Register

Author Topic: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!  (Read 355902 times)

Yoshiken

  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 2068
  • Yay!
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1775 on: April 19, 2010, 05:23:16 AM »
If it was not obvious from tournament talk, I have abandoned Hatbot Gold. :(  I need the Mewtwo, and I only have a month to get this team together, so...

Anyways, off to fight Red so I can get a Kyogre! :D

DjinnAndTonic

  • Genie and Potion with Alcoholic Undertones
  • DL
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 6939
  • "When you wish upon a bar~"
    • View Profile
    • RPGDL Wiki
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1776 on: April 19, 2010, 06:48:57 AM »
Gone all weekend, played DS on the train.

Suikoden Tierkreis: Yeah, finally popped this in. I'd been looking forward to it before it came out, being the Suikoden nut that I am. When I found out it wasn't a proper Suikoden, I stopped caring. But Dhyer's comments about it being a really enjoyable game if it wasn't a Suikoden actually inspired me to give a shot and I just tried to ignore that it was called Suikoden.

Well, the game has more Suikoden elements than I was expecting from Dhyer's descriptions, but it's still removed enough that I can ignore the connections and try to see it for it's own merits.

And so far, those merits have been good! The characters all act logically and obvious conclusions that the player can see coming from a mile away are often picked up on by the PCs shortly after they become obvious. Things like 'Hey, we're toting around a magic book that gave us visions when we touched it... Oh HEY! Let's see if the random people that we meet get visions too!" It's nice to see PCs actually trying to -use- their random McGuffins of Power wisely. Also, I'm not far yet, but Dirk's foreshadowed betrayal through the evil chick's persuasion is actually understandable. Additionally, even though we've gotten to see the villains talking alone, none of them have broken down into evil cackling about destroying the world, but they seem to actually be trying to save it in their own (somewhat flawed) way.

So, everyone acts rationally, this is a pretty good step in the right direction.

The world-building is fairly interesting so far, as I'm really curious why the main can't travel through Gateways, and what the purpose of the randomly-appearing Forest is. The introduction to the different cultures is a little rushed, but serviceable.

Gameplay is boring as hell so far, though. No party-building, no weapon-building, actual battles are really straitforward without many options to play with. Rune skillsets are swappable between PCs, so there's some potential, but I'll probably end up leaving most everyone with their initial skillsets thanks to the DL's influence... >.>;;

Oh, the Support PCs don't suck anymore... at least, not the priestess chick I've picked up so far. That's pretty cool.

Characters: Main and Marica are pretty likable, though Marica was at her best during the stint with Marica? running around too. Everyone else is some flavor of 'Okay...', but at least no one's running around with the idiot ball. In particular, the previously-mentioned priestess chick is fairly cool, though she'll need more screen time if she's ever going to stand out beyond her big scene in her intro.

The best stuff so far has been the presentation of the Order as a fairly weird, but believable view of extreme religious fervor. The Order is presented as being able to predict the future because future is already ordained, however, they will not be able to predict everything -perfectly- until the day the whole world follows its precepts. So, they can predict floods and lightning strikes, but there are some things which they haven't predicted yet becase the Order's influence needs to expand. The more believers, it seems, the better the predictions. As a result, the people who follow the Order live their lives directly according to the Order's instructions, and we see everything from predetermined marriages to punitive action being taken against those who declare a desire for their future, since it implies that Order doesn't already know what their future will be. It's fairly scary to see people believing in this sort of thing, but there are plenty of people who believe in Fate that it rings eerily true in some places. Especially when the followers talk about how excited they are for the day when the Order can predict everything perfectly and they can rise above the 'illusion' of free choice.

I'm looking forward to see what more they'll do with this viewpoint and whether they'll be able to continue making its followers at least somewhat sympathetic even if their beliefs are weird and scary and not conducive to a productive society.

It'll just be nice to see the 'Religion is Bad' trope be used without making the Church a bunch of literal demon-worshippers or child molesters.

Talaysen

  • Ara ara~
  • Administrator
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 2595
  • Ufufu~
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1777 on: April 19, 2010, 07:25:28 AM »
Gameplay is boring as hell so far, though. No party-building, no weapon-building, actual battles are really straitforward without many options to play with. Rune skillsets are swappable between PCs, so there's some potential, but I'll probably end up leaving most everyone with their initial skillsets thanks to the DL's influence... >.>;;

Um.  Skillsets are locked to PCs.

---

Oh right I play games.

Pokemon Heart Gold - In Goldenrod or whatever.  Did some Voltorb flipping for a Dratini, a Silk Scarf, and a Metronome, but didn't bother doing any more than that.  Voltorb flipping > slots though.

Current team:

Togepi L7
Heracross L8
Zubat L9
Mareep L12
Bayleef L17
Butterfree L17

Godlike team amirite guyz.  Pretty much ignoring wild pokemon battles outside of catching so my levels are low.  Makes for more fun fights!
« Last Edit: April 19, 2010, 07:34:18 AM by Talaysen »

Tide

  • Malice Tears
  • Mod Board Access
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 1357
  • Cacophony of Sorrow
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1778 on: April 19, 2010, 09:04:55 AM »
Tales of Vesperia:

Playing this. Around halfway through and not sure what to say. I'm probably the odd one in the DL group though since from what I've played, I dislike it. It's just a bunch of minor annoyances that are making me go "fuck this shit". Very tempted to just play the rest of the game on easy just so it takes less time and I can move on to other games. Will see how the remaining half holds up, but I am not holding my breath for it.
<napalmman> In Suikoden I, In Chinchirorin, what is it called when you roll three of the same number?
<@Claude> yahtzee

<Dreamboum> Everyone is learning new speedgames!
<Dreamboum> A bright future awaits us gentlemens
<Pitted> I'm learning league of legends
<Dreamboum> go fuck yourself

Grefter

  • Villain.
  • DL
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 10386
  • True and Honest. Smarter. More aggressive.
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1779 on: April 19, 2010, 10:15:38 AM »
ToV - So I decided to try to do the obsessive Tales fan thing and go for the complete everything acheivement.

You can't be serious, or are you secretly in love with ToV that much?

No, I like the game well enough, I think it is really good, but certainly not THAT good.  But doing it certainly would be something different.
NO MORE POKEMON - Meeplelard.
The king perfect of the DL is and always will be Excal. - Superaielman
Don't worry, just jam it in anyway. - SirAlex
Gravellers are like, G-Unit - Trancey.

DomaDragoon

  • Lazy
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 426
  • Boink.
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1780 on: April 19, 2010, 12:48:10 PM »
Heart Gold: Screw you, Lance. Had to burn through 20 or so Revives to take him down because he wouldn't stop criticalling my Feraligatr, which was the only one of my Pokemon that could do some serious damage to his darn Dragonites. Beat him, though, and now I'm unlocking Kanto towns before I tackle the Gyms. Might save Surge for one of the last because I currently have four weak to electric.

Grefter

  • Villain.
  • DL
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 10386
  • True and Honest. Smarter. More aggressive.
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1781 on: April 19, 2010, 01:55:17 PM »
Sounds like you are in a real problem and the solution is more Geodudes.
NO MORE POKEMON - Meeplelard.
The king perfect of the DL is and always will be Excal. - Superaielman
Don't worry, just jam it in anyway. - SirAlex
Gravellers are like, G-Unit - Trancey.

superaielman

  • "Mordero daghain pas duente cuebiyar/The fear of death holds not my heart!"
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 9631
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1782 on: April 19, 2010, 11:29:25 PM »
FFTA2- Just got Cid. Taking a break from this for a bit, as the current crop of missions are annoying me.

FE9- Started.

C2- Had a reset when Boyd got killed. Not hard otherwise.
C3- Augh. Ike gained three levels here, and gained no HP or speed. This is a bit sad, since Ike is L8 and has less HP than my L4 cleric.
C4- Had a reset when Ike got swarmed and killed (Since he doesn't believe in gaining HP or defense). Used Titania has a focus and Shinon as bait.
C5- Had a few resets here. The fight got easy when I sent Titania and Gatrie to hold the point where most of the enemies were coming from.
C6- A breeze. Enemies come in small, managable waves and they don't have much offense.
C7- See above. Unless you're Boyd and getting doubled with the wrong weapon, enemies aren't too bad.

Ike: Doesn't believe in gaining HP, he went like six straight levels without gaining any. Otherwise, he's got plenty of speed and strength.
Titania: Obvious MVP to this point.
Boyd: Awful. Has the speed of Gatrie and the strength of Mia. HE DOES HAVE RES THOUGH!!! Going to ditch him as soon as I get a less bad axeman to use.
Oscar: Solid outside of not really getting strength.
Soren: Ranged damage? Good. Getting 2HKOed by random scrubs? Bad. He has use thanks to the range, but he is beyond awful on durability.
Rhys: FE staffman.
Mia: Just got her. Offense is pretty shitty at first, but hey she opened up with a six stat gain on her levels.  Looks like a typical FE swordmaster.
Gatrie: Useful in a few levels for tanking, but blah to 25% speed growth.
Shinon: Meatshield+softening up enemies.

I'm enjoying the game a good deal. FE has it's problems, but it has been good about giving you different mission objectives and making the game flow smoothly.
"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself"- Count Aral Vorkosigan, A Civil Campaign
-------------------
<Meeple> knownig Square-enix, they'll just give us a 2nd Kain
<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...

VySaika

  • DL
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 2836
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1783 on: April 19, 2010, 11:54:12 PM »
Quote
Boyd: Awful. Has the speed of Gatrie and the strength of Mia. HE DOES HAVE RES THOUGH!!! Going to ditch him as soon as I get a less bad axeman to use.


You, uh, kinda don't, I'm sorry to say. Titania and Keiran are the only other decent axe users and they're both mounted. Sounds like you just got RNG screwed and how with Boyd though. He's usually a lot better then that. I've had him drop the ball early like this as well and pick up steam later though, if you want to stick it out with him. Still plenty of time for things to turn around.
<%Laggy> we're open minded individuals here
<+RandomKesaranPasaran> are we
<%Laggy> no not really.

<Tide|NukicommentatoroptionforF> Hatbot is a pacifist

Jo'ou Ranbu

  • Social Justice Steampunk Literature Character
  • New Age Retro Fucking Hipster
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 12981
  • Ah'm tuff fer mah size!
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1784 on: April 20, 2010, 12:10:06 AM »
Crack Quest - WEB+FLAMING SKULLS IS COMPLETELY AWESOME~~
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> HEY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> LAGGY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> UVIET?!??!?!
[01:08] <Laggy> YA!!!!!!!!!1111111111
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> OMG!!!!
[01:08] <Chulianne> No wonder you're small.
[01:08] <TranceHime> cocks
[01:08] <Laggy> .....

Meeplelard

  • Fire Starter
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 5356
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1785 on: April 20, 2010, 12:52:14 AM »
Quote
Boyd: Awful. Has the speed of Gatrie and the strength of Mia. HE DOES HAVE RES THOUGH!!! Going to ditch him as soon as I get a less bad axeman to use.


You, uh, kinda don't, I'm sorry to say. Titania and Keiran are the only other decent axe users and they're both mounted. Sounds like you just got RNG screwed and how with Boyd though. He's usually a lot better then that. I've had him drop the ball early like this as well and pick up steam later though, if you want to stick it out with him. Still plenty of time for things to turn around.

Largo isn't too bad though he's a total glass canon to add to that; he's also gotten late.  Haar is another half decent one for filling slots though yeah, also late.  Any Paladins and Jill can also work for an axe user, though only after promotion; in fact, I'd highly recommend giving Astrid an Axe should you use her.  Lance vs. Axe have such minor differences that its a close call, but then you factor in how Axes let you use Steel Axe out of the gate while Lances require some training, it becomes an obvious win.

FE9 doesn't have much in the way of Axe users though.  FE10 makes up for it a bit by making Jill's primary weapon Axes, adding Nolan to list of characters, as well as turning Brom's primary weapon into an Axe.  Oh yeah, Gatrie/Tauroneo use Axes instead of Swords as a secondary weapon, Ike gets them upon promotion, Titania has debatably IMPROVED in FE10, Haar is flat out better...yeah, Axe's had a pretty strong showing in FE10.  Then again, don't think any weapon was poorly represented there (even Bows were pretty well represented, due to Shinon and Rolf being rather strong competent PCs.)
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

Dark Holy Elf

  • DL
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 8135
  • Well-behaved women seldom make history
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1786 on: April 20, 2010, 03:53:59 AM »
FE9 has Kieran who mains axes, it's not like his mountedness is a disadvantage. Boyd's generally a good PC but if he's being RNG screwed I can't see any reason at all to use him once you get Kieran.

Erwin Schrödinger will kill you like a cat in a box.
Maybe.

Meeplelard

  • Fire Starter
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 5356
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1787 on: April 20, 2010, 03:56:17 AM »
I meant to say that in terms of raw options, Axe users are very limited in FE9.  This isn't to say what's there is bad (hard to say Titania can ever be bad, and barring RNG screwage, Kieran and Boyd are both good), just you have a small selection of them, especially before promoting.

FE10 upped the number of raw Axe users significantly, so your options were a bit more flexible.  I know, FE10 upped the number of EVERYTHING, but shh <_<
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

Just Another Day

  • Just Another Dollar
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 191
    • View Profile
    • (BL)
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1788 on: April 20, 2010, 05:27:57 AM »
I feel like there are fewer useful lance users, but I don't feel like actually doing the homework to demonstrate this.

superaielman

  • "Mordero daghain pas duente cuebiyar/The fear of death holds not my heart!"
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 9631
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1789 on: April 20, 2010, 01:19:40 PM »
Quote
Boyd: Awful. Has the speed of Gatrie and the strength of Mia. HE DOES HAVE RES THOUGH!!! Going to ditch him as soon as I get a less bad axeman to use.


You, uh, kinda don't, I'm sorry to say. Titania and Keiran are the only other decent axe users and they're both mounted. Sounds like you just got RNG screwed and how with Boyd though. He's usually a lot better then that. I've had him drop the ball early like this as well and pick up steam later though, if you want to stick it out with him. Still plenty of time for things to turn around.

*Nods* I used a speed wings on him and got him a BExp level. That plus a level where he FINALLY gained speed helped some. I did end up getting Soren killed on that map (8), but it's an FE9 mage. I'm not feeling that loss too much.
"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself"- Count Aral Vorkosigan, A Civil Campaign
-------------------
<Meeple> knownig Square-enix, they'll just give us a 2nd Kain
<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...

Yoshiken

  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 2068
  • Yay!
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1790 on: April 20, 2010, 01:25:03 PM »
I did end up getting Soren killed on that map (8), but it's an FE9 mage. I'm not feeling that loss too much.
* Yoshiken burns Super.
You missed out. IMO, there's only one mage in FE9 worth using and that's Soren. Sure, he's frail, but he can kill pretty much anything before it kills him. I still remember giving him the spare Vantage scroll I had, sticking him out on his own in the 3rd section of the stupid 4-part chapter and... watched as he tore everything to shreds. Only reason I pulled him back is because he'd gained, like, 9 levels and was starting to gain next-to-nothing on the kills.

Pokemon Heart Gold: EV training: 1/6 Pokemon down.
One of my friends just told me the perfect trick to hatching eggs: "I've just put a cup on the DS to hold the UP button down and went to Morty's gym." As though those stupidly long routes from before weren't good enough, now we have this. XD

Meeplelard

  • Fire Starter
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 5356
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1791 on: April 20, 2010, 01:59:15 PM »
Soren is pretty much generic as a Mage, honestly.  Adept is cool, but that's about all that makes him stand out.  Illyana's about as good, actually; Soren's faster, but Illyana has more strength which offsets it (Soren's strength is so bad, he gets weighted down by Thunder Tomes, aka the only Magic worth using.  Illyana does not.)  I think she also has a lead in Thunder magic, making her using Rexbolt actually reasonable without Arm's Scrolls (I think Callil can probably win it too though.)

Tormod's the best of the Unpromoted Mages pretty easily, due to Celerity if nothing else (hard to argue with +2 Move) though he's got the whole "joins a bit late, underleveled and understated" issue.  Its not Nino level bad, and the existence of bonus EXP lets him catch up reasonably so with enough chapters to spare, but its still a slight nuisance.

I'd definitely place Callil above Soren or Illyana, outside of the fact that both have options for staves while Callil has knives; that honestly still feels like something shoved to Callil for the sake of not obsoleting the unpromoted mages (for all that Tormod would still have an argument, Celerity is just that good.)  She's basically Pent-, when it comes down to it, which is hardly bad.

Bastian...ahahahahahaha, no.  Maybe if he had Staves instead of Knives, he could fill in gaps as another Healer or something, but egads is he atrocious.

So uh, yeah, to say Soren is the only mage worth using! is something I can't get behind.  Probably rate mages something like Callil > Tormod > Soren =~ Illyana > Bastian?  I could be argued for Tormod above Callil.
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

Grefter

  • Villain.
  • DL
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 10386
  • True and Honest. Smarter. More aggressive.
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1792 on: April 20, 2010, 02:26:56 PM »
ToV - Almost got the low level challenge achievement.  Just need another 5 minutes play, but sleep first.
NO MORE POKEMON - Meeplelard.
The king perfect of the DL is and always will be Excal. - Superaielman
Don't worry, just jam it in anyway. - SirAlex
Gravellers are like, G-Unit - Trancey.

Yoshiken

  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 2068
  • Yay!
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1793 on: April 20, 2010, 02:36:00 PM »
Meeple: Maybe I got majorly Speed-blessed or something then, because I can't think of a single enemy that Soren didn't double after promoting, except possibly a few bosses.

OblivionKnight

  • Boom! Big reveal: I'm a pickle. What do you think about that?
  • Global Moderator
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 2999
  • I'm Pickle Rick!
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1794 on: April 20, 2010, 02:40:58 PM »
Bastian is the best knife-wielding Sage in the game, Meeple!
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
[19:27] <+Terra_Condor> Han Kicks First?
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Vader intercepts.
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

Meeplelard

  • Fire Starter
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 5356
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1795 on: April 20, 2010, 02:49:03 PM »
Bastian is the best knife-wielding Sage in the game, Meeple!

Callil <_<?  Or did Bastian actually beat her on Strength (though I'm pretty sure she crushes him on speed)

Quote
Meeple: Maybe I got majorly Speed-blessed or something then, because I can't think of a single enemy that Soren didn't double after promoting, except possibly a few bosses.

Soren generally doesn't double Swordmasters, Dragons (enemy Dragons are actually fast in this game, remember), and probably stuff like Cats.  Illyana's honestly not much different.  Soren is actually not that much of a speed god, and he's certainly unspecial by Mage standards; Adept is really his only niche.

EDIT: According to Elfboy's stat topic, Soren is 1 point above average speed...not even (he's 0.8); he's not really that fast.  Oh, he's by no means SLOW, but he's not a speedster like the Swordmasters, or Nephenee (at least with Knight Ward) is.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2010, 02:53:15 PM by Meeplelard »
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

DomaDragoon

  • Lazy
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 426
  • Boink.
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1796 on: April 20, 2010, 02:55:57 PM »
Heart Gold: LOL Poison, LOL Grass. The only reason Erika wasn't an outright slaughter was because she did have the level advantage. Still, two Gyms down, the Train is up and running, and I have a Snorlax.

Just Another Day

  • Just Another Dollar
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 191
    • View Profile
    • (BL)
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1797 on: April 20, 2010, 06:52:58 PM »
Soren is pretty much generic as a Mage, honestly.  Adept is cool, but that's about all that makes him stand out.  Illyana's about as good, actually; Soren's faster, but Illyana has more strength which offsets it (Soren's strength is so bad, he gets weighted down by Thunder Tomes, aka the only Magic worth using.  Illyana does not.)  I think she also has a lead in Thunder magic, making her using Rexbolt actually reasonable without Arm's Scrolls (I think Callil can probably win it too though.)

[...]

So uh, yeah, to say Soren is the only mage worth using! is something I can't get behind.  Probably rate mages something like Callil > Tormod > Soren =~ Illyana > Bastian?  I could be argued for Tormod above Callil.

Soren's speed isn't great at all, but his power is good enough to keep his offense usable regardless (remember his Ike support + Adept + high skill, I suppose), and his durability, though never good, is abeted by his evade.

Ilyana is unabashedly terrible (not as bad as Bastian, who is basically unusable and believe me I've tried). Her offense is bad (and no, her strength does not  for the most part make up for her speed, tomes don't weigh that much and forged Thunder is almost certainly your mainstay for most of the game), and her durability is arguably worse than Soren's. She lacks evade, gets doubled more, has lower RES and doesn't actually have useful physical durability despite her marginally better defense and hp. Rexbolt is a dragon-killing niche, I suppose, but it's not really that great and in any case she's not any better at getting to it than Soren or Calill. I really like her as a character, but that's just the way the cookie crumbles statistically.

Calill is definitely alright, but has availability issues and its hard to argue that she's manifestly superior statistically to Soren. I think the lack of staves really hurts her, some disagree. Access to all the ranged tomes is a pretty significant plus. Knives suck.

Tormod is statistically pretty comparable to Soren, I'd argue slightly worse due to his lower power and evade, but close regardless. Celerity is probably the best skill in the game, though, and if he wasn't so goddamn underleveled I'd have more sympathy for him. But as it is you'll have Calill before Tormod's anywhere near caught-up without significant favouritism; his effective availability's lower than hers, and he's actually a liability for several chapters previous if you want him to be competitive at all.

I'd say Soren ~> Calill > Tormod ~> Ilyana >> Bastian. B really needed staves and/or auto Rexbolt access to have a niche at all. Soren and Calill are both useful without particular effort (Soren requires caution in his early chapters but doesn't need kill favouritism or bxp), Tormod's useful with effort, Ilyana's usable but not really good under realistic circumstances, and Bastian is bad under all circumstances that are not cutscenes.

Meeplelard

  • Fire Starter
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 5356
    • View Profile
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1798 on: April 20, 2010, 07:09:04 PM »
I'm looking at the stats and Soren just stands out in Magic.  Yeah, fastest Sage, but only a point above Callil, who offsets it with Strength (if you're not using Forged Thunder, which I wouldn't assume, stuff like Elthunder actually DOES weigh him down), and has better evade.  Tormod's actually about even overall with stats; Soren doesn't really stand out high enough on Magic to make up for +2 Move.

Adept's rate isn't high enough to really save Soren as being this overpowered Mage God if you ask me.

And soren struggles to use a good deal of Tomes without being weighed down until he promotes, and even after, he's still struggling.  His average Strength is 3.6; Thunder in itself weighs 4.  This means end game, Soren can barely wield a Thunder Tome without being weighed down, and likely won't be able to use Elthunder.

Illyana isn't as bad at stats as you're making her out to be too.  She's actually better than Soren out of the gate if you ask me cause Soren IS held back by his strength early on; as the game goes on, Soren works away this flaw, but he's frankly nothing special.

ALso, worth noting that Callil starts with a B in all weapon classes, which actually does matter cause raising Weapons in FE9 is a bitch.  I've struggled to get them to A; Callil is pretty much insured to do this, thus can wield stuff like Thoron, which is stronger than any forged Magic weapon *AND* weighs a good amount (Callil has no problems with Weight, Soren does.)

I dunno, just don't see what the Soren hype is.  The only real edge on Callil, which I will grant is a good one, is the usage of Staves.  But to branch from that, Tormod about matches Soren on stats, has Celerity which is better than Adept.
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

Just Another Day

  • Just Another Dollar
  • Denizen
  • *
  • Posts: 191
    • View Profile
    • (BL)
Re: Let's Play Some Motherf*$&ing Games: 2010!!!!!!
« Reply #1799 on: April 20, 2010, 07:13:03 PM »
Also, I'm feeling more energetic now.

(I'm going to assume that you're not stupid and will never give Kieran, Astrid or Makalov lances)

Unabashedly good FE9 lance users: (1 pt)

Titania
Nephenee
Oscar
Marcia
Jill
Tanith

Decent FE9 lance users with good availability: (0.5 pts)

Gatrie
Brom

Decent FE9 lance users with bad availability: (0.25 pts)

Haar
Tauroneo
Geoffrey

Bad FE9 lance users: (0pts)

Devdan

Total: 7.75

--------------------

(less confidence in my evaluations of FE10 units, but anyways)

Unabashedly good FE10 lance users (1 pt)

Marcia
Haar
Nephenee

Decent FE10 lance users with good availability (or good lance secondary characters) (0.5 pts)

Aran
Gatrie
Oscar
Meg
Jill

Decent FE10 lance users with bad availability (or good lance tertiary characters) (0.25 pts)

Brom
Fiona (late bloomer = bad availability)
Tauroneo
Geoffrey
Sigrun
Tanith

Bad FE10 lance users (0 pts)

Danved
Astrid

Total = 7 pts

Unscientific, but I think it's pretty clear that, even without weighting for cast size, FE9 has at least comparable and probably more good lance users than FE10.