A memes to an end(Meme Mafia: Game Over)

[COMBO BREAKER]

[COMBO BREAKER]

(Anyone mind me trying to direct Combo's posts a little? I'm getting tired of the same damn pics and want to see some original posts, since we'll have to tolerate them either way.)

[Helga Pataki]

Screw roleplay, I've got posts!

Stupid logic theory post ahead! Please correct any mistakes!

Okay. What we have claimed:

Touhou Tracker saw !cake target ADog.
Demotive Watcher saw Touhou target !cake. (No one else.)
!cake targeted CCCCCC.
We know: ADog received the Killer Instinct.

Can the hijacker/switcher/whateverthefuckitis be -someone outside these three-?

Basic logic says YES; if all three are telling the truth, !cake must have targetted CCCCC. CCCCC and Advice Dog must have been swapped/hijack'd/bussed/whatever swaps -targets-. Demotive watched !cake, saw only Touhou target !cake (as the swapper need not in theory target !cake, this still holds), and Touhou saw !cake target ADog, who -due to busser was the new target of !cake-.

Is there an issue with this logic? If not, then -there is not definitively scum between the three, and in point of fact I'd venture there is not scum amongst any of the three. Touhou/Demotive, at the least, are not lying about their roles, and !cake, even if third party, is not actively malicious to town due to a (potential) honest attempt to catch a second scum with his ability.

[COMBO BREAKER]

SO I HERD U LIKE MY IMMORTAL?

Preview first chapter, yes yes?

Hi my name is Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way and I have long ebony black hair (that's how I got my name) with purple streaks and red tips that reaches my mid-back and icy blue eyes like limpid tears and a lot of people tell me I look like Amy Lee (AN: if u don't know who she is get da hell out of here!). I'm not related to Gerard Way but I wish I was because he's a major fucking hottie. I'm a vampire but my teeth are straight and white. I have pale white skin. I'm also a witch, and I go to a magic school called Hogwarts in England where I'm in the seventh year (I'm seventeen). I'm a goth (in case you couldn't tell) and I wear mostly black. I love Hot Topic and I buy all my clothes from there. For example today I was wearing a black corset with matching lace around it and a black leather miniskirt, pink fishnets and black combat boots. I was wearing black lipstick, white foundation, black eyeliner and red eye shadow. I was walking outside Hogwarts. It was snowing and raining so there was no sun, which I was very happy about. A lot of preps stared at me. I put up my middle finger at them.

"Hey Ebony!" shouted a voice. I looked up. It was.... Draco Malfoy!

"What's up Draco?" I asked.

"Nothing." he said shyly.

But then, I heard my friends call me and I had to go away.

AN: IS it good? PLZ tell me fangz!

Is it as good a second time?

Hi my name is Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way and I have long ebony black hair (that's how I got my name) with purple streaks and red tips that reaches my mid-back and icy blue eyes like limpid tears and a lot of people tell me I look like Amy Lee (AN: if u don't know who she is get da hell out of here!). I'm not related to Gerard Way but I wish I was because he's a major fucking hottie. I'm a vampire but my teeth are straight and white. I have pale white skin. I'm also a witch, and I go to a magic school called Hogwarts in England where I'm in the seventh year (I'm seventeen). I'm a goth (in case you couldn't tell) and I wear mostly black. I love Hot Topic and I buy all my clothes from there. For example today I was wearing a black corset with matching lace around it and a black leather miniskirt, pink fishnets and black combat boots. I was wearing black lipstick, white foundation, black eyeliner and red eye shadow. I was walking outside Hogwarts. It was snowing and raining so there was no sun, which I was very happy about. A lot of preps stared at me. I put up my middle finger at them.

"Hey Ebony!" shouted a voice. I looked up. It was.... Draco Malfoy!

"What's up Draco?" I asked.

"Nothing." he said shyly.

But then, I heard my friends call me and I had to go away.

AN: IS it good? PLZ tell me fangz!

[Li Syaoran]

Was very busy yesterday, still am very busy for about 5 more hours. Have checked over the role madness, think it's very unlikely that all of Cake, Demote and Touhou are telling the truth, at least right now. Not sure what to think of Astley and Boxed Air.

[COMBO BREAKER]

Let's check in with our good friend, Advice Dog!

[Alice Margatroid]

Mr. Astley, it's possible Demote is more than just a Bus Driver or Hijacker or whatever, or that scum obtained extra info somewhere along the line (who knows what lolcat could have done Night 1). You're asking me to speculate on scum roles in a role madness game with possible bastard moddery; I don't think this experiment is likely to succeed.

I targeted Cake because his inconsistent statements, kill claim and subsequent disappearance on Day 2 started inclining me toward thinking him third party. Wasn't fully convinced, but the suspicion was there, so Optical Camouflage go. I was curious to see if he had any other machinery at his disposal, and I also wanted to make sure he kept honest about his kill target.

Shana, I do think it is possible Demote is trying to pull something of an endgame run for a buddy (with seventeen players and role madness I believe four scum to be the case and was a bit surprised to see this actually get discussed) by getting me mislynched (if I may exteeeend my own aaaaarm for a moment) and creating a lot of confusion to oust some more role info. It is also possible we are both telling the truth and someone else entirely hit a redirection button, but Demote's play has been sufficiently scummy that I am more inclined to think him scum than speculate about outside forces.

I naturally assumed it would fall to me to declare results first tomorrow. I have no problem doing this.

[COMBO BREAKER]

Hey Statler, have you ever seen a troll this big?


Not since my wife died!

Wohohohohohoho!

[Margaret Houlihan]

So, SO relevant. Ignoring the 'picture', just taking the captions here.

Touhou is not Speculating on Roles is Speculating on Roles! Let's Play: Go through Touhou's posts today!
Post #1: Bel Air > Astley > me > Xbox > Shana > others. No comment on Cake and says that the NKs don't really change much.
Jump to Post #2 where they use an in-topic claim that could apply to either Scum or Town and a proven target to roleclaim. This is followed by some WIFOM regarding 3rd-party Cake and then accuses me of lining up lynches and rushing without hearing from everyone when I explicitly state that we need more input.
Post #3 says exactly why Cake would target Combo, despite Post #2 saying that Cake shouldn't have.
Post #4 jumps back to me apparently lining up lynches and being scum Bus Driver. Except, y'know, I wouldn't have known that nobody other than you targeted Cake.
And now, Post #5, the last of today, where you say you're not speculating on roles, and thus say "He could be more than just Bus Driver!" If that's not role speculation, what is? You seem to now be certain that I am scum, despite having both Bel Air and Astley ahead of me at the start of the day, and say that it's possible somebody else redirected the kill, but you're happy to assume it was me. Don't base your argument on the fact that I'm counter-claiming you; if it's possible for someone else to have redirected it, vote for who is most scummy. If you think that's me, I'd be interested to hear what I've done today to push me ahead of Rick and Bel Air who, outside of a questionable Mason claim, haven't offered all that much.

[COMBO BREAKER]

So, SO relevant. Ignoring the 'picture', just taking the captions here.

[Alice Margatroid]

Post #1: Bel Air > Astley > me > Xbox > Shana > others. No comment on Cake and says that the NKs don't really change much.

I do not much appreciate trying to paint me in a bad light due to my being pressed for time. There was a workshop emergency and I had to go right then and there so I didn't have time to think much about who I saw flip. Even given that, it's true that the flips did not change my list of who I thought was the scummiest very much, as I had just mentally dropped Cake into the third party bin, so if I had the time to attach a Cake modification to that post it would have been a separate matter entirely.

Jump to Post #2 where they use an in-topic claim that could apply to either Scum or Town and a proven target to roleclaim. This is followed by some WIFOM regarding 3rd-party Cake and then accuses me of lining up lynches and rushing without hearing from everyone when I explicitly state that we need more input.

The claim coming before my return I can do nothing about. This is the point of having me claim first tomorrow, is it not?

I saw "I'm content with lynching Combo today and Touhou tomorrow" in your post and chalked it up to attempting to line up lynches. Why would you even say something like this if you were town, regardless of prefacing it with "until we get some more input" or not? It presupposes me to be scum, and all the prefaces in the world don't change that. "I really want to hear what Nitori has to say on this subject" is what I would have expected a town Demote to say, as it comes with the implication of "I will wait until all parties have weighed in before casting judgment". A snap decision of "okay I'd be happy to lynch Nitori tomorrow" is not what I would expect a town Demote to make.

Post #3 says exactly why Cake would target Combo, despite Post #2 saying that Cake shouldn't have.

I agree that targeting Combo was the right choice over doing nothing. I still hold that targeting someone else Cake thought scummy would have been a better choice than Combo, however.

Post #4 jumps back to me apparently lining up lynches and being scum Bus Driver. Except, y'know, I wouldn't have known that nobody other than you targeted Cake.

This assumes I should take your role as exactly what you have claimed and is already addressed in my response to Mr. Astley.

And now, Post #5, the last of today, where you say you're not speculating on roles, and thus say "He could be more than just Bus Driver!" If that's not role speculation, what is?

Where did I say I was not role speculating? I said it was likely to be fruitless, not that I was not going to do it at all.

You seem to now be certain that I am scum, despite having both Bel Air and Astley ahead of me at the start of the day, and say that it's possible somebody else redirected the kill, but you're happy to assume it was me. Don't base your argument on the fact that I'm counter-claiming you; if it's possible for someone else to have redirected it, vote for who is most scummy. If you think that's me, I'd be interested to hear what I've done today to push me ahead of Rick and Bel Air who, outside of a questionable Mason claim, haven't offered all that much.

For one, you targeted Cake yourself. My reasons for thinking you more likely to be scum than town with someone else pushing buttons on the outside are pretty much summed up in my response to your second statement.

[Helga Pataki]

Blah. I'm here, I'm reading, I had a huge post of stuff, let's just summarize and say I'm not yet buying that both Demotivator/!cake are lying, as I believe both would have to be in Touhou's example (logic presentable upon request) barring some extremely bizarre role. Flip side, push on Touhou seems somewhat scratchy:

Right. Until we get some more input, I'm content with lynching Combo today and Touhou tomorrow. For now, though, I'm off, so don't expect input from me for a while. No doubt I'll return to a spam wall of pictures that I'll just lol at and move on.

^-- Quote from your end p13 post. You do look kinda like you're lining stuff up, dude, and if I'm not mistaken you did that... before Touhou posted again, so her calling you out for the lineup isn't terribly unsurprising (ninja noted by Hijack who claims the same thing).

Possible scum is on either side of this argument, but... blagh, this seems like a gamble for both sides, bigger for Demote than for Touhou but regardless. Back in a bit.

Gutchecking TvT spat, honestly, kneejerking remaining two non-CCCCCC scum are cheerleading one way or another from sidelines, and thus:

I'm gonna read day 2 again. Right now, people I'm looking at: AYB, Shikishana, Boxxyel Air, MPDAstley. Idly, confessionally not pleased at the lack of much commentary from AYB/Air, but all four are kinda low on the radar which isn't a happy thing and the heavy lurkertude here amongst other things is worrisome, extremely so.

This is a trainwreck.

[VySaika]

Votecount

COMBO BREAKER (5): Cake, Russia, Touhou, XBOX, O R'LYEH, Russia, COMBO BREAKER

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Roughly 49 hours remain in Day 3.

COMBO BREAKER is at L-1!

[Bill Hellsnake]

D1 Astley here, I'm pestering D2 Astley to show up, but we're having disagreements about a few things, so, eh.

Regardless, I'm gonna be busy enough that I'm not sure how much I'll be able to add after this.  That said, I think I'm happy about where discussion stands for today, aside from AYB not really having joined in yet, and Bel-Air having said nothing at all about the Touhou/Demo issue.  At least, not in public.  Granted, the conversations I have had with the guy have me leaning town, but I'm not going to expect you guys to take my word for it, so I'll try and boot him into posting.

I'm still leaning against the Hijackers, but honestly, despite having brought it up, it still seems a little too convenient.  I mean, that the guys named hijack would be a hijacker (though, after some recent Mafia's I can accept that that does happen).  Main reason why I'm no longer to eager to hold onto today.  So, will be content to vote after AYB's had a chance to raise some issues, and have them resolved.

[Bill Hellsnake]

Would somebody mind taking their vote off of C-C-C-CRAZY? Not comfortable with him--her--IT being at L-1. Thank you.

Cup-Sisters: Your one and only DuckRoll V2 is here and ready for some action! (Preferably some song and dance) Before I answer your questions, might I add that the Applesauce Warriors already met last Wednesday, and are now on their yearly vacation. *ahem* Right then, your questions. Yes, there are two of us at the reins here. I was in control D2, and am in control right now. No, it isn't part of the role. I was originally meant to be a replacement, starting D2. (So, uhh, yeah. Couldn't really explain why D1 did what D1 Rick did. Sorry. I figure you weren't told about it, either, because Bastard Modding) But then, I got very frustrated with this game and its massive un-fun trainwreckiness, so the original came back and offered to take the reins from me, and I was torn between just giving up (I did say I was never gonna give you up) and staying in control, so the mod allowed for two people to be in control of the one account. Bel Air can confirm this. Oh, and Bel-Air is not me, I am not him. Nor is DuckRoll V1. Bel-Air is separate from us.

[Helga Pataki]

.........

Well, I'm decently confident after a quick analysis of a few things that you are, indeed, two separate people. How much of the whole bastard moddery whatever thing I believe, I don't know; for a replacement to come in between D1 and D2 without announcement? Uhm. Please excuse my incredibly high amount of suspicion at that. It's really not... uh, it would be bastard moddery on a pretty special level, that; far more inclined to believe it's role related. But for now, I'll let that simmer, as there's little to be done today about it. Regardless, if you're not two different people, I'll be more than a little bit surprised, since one of you very very indirectly (perhaps unconsciously) has been hinting on it from D2 (as in I don't think even I would've guessed it, if not for experience spotting it and thinking to go back -now- and check to confirm, and if you're actually doing it intentionally to throw people off I will be incredibly surprised).

I'd be more inclined to believe the invisible replace -if XBox's replacement had also been invisible-. As it stands? Uh. Yeah, skeptic present. Working on reread still.

[Chiaki]

2g1c: I think demotivational is far less likely to be scum than touhou because using a role to try and push a lynch on touhou would inevitably lead to his own destruction were he lying, and trading 1scum/1town is stupid from the scum perspective. Basically, he's playing to lose if he's scum. But playing to win if he's town!

[Chiaki]

Also, I think I may have made a terrible mistake in playing this rolegame.

Touhou Tracker saw !cake target ADog.
Demotive Watcher saw Touhou target !cake. (No one else.)
!cake targeted CCCCCC.
We know: ADog received the Killer Instinct.

Can the hijacker/switcher/whateverthefuckitis be -someone outside these three-?

*headdesk*

retracting forceful suspicions, entering reconsideration mode.

[Chiaki]

ebwop: and that's 2g1c, not demo as the quote.

[Margaret Houlihan]

Me at this puzzle of roles.

I do not much appreciate trying to paint me in a bad light due to my being pressed for time. There was a workshop emergency and I had to go right then and there so I didn't have time to think much about who I saw flip. Even given that, it's true that the flips did not change my list of who I thought was the scummiest very much, as I had just mentally dropped Cake into the third party bin, so if I had the time to attach a Cake modification to that post it would have been a separate matter entirely.

I'd assumed that much, yeah. I'm not attacking you for time restraints either, I'm attacking you for saying "At a quick glance, flips change nothing" when it was blindingly obvious that they would and did. If you'd simply said "No time to mention them now, more later" or something, I'd not think it was a problem.
Second point was me suddenly going from third to first without much (if any) reasoning throughout the day.

I saw "I'm content with lynching Combo today and Touhou tomorrow" in your post and chalked it up to attempting to line up lynches. Why would you even say something like this if you were town, regardless of prefacing it with "until we get some more input" or not? It presupposes me to be scum, and all the prefaces in the world don't change that. "I really want to hear what Nitori has to say on this subject" is what I would have expected a town Demote to say, as it comes with the implication of "I will wait until all parties have weighed in before casting judgment". A snap decision of "okay I'd be happy to lynch Nitori tomorrow" is not what I would expect a town Demote to make.

You said yourself that opinions need to be given so we can be held responsible for them later. I've already said that a lack of role knowledge is my main reason for being pretty much certain you were scum - not so sure now, with the alternative scenario presented. This was essentially me saying "Cake's target was changed, only Touhou targeted Cake. I think the answer is obvious." You'd line up lynches for 2x Cop results, and that was what I was seeing this as.

This assumes I should take your role as exactly what you have claimed and is already addressed in my response to Mr. Astley.
[...]
Where did I say I was not role speculating? I said it was likely to be fruitless, not that I was not going to do it at all.

If it is bad to speculate, then don't do it. If it is not, don't tell others that it is a bad idea to. Hypocrisy is bad.

The rest of the points, argued well enough, I guess. I'm still suspicious, but I'd rather look towards others first, since there's almost certainly at least one scum lying in the other 5 (being AYB/Xbox/Shikiana/Bel Air/Astley).
Oh, and just a side-note? You mentioned my claim several times, and I'm going to say now that I have not full-claimed. Doing so means I lose my ability completely, and I'd rather that not happen.

2 Ninjas 1 Cup: Xbox's replacement also came after hours and hours of nothing, while Rick's came during/after a Night Phase. It's believable enough for now.
OH GOD SHIKI IS NINJA: ...uhm, what? I'm sure there's a point to that second post, at least, but where is it?

[Tanaka]

I'm here, not much new to say, haven't really said anything on the Demo/Toujou role madness since everytime I think I figure something out about it I pretty much just think of something else that just kind of makes me go  at my previous thoughts.  Though if I had to guess I would probably lean towards Touhou being the scum myself, though I've been trying not to think about it so much since I'm bad with that kidn of WIFOMy madness.

I do have one question for Russia, what alignment would you consider your previous role giving off if someone were to learn of it, would someone who learned of it, think "well that's pretty towny" or is it of an ambiguous nature without the alignment in that it would leave a neutral tell?

I'm thinking I may have a good case, and the answer I get from Russia will have me either considering it really damn solid or just another case to think about depending on the answer, seconding the notion of someone removing the vote from combo for now, we still have plenty of time left in the day and I rather avoid a hammer too soon if possible, even if Combo is flooding the thread.  Also, there was no announcement for Astley's replacement since it was during the night period.

[VySaika]

I will confirm that the Astleys' account of thier multi-playership is correct. Astley 1 was replaced during night 1, as it was during the night phase and it's an anon game, I saw no reason to make a fuss out of it. XBOX was then replaced during the day phase, so I had to make an annoucement of it.

Then at the end of day 2, Astley 2 was wanting out and Astley 1 suddenly had free time again, so I let them tag back out. Then the idea of them just tagteaming the account came up, I thought it was funny so I allowed it. This isn't roles and it's not something that I had planned from the beginning, so I think it's only fair to actually clarify. Note I am saying nothing about the alignment of the role or the mason claim or anything else. Just the replacement/multi-player issue.

Bastard modding? All signs point to probably~ But at least everyone now has Word Of Mod on what's up with Rick and Roll.

[Princess Leia]

Again, said I would post so I will; less has happened than I'd expected, though. First, demotivator, whom are you saying is pretty much confirmed town in this? Me? Soviets? Someone else?

Looking surprisingly flustered there, Touhou. You of all people should know, if what you're saying is true, that the demotivator was also telling the truth about what he saw - and he did so before you made your roleclaim. So what on earth is the logic of this post? And when Astley calls you on it, your response is far from reassuring:

Mr. Astley, it's possible Demote is more than just a Bus Driver or Hijacker or whatever, or that scum obtained extra info somewhere along the line (who knows what lolcat could have done Night 1). You're asking me to speculate on scum roles in a role madness game with possible bastard moddery; I don't think this experiment is likely to succeed.

Russia's point about SKs being made unlikely by my/his role is sound, but also precisely the kind of reasoning we've been explicitly warned against - rolemadness bastardmod game, remember. So I wouldn't give it too much weight.

I don't see any reason for Astley/Air to be lying wrt masonry, but I see no need to look for one, because in this game I see unconfirmed mason as pretty much null for determining alignment. Astley has at least explained the silly ragequit a little, and is posting solid reasoning. (Heck, this post is twice in quick succession I'm repeating one of his points - but given how many people are still running with the stupid "no way all three can be town" line, it bears repeating)

Demote was lining up the lynches (though I can see him not realising; wording is everything here) and his pressing of the Hijack is clumsy, but honestly I think Touhou comes off looking worse. Sloppy reasoning from the demotivator can potentially be written off as just that (which still hardly leaves him looking great), but that simply isn't the case for Touhou given previous days.

Rick requests removal of a C-C-C-C vote, which I did consider doing, but no. With selfvote and modvote already on him, a hammer would either reveal a new power we want to know about, or make someone look very suspicious indeed; leaving him on L-1 is fine by me. (Honestly I'm not at all convinced letting the day go on has made things better for town - this mass roleclaim is giving the scum a lot of info, and a lot of it could've probably waited until tomorrow. But whatever)

Bel-air ninja, doesn't look great. Declines to give a concrete view on the big issue, and then rolefishes. But he's claiming to have something solid, and it probably affects me given my relationship with the reds, so I'd better make sure he can speak his piece. ##Unvote.

[Nathan Greaves]

This is a trainwreck.

Most truthful thing anyone's said all game.

Alright, so. I have to wonder something.

Does anyone know what this role-swapper or whatever it was did on Night 1? Does anyone think their action may have been misinterpreted or misplaced? I'm curious as to why this appeared today and not yesterday is all. 2g1c wasn't swapped (bit strange to put that effort on someone you've roleblocked), and clearly neither was Milhouse given his investigation on Combo. I hit lolcat, Astley got his recruitment to Bel-Air through, Xbox got the Leather Jacket to Soviet, and Touhou saw it happen. How much is left if this is all true?

Now for the incident which I've dubbed 'Me, De and Nitori'.
Firstly. Demotivational, you've said already that you can't claim, but you get anything useful Night 1?
Second, my own opinion on the matter. I'm not convinced that De is scum trying to get a mislynch on Touhou, because it's too blatant and upfront. Touhou is interesting in that people jumped to lynch her very quickly, when the evidence against her - namely that she targeted me - probably isn't enough to put her ahead of the Astley/BelAir pair. That said, the instant OMGUS accusation on Demotivational is somewhat unnerving, but hopefully another set of Night actions should help clear this matter up. In other words I'm unconvinced as to either of them and we have an obvscum to lynch anyway, so...

Bel-Air/Astley claim I'm still not convinced by. Bel-Air popping up to say 'Hey, I exist and still have no opinions except for a good case I'm going to say absolutely nothing about!' is making him flare up further than his partner does. Even if they are masons, Bel-Air is still worthy of a lynch from where I'm standing.

Also, I'm holding AYB to his promise to produce content.

[Margaret Houlihan]

First, demotivator, whom are you saying is pretty much confirmed town in this? Me? Soviets? Someone else?

Russia.

And this section makes no sense to me:

I don't see any reason for Astley/Air to be lying wrt masonry, but I see no need to look for one, because in this game I see unconfirmed mason as pretty much null for determining alignment. Astley has at least explained the silly ragequit a little, and is posting solid reasoning. (Heck, this post is twice in quick succession I'm repeating one of his points - but given how many people are still running with the stupid "no way all three can be town" line, it bears repeating)

The "no way all three can be town" refers to me/Touhou/Cake generally, methinks.

Ninja: Night 1? No information, if that's what you mean. I also have no idea if my ability went through as planned or not, but I've reason to believe it did.

AYB's content is due around now, methinks? Or, more, around an hour ago. Shame, since I'm leaving now. If there are any specific questions, I'll be around for another 10-20 minutes to answer those, but that's all I'll do for now - I'm half-dead today and past experience has taught me that this is never a good time to post in Mafia.