Author Topic: Politics '11: Keeping up with the Xornses  (Read 62697 times)

Sierra

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #300 on: September 06, 2010, 05:10:55 PM »
Probably about the same time he noticed that publicly acting like an insane wingnut gets you mad bank and publicity.

Grefter

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #301 on: September 06, 2010, 09:34:25 PM »
Alternately, when he observed that a portion of the world that still has capital punishment has similar laws.  People still smuggle drugs in south east Asia where it can get you executed.
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metroid composite

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #302 on: September 15, 2010, 01:51:33 PM »
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/montreal/story/2010/09/14/france-burka-ban.html
France Senate votes almost unanimously for the Burka ban.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11027288
France cracks down on Gypsies.

wtf France.

SnowFire

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #303 on: September 16, 2010, 01:19:59 AM »
Agree with the wtf on the Burqa ban.  The Gypsies issue is more complex - as noted, technically they're not kicking out gypsies, they're kicking out illegal immigrants who are in known problem spots.  That happen to be hubs of gypsy illegal immigration.  Yeah, yeah, I know.

That said, it's a really really tough issue with no easy solution.
http://www.economist.com/node/16943841?story_id=16943841
is an article that covers the problems that the Gypsies have in more depth than I can, but aside from the travelling lifestyle not really translating to the 21st century well at all, the Gypsies face  horrendous discrimination in their home countries.  What's worse is that their culture doesn't value education highly and the Eastern European countries keep it that way - here's the most horrifying quote from that article:
Quote
One of the biggest problems is schooling: Roma children are routinely placed in institutions for the mentally handicapped. A new survey by Amnesty International says that in Slovakia, Roma make up less than 10% of the school-age population but 60% of pupils in special schools. Unsurprisingly, many leave school early, without the skills they need to compete in the job market. Instead they drift into collecting scrap metal, begging or petty crime.

Ideally the state would step in and hit the education issue the hardest as a way to work on Gypsy integration.  However, I can't exactly blame France for not wanting to be the state that dives into a massive jobs / education program for the Gypsies - they're just getting hit by the spillover from what by all rights should be a problem Bulgaria / Romania / et. al need to address.  So yeah, no easy answers on that one.

Anyway.  Primary day was yesterday!  The big news of course was the Mike Castle lost in Delaware, which is a shame, since Castle was of that dying breed of the 50's and 60s Northeast Republicans.  There's that famous YouTube clip of him actually telling a questioner in a crowd that no, Obama is an American born in Hawaii, really.  There's also the fact that there's nothing in O'Donnell's background that suggests she'd be any good at that whole governing thing.  This'll make the general election interesting...  Castle was respected (??) among the left and the independents and almost surely would have won Biden's old Senate seat, but now the pundits are betting on a Democratic hold.  We'll see; depends on if the Republicans who voted Castle turn out for O'Donnell.  (Also, as far as media narratives, it always amazes me how people treat a 53%-47% election as if "the voters have chosen X" and a 53-47 election the other way as the reverse.  Especially in primaries, that's not anywhere near all the electorate, and that still means that a huge number of people supported the other person...)

The more depressing news was that Adrian Fenty, the youngish and independentish mayor of DC, was defeated by the machine candidate.  According to the Washington Post, it sounds like he just didn't really run a campaign until too late assuming that everything was fine.  Sigh.  Not to insult DC, but you know how some politicians in third world countries are beloved outside the country by international types but promptly lose their reelection due to not being popular enough at home?  Reminds me of that here...  Fenty was one of those guys whom everyone outside of DC thought was great and helped the city, but it seems results weren't enough.  I really don't trust DC voters taste in mayors, as remember that they gave us Marion Berry's *second* term after he'd already been convicted.

Shale

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #304 on: September 16, 2010, 02:22:35 AM »
"Almost surely" nothing - As somebody who's covered politics in delaware for five years now I can tell you without a doubt in my mind that the only Democrats who'd stand a chance against Castle are Joe Biden and the state's other senator, Tom Carper. There's a very strong gool-ol'-boy system here and Castle was one of the bigshots in it. That he lost a primary is jawdropping, and if anything what that says about the mindset of the Republicans this year is being undersold.

That said, O'Donnell has a very good chance of getting annihilated in the general election. This state has a lot of Dems who liked Castle but won't vote for just any Republican, and she's not going to win them over. I doubt she'll even try very hard. She's very much an appeal-to-the-base person, and also something of a nutcase. Neither will help.
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superaielman

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #305 on: September 16, 2010, 03:10:49 AM »
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/09/karl-rove-dukes-it-out-with-hannity-there-are-a-lot-of-nutty-things-odonnells-been-saying.php

The fact that someone with as much pull as Karl Rove came out and more or less called her unfit for office says more than enough about O'Donnell.
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SnowFire

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #306 on: September 16, 2010, 03:53:48 AM »
And oh yes.  For completeness's sake, Lazio - who made various scumbag comments on the "Ground Zero Mosque" - lost the primary to Paladino, who is crazy, but is mad as hell and isn't going to take it anymore and is going to go to Albany with an axe.  However it doesn't matter as neither had a chance of victory anyway, short of Cuomo converting to Wahabbist Islam and promising to implement Sharia or something.

On that note!
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/091510dntexeducation.28d07a4.html
Quote
The board will consider a resolution next week that would warn publishers not to push a pro-Islamic, anti-Christian viewpoint in world history textbooks.

The Texas school board is at it again, tackling the problem of all those pro-Islamic textbooks being pushed on innocent Texan children.

Dhyerwolf

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #307 on: September 16, 2010, 04:24:03 AM »
The more depressing news was that Adrian Fenty, the youngish and independentish mayor of DC, was defeated by the machine candidate.  According to the Washington Post, it sounds like he just didn't really run a campaign until too late assuming that everything was fine.  Sigh.  Not to insult DC, but you know how some politicians in third world countries are beloved outside the country by international types but promptly lose their reelection due to not being popular enough at home?  Reminds me of that here...  Fenty was one of those guys whom everyone outside of DC thought was great and helped the city, but it seems results weren't enough.  I really don't trust DC voters taste in mayors, as remember that they gave us Marion Berry's *second* term after he'd already been convicted.

This strategy generally doesn't end well for people running for political office, and yet, time and time, they use this strategy. Of course, we may see the backfiring in CA governor's race this time, because I wouldn't be surprised if everyone is so sick of Meg Whitman being everywhere for 6 months straight that they run away from her!
...into the nightfall.

Pyro

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #308 on: September 16, 2010, 05:47:40 PM »
Quote
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/09/karl-rove-dukes-it-out-with-hannity-there-are-a-lot-of-nutty-things-odonnells-been-saying.php

The fact that someone with as much pull as Karl Rove came out and more or less called her unfit for office says more than enough about O'Donnell.

I wonder how much of that is Karl Rove calling it like it is and how much is Karl Rove being butthurt that his party machine got owned by a lower-middle class crazy.

Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #309 on: September 21, 2010, 10:08:35 PM »
When humanity stands strong and people reach out for each other...
There’s no need for gods.

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #310 on: September 25, 2010, 04:38:58 PM »
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/09/colbert-testifies-on-ag-jobs-bill-like-most-members-of-congress-i-havent-read-it-videos.php?ref=fpa

Stephen Colbert status: Still Owns

But maybe I just have a soft spot for people who troll Steve King.

Also!

http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/09/officials_sheriff_joes_office_charged_luxury_trips_misused_up_to_possible_80_million.php?ref=fpb

In case you've been living under a rock Joe Apario was the Arizona Sheriff that started that awful illegal immigration bill thing. 1700 dollars for a portable generator for lights on a tank. Out of the jail fund.

America's Toughest Sheriff
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Grefter

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #311 on: September 25, 2010, 11:04:45 PM »
But he isn't a Democrat, I thought it was the Democrats that are wasting your tax dollars on frivolous things.  Are you sure he wasn't giving blow jobs to cowboys?
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superaielman

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #312 on: September 27, 2010, 04:48:08 PM »
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-11416055 China vs Japan slapfight is in full swing.
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Cotigo

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #313 on: September 27, 2010, 05:41:01 PM »
Yes let's get into a pissing contest with the country that's still very upset about that little period at the beginning of the 20th century.  Good surgery, Japan! Won't go wrong at all.

superaielman

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #314 on: October 02, 2010, 03:09:48 AM »
http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/01/new.jersey.suicide.legal/index.html?hpt=T1

I hope the two responsible for setting up that camera get the longest possible sentence. That is just horrible to do to someone.
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<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...

Dunefar

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #315 on: October 02, 2010, 06:53:00 AM »
I predict they'll get a token amount of jail time and a lot of community service/probation. To be honest I'm not sure what they deserve; this is a horrible crime but one that's difficult to judge. Yeah, it was a stupid, malicious teenage thing. Is it worth going to jail for five years over? Hell if I know.

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Grefter

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #316 on: October 02, 2010, 10:18:57 AM »
The idea that hey getting kicked out of university, a permanent criminal record and 5 years prison may not be enough punishment like they talk about in that article is fucking insane though.
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Hunter Sopko

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #317 on: October 02, 2010, 11:58:53 AM »
I mostly agree except on one point. A lot of comments and even the article suggests that the video would not have been posted online if he were straight and engaging in heterosexual intercourse. Uh... no? Granted, he was targeted for that reason, but honestly if they had caught him banging a chick it would still have gone up. Have those people even been on the internet?

I honestly don't know. It's a crime that needs punishment, but I agree with Grefter that the tone involved seems a little overstated.

Pyro

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #318 on: October 02, 2010, 02:00:26 PM »
http://abcnews.go.com/WN/us-apologizes-std-study-infected-guatemalans-syphilis-1940s/story?id=11779633

There goes Obama going everywhere APOLOGIZING again geez that's not what a pres...

Wait... we did WHAT?

Oh shit. That's actually pretty horrible.

metroid composite

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #319 on: October 02, 2010, 05:47:27 PM »
I mostly agree except on one point. A lot of comments and even the article suggests that the video would not have been posted online if he were straight and engaging in heterosexual intercourse. Uh... no? Granted, he was targeted for that reason, but honestly if they had caught him banging a chick it would still have gone up. Have those people even been on the internet?

I honestly don't know. It's a crime that needs punishment, but I agree with Grefter that the tone involved seems a little overstated.

It wouldn't be the same crime with hetero sex...unless the person was prominent in the gay community, but secretly bi.  It's the closet that makes the difference here.

NotMiki

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #320 on: October 02, 2010, 09:35:11 PM »
This kind of thing is very fact-specific.  Gay or straight isn't the important question.  The important question is, what did the roommate think this was going to do to the guy?  If the answer is not much, then he deserves a light punishment.  If the answer is that he anticipated that the roommate would be very hurt by it, then he deserves a heavy one.  Now, the fact that the guy was gay definitely plays into how his roommate should have thought the guy would react, but it's not dispositive.

We want this analysis:

The roommate deserves heavy punishment
because the invasion of privacy he committed was particularly egregious
because he knew the guy  would be devastated
because the guy was sensitive about his homosexuality

NOT this analysis:

The roommate deserves heavy punishment
because the invasion of privacy he committed was particularly egregious
because the guy was sensitive about his homosexuality

Let's keep this in perspective.  The roommate didn't throw him off the bridge, and the roommate should not be treated as if he did.  We want to punish the roommate for his conduct, not for someone else's sensitivity.  We shouldn't let the punishment grow out of proportion to the culpability of the act, no matter how terrible the consequences.

(for the record I do think it should be a crime to take pictures of someone in their own home without their knowledge and then show those pictures to the public, though not a particularly serious one.)

EDIT: Here's the crime the two people are being charged with, criminal invasion of privacy, along with a good take on the situation.
« Last Edit: October 03, 2010, 04:02:57 AM by NotMiki »
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Dunefar

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #321 on: October 03, 2010, 07:58:20 AM »
Notmiki, what sentence would you pass if you were the judge there?
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NotMiki

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #322 on: October 03, 2010, 05:33:41 PM »
Quote
Notmiki, what sentence would you pass if you were the judge there?

If I were a judge, I'd be bound by the law of NJ.  I would have the choice of sentencing with a fine or a term of imprisonment.  Because the crime was so harmful to the victim, I'd be inclined to impose imprisonment.  How long depends on the extent to which the people involved thought that their actions would harm the victim.  If they were acting with real malice, I'd impose the maximum penalty: 5 years with a 2.5 mandatory minimum.  I think they probably weren't, but that doesn't outweigh the harm they caused, and they definitely had to have known that this would harm their victim to some degree, so I'd probably impose a 3 year sentence with no mandatory minimum.  As an aside, I think this is about right for punishment even if I weren't bound by the law of NJ.

Here are the relevant bits of NJ law:

2C:14-9.  Invasion of privacy, degree of crime; defenses, privileges
2C:14-9(c) An actor commits a crime of the third degree if, knowing that he is not licensed or privileged to do so, he discloses any photograph, film, videotape, recording or any other reproduction of the image of another person whose intimate parts are exposed or who is engaged in an act of sexual penetration or sexual contact, unless that person has consented to such disclosure. For purposes of this subsection, “disclose” means sell, manufacture, give, provide, lend, trade, mail, deliver, transfer, publish, distribute, circulate, disseminate, present, exhibit, advertise or offer. Notwithstanding the provisions of subsection b. of N.J.S.2C:43-3, a fine not to exceed $30,000 may be imposed for a violation of this subsection.

2C:43-6  Sentence of imprisonment for crime; ordinary terms; mandatory terms.
(a) Except as otherwise provided, a person who has been convicted of a crime may be sentenced to imprisonment, as follows:
(3)In the case of a crime of the third degree, for a specific term of years which shall be fixed by the court and shall be between three years and five years;
(b)As part of a sentence for any crime, where the court is clearly convinced that the aggravating factors substantially outweigh the mitigating factors, as set forth in subsections a. and b. of 2C:44-1, ...the court may fix a minimum term not to exceed one-half of the term set pursuant to subsection a., or one-half of the term set pursuant to a maximum period of incarceration for a crime set forth in any statute other than this code, during which the defendant shall not be eligible for parole....

2C:44-1  Criteria for withholding or imposing sentence of imprisonment.
(a) In determining the appropriate sentence to be imposed on a person who has been convicted of an offense, the court shall consider the following aggravating circumstances:
(1) The nature and circumstances of the offense, and the role of the actor therein, including whether or not it was committed in an especially heinous, cruel, or depraved manner;
(2) The gravity and seriousness of harm inflicted on the victim, including whether or not the defendant knew or reasonably should have known that the victim of the offense was particularly vulnerable or incapable of resistance due to advanced age, ill-health, or extreme youth, or was for any other reason substantially incapable of exercising normal physical or mental power of resistance;
(b) In determining the appropriate sentence to be imposed on a person who has been convicted of an offense, the court may properly consider the following mitigating circumstances:
(2) The defendant did not contemplate that his conduct would cause or threaten serious harm;

EDIT: god, I'm such a law dork.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2010, 06:58:42 AM by NotMiki »
Rocky: you do know what an A-bomb is, right?
Bullwinkle: A-bomb is what some people call our show!
Rocky: I don't think that's very funny...
Bullwinkle: Neither do they, apparently!

NotMiki

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #323 on: October 20, 2010, 07:18:03 PM »
Turns out separation of church and state is more or less written into the first amendment.  Who knew?  Answer: not Christine O'Donnell, apparently.

http://volokh.com/2010/10/20/senator-odonnell/
Rocky: you do know what an A-bomb is, right?
Bullwinkle: A-bomb is what some people call our show!
Rocky: I don't think that's very funny...
Bullwinkle: Neither do they, apparently!

superaielman

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Re: Politics '10: Keeping up with the Xornses.
« Reply #324 on: October 28, 2010, 02:47:07 PM »
http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/251121/drug-war-failure-conrad-black

NR is at it's best when it's focusing on actual issues and not being a shill for the right wing of the republican party.  This article details the unsurprising failure of the drug war and puts it in perspective.

Quote
For blacks, the chances of being arrested and charged and convicted for cannabis offenses are 300 percent greater than for whites. Sending nearly half a million cannabis offenders to prison each year inflicts a $40,000 annual charge per prisoner, not counting the processing costs of the mass-convict-production U.S. law-enforcement system.

yikes.
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<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...