DL Playership Drive- Winter 2010

[Cmdr_King]

Oh.  given the context of the topic I was just talking from a ranking perspective.  Board tourneys, due to smaller topics, less clutter, and smaller voting pools can handle most things pretty well.

[OblivionKnight]

Definitely don't see Revya as non-rankable. 

Those stat boosts aren't really random - I can check to be sure more specifically, but I've seen them listed as set boosts, and have also seen them like such myself during the game.  They're set boosts, like +18 INT or whatever.  So the randomness argument doesn't work.

The game is basically Ogre Battle, though more polished.  Same thing with squads, just with the room thing.  While there is a synergy with other units in the room, it's perfectly normal in-game to see a single unit in a single, normal room (Layna in the Demon Path, IIRC, as well as some random monsters throughout the game).

Now, the HOME room can be changed as needed, and isn't random - you could argue Revya has access to any room possible, which means she's far better than a Low Godlike - crazy evasion room mauls those without multiple-hit attacks, stat boosting rooms when solo, etc. 

As for summoning...it's more akin to Marona than anything, I'd say?  Unless you allow summoning of generics, since I would assume most people...wouldn't allow summoning of other PCs. 

Really, really don't see Revya as unrankable.  Still isn't exceedingly fast, relatively status-vulnerable, doesn't get initiative that I remember (I've surely seen Danette go first - I might be wrong on this, but unlikely), is purely physical.  I honestly don't think there's anything unrankable about Revya that we haven't done already - the stats thing is more like if a character started with an item that boosted stats on level up (like TotA capacity cores), and was the only member of the cast to get one and had a claim to it...would they be unrakable?  I mean, what about Grandia stats from weapon/magic levels, or runes/mediums in the WA series, or SMRPG ability to choose stat bonuses on level gain?  Should we not rank Chuck because he has a starting medium, or not rank Mario because he can theoretically modulate his stat growth (or Serph, for that matter - ignoring the fact that, in the SMRPG example, they eventually even out)?  It's one of the advantages of Revya in-game that she can get more statistical bonuses via her mechanic.  Really, really don't agree with the unrankability argument.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Definitely don't see Revya as non-rankable. 

As for summoning...it's more akin to Marona than anything, I'd say?  Unless you allow summoning of generics, since I would assume most people...wouldn't allow summoning of other PCs. 

This is pretty much the sticking point. None of that other stuff would make her Bluelike.

[hinode]

Comparing her to Marona isn't helping your case here, OK.

[alanna82]

I dont allow Yuna Aeons, or Guv call team. Sounds like I wouldnt allow Reyva's summons, which would make her rankable to me. Sounds almost like a Chongara situation. (does anyone allow his summons?)

[Cmdr_King]

doesn't get initiative that I remember (I've surely seen Danette go first - I might be wrong on this, but unlikely)

She doesn't get initiative every turn, no; Soul Nomad uses a CTB-styled system, so initiative every turn wouldn't work correctly.  She simply gets the guaranteed first turn at the start of the battle, then skips her first 'normal' turn and afterwords performs at her listed speed (20 is it?); this is to guarantee that the player has a chance to summon units before anyone else can attack them.

As for summons, history has shown that people DO allow Revya to summon generic squads to battle.  In fact, her case for it is better than Marona's, since Revya doesn't have to confine her minions to random objects on the battlefield.  They literally appear out of nowhere.

[Luther Lansfeld]

Rankability isn't just based off of your own views, sometimes. If you think a large margin of people are going to vote in a way that makes a character Bluelike they still aren't rankable, at least to me! See Ryu 5.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Rankability isn't just based off of your own views, sometimes. If you think a large margin of people are going to vote in a way that makes a character Bluelike they still aren't rankable, at least to me! See Ryu 5.

This this this.


Also yeah if you are going to do a "playership drive" for making a game rankable I am not in favour of pushing games with significant ranking issues, and the last page of the topic pretty much shows that SN qualifies. The SN fans are welcome to support the game but as far as a concerted drive to get people to play a game goes? Choose something that is a slamdunk ranking idea if it gets writers. It just makes sense.

[Talaysen]

OK: Revya is unrankable due to being too powerful for Godlike.  Extra stats have nothing to do with it on their own.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

I dont allow Yuna Aeons, or Guv call team. Sounds like I wouldnt allow Reyva's summons, which would make her rankable to me. Sounds almost like a Chongara situation. (does anyone allow his summons?)

I certainly do, and I think most people who allow summons allow Chongara his, too. His summons, however, have -other- problems, and the few unfortunate bastards who played AtL1 are likely to kneejerk Chongara as terrible due to how awful he is in-game, and due to how raising him -and- the summons is a pain in the fucking ass (even risking running anathema to each other), placing a level disadvantage on the monsters probably feels quite reasonable too.

[Dhyerwolf]

In fairness, the last page is all about Reyva. SN is so much more than just Reyva, and honestly I find a lot of the rankable duellers to be more interesting anyways. Magic-weak death tanks! Fun Light heal stallers! Evil speed and evasion buffers!

[Pyro]

We are not ranking Revya because she has too many issues and I don't want to see the entire SN cast denied a chance in the DL just because a few people wanted to push for her. There are perfectly fine ranks from the game and if it was pushed I would support it myself.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Rankability isn't just based off of your own views, sometimes. If you think a large margin of people are going to vote in a way that makes a character Bluelike they still aren't rankable, at least to me! See Ryu 5.

This this this.


Also yeah if you are going to do a "playership drive" for making a game rankable I am not in favour of pushing games with significant ranking issues, and the last page of the topic pretty much shows that SN qualifies. The SN fans are welcome to support the game but as far as a concerted drive to get people to play a game goes? Choose something that is a slamdunk ranking idea if it gets writers. It just makes sense.

SN qualifies in the same sense that BoF5 and P3 qualify - the main has significant interp split, and one of the fairly prominent views has her as a Bluelike. This doesn't make all of SN unrankable. And even Revya could be rankable if listed specifically as not being able to summon. (Similarly, Minato is rankable without his curve-breaking persona. And Ryu5 might be rankable by today's standards anyway, just a really good Godlike.)

[Cmdr_King]

Also yeah if you are going to do a "playership drive" for making a game rankable I am not in favour of pushing games with significant ranking issues

*shrug* People have played different things, so hyping ideas that might struggle more than others doesn't necessarily hurt the "slam dunk" games in terms of players.  As well, some people don't necessarily care to play some games.  So, for example, If I want to loan out my copies of Soul Nomad and Mana Khemia 2, both Sopko and Shale could use Mana Khemia 2, but Shale doesn't particularly care to play it, so I loan Soppy MK2 and Shale SN, both games improve better than they could otherwise, but loaning Shale SN doesn't hurt MK2 since he didn't intend to play it anyway.
(Also, well, in looking at my data both VPDS and DQV are very near player walls, and Mana Khemia 2 requires a little more work than the others, so if I'm a little focused on Soul Nomad it's because it's the one I can do the most about at the moment is all.)

Besides which, while there are people who are less than thrilled with Soul Nomad as a ranking idea (it does require more work than average to get a DL cast out of it), on the whole agreeing not to rank Revya seems to address the biggest issue?  I mean, unless folks like Ciato, Excal, or Snow have other issues I haven't presented.  if so I'd really like them to speak up, since discussing ranking issues is one of the things I wanted to accomplish.

[Cmdr_King]

Mega Bump!

Okay, so we're closing in on ranking time.  At current, ranking front-runners based solely on the numbers are:
Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn (Wii.  22 players, 8 writers)
Valkyrie Profile: Covenant of the Plume (DS.  22 players, 12 writers)
Dragon Quest V (SFC/DS.  21 players, 10 writers)
Soul Nomad & The World Eaters (PS2.  21 players, 10 writers)

If you have the correct system to play these games, but lack a copy of the game proper, please respond in topic and I'll see if we can't work something out.  Be warned that I'll probably only be able to help North American folks in this matter.
If you lack a DS and would be interested in either of those games, please get ahold of me on IRC.