PokeMafia - Day 4

[Deltaflyer]

I'm guessing that Excal used hitman on me as well then. I figured my roleblock wouldn't stop that if I used it on him, so I used my Hitman on him.

Anyways, good game all round. Was fun. Sorry to Xanth for *cough* killing my team-mate but I had to at least TRY to gain some town standing.

[Kilgamayan]

Also it fucking figures that the ONE THING I WAS RIGHT ABOUT ALL FUCKING GAME was going for Delta over one of Alex/OK on Day 3.

Also also Alex you should've totally claimed Aqua and tried to bullshit your way to getting Delta lynched.

[Deltaflyer]

Ninja'd by QR two I figure we both hitman'd each other. I didn't use regular NK on Excal.

[Deltaflyer]

Also it fucking figures that the ONE THING I WAS RIGHT ABOUT ALL FUCKING GAME was going for Delta over one of Alex/OK on Day 3.

I laughed. Alot.

[Kilgamayan]

Also also also shame on Alex and Excal for thinking Nietz was Xanth's buddy. Another part of the reason I was sure it was Delta was because everyone else in the game would've killed Alex the night after he claimed cop.

Also also also also I like how town won despite two town modkills, every NK prior to the end being a townie, masses of people going long stretches of time without talking (shame on all of Ryogo, Excal, Delta, Strago and OK for this) AND Tom being Tom. Again.

Also also also also also I felt bad for Rat because absolutely no one cared when he died.

[superaielman]

Meeple as the sole survivor of pokemafia makes too much damn sense.

[Meeplelard]

Heh, somehow, I had a feeling that'd happen.

Why?  Cause the only way that either scum COULD win was to *NOT* attack me.  I spelt out the exact scenario to yield paranoia.  Really, if a scum attacked me, that'd be an AUTO LOSS to them, unless they both did, then it was a tie.  Given this paranoia, I figured both would go after each other, hoping the other would attack me.  Sure enough, that's exactly what occured!

So...JUST AS PLANNED!!!! or something!

But anyway, fun stuff.

[Taishyr]

Well, ties IIRC break via Hatbot, so the scum had 50-50 that way.

Still, this causes issues: if one shoots you, but the other shoots scum, they win period.

So killing you's still a gamble, while shooting the other's more likely. Prisoner's Gambit variant of sorts.

[Excal]

Meeple, you weren't cleared from being scum.  It's just that I preferred to let Aqua win than Delta.

As for Delta?  Nietz called the Inventor thing, which got us really paranoid on him being Aqua, since how the hell would he know otherwise.  As for Bard Doccing OK?  I'd just like to say to Alex here and now that I did, in fact, call that.  Strago had way too much sense to do that.

[Bardiche]

I was raging so hard when you guys lynched OblivionKnight.

I was like, "WHAT THE HELL WAS I PROTECTING FOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

But hey, we won. Good show.

It amuses me how I protected someone both nights but was thwarted the first night by Kilga. 8D

[Excal]

Bard, the best thing you could have done for town there was to let him die.  That way, Alex dies day 3 instead of letting us mislynch again.  Strago/Meeple had the right idea.

[Kilgamayan]

In fairness to myself (and Meeple I guess), if OK had shown up to say anything in his own defense I would have reconsidered.

[Deltaflyer]

And sorry for the incessant spamming (it stops now. Promise.) but I feel an inherant need to apologise to all whom I NK'd. I feel guilty taking people out of games.  

Funny as hell at the end though, as I went through WIFOM after WIFOM in my head before Alex Claimed. I ended up with hysteria. Yea.

Anyways, I cannot wait until my next game. I have the easter holidays from friday onwards, so BRING IT ON!

Ninja'd so many times I want to destroy the computer.

Meeps, I was praying that Excal would regular NK, and that a hitman NK would sorta 'beat' a regular NK. I was... um. wrong.

Ninja'd to the power of 6.

****

Kilga: I killed you instead of Alex simply because, well, I felt that the whole Alex situation wasn't NK-worthy. Don't ask. Put it down to Delta-ness.

Xanth: I really AM sorry for lynching you. Although, secretly, I was pissing myself laughing at the thought of me hammering a freindly scum as part of a weird Gambit. Probably woulda worked if I had targeted a scum that night too.

wrong. to the power of 8.

[Bardiche]

And I guarded OK because I figured scum'd go for him since I desked him as a real Cop. I wasn't expecting to die myself and would've fervently argued in his favour, considering it would be collosally stupid for him to reveal himself and...

Well, Team Aqua died and OK accused Alex of being Team Magma, which... made sense.

QuietRain actually mentioned something in the killing flavour about finding scrap of cloth with an A on it which implied shirts so I was like "guys what the hell".

So yeah from the start I was pretty sure Alex was scum, OK comes in and confirms he is scum, I'm like "OK! Save the town cop! Brilliant move!" and then only to find the town decides to lynch a copclaim anyway with all due haste.

This is why I fear Alex, freaking master of rhetoric.

[Strago]

I always have the right idea, Excal. Wooooooo go Town!

[Bardiche]

I can't help having a wacky logic mechanism. ;_;

[Nietz]

Twist ending, huh? Good play by Meeple, really played the Prisoner's Dilemma thing for town's victory. (Well, it was not really PD, but some other theoretic game I don't remember now).
Seeing scum NK so many townies during the game was a little aggravating, but I suspected it would backfire on them in the end.

I confess I played a lot by setup meta theories, like:
- Snow's claim felt very believable because I had a similar role, and I didn't see why he would make the One-shot claim unless it was true (I didn't know at that time that most roles were one-shot).
- Tom immediately believed Snow's claim, and I was pretty sure it was for the same reason as me. So that basically cleared him for me as well. The way Alex attacked him nonetheless caught my attention as well.
- After Xanth's flip, I was convinced Team Magma would also have an Inventor on their side for balance. And why would Town Alex investigate him instead of the guy he said was suspicious? (Also, earlier I was hoping to find scum by role description myself, so I had that possibility in mind.)
- And how could anyone believe his claim that Tom was "too suspicious to waste an investigation on"!? My biggest mistake in the game was waiting for OK to post before replying to that. And then going to sleep and find out he was quicklynched.
- On that matter: What the hell, OK... Though coming so late to the game was a town tell, after 3 town modkills the last thing we needed was a cop who couldn't bother to post. His night survival was indeed fishy, I still don't understand Bard's reasons for trying to save a spent one-shot cop.
- Incidentally I never believed Meeple was actually a Vig. At first I was sure he was a Bomb trying to lure scum into killing him. And after he claimed to have shot OK I thought he was actually a Godfather. 

[SnowFire]

Huh.  Bizarre but fitting end to the game.

Amusing that both the Xanth/Delta speculation from Day 2 and the Alex / Excal speculation from Day 1 (cough, cough) turned out to be true.  In fact, most of my confirmed townies were right too - EvilTom and Bardiche seemed to be the only people talking sense early on, and Meeple and OK seemed fine too.  (I chatted with superaielman after I was dead, and let him in on some of my thoughts, so not making the "I would have told you so!" up.)

Anyway, glad that both Excal and Sir Alex WERE scum, I feel better now.  They did successfully bait me, I'll grant- make an attack, let me defend, misrepresent the defense, force me to explain more, accuse that of being too WIFOMy, force me to explain more, and then accuse me of Wall of Texting.  Town seriously needs to not fall for that, myself included for letting it happen.  I also wish I'd been awake on the last night of Day 1 - the arguments on top of page 11 ( http://www.rpgdl.com/forums/index.php?topic=3132.msg55285#msg55285 ) were precisely the kind of misrepresentations that scum / cops tend to make when pressing a case, and I wish I'd been around to rage futilely at the heavens for that.  Given more time, I probably could have articulated why I found SirAlex and Excal suspicious better, but I'd already been accused of too much text, and the short version in my mood at the time would have sounded too much like OMGUS.

Also.  For me personally, I will say that the worst part of the game was the nonsense over Day 1 being shortened and then lengthened again.  (EDIT: See below, apparently I was just insane on this and the day wasn't shortened from 72->36 hours, but it's what I thought at the time!)  There are good arguments either way, but that kind of heated debate over mafia philosophy in the middle of a game wasn't fun and was highly avoidable.  Kicked up way too much rancor and kept a bunch of people up late/early for a deadline that didn't happen.  Also, though it's hard to do alternate history, it also partially led to my lynch - the major rallying cry SirAlex and Excal used was the "perpetuating the false dichotomy between Sylon and Xanth" and "didn't vote for the person he found scummiest" when there was like 3 hours left before a *possible* deadline that ended up not happening.  I never would have cast the Xanth vote otherwise.  So....  major meh to that.

Obviously, it was weird circumstances for me, but it looked like a fun game the rest of the way, at least.  I will tip my hat to effective scum play, SirAlex deserves major credit for staying alive entirely too long and practically running town.

[SnowFire]

Also, random thought, though probably spoiled now.  When reading the last day...  I did have a moment of doubt where I considered that the scum team might have been SirAlex / Meeplelard (until I saw Excal's post about "let's try and lynch the other Magma member!" which basically said "Go Magma!").  It wouldn't have worked in this game, with no Godfather, but I didn't know that at first.  Think of it this way:

* Godfather Meeple claims one-shot vigilante out of nowhere.  Scumbuddy Alex groans about why you revealed it now.  Seems like bad townie play.
* If rival team / disbelieving vig shoots Godfather, ting!
* If nothing suspicious happened during the night, say you didn't shoot, or that you hit bulletproof, or that you hit the same target as the scum did.
* If something happened that does fit in well...  use it toss suspicion!  "Yeah, I shot at the cop who I think is a liar, but look, a bodyguard died!  He must have taken the shot!"
* Plus you're now sorta-certified as having a role!  "I'm a vig, see this explanation from before!" 
* And even better, because you declared your number of shots too soon, you have an excuse for why the mafia hasn't night-killed you.  "They must be looking for power roles, they know I'm out of shots."

Due to the lack of godfathers, it obviously wouldn't have worked here, but a thought for the future.

Amusingly enough, my orders for Night 1 (which never mattered) would have been to track Ryogo, because I couldn't get a bead on him at all and figured that roles were best for investigating the quiet ones.  Also, like many of the others, it was "one shot that actually worked," so it could theoretically have multiple uses, maybe.  A neat touch to add uncertainty.

[Sylon]

I would like to apologise for the inconvenience I have caused by dropping out of this game. I do hope I didn't upset anyone too badly by doing so.

[QuietRain]

Also.  For me personally, I will say that the worst part of the game was the nonsense over Day 1 being shortened and then lengthened again. 

SnowFire.  You said this in game, too.  In the interest thread and in the first post, it was always stated to be 36 hours.  Where did I put 72?  My error, seriously, but I can't find it.

[SnowFire]

I am 99% sure that the original post said 72 hours.  It is, of course, possible that I read the wrong post or for a different mafia game, and if so, my apologies....  but that's what I recall.

[QuietRain]

The intent was always to be a short Day 1 and I can't find any mention of 72 hours.  Perhaps it was just from a different Mafia game?

[SnowFire]

So you'd always intended 36?  I suppose you would know, and that doesn't seem likely to have been a typo.  Heh.  Well, I did do some archive diving through old Mafia games recently, and I'll concede it's possible that some game there was 72 hours Day 1 / 48 hours other days.  And I remembered that post.  That's the only explanation I can think of.

The strange thing is that as you know I was one of the last ones to join with Sylon, and I re-read your original post then, and I still "remember" it as saying 72 hours very distinctly.  I'd assumed you'd had a last-second change of heart and edited it away, but guess that didn't happen.  Okay, if I was the crazy one, that's fine, and then you do have my deepest apologies for the misunderstanding.  Stranger things have happened...

(Edit: And to be clear, this might explain my seemingly strange conviction for an extension?  I thought we were just extending back to the originally planned timeframe, which is why I was so indignant about it.)

[Bardiche]

I still don't understand Bard's reasons for trying to save a spent one-shot cop.

At the time, I had a one-shot ability, Snowfire and there were three other one-shots revealed on flip. I had a reasonable suspicion that there would be more one-shot roles, so it wasn't so much as saving the one-shot cop as saving who I thought was genuinely town and needed to be preserved so we wouldn't needlessly lose someone.

I was also hoping Meeple would vig Alex instead of OK, since I kind of always think town follows leads from cops but yeah. The flip determined for me who to protect: if Xanth flipped Magma I'd have protected Alex, if he flipped Aqua I'd protect OblivionKnight.

It just made sense to me how Alex would have his interests served if he got an Aqua-ite lynched, which is also why I willingly dropped all pursuit of Alex and opted for Xanth instead.

The next day my strategy would've been to reveal I had been roleblocked night 1, telling town there is a roleblocker around. Then declare my role and activity the night before, outline why I did it, point out why I found Alex scummy again and add OK's statement of Coptitude to it and hope town'd follow that way!

Clearly I made a gross mistake in that and it might've been resolved faster had I just let OK die but man, I just didn't expect to die that night since I had been making pretty bad mistakes and people were thinking I was maybe scummy.