start a train, only to help discussion; I'm guessing this is the "joke post after the call for seriousness" which...eh, it happens.

Honestly, if silly stuff is not allowed like that, why is it called a "Joke Phase"?  Snowfire has since started acting seriously, so its clear that was just him having fun; had he continued to run with it, it'd look bad, but I'm just not seeing it as much as others.

Also, I'm looking at Xanth's vote on me.  After the SNowfire stuff, he then says "You attack Sylon!" which as I recently noted, and he doesn't take action until after Bard does.  Feels like "Oh, someone attacked, I'll do it too!" as a means to smokescreen an OMGUS but *Shrugs*  maybe I'm reading too into it.

I also didn't notice how most of Sylon's votes were joke votes, so looking back, that Sylon train was more just Excal trying to promote discussion.

side note: Excal, while you're being brought up a decent amount of times in this post,I don't mean to single you out; its just that I kept running across your posts when I looked at the ones I was dealing with, so you stuck out.  I do not mean to imply anything by this.

[Ryogo]

Bah! Got catching up to do. Meaningful post coming, but just a quick post to let everyone know I'm here in the meantime while I review the game thread.

[QuietRain]

Can we get Deadline ETAs in post counts?

You sure can.

VOTECOUNT

Yoshiken(0): Bardiche
Snowfire(0): Xanth, Snowfire
Carthrat(1): OblivionKnight
OblivionKnight(0): Excal, Carthrat
Kilgamayan(0): Nietz
Sylon(4): SirAlex, EvilTom, Excal, Carthrat
Deltaflyer2k8(2): Sylon, Snowfire, Yoshiken
Xanth(2): Kilgamayan, Meeplelard
Meeplelard(2): Bardiche, Xanth

VOTES FOR EXTENSION (9 needed for majority)
(5) : SnowFire, Yoshiken, Nietz, Sylon, Meeplard

Deadline in just over ten hours.  It takes 9 to lynch.  REMINDER: If there is no vote count leader, a random target among those that share the highest vote counts against them will be done by myself at deadline tonight.  Avoid this.

[Meeplelard]

Just a question for future, cause I'm not sure how the Extension mechanics work:

Is it possible to withdraw a request for extension (like say "unextension"?)  I don't intend to do this now (possibly ever?), it'd just be something useful to know one way or another.

[QuietRain]

MOD CLARIFICATION: Yes, just like UNVOTE: UNEXTENSION will remove your vote to make the day last longer.

[Strago]

I also didn't notice how most of Sylon's votes were joke votes, so looking back, that Sylon train was more just Excal trying to promote discussion.

I dunno, Meep. The Sylon train might have been part discussion-oriented, but Rat and Alex certainly seemed sincere enough in their desire to take him out just because.

Also, I'm looking at Xanth's vote on me.  After the SNowfire stuff, he then says "You attack Sylon!" which as I recently noted, and he doesn't take action until after Bard does.  Feels like "Oh, someone attacked, I'll do it too!" as a means to smokescreen an OMGUS but *Shrugs*  maybe I'm reading too into it.

Yeah. Yeah, I see what you mean there. Xanth was also very eager to chastise Delta for lacking in civility, which I've gone on record as saying is pretty much bollocks as Delta immediately apologized for the comment in question. And since I don't see a reason (and do feel suspicious of those who do) for the Sylon lynch right now, let's work on getting someone else in the running and not risk a horrible Hatbot event:

##VOTE: Xanth

Pokemon enfranchisement. Booyaka. Equal rights for weird martial artist pokeymans I've never heard of.

I'm still vaguely against the extension for reasons I mentioned, and am now going to be gone for a few hours. I'll be around again before deadline, though, and won't necessarily be against voting for an extra 24 hours. That said, I'd rather just have more people in discussion than start dragging things out interminably.

[Deltaflyer]

Delta: So...  I try to get things moving with a more inane post (though with some serious parts tacked on), and you jump on it immediately.  But you don't vote me either.  In fact you haven't voted for anyone at all.  It's Day 1, do something, anything, to get things moving.  If you thought I was authentically suspicious you should have voted me, not merely attacked me.  I find *this* mildly suspicious (by Day 1 (TM) standards)  So...

##VOTE Deltaflyer[/b

The reason is more so now, because you say that you actually read Excal's post. However, did you not notice the bit that implyed "Start serious mafia now"? Did you think that you were contributing alot? Did you bother to try and make a case on anyone?

Nope. Nada. Zilch.

The reason I haven't voted for you yet, is because at the time, I was just wanting to get the post done and dusted, and it was relatively early out of the joke-vote phase at that time (to me, anyways). I am leaning towards jokey-style posting, and reading some other people's comments is that it happens. Sorry >.<

Sylon: can we actually hear from you? I've seen you lurking the board repeatedly through the day, but not a peep out of you here. I know there's not much you can say in your defence of a roulette lynch on you, but it's an odd time to be silent nonetheless.

If that's true, then Sylon's (lack of) actions becomes definitely suspicious.

I have to second this, I think that although he has posted, he still needs to comment on everyone, get his views on the arguements everywhere.

The tone of it, primarily. Sure, Snow carried on with the joke stage, but to attack him on that despite it being the first post since the first call for serious mafia seems somewhat ridiculous.

However, looking back again, he then complains about a lack of serious posting & the fact that Snow made a long post to say very little, yet then gives us an Encore, saying the same thing two or three times in that post.
Finally, to finish off, he... doesn't comment on anyone or anything else. If you're gonna Lock On to someone else for not being serious, it's probably better to at least lend a Helping Hand yourself...

(Oh, and the poll count is still out - I voted Delta, not Meeple.)

What can I say? It annoyed me. I honestly hate day one because of the jokevote phase. I guess all I can say is sorry.

I am getting neutral-town reads off Yoshi, Meeps, Bardiche, Strago, QK and ET.

Neutral-reads off Ryogo (post moar now.), Snowfire, Rat, Nietz, Excal and Kilga.

Everyone else, I think you need to post moar.

Sorry for the last bit, but I need to finish this off now and get to sleep, Damned Viral infections.

[Meeplelard]

I dunno, Meep. The Sylon train might have been part discussion-oriented, but Rat and Alex certainly seemed sincere enough in their desire to take him out just because.

Looking back, you're right; Excal's push was mostly an "attack" to start discussion, but Alex and Rat's responses do seem sincere, based on the "There's not much to work with, someone's gotta go, lets just make it more firm who dies" logic or some such.  Rat's post was short so I somehow missed, Alex didn't have a vote in it, so was thinking he was just talking about philosophy, though, I now notice Alex's vote is placed on Sylon, so that'd explain why he didn't vote Sylon there.

Only joke vote on him, at least one that REMAINS a joke vote (Alex's was initially, but he kept it on for non-joke reasons, so doesn't count) is Tom's, and that seems mostly cause Tom hasn't spoke up yet.  I expect that when he finally does speak (IIRC, Tom's got actual time zone issues preventing him from posting at normal times?), he'll either remove the vote, or at least acknowledge keeping it on for whatever (non-joke) reason.

So yeah, I take back my "Most of those votes are jokes!" comment; Alex's was probably a joke INITIALLY, but seems he had a (semi) serious reason to keep it after the joke phase is up.  Rat has outright voiced that his reason was based solely on the above logic.

Wondering where I got this idea from?

Can't really say anything about the train on myself- It does consist entirely of joke votes, after all.

I figured someone would at least go out of their way to figure out why they're being called out, but I guess I'm just being a little too trusting, and I should have double checked on my own.

Though, it seems it might just be diction in terms of how he used "joke" in that he didn't literally mean "joke votes" as much as "votes without actual substance other than to pile votes on one person, so I can't actually defend it in any legit way" which is a fair statement; kind of hard to defend against nothing.

Sylon, care to clarify if that's what you meant?

[Yoshiken]

I find it amusing that SnowFire talked about how Day 1 sucks right after voting to extend it.

Ehh, that makes sense. Day1 sucks because you don't know much about anyone, even by the end of it. At least with an extension, there might be some use come from it.

Meeple, take a Keen Eye over my last two posts. I've been including quite a few Pokemon attacks, just for fun.

Delta...  Fair enough. Still slightly Maqua to me, but less so. I can understand being Torment-ed by the joke stage - this is the first Mafia game I've been in one, and I've managed to Pickup how damn useless it is. >.>

Mostly going by instinct at the moment, but I'm getting (very slightly) town reads from Strago, Nietz, Excal, Bard.
Still looking to hear more from quite a few people, with the ones that stick in my Calm Mind most being Ryogo, Alex & Tom.

Oh, just a point - without at least a small extension, I won't be around for the deadline. That's 7am for me, and I'm not waking up earlier than I already do solely for this, I'm afraid.

[Ryogo]

##VOTE:QuietRain
Mod is obviously undercover scum.
##UNVOTE:QuietRain

There. Random mandatory day one joke vote out of the way. Now for real input!

Day one is a crappy day for drawing conclusions. So much has to be taken from the joke vote phase, especially when it's shortened. Going for SnowFire because he voted for himself at the beginning of day one is a good way to start some discussion early on, but if anyone is seriously still clinging to that notion that it proves he's scum I'm inclined start suspecting them instead. It is the joke vote phase, after all. Not exactly something to take seriously, and if you do, with more than a few grains of salt.

Using the "Iron Wall of text" attack, however, is not a good plan. Especially so early in the game. Especially when the first 3 paragraphs of text have nothing to do with anything at all. It's foolish, but I read it as it was meant as a joke as well. To use the scum scale that SnowFire used, I'd put that wall at about a .3/10 for scum. At least its something to get the ball rolling though.

Sylon lynch train: It's a day one lynch train. It happens. Though after it started, Sylon lurking the way they apparently did does set off the alarm bells. Being absent is fine by me, but actually being around on the forum and not making any posts? Not a fan of that activity. Sorry that you're feeling sick, but as they say "Scum can have RL problems too"

Xanth's line of thinking seems like basic day one grasping for straws. I know the feeling, so I can't really fault him there. Xanth seems to be one that's all for getting straight down to business, so it seems like normal activity for him, especially after playing Simpsons Mafia with him. I really don't like to get into metagaming like that, so take it as you will, but its just my read of the situation.

Carthrat should come up with a better reason than "Hey, lynch train! Jump on board since its day one!" for Sylon reasoning, But he also hasn't been online since his last post (at least not logged into his account). Carthrat usually has some good insight on things, so it seems a little suspicious that he's not around and hasn't said more. BUT if he's from Australia like people have mentioned, that seems like more of a time zone thing than not posting for lurking intent.

So, right now...
##VOTE:Sylon

I think its the worst case so far, but its far from being overly scummy. Its at least something. I'll be around for the rest of the un-extended day, so I'll keep my eyes open for anything else I don't like.

That's really all I got I'm basically useless on day one.

I'm personally against an extension, just because day one is always terrible for me, but if townies believe they can get insight on scum from an extra 24 hours on day one...

##VOTE: Extension

Might be good for me anyways, considering this is only my first real post of the day

[EvilTom]

Sorry timezone-mafia sucks. ##unvote; will follow up as soon as I get to read thread in detail (skimming at uni). ##Vote Extension

[QuietRain]

VOTECOUNT

Yoshiken(0): Bardiche
Snowfire(0): Xanth, Snowfire
Carthrat(1): OblivionKnight
OblivionKnight(0): Excal, Carthrat
Kilgamayan(0): Nietz
Sylon(4): SirAlex, EvilTom, Excal, Carthrat, Ryogo
Deltaflyer2k8(2): Sylon, Snowfire, Yoshiken
Xanth(3): Kilgamayan, Meeplelard, Strago
Meeplelard(2): Bardiche, Xanth
QuietRain (0): EvilTom

VOTES FOR EXTENSION (9 needed for majority)
(7) : SnowFire, Yoshiken, Nietz, Sylon, Meeplard, Ryogo, EvilTom

Deadline in a little less than 8 1/2 hrs.  It takes 9 to lynch.  REMINDER: If there is no vote count leader, a random target among those that share the highest vote counts against them will be done by myself at deadline tonight.  Avoid this.

[Bardiche]

Meeple wall-of-texting is nothing new, and I'm willing to buy the "I didn't read the rules closely" comment. So, my right honourable friend, I will be

##UNVOTE: Meeple

and then look at another person. Let me stress though, Meeple, that I do want you to read posts more closely from here onward and familiarize yourself with the rules, because future inattention will make me pursue the matter as a scum action moreso than town just not being all there.

There are several disagreeable people among our number, some of whose arguments for voting someone I just find ludicrous and some who I just find sketchy in and of themselves for being relatively low-key.

Xanth, what changed inbetween your first post after Meeple voted you and your second post in which you vote for him that you find it a good idea to vote him? You present no new reasoning on Meeple besides blatantly stating that you are abandoning the Snowfire argument for lack of momentum and then latch on to a case I just picked up. Me-too-ism and OMGUS, or is it just the former, or neither? Please tell me.

[Excal]

post from work.  Quick note: End of joke vote caught Meep/Andy last game.  Can help to see how and why people vote early.  Self vote denies this and so is auto-strike against poster.     More when returned home.

[Carthrat]

Waking up, no time, fun.

##Vote: Extension yeah why not 36 hours is a bit silly.

Offhand, I don't like Meeple because he uses a lot of words at a time when a lot of words are not necessary or helpful. Delta seems shakey on his feet, but I can't see him as being otherwise explicitly scummy. Anyone making up shit about 'general town reads on peoples x y and z' is irking me.

I also don't like how Sylon favours a delaying tactic that forces Meeple to respond to him before he deigns to reply to us or vote for someone. Serious vote is still serious.

[Nietz]

Okay, Meeple last posts seem more solid, and he at least seems dedicated to analyze and scumhunt. Now, while on regular Mafia it's a good idea for scum to put up a pretense of doing that, I can only suppose it's not so good on multiple-faction games, as it can get you NK'ed by the rival team.

Sylon, on the other hand seems to be trying a little too much to keep it low even while the metaphorical light is over him.   

Can't really say anything about the train on myself- It does consist entirely of joke votes, after all.

Considering it was the largest wagon so far and that it was against you, you should have at least something to say about it or its repercussions. Just brushing it aside as joke votes looks like saying "Nothing to see here, move along."

My apologies. I haven't been feeling well these few days, and thought I would put off posting until I could think coherently.

But if you had time to lurk around you could certainly have posted something, considering the wagon was about the fact that you weren't around. I can't get off me the suspicion that you were just waiting for the wagon to runs its course and for a bigger case on someone else to come up without your intervention.

Anyway, active lurking for most of the day and a post with a few weak opinions like you're trying to go by unnoticed does not look good for me. So:
##Vote: Sylon

[Kilgamayan]

Okay, another quick post before rehearsal.

To answer your question, sure, a theoretical scumSnow would eventually have to contribute or get cut, but benefits in the meantime by not needing to do so now or get caught by the simple measures people tend to fall to on day one.

I now understand this. I happen to disagree with the idea, though, as I think the scum-benefit gained by not contributing to Early Day 1™ is tiny at best and will only get smaller as the game goes on. By about Day 3 I'd consider it negligible, if not before that.

Also, your rationale ('doing something that would make sense for town or scum in equal parts') seems worse than the one you're hitting me for ('doing something that is slightly tipped into scummy').

I'm still not sure I understand this. Let me try to spell out my thought process.

Snow self-voted. You responded by going "self-vote -> vote for self-voter". Such a mechanical approach to the situation is what I don't like; I believe scum are far more likely to go the formulaic route (because they just want to have a defensible vote down), while town are far more likely to look at the context of the situation (joke vote stage, vote immediately withdrawn in the same post) and recognize that no harm has been done. Your explanation as to why self-voting is bad suggests to me that you took the formulaic route, because I don't believe your reasoning is the real reasoning behind why self-voting is bad.

...And then you tell me to disregard that statement anyway. Whoops. At least my vote reasoning is out for everyone to see and analyze.

I'm being pushed out the door, so discussion concerning people that aren't Xanth will have to wait, sorry.

[QuietRain]

VOTECOUNT

Yoshiken(0): Bardiche
Snowfire(0): Xanth, Snowfire
Carthrat(1): OblivionKnight
OblivionKnight(0): Excal, Carthrat
Kilgamayan(0): Nietz
Sylon(5): SirAlex, EvilTom, Excal, Carthrat, Ryogo, Nietz
Deltaflyer2k8(2): Sylon, Snowfire, Yoshiken
Xanth(3): Kilgamayan, Meeplelard, Strago
Meeplelard(1): Bardiche, Xanth
QuietRain (0): EvilTom

VOTES FOR EXTENSION (9 needed for majority)
(8) : SnowFire, Yoshiken, Nietz, Sylon, Meeplard, Ryogo, EvilTom, Carthrat

Deadline in a little less than 8 1/2 hrs.  It takes 9 to lynch.  REMINDER: If there is no vote count leader, a random target among those that share the highest vote counts against them will be done by myself at deadline tonight.  Avoid this.

[SnowFire]

Some quick notes before cooking dinner for large amounts of people:

Excal: I assume you're referring to me?  The self-vote was in the jokes phase, not immediately after.

Sylon & Delta: While I'm normally on-board some form of early lynch train, if Sylon is genuinely sick this may not be the best choice (NOTE: Please don't bluff this kind of thing, Sylon, because it's why I'm assuming your lurking isn't evil lurking).  It seems Delta isn't feeling well either.

Kilgamayan: Yup, Day1 sucks, and it'll suck more if it's too short.

Strago: Mm.  Well longer days where people would be expected to post as fast as they have in short days would cause town burnout, sure, but the hope is that the longer days means the same amount of posts but not as packed together, thus not eating all the poster's Internet time and dealing with events / illness better.

Day 1, so hard to tell.  I'll only say that I'm getting a mildly townie read off Excal (seems to take the lack of time we have seriously - though please vote for an extension so it won't be as big an issue?).  I'm not sure pursuing Delta is going to be fruitful if he's ill, so instead...

##UNVOTE Deltaflyer
##VOTE Ryogo

"The Sylon case is the worst so far, but far from being overly scummy?"  Huh?  I suppose it could be a slip of the tongue, as I assume you meant "it's the best we have which is still not much," but it still comes off weird.  If you think that there's a better case...  vote that!  (Or did you mean worst as in likeliest to be guilty?)

Curious to see what EvilTom, Sir Alex, and OblivionKnight have to say, as well.

Ninja'd by Carth/Nietz/Kilgamayan.  Er, suppose I'll keep my low-confidence who's townie mention in there anyway.  Oh well.

[Xanth]

Okay, so I've managed to horribly screw up the timing of the evening and am now shattered. I'm not sure I believe in the extension (just about everyone's at least emerging from the woodwork now and votes are going places), but the concession I will make is that I'll set my alarm to wake me up well before what is currently the deadline (although I will just go back to bed if the extension is pushed through).

Bard: I should probably at least respond to you before going. What had changed in that time was that my motion to Snow had clearly become meaningless. It'd probably be a stupid reason to drop on another day, but on day one the first threads don't go anywhere if people disregard them as meaningless, so yes, partially precisely because I didn't see it going anywhere (I still think it was a bigger deal than anything else at the same time, but we're further in than that now). Then yes, given the dwindling number of hours it looked better to start collocating the voting somewhat (given the lack of grand inspiration elsewhere), and Meeple was the one person who I both had doubts of and could see with votes on. So yes, my vote exchange was at the very least eased by your presence, although I will note that I had expressed my doubts in full before you showed up, and probably would have switched to him regardless.

This might look bad out of context, but I assume you see it. If not, try reading how things would have gone had I kept my vote on Snow longer than I did, which felt far worse to me.



That took far too long, sorry if it's written badly. Rest to [possibly] follow in about six hours.