Author Topic: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic  (Read 121666 times)

Kilgamayan

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #250 on: January 19, 2008, 05:06:24 AM »
"So why should we believe whatever you decide, little girl?" Flandre said. "Since it wasn't the bunny's fault, for all we know, you're responsible!"

"I keep telling you, little girl, I didn't do a thing!" suika spat.

Flandre grinned and drew her Laevatin. "Maybe I should beat the truth of you!"

"I'd like to see you try! You're about 1000 years too late to-GYAK!"

Before a fight could break out, a humongous boulder came flying out of nowhere and smashed into the side of Suika's head. She skidded about 15 meters along the ground before finally coming to a stop, the boulder crashing down next to her.

Reimu gasped as a few others ran over to check on her. "That's Throwing of the Rock Door! I'd know that spellcard anywhere!"

Youmu frowned. "How can you tell?"

"I'm a shrine maiden. I know these things."

Keine had been one of those to run over to Suika, and called back to the rest of the group, "She's out cold. That must've been a SHOT to take her down in a single blow. We're lucky it didn't hit any of us."

Aya had to shout to be heard over the new wave of worried discussion. "All the more reason that we end this now! Let's do it quickly before one of us actually dies!"

"Ara, but I'm already dead..."

"Then maybe they'll come after you with a vacuum clear or something, Yuyuko. Does it really matter?"

---

It is now Day 2, and EvilTom, playing Suika Ibuki (Doublevoter, TOWN-ALIGNED) has been killed!

There are 19 of you left, so 10 votes is a lynch. You have until midnight EST on Saturday/Sunday, which is 48 hours away, to make a decision.


[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Yakumo

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #251 on: January 19, 2008, 05:09:54 AM »
...I am so going to beat some sense into that guy if I ever meet him in real life. >_>

Ranmilia

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #252 on: January 19, 2008, 05:15:40 AM »
....

.............

I don't know anything anymore.  Hold me, Chen, I need huggles time.

##Love: Chen

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STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN
STOP LYING AS TOWN


OblivionKnight

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #253 on: January 19, 2008, 05:16:24 AM »
...

I think I'll go to bed and work at this tomorrow.
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
[19:27] <+Terra_Condor> Han Kicks First?
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Vader intercepts.
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

OblivionKnight

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #254 on: January 19, 2008, 05:17:07 AM »
And before then:

##Love: Everyone

We all need hugs.
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
[19:27] <+Terra_Condor> Han Kicks First?
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[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

Nitori

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #255 on: January 19, 2008, 05:21:10 AM »
...What. Just what. *resists urge to spin Tom's head in a bit tighter~*. And to think it would have gotten even more trainwreckish had he somehow lived through the night. Ah well, guess it's time to go look at some of the day 1 trains/lurker masses...

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Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #256 on: January 19, 2008, 05:21:43 AM »
...

I think I need a drink.
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Shale

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #257 on: January 19, 2008, 05:25:11 AM »
"Sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology."
-Ponder Stibbons

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AndrewRogue

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #258 on: January 19, 2008, 05:25:23 AM »
I do want to ask clarification on this one though. Are we getting full flips here, or just partial flips? I'm asking because I can say that it is quite possible we don't full revelation, meaning Tom could well be cop still. If not, yeah, he needs to be smacked for lying.

Idly, regardless of the actual flip, I think f we have a doctor or bodyguard, they ought be smacked too.

Either way, I'm getting right on this boat and FOSing every single person who stayed on Tom after the Cop claim. Especially Quietrain and Patchcloud who are all gung-ho about potentially lynching our cop on day one. You know, a role that can be proven or even counterclaimed and is of exceptional benefit to town. So, I want to hear you all explain yourselves.

Kilgamayan

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #259 on: January 19, 2008, 05:27:55 AM »
I do want to ask clarification on this one though. Are we getting full flips here, or just partial flips? I'm asking because I can say that it is quite possible we don't full revelation, meaning Tom could well be cop still. If not, yeah, he needs to be smacked for lying.

You're getting role name and alignment. That's pretty much it. (Have we had a full role flip game yet? I don't remember one. If we have, I guess I could start doing it...)

On a related note, I will say that my Illusionist is an original creation and is not the same Illusionist as the one in the MafiaWiki.


[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Yakumo

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #260 on: January 19, 2008, 05:32:06 AM »
Anyway, real post not colored(much) by my general dislike of Tom recently.

I do agree with Alex and Andrew to an extent on not killing a cop claim day one.  That person is going to be under a lot of scrutiny from that point forward, and obviously isn't going to be trusted, but that's too valuable a resource to be tossing out offhandedly.  Yes, I say this with my vote sitting on Tom at the end of the day, and I even posted in RandoMafia.  Unfortunately, I only had enough time to read and comment on one game this morning before work, and I chose the one that my life has been, and still is, in significantly more danger in. >_>

Wow, miasma certainly knows how to rant.  It's like Meeple, only coherent!  Mostly.  Just one thing, though... could you please break up the wall of text a little?  Paragraphs are our friends.

I don't really know what else to look at yet.  People who didn't clear off Tom aren't necessarily any worse than people that did jump off Tom as soon as someone called them on it.  Some of them probably did actually start thinking and go 'wow, he's got a point', but it could be scum thinking 'oh s---, if I'm still on this train and he turns out to be a cop after all I'm done for!'.  So, I'm just going to go look at everything and hope my head doesn't explode.

Sierra

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #261 on: January 19, 2008, 05:36:28 AM »
What.

Why claim cop if you're town and not a cop? Well...I suppose it's possible he was trying to draw the scum's fire from a real cop? But we don't even know we have one (granted, it's likely, but...eh). It would make more sense for someone who'd already drawn fire to sacrifice himself if he was vanilla, though. And if he clearly had something to gain (as in, keeping a vital town role alive--but there's no way in hell he could know of any at this point). So yeah, boggle.

Shale

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #262 on: January 19, 2008, 05:37:18 AM »
You're getting role name and alignment. That's pretty much it. (Have we had a full role flip game yet? I don't remember one. If we have, I guess I could start doing it...)

Super gave the full flip, up to and including cop sanity. Other than that, role name is the most anybody's given, IIRC.
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Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #263 on: January 19, 2008, 05:42:36 AM »
Well, I can... well kind of see his tactic here, not that I really agree with it or anything.

Basically, if you are a townie who is about to be lynched and you claim cop, you give the town more chances to find scum rather than lynching you. You also draw a NK that could be wasted on legitimate power roles if the scum choose to play into your hands (which they did!). Since you would be dead without claiming anyway, the fact that you are NKed means you are still dead, but you gave the town another chance to hunt scum.

Or something. >_> It worked pretty much ideally, but it could have been much worse!
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Ranmilia

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #264 on: January 19, 2008, 05:51:12 AM »
... oh fine, and here Kilga strips away our last shred of dignity by revealing that we did not in fact lynch an unhelpful or pro-scum town role.  Argh.

Argh sdkghskldghsdklhgklsdhgklsdklghsdklghklsdhgklpWEUTpEUITPASOPesopgP seUOPjuRP opsetju se gpseioIOPeurpio uOPuwropUpqwrUPaRPQ

Anyhow!  What can we tell.

There were scum on both trains, this is virtually certain since, yknow, nearly everyone in the game was on one train or the other.

Patchumia does stand out to me.  I'm not horribly offended by her low volume, nor her content, by themselves.  Her lack of votes to accompany those posts, however, is a real kicker.  Then at day's end, we get a wall of text, which... honestly, I doubt a lot of the game is even going to bother reading.  I did, though.  It seems all in favor of voting for Tom, which is in agreement with her voteless posts earlier, but then at the end the vote - the HAMMER! - comes for....  Strago?!  I don't get it.

##Vote: Patsuriii Cloud

Please explain why you hammered Strago when your arguments seemed to be in favor of lynching Tom?

Otter

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #265 on: January 19, 2008, 05:54:51 AM »
This is troublesome.  I must have neglected to establish ground rules for shrine visitors ahead of time.  I'll fix that.

RULES!
1) Tell the truth!

Okay, we're set!!


As much as I want to join the prevailing theme of "blrrrgh, that was terrible..." I think we all know how bad that was already.  And we don't have any votes yet, and we only have 48 hours, so I'm going to cut the self-pitying malaise short and kick things off.  First pressure vote will be...

##VOTE: patchucloud

I think I see where Shale was coming from here.  I love me some miasma for the SZS Zoku hookups, but I was a little bothered by how she seemed to be making little synopsizing posts from the sidelines without getting herself involved.  Let's see some change from that trend!


Also, quick note: had I been here from Tom's claim on yesterday, I would have promptly withdrawn my vote from Tom and probably, unfortunately, placed it on Strago.  I think Alex is right, there's no good reason to lynch him there.  If he's really a cop, he's likely dead anyway and lynching him is just handing scum a free kill.  If he's a lying scum, his failure to get NK'd combined with an immediate demand for sensible investigations and reports are going to have him on the ropes real quick.

Otter

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #266 on: January 19, 2008, 05:58:20 AM »
Ah, ninja'd by the fox.  Yukari trains her pets well.

Carthrat

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #267 on: January 19, 2008, 05:59:33 AM »
But that was so *stupid*! Yak, uh, I'll jab him in the ribs for you? What Cor said about Tom playing for Team Tom is, uh, suddenly really, really apt.

<->

Andrew! Cop can't be proven. Scum already know who is scum and who isn't. They can fake it. I called him on being wussy, and then he proceded to get wussier, just with a claim thrown in. As I've said, there was nothing compelling there. Hence why I didn't want to change my vote. I admit having cast it scant posts ago had something to do with it.

The Strago train is more interesting, anyway. I can see reasons to vote or not to vote for Thomas. I can't see such reasons to vote for Strago, especially towards the end when there were *several* votes without real quantifiers. Yes, it was close to deadline. I don't think this excuses you of the need to post a reason for voting! I'm mainly looking at Cloud, Cid, and Chisa (CCC!). It seems that a lot of people were taking shots at Strago just because he wasn't Thomas, which.. I.. feel is pretty weak.

Remember that the original reasons votes came after him were for lurking. I don't feel he could be accused as guilty of that after his salvo against Thomas. Nor do I feel that it's terribly valid to hit at him for voting for Thomas, when, in his position, lynching 'the other guy' is a fair call for him to make.

Personally, I feel Chisa has *slightly* less excuse than Cloud for the vote, so that's where I'm tossing out my ##Vote: Chisa, why'd you vote for him? I think Strago got lynched mainly 'cos he was there, and that's just really... not good as far as reasons go. Noted that there a couple votes for Cloud and I second pretty much everything they represent, but Chisa was earlier in the day and there was still value in going after someone else at that point.
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QuietRain

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #268 on: January 19, 2008, 06:05:03 AM »
*breaks the fourth wall for a moment and looks out into cyber space at Tom*

Anyone who plays a cop and is almost lynched Day 1 will give praise unto you (in the form of very vitriolic curse words) when their pleas of 'Don't kill me, I'm a cop' are ignored because that's twice now people have claimed that and NOT BEEN COPS.  Don't lie when you're a townie.  It makes it harder for anyone to believe that when it IS declared.  Scum doing it makes sense to lessen the impact and believability of the claim.  Town.  Should.  Not.  Lie.

If you had claimed your ability to doublevote instead of the lie, more people would have believed you since it was something you could quickly prove.  Heck, even *I* would have backed off because I don't think I've ever seen or heard of a scum having this ability.

When the final flip is done and the game is over, I would (honest here, that's not sarcasm) like to hear you post your reasoning on this move because right now...it just wobbles my mind.

(Now this assumes that was a full flip and Kilga didn't do some weird Doublevoting Cop thing...o.O)

-------------------------------------------------

OK, now onto stuff.  I am not going back over my reasons for not taking my vote off Tom.  I refer you to Reply 140 where I laid out my original case and to Replies 224, 229, 232 & 234.  You can pull up my profile and find them pretty easily that way.  From his actions, I found him the scummiest.

ONCE AGAIN, Tom has shot himself and town in the foot by bad play.  There is a lot for me to sift through and after the day I had at work today (which sucked hard enough to draw marrow from bone), I don't have the soul or patience to do it tonight.  Tomorrow when I get up, though, you can expect a post from me with more in depth analysis of what I'm thinking.

G'night to all...and yeah.  Morale killing at it's finest there.
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mia~

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #269 on: January 19, 2008, 06:08:49 AM »
Yakumo + Others, sorry for my... really random wall of text. I kind of don't care about line breaks when I'm frustrated. Editing is against the games rules though. I guess I could just repost it maybe? Or is there some global mod or something who isn't playing and could do it?

Andrew, in my eyes, I explained myself before his death and card flip at the end of the last game day. I wrote out and spilled everything that went through my head in regards to Tom. If you're asking me to... erm, explain my explanations... Then... uhm? >_>; I can even think of a good reason why someone else might want to keep a vote on him. In fact, I even spelled this reason out in my wall of text.

Re: MCHAMMER on Strago, when I started writing ye olde grande wall of text, Strago was not at -1 to hammer. It was like, Tom 7 Strago 8 ~ ish? Really, I don't remember, but I wasn't aware I was hammering him. That's why I tacked on the "multiplepostsinfrontofmineidontcare" statement, to indicate that I hadn't read new posts. That aside, why was I voting for him? Because even if I was in favor of lynching Tom, let's be realistic. What's the point if your vote is going to sit there and do nothing at the end of the day? I was voting alongside the majority just to help lynch someone and get the day over. Regardless of what I think/thought about Tom, the case against him for most people had pretty much been killed by the time I got home.

I'm kind of... not really awake falling asleep was staying up to see what happened here and now I'd like to go to bed.

Smodge13

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #270 on: January 19, 2008, 06:22:05 AM »
My post time is limited today just a warning, basically i'll give a big post later in about 3-5 hours, and then probably not again until about this time tomorow.

Ranmilia

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #271 on: January 19, 2008, 06:25:40 AM »
I can see reasons to vote or not to vote for Thomas. I can't see such reasons to vote for Strago, especially towards the end when there were *several* votes without real quantifiers. ..........
Nor do I feel that it's terribly valid to hit at him for voting for Thomas, when, in his position, lynching 'the other guy' is a fair call for him to make.

For my part, I don't agree with this.  Just as Tom should be playing for Team Town and not Team Tom, it can be said that Strago should be doing the same.  If the only way to avoid lynching the guy claiming cop is to let yourself be lynched, and you have a role that's less valuable than cop, well... don't be voting for yourself, obviously, but don't be pressing hard to lynch the potential cop, even if you're on the block with him. 

Cop really is that important and as a townie Strago (along with everyone else) shouldn't be willing to sacrifice them so lightly.  This is the essence of what it means to play for Team Town, at least in my eyes.  The sheer number of people apparently disagreeing, even now (though admittedly Tom's lie being exposed doesn't help) (and Strago winding up town) seems to say that this won't be a useful scumtell in this game, which irks me, all I can do is caution that being willing to sacrifice a potential cop on day one is terrible play.  Town acting irrationally makes hunting scum very hard, especially for me since I'm one of those people who lacks intuition.

Yes, this can allow scum to claim cop early and 'get away' with it... in the short term.  In the long term?  A scum claiming cop will almost always be found out in the long run, and often wind up doing the town more good than harm by revealing some truthful investigations.  It's not worth the risk of losing a real cop.

Anyhow!

Patchu's response is extremely unsatisfying, wavering between "I didn't bother to look if I was hammering" and "I was just voting someone to get the day over with, my vote wouldn't cou-

Wwaaaaaiiiit

"It was like, Tom 7 Strago 8 ~ ish? Really, I don't remember, but I wasn't aware I was hammering him."
...
"Because even if I was in favor of lynching Tom, let's be realistic. What's the point if your vote is going to sit there and do nothing at the end of the day? I was voting alongside the majority just to help lynch someone and get the day over."

Say WHAT?  First of all, both of these are terrible play, be careful with your votes when it's close to hammer, and your vote DOES count when it's close, second of all, were you aware of the count or were you not?  That... looks like a slip if ever I saw one.

Vote Patchucloud even though I already did.  What.  What.  What.

Nitori

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #272 on: January 19, 2008, 06:37:01 AM »
Mmmhm...not quite sure who to go after, but I have a few ideas...

Tonfa: A lot of his posts seem to be reiterations (keeping vote on Tom), as far as I can tell. Stayed very, very neutral throughout day 1, but wasn't on any other trains.

QR: Didn't buy Strago as scum, which was reasonable; there was an argument for it, but it wasn't that strong. It still feels a bit weird you didn't go for the cop claim, but eh. I don't see that big a case here yet.

Chisa: Was on every big train (Strago/Andrew/Tom), and had a fairly lackluster reason to vote for Strago; if you made a mistake the first time, it's likely someone else might make the same one. Plus, it doesn't seem like a big enough gaffe to be scumworthy. (although he was the only possible choice to prevent Tom lynchage, Chisa didn't seem to be going the way of preventing it anyway.)

EDIT: And there goes Alex hitting Patchu pretty hard. I didn't really look at Patchu much, but that...was not incredibly smart. I didn't think much of Patchu before, though, so I'll keep my original vote here.

##VOTE: Chisa
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Kilgamayan

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #273 on: January 19, 2008, 06:47:22 AM »
Bed time for me. I'll give you guys a vote count when I wake up (in about 7 hours), but I think doing one now less than two hours into the day is somewhat foolish.


[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Touhou Mafia - Main Topic
« Reply #274 on: January 19, 2008, 06:48:52 AM »
QR: I don't understand how this is really morale-breaking. Scum killing a liar and someone who isn't a cop seems like basically the best scenario possible, morale wise. We didn't lose a major power role and the person who would have probably been lynched tomorrow got NKed.
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