A memes to an end(Meme Mafia: Game Over)

[Li Syaoran]

As they often say, hindsight is 20/20...reading over lolcat's past posts has revealed what is basically textbook active lurking. Opinions are scarce, there is plenty of hating on the Great Soviet Motherland without really any opinion anyone else, save some minor cheerleading for O9K, and in general there really isn't anything particularly useful in any of lolcat's posts for today, as even the Russia stuff is largely WIFOM.

As for the rest:

I'm still not sure what to make of our good friends The Soviets. On the one hand, they did a lot of good by advancing our technology and getting into space! On the other hand their D1 posting was rather awful: I don't blame them for their initial No Lynch stance simply because it was so bad and daft that literally no faction stood to gain from it, the fairly rapid turnaround onto O9K after claiming it was a "test" is weird though (what "test"? If you are referring to being properly annoyed at the No Lynch strat, then how could anyone fail that? That strat is terrible, as everyone knows by now), and his post today...is LAL. While I'm not a fan of XBOX or Astley, and Astley deserves at least some hate for his last post yesterday where he acquiesces to town's request to move his vote, however as he is moving it onto someone who he claimed earlier that he thought was scummy, this is not that terrible. In general though, D2 is not the day for LAL either, really.

That being said: I agree with them somewhat on Cake, however I am disappointed that they don't elaborate on their Cake case, lolcat's vote for them makes them a bit less likely to be scum (why would scum be bussing one of their own at this time when there's a townie wagon right alongside?), and so much of their play is just so nonsensical that I'm unconvinced that they're the lynch for today. Somewhat scummy, yes. Likely to be scum? At the moment, I don't think so.

Cake is bad on D1 for the same reason as lolcat is: pretty much active lurking. He slams O9K for, admittedly, decent reasoning, but there's a lack of opinions on other people, and his post today isn't particularly endearing, nor does his case on Shiki make all that much sense imho - voteswitching on D1 is not terrible if it comes with good reasoning (which in this case it did), and it's certainly not indicating of scumminess on its own, and outside of the switching Shiki hasn't done anything else terribly objectionable on D1, so yeah.

Cake, Shiki and Russia need to elaborate on cases, whereas others such as Astley, Bel-Air and XBox all need to post. I'm exhausted right now and need to re-read D1 properly, will post a proper post in about 4 hours.

[Helga Pataki]

"Hmph. A lot to say and little time, so I'll attempt to keep this brief. First, we were roleblocked last night. Not sure why us, but it's what happened.

"Moving on. Rick Astley, and by extension anyone who in the future might be inclined to do as such; please announce an intent to hammer -before- hammering, alright? Seeing that darling little hammer post just as I was getting here was about the equivalent of getting rickrolled by goatse.

"In point of fact... a post with horrible/deceptive syntax voting for Russia, a post to us defending his own post after we voted him and explaining what the syntax was supposed to mean, the switch off much later which placed a self-claimed 'worthless' vote, and then the sudden hammervote. That is the entirety of the content Astley has provided. While the vote for Russia I'm willing to set aside, the rest of it seems pretty much pathetic."

##VOTE: Rick Astley

"And since people seem to think my early vote on the rickroll was unreasonable, a brief syntax explanation, provided by Hazel:

Scum's gotta keep those joke votes hot
[Which nine thousand sure has not] <---- Primary actor
Unlike (Shiki and the Comrad) <--- Secondary actor, used -as a comparison-
He hasn't even said a thing
Just stay neutral and sing.
Which I'm thinkin' is a sign that he's ba~ad. <--- Applies, due to syntax, to -the primary actor-. Thus it reads as if Nine Thousand was accused of being bad, but the vote was for Soviet Russia, thus my vote on Astley at the time; he read as if he was contradicting himself.

"Anyways. Talking of other possibly questionable personages... Like others have said, hueg like breadbox fails to impress; one post of little relevance and then back into the aetherous flub isn't good. [STAR FOX, REPORT]
"AYB actually looks decent to me; there's some reporting like what Shanapersun said, but... he breaks down his arguments against O9K (third page) well enough that I'm not concerned about the reporting parts. [REPORT]

"Soviet Russia still sits poorly with me as well, and would be my vote recipient if Astley's quickhammer didn't ring as horribly anti-town. The case was pretty much made yesterday; horrible lack of content for most of it, somewhat off-kilter case on Milhouse who reads fine to me (I'd point out the flaws in the Milhouse case but that was done fine by Touhoujack/Shiki). And to answer a comment he made, blazing red sirens were a joke on the "glorious red color", yep. I don't particularly get the snapvote argument, either - I voted you because you persisted in voting No Lynch at the time I wrote that. The post today doesn't help - sure, he votes my own target, but mainly because... he can't remember him. I don't know, but... one would think going back to see what the person you're voting for said would be a good idea, eh, Communist Reference?"

"Lying Cake... augh. Okay, next post, will be up in a hour or two. He's got a fair bit more posting than the rest of these guys, and I've spent long enough trying to pace through this stuff that I need to stand up.

"Ninja by Ad Dog and AYB; I'm well aware that I have relatively low content. Blame that partially on my own deficiency, sure, but I have a job at a adult bookstore to go to, and Hazel does still write her columns. We can't be around consistently or constantly.  We do, however, try our damned best to be here when we can. AYB... not much to say. Some nitpicky stuff (I disagree that Astley is "just a lurker", really) but."

[Helga Pataki]

"Lying Cake: Breakdown, 2g1c style.

"After jokevote phase: votes O9K for unvoting/not revoting. Gives justification for not voting on Zerg Rush, which I... No, in the end I think I agree with the issues here; even presuming !cake voted Zerg Rush and that made other people shy away from the train, we would still get info based on who textually avoided the train. In other words, !cake's excuse that it would make people shy away seems bollocks and does indeed read more as an avoidance of the case while trying to put pressure on Zerg Rush.

"Page 3: prods lurkers, continues to justify 9000 vote while semi-cheerleading the Yodawg suspicions (calling them strong... when the entirety of the case on Yodawg at the time was that he wasn't saying anything. Uh, 'kay, strong's not the word I would use there).

"Page 4: ... Okay. His post here...

Besides, people can still strongly express opinions without actually having a vote down. They can also make alternate cases and put the votes to use there!

And if all the votes are already on one target people are more likely to tunnel and less likely to turn away. Last game was a huge fluke in that the Prinny wagon gained enough speed to stop Middleman.

[...]

"...contradicts the thrust of his earlier post in Page 2:

lol, wimp. Zerg rushes are srs bsns, as are mafia. If Apeture Science Vessel Cake Liar have case u push case, u don't just go 'lolz look he losing and bad so I not vote cause we'll accidentally day one lynch.'

Placing you too close to lynch would give test subjects an excuse to refrain from voting your case. There are several subjects who have still not commented, and keeping you distant from the Aperture Science Fifteen-Hundred-Megawatt Super-Comfortable Electric Chair means people cannot make their first post something along the lines of 'Zerg is bad, but he's at L-whatever so I'm not voting'. ...

"Emphasis mine in both cases. At first he's afraid that people will not vote Zerg Rush because he's so high up, but then switches to being afraid that people will tunnel on Zerg Rush. This reads highly as someone attempting to distance himself from a failed train. The rest of the post referenced looks acceptable, however. Page 5, a post commenting on liking O9k less, little commentary elsewhere. Page 6, same.

"And today, a post against Shana. Of the bullet points provided, I disagree that Shana cheerleaded on Soviet: she seems instead to have just sputtered at him regarding the push of no-lynch, and later admits the vote on Cake for the fakejester mention was gut and not as logical as she thought. Somewhat weird flop, but whatever, it's not as bad as the !cake seems to push it to be, unless I'm terribly missing something.

"Vote stands, but will switch to vote !cake if Astley does not gain steam. I very much dislike Astley's minimalness and cutoff of discussion, and would rather see him out, but agree that the case on !cake is more substantial than I had been giving it credit for."

-*^*x*^*-

Wha- Cake, what are you doing, popping in like Sakuya? Gotta say, I don't like your "yay a scum died sad to see a townie lynch" and pre-defense of wagon positioning too much there. Kinda makes me want to blow the voting winds back your way, but I want to hear from the life partners first.

"Wha- I think there's a bit of misunderstandi-"
"DAMNIT AYA I AM NOT A LESBIAN!"

[Margaret Houlihan]

Yeah, this had been draining a bit of my spare time before this game even started. Now, thanks to Advice Dog, I'm back on it.

The quick-hammer for Rick was annoying, but the points you've presented against GlaDOS are much stronger. That said, expecting GlaDOS to actually show up and respond, unlike Rick.

AYB, I know it's not a major point of yours, but worth commenting on: you wonder why scum would be bussing one of their own? Exactly that. It could be for town credit either way, and it's WIFOM to look into it. Not only that, but at the time of Lolcat's vote, it was early in the day and there was more than enough time for the trains to change.

Still think the Soviet is worst, with GlaDOS a distant second, then lurkers. If anyone has anything in particular they want me to respond to, I'll be around for the next two hours or so. In the meantime, I'm gonna go back to beating this.

[Alice Margatroid]

My apologies to Hazel for the innaccurate remarks of that tengu rag regarding your sexuality. Aya has often done such things in the past to many Gensokyo residents in the interest of generating stories.

Your most recent posts are a substantial step up from your Day 1 conduct, though I think your vote should be on the faux dessert instead of the singer given the arguments you have presented. Your claim of being roleblocked also stays my accusational hand for the time being. ##Unvote

Speaking of your argument against the faux dessert, I must admit your second faux dessert hypocrisy discovery (the first being presented by Scarlet's librarian back on Page 2) has me strongly leaning back toward it, as does the insect horde's revisionist history accusation (perhaps the dessert becomes real in the light of the full moon? This would be consistent with Gensokyo's own population), as does the tengu's second set of comments about pre-emptive defense and pro-town celebrations. There is far too much inconsistency and pro-town acting here for me to let this go. And then, above all else, Chen learning of the non-existence of cake has made her cry. This crime absolutely cannot go unpunished. ##Vote: The Cake Is A Lie

On to other meaningful subjects. As the female pair and the less-than-inspiring messages continue to hold Aka in very low regard, I must cite my mistress's argument against the prospect of him being scum and ask you why you believe him to be so even in this light. The messages, in particular, I frown upon because their vote today seems to be entirely founded on the fact that Aka once supported No Lynch, and they have not expressed other suspicions beyond the obvious faux dessert case and then the lurkers, which anyone can do. Clarice at least mentions more, though I believe the "lack of content" argument only applies to earlier in the day, which is slightly less offensive considering the nature of Day 1. The content improved as the day went on, at least in my rather keen eyes.

Combo Breaker, the box's joke vote did eventually metamorph into a serious vote. I agree that the box is suspicious, but I cannot agree with your reason for thinking so, as it is rather incorrect.

In terms of people I feel are/were lurking in the shadows, my full list would include Combo Breaker, All Your Base, Rick Astley and Bel Air, the box more lurking in a bottomless pit. Combo Breaker I find myself raising an eyebrow at due to the nature of box vote. All Your Base's content has admittedly been good when it's there, so I find myself concerned the least with him. I dislike the lack of vote in his opening post but he has made a follow-up promise so I will wait patiently for that. Rick Astley has been covered by Clarice; I find myself agreeing with her, though not to the extent that I feel he is the most vote-worthy target at this juncture. Bel Air...feelings are nebulous, as if they have been sukima'd away entirely. I do not like this and would especially like to see what he has with which to open the day.

[Nathan Greaves]

Gah, to hell with it. I haven't been able to give this game the time it deserves, and as a result I'm falling behind. I admit I was being an idiot when I didn't vote for Zerg. I wasn't paying a whole ton of attention to all the cases rising up and I haven't taken the time to read through the topic.

On the other hand, I shot lolcats last night. So...yeah.

[Alice Margatroid]

That is quite the claim there. ##Unvote, ##Vote: HUGE LIKE XBOX for now (read Aya's story for reasoning), though very curious to see if someone will counterclaim this, as that claim is about the only thing that would save you from the sheer amount of inconsistency you've produced.

[Helga Pataki]

"Eh, don't sweat it, Tenko. Jamie tends to make that joke a lot. I just, uh... overreact.

"As for the scumminess of Red Red Red, it is not only the pushing of no lynch that has pushed my buttons, though that certainly earned him my vote when he first did it day 1. As for Violet Yakumo's arguments on its lack of scumminess... well. I can't quite say what scum Red has to gain from it. I can't see what -town- Red could have gained from it, either, and as such I think I dismissed your argument there earlier as somewhat of a WIFOM case. Regardless, the no lynch vote and maintainment didn't really promote discussion, as he claimed. O9K commentary? Rehash. Milhouse push? I don't really see where he's coming from, though it might be because I am a capitalist wage slave (though if Red Red Red converts that to mean scum I've got a coffee to pour over his head; I'm as much a victim of capitalism as he!). Astley vote today? As much as I enjoy the company on him, placing the vote and citing only the lurker aspect feels off. In other words, I'm not feeling the content boost you're feeling, and the maintainment of no lynch still rubs me the wrong way since it really is just a bad thing to push for in general.

"And... Okay, !cake. Unless more problems come up that's claim enough. Still keeping eyes on you, but... yeah, okay, that claim is good enough for now.

[Asuka Langley]

##UNVOTE: THE CAKE IS A LIE

Sure, good enough for an immediate vote removal. Just about sure that's enough to clear if there isn't a counter-claim, unless scum somehow know how the cats died. It can obviously also be explained as an SK, but so long as !he's effectively anti-scum and has to play that way I don't think it makes a difference in at least the short run.

I'm not entirely sure how !you reached the conclusion to go for the cats, as there are no hints in !your day one talk to support it.


##VOTE: COMBO BREAKER

I should be somewhere, and right now it's somewhere between C-C-C-C, CATS and an extreme lurker (or Commie, but I'm still really stuck there). Of them, I feel that my vote is still not best served on a lurker when we're still waiting on four people to post today, including the main culprits there and it's close to a dartboard decision there (okay, the big black box is worst of them regardless), and I'm at least willing to wait on this 'proper post' that CATS has in the wings. C-C-C-C, however, has the baggage from yesterday chaining into being surprisingly light on the Commie today despite being doggedly on his tail yesterday and at least one large ball of gas here in discussing !Cake on New Hotness. Kept a joke vote down for longer than necessary (by which I mean through another, serious, post). Easily distracted by the shiniest of immediate stuff as well. Closest to the model of 'oddly supportive of o9k' that I was looking for.

The big black box being bad for super low content lurking is sure, a case I can see following, but his vote on o9k coming during the joke phase is irrelevant. Disappear after joke vote phase, return and find the vote to be made is already in the right place. Sure, the disappearance and low content on reappearing is bad, but the happenstance of the vote is not, and not something to base a case around.

[Nathan Greaves]

I'm not entirely sure how !you reached the conclusion to go for the cats, as there are no hints in !your day one talk to support it.

During the night, I basically tried to quantify everyone in a sentence or so. When I realised that I couldn't say anything at all about lolcats - not even 'hueg lurker liek xbox' - I decided something was up. Given that I had basically messed up D1 horribly I figured it was worth taking the shot because otherwise I was likely to die today. If I hit Town...well, it was worth a try.

[Bill Hellsnake]

Sorry about the extended nap, everyone. But don't worry. I'm never gonna let you down.

"Moving on. Rick Astley, and by extension anyone who in the future might be inclined to do as such; please announce an intent to hammer -before- hammering, alright? Seeing that darling little hammer post just as I was getting here was about the equivalent of getting rickrolled by goatse.

"In point of fact... a post with horrible/deceptive syntax voting for Russia, a post to us defending his own post after we voted him and explaining what the syntax was supposed to mean, the switch off much later which placed a self-claimed 'worthless' vote, and then the sudden hammervote. That is the entirety of the content Astley has provided. While the vote for Russia I'm willing to set aside, the rest of it seems pretty much pathetic."

##VOTE: Rick Astley

"And since people seem to think my early vote on the rickroll was unreasonable, a brief syntax explanation, provided by Hazel:

Scum's gotta keep those joke votes hot
[Which nine thousand sure has not] <---- Primary actor
Unlike (Shiki and the Comrad) <--- Secondary actor, used -as a comparison-
He hasn't even said a thing
Just stay neutral and sing.
Which I'm thinkin' is a sign that he's ba~ad. <--- Applies, due to syntax, to -the primary actor-. Thus it reads as if Nine Thousand was accused of being bad, but the vote was for Soviet Russia, thus my vote on Astley at the time; he read as if he was contradicting himself.

Skimming through Day 2, when I noticed this. Just gonna take a few minutes to pick it apart before I get back to the rest of the posts.

First off, I did declare an intention to hammer. My vote on the !meme was, as I said, to state that I don't like him. However, after that, I got pestered a whole bunch to make a "meaningful vote" so I did. With about an hour left in the day, anyway. Got a problem with it? Don't take it up with me.

Next, about my content. That self-proclaimed 'worthless' vote also had a reason behind it, and the hammervote was as sudden as the people yelling at me for not doing it earlier.

Finally, about my little routine. I said that scum's gotta keep those joke votes hot, and o9k had not. That seems pretty clear, doesn't it? Alright, gonna get back to reading.

[COMBO BREAKER]

##VOTE: COMBO BREAKER

I should be somewhere, and right now it's somewhere between C-C-C-C, CATS and an extreme lurker (or Commie, but I'm still really stuck there). Of them, I feel that my vote is still not best served on a lurker when we're still waiting on four people to post today, including the main culprits there and it's close to a dartboard decision there (okay, the big black box is worst of them regardless), and I'm at least willing to wait on this 'proper post' that CATS has in the wings. C-C-C-C, however, has the baggage from yesterday chaining into being surprisingly light on the Commie today despite being doggedly on his tail yesterday and at least one large ball of gas here in discussing !Cake on New Hotness. Kept a joke vote down for longer than necessary (by which I mean through another, serious, post). Easily distracted by the shiniest of immediate stuff as well. Closest to the model of 'oddly supportive of o9k' that I was looking for.

The big black box being bad for super low content lurking is sure, a case I can see following, but his vote on o9k coming during the joke phase is irrelevant. Disappear after joke vote phase, return and find the vote to be made is already in the right place. Sure, the disappearance and low content on reappearing is bad, but the happenstance of the vote is not, and not something to base a case around.

I never like the line of thinking that not voting immediately on someone you were suspicious of yesterday is automatically scummy, especially since I questioned Soviet on most of his arguments today. I believed that the thing about X-Box was noticable enough to bring up and worth a vote, even if I change it down the line. How else do you want me to show I am serious about the case? If I was less suspicious of Soviet I would have explicitly said so, but I did not and I am not. Also, if I was distracted by the shiniest immediate stuff, why would I even put the case and vote on X-Box to begin with? No one had even mentioned it (and it is worth mentioning). Especially since you yourself posted "Make Joke Serious, Get Lynched". Yes, there is a time gap, but he supremely skated through the day and it just looks like classic scum lurker material.

As for the joke vote thing you claim is so bad, I didn't really have anyone serious to vote on at the time when I put up the post poking at O9K's reasoning, so I just forgot to unvote. Simple as that. I don't see how you're attributing a one post gap to immense scumminess.

I'm not pulling off until X-Box posts something substantive. Soviet is still high, high on the list (BTW, still waiting on the answers to those questions, Soviet... again... like I waited yesterday without any sort of answers to the questions I asked you).

Cake... the cake is not a liar, hopefully. Nothing I can say that hasn't already been said though.

[Helga Pataki]

Skimming through Day 2, when I noticed this. Just gonna take a few minutes to pick it apart before I get back to the rest of the posts.

First off, I did declare an intention to hammer. My vote on the !meme was, as I said, to state that I don't like him. However, after that, I got pestered a whole bunch to make a "meaningful vote" so I did. With about an hour left in the day, anyway. Got a problem with it? Don't take it up with me.

Next, about my content. That self-proclaimed 'worthless' vote also had a reason behind it, and the hammervote was as sudden as the people yelling at me for not doing it earlier.

Finally, about my little routine. I said that scum's gotta keep those joke votes hot, and o9k had not. That seems pretty clear, doesn't it? Alright, gonna get back to reading.

"Response appreciated, and you're right - somehow I boneheadedly missed that you did, in fact, say you were willing to hammer. That... I'm still somewhat annoyed about the whole matter since responding to the pressure to move your vote doesn't sit well with me, but that diffuses the annoyance to those that commented on it (I believe I read the page 7 hammer, skimmed back, saw people pestering you about it, and concluded that you had placed the vote). Use of word 'worthless' to describe your own vote probably just shut down my own skimming at that point, especially since you had ended the day.

"Frankly, if you didn't want pressure to move your vote, why call your own vote worthless, though? The situation still sits poorly with me - you effectively provoked your own hammer reaction.

"I already explained the syntax issue, and I admitted day 1 that there was an alternate way, which you seem to have intended, for that post. It still merited bringing up in the breakdown.

"Finally, the Milhouse vote? Just says you're voting him based on gut. Nothing else. Seems just a way to try and pull attention to him - perhaps not that day, but later. Light mudsmearing, if you will - I can't see a point behind those events.

"I'm going to be gone for a fair chunk of time at this point, work concerns loom. Vote is standing for now, want to hear more from a lot of people, and so on and so forth until the dawn of time part two."

[Bill Hellsnake]

Alright, not feeling well, so I'm gonna try and make this brief so I can get back to sleep.

HLX: Insultingly absent. In his post, he also says that talking about Jesters is fear-mongering, but then goes on to talk about it himself. Really needs to get on the ball, and actually post some real content soon, otherwise will remain incredibly suspicious.

!meme: Gonna put out a call to post, since you seem to be absent in Day 2 so far. As for the rest, well, not really liking your posts Day 1. Big thing that sticks out to me is that last Day 1 post, during your largest WoT. Looks like your forcing a lot of what you said there- namely the part where you mention me, !cake, the Dogs. It kinda looks like you're contradicting yourself within that Wall. Mind breaking it down and explaining it?

Motherland: Consistently bad play. As others have said, a lot of it is incredibly WIFOM-y, especially that No Lynch bit, but frankly that last post of yours really strikes me as off. You claimed suspicions of 2 people, with what seemed like actual cases on at least one of them, but instead you go for LAL, wherein your only case is "lolcat was lurker, is ok." In Soviet Russia, does Scum lynch Town?

Cup-Sisters: About your case on the !cake, I'd just like to point out that you're mud-slinging there. It's pretty clear that he--she--it didn't want the lurkers to come out and have an excuse to avoid the Zerg Train. As we've already seen, when someone is near a hammer, the only discussion it tends to create is 1) whether or not to hammer, 2) defences of the accused, and 3) lightly touching base with any of the points of the case just to show that you're aware they're there. I'm reading that, and when I read beyond what you bolded, I'm noticing that  !cake wasn't contradicting itself. There's more, but my head isn't with me now, sorry. If I don't address this again in my next post, feel free to call me down on it.

As things stand, I'm looking between Motherland and Cup-Sisters. Gonna ##Vote: 2Girls1Cup just to take the path less travelled, however. And now, sleep~

Cup-Sisters Ninja: No more "syntax" claims, mmk? Click the link in the lyrics. It was provided for good reason. (I told you I'd never let you down. Never run around and desert you, either)

[Zerg Rush]

KEKEKEKEKEKEKE!

Since I failed to bold in my last post, let's make sure what I did was clear and recorded.

##Vote: The Cake is a Lie

KEKEKEKEKEKEKE!

Now then, with the defensive claim in mind.

##Unvote: The Cake is a Lie

Unless there's a counterclaim or such, that's enough to get me off your case for the moment. My previous complaints still stand however. Its been documented that 3rd parties are possible in this set-up, so, shooting lolcats does not particularly make you a townie, even if there is no counterclaim. It does mean you can be potentially useful though, so you get to live for the moment. Hurrah!

KEKEKEKEKEKEKEKE!

So, for the moment, I'll fall back to my secondary case. ##Vote: Russia

Looking at your post from this day, I'm not particularly fond of what you do. You throw out about five different suspicions, then go and attack two different lurker angles. Are you saying the lurkers are worse then your suspicions? Do you have any particular ranking to your suspicions? Do you think the cases on your five suspicions are weaker then the cases on two day one lurkers? I'm very curious as to why you put your vote down where you did, instead of anywhere else, and why you chose to only give short, one point arguments instead of actually looking deeper into things.

[VySaika]

Votecount Unicorn Attack!

Votecount
Soviet Russia: (2) - Demotivator, Zerg Rush
Cake: (0) - Touhou Hijacker, Advice Dog, Zerg Rush
XBOX: (2) - Touhou Hijacker, COMBO BREAKER, Touhou Hijacker
2girls1cup: (1) - Touhou Hijacker Rick Astley
SHANA IS HOT: (1) - Cake
Rick Astley: (2) - Soviet Russia, 2girls1cup
Demotivator: (1) - SHANA IS HOT
COMBO BREAKER: (1) - Advice Dog

With 14 memes alive, it takes 8 votes to axe someone in the face.

[Chad Hutchins]

To Combo Breaker:

This is so gonna be an ugly day 2 to look forward to. Right now, as far as I see, we've got two plausible lynch cases: Over 9 inches and Soviet Communism.

That said, is there any more progress to be had within the debacles set up for this day? I'd want to see a bit more insight on the Crappy Fighting Game Mechanic/Pimp My Ride debacle, but at this point, things feel like they're becoming drawn out and tired. Although I hope at least 9.1 Inches can make something of a convincing "last stand" if it comes down to it.

Herd town like cattle!

Good NK is good. Interesting to see an extra death in N1, but it's worked out, so not complaining.
....
What I'm looking at for now, though, are the roles that've flipped. Or, more specifically, looking at the role of Body Double, I'm wondering if Yo Dawg was the intended kill of the Mafia. 'Course, this is just mild speculation while I look around for other people, and wait for some input from our quieter members from D1.

Pointless role speculate!

Discussed herding specifically yesterday!  Is irritating to be asked again to point out things and have to wrangle quotes into post, is not obvious?  Not complaining too much but please do not try to paint loyal soviet in bad light for "not answering" when asker of questions too lazy to go back and find own answers!  

In Soviet Russia, man who ask trapping questions scummier than man who answer!  (this is joke.  mostly.)

Cake concerns explained, Cake good in soviet book.  Still wish for Astley to make give thoughts.  XBox not pressed on because XBox flat out not post, ees in modkill danger.  Less scummy than posting a leetle but saying nothing, нет?'

Ninja by Astley, just the man I am looking for, oh ho ho!

... Astley seem to not have seen Cake claim, or not understand?  Argue against lurker lynch, argue on cup sisters case on cake, is bizzare.  Agree with me that Meelhouse is scummy, but say I am scummy for not pursuing case... then Astley also do same thing on case?  What.

Vote stay on Astley for sure now!

Ninja more by Zerg Rush! 

Да, I am saying lurkers worse than suspicions, at very least in terms of deserving early day pressure.  Pressure which has now paid off on Astley!  Astley now definitely top of pack, Cake suspicions now gone, rest not in particular order really.  What "deeper looking" you want, eh?  This attitude, that people scummy for suspicions not being ranked, for not "following up on cases", for putting votes on lurkers?  Thees is how lurking scum win!  Ees very good to vote lurkers.  Suggest people do it more, especially Astley now.

[COMBO BREAKER]

I asked because I still didn't see any of what you were talking about in their posts. Both times you brought up the herding you didn't really say exactly what about it was herding. Whats wrong with asking someone to back up their argument? There's nothing to be gained by letting details slide.

I still don't see how that qualifies as herding. It's strongly worded argumentation. I don't sense any sort of maliciousness behind it.

And I'll admit my mistake on Demotivational. I only checked his Day 1 stuff for it since you mentioned "early role speculation". I assumed it meant Day 1.

[Chad Hutchins]

I still don't see how that qualifies as herding. It's strongly worded argumentation. I don't sense any sort of maliciousness behind it.

Check timing of first quoted post, Да?  That early in day, to use "strongly worded argumentation" to narrow to two lynches and already complain about tough day 2, is very alarming indeed!  But for now, what do you think of Astley here, comrade?

[Chad Hutchins]

In Soviet Russia, mafia game emptyposts in you!

Six hours and nothing, when brave Soviets have free time at last?  Reeeally?     Well, bed for loyal workers now.  Please consider lynching Astley, also look back at Meelhouse and company!

[Alice Margatroid]

In the interest of activity, I have been summoned to speak my piece, in hopes of cutting through the current deafening silence (at least a little bit). However, I cannot stay for long, as there are still plenty of matters to attend to back at the Dragon Palace as well as Bhava-Agra. Do not expect more from me after this for a while.

Read: Posting this and then will be gone for a long while for various real-life reasons. Sorry to add to the number of people not posting. Also, I'm very quickly running out of intellectual-style characters, and I'm starting to worry about it.

With the Box's continued lack of presence, I cannot, in good faith, remove my vote from him until he posts something awe-inspiring or a message descends from the heavens that he will be struck by lightning. The two players I look at after him, at this point, are Combo Breaker and Mr. Astley.

Combo Breaker is for reasons various Gensokyo residents have lightly touched on throughout their visiting time. I will bring forth the writings of Ms. Kaenbyou, Ms. Scarlet and Ms. Yakumo, who all talk about his odd penchant for innaccurate accusations, first toward Mr. Zibit and then toward...the Box, aggravatingly enough. He also states that he was the first to mention the Box case, which is patently untrue, as Ms. Shameimaru had already printed an article about it. If he refers not to the case in general but his specific point about the joke vote maintainence, well, that has already been addressed, and is hardly something to champion.

Mr. Astley is for general lack of content on Day 1 and several instances of unexplained/underexplained Day 2 content. His suspicions of Milhouse have morphed into something else that he only states and does not explain. I read the post in question and did not particularly see these instances of "forcing" he mentions, nor do I see any readily obvious contradictions, and with no explanation for these accusations I cannot tell at all what he is thinking. Similar lack of explanations surround his response to Hazel's case discussing Cake's contradiction, and his brief discussion of Mafia theory does not help me understand why he holds the position he does. These cases do not energize me at all.

Then there is his thrust toward the Russian, which presents an opinion I see the insect hordes also hold regarding the Russian's opening vote. I read that vote as not simply voting for a lurker, but voting for a lurker with no memorable content. We already have one scum flip that fits that exact description, so I see no wrong in pursuing that angle. Simple "you're voting for a lurker!" charges are lackluster at this stage anyway, as it is very possible to lurk and still look townie. The most obvious way is to produce good and memorable content when you actually do post. Shana does this for me, for example.

There may also be a bolt of OMGUS here, as I feel like he is trying to slight Ms. Whiterock and overblow the circumstances of his hammer. It is true that she did ask him to move his vote somewhere meaningful, and it is also true that he declared an intention to hammer. However, I cannot understand why, when pressed about this, he did not simply say "I had declared intent to hammer" and left it at that. Using strong language such as "I got pestered a whole bunch", "Don't take it up with me" and "people yelling at me for not doing it earlier" is unnecessary and just looks like trying to shift the blame our way. But, again, I may be biased in that regard.

[Chiaki]

Soviet: I swear you are twisting Astley's position around to make him seem hypocritical on top of his lurking. I don't think the parallel you draw between your situations is on the spot; I mean, he doesn't really like look his case on Milhouse was a heavy dose of suspicion. I am also trapped between a couple proposed statements;

1) Lynching lurkers is good! (said by you and many others, no doubt)
2) "Because one scum lurks, the others clearly also do" (said by you, does not seem at all an axiom to lynch by in mafia, the pointing out of which is (somewhat ironically) the only worthwhile thing out of demotivational today in my view, feels like a wrongheaded way of pointing everyone towards a typically-maligned subset of the game... which consists of like a third of this one.)

In other words, 1 may be true, but 2 is not and feels like a way of pushing people towards 1 under bizzare rationale. I believe I must retract my earlier position on demotivational, now that I agree with him; today soviet's play seems very much a 'prey on the weak!' deal. (I suppose I have to disregard lolcats vote here, although I do generally believe that scum on a train like that means they're on town.)

##UNVOTE OF DENIED ENCOURAGEMENT, ##THE SOULS OF A THOUSAND DEAD MOSQUITOES: SovietRussia

2g1c: Why are you voting Astley? Furthermore, I believed he projected his hammer well enough. So.

Combo breaker makes me a bit leery for cheerleading Cake's case on me without really adding anything, but nothing solid on him.

[Asuka Langley]

(to avoid incoming mod lightning)

Over 50 hours of day time since the big black box has last posted (and, let's face it, first posted).
Boxed Air is closing in on the 48 hour mark as I post this.
Even Milhouse is now over 40 hours.

What's the call on this, mod? I feel like a vote on the big black box or Boxed Air ought to be worthless at this point as I'd rather at least the former was obliterated for having not actually taken part in the game, and I don't feel much less for the latter. None have been active since day two started, so I'm not going to be paranoid about stupid possibilities like a silencer.


C-C-C-C: Or may I call you -2C? Anyway, sure it's more often than not the case that you'll want to change votes between one day ending and the next one beginning, but what I actually disliked was the sudden toning down in your stance on the Commie despite no relevant new information. Hmm, I was about to recant and say that you weren't actually so strongly on the Commie during day one as I thought you were, but what's this?

If I was less suspicious of Soviet I would have explicitly said so, but I did not and I am not.

You thought the Commie was worse than the big black box but you voted the latter? To show you were serious or something? I'd like to label this excuse as 'When Retconning Goes Wrong'. I can't shove the following down your throat as much as I'd like given that Hijack is doing similar, but what your vote for the big black box distinctly smells like to me is a delaying tactic for a later jump. What makes it worse than the Hijack is that they're more committed to the position (and have early townie points to cash in), whereas you have explicitly set the easy stage for a later leap:

I'm not pulling off until X-Box posts something substantive.

Oh gee, that's some pressure there. It smells yet worse after the similar, but less bad, vote on Dawg yesterday.


Splitting my post here as I don't want the -2C case to get lost in the middle.

[Asuka Langley]

CATS has yet to deliver the promised 'proper post'. Uh okay. Reeeeaaallly doesn't sit well with me when he's the only poster actually present in day two without a vote down, on top of the mounting negatives from before.

With no forthcoming counter-claim (not that one seemed likely), !Cake seems clear for now unless Milhouse counter-claims, as I'd lynch either boxes ahead of !Cake should they claim. There are other tricky possibilities, but if true they're already in hand and I don't want to contemplate or direct night actions, so won't mention them.

On a similar note, 2g1c's claim is enough to remove her from my list of potential lynch candidates for today. I've been keeping out of the semantics between them and Duck Roll v2 (for what it's worth, I read it at the time with the intent Rick has claimed), but dislike the latter for casually ignoring this claim, and likewise dislike the cases being built outside of defence. Don't buy into either side of the finger-pointing between him and the Commie. In turn, growing oddly more comfortable with the Commie as time goes on. Still can't fathom the day one play, but actually don't have much issue with the day two content thus far outside of potentially how far he intends to push the solidly anti-lurker stance. Muddied a little by the positions from the New Hotness and CATS that the cats' vote for him makes him less likely to be scum, which it doesn't - the muddying mostly coming from disliking CATS otherwise already.

Expecting an ultimatum on the lurkers, I'm looking at -2C > CATS > Duck Roll v2 as things stand.

[Margaret Houlihan]

As 2G1C said, the main case against the Soviet early-day wasn't for the No Lynch, it was for claiming that was all an elaborate ploy, for the most part. It's just got worse since then to me.

Because I want an excuse to use this, and Soviet now is the closest I'll come: DEMOTIVATOR!

For this post, what is it in Astley's posts that imply he hasn't seen the Cake claim? I don't see a single comment implying that Cake is scum or looking at Loldeath.
I'm also kind of concerned with how much that post and this one are attempting to push town completely towards an Astley lynch, especially considering you've attacked Milhouse for mostly the same thing.

Agreeing with Advice Dog on at least one part of -2C case: "post something substantial" is never a good reason to move a vote. Vote scummy behaviour, not just a lack of town. -2C looks bad, but I definitely think the Soviet looks much worse, and I'm not seeing the problem with Astley's content today.

How long have we got left in this day? Last votecount has no time mentioned.