Author Topic: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)  (Read 269204 times)

Meeplelard

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1400 on: May 16, 2011, 07:10:14 PM »
Oh, that's what mastering your attacks does? I'm still pretty far from enough AP to do that at this point.

Mastering your skills do two things:

-Lowers the CP needed to equip it.  This might not seem like a big deal, but once you start hitting CP limits, it makes a huge difference (and yes, you do gain CP as you level up.  Level 100 characters have 450 CP, for reference); for attacks, its pretty much always halves the CP Cost.  For support skills, its...all over the place.

-If the skill has a yellow Diamond on its name, that means mastering it leads to a new skill.  For Attacks, this pretty much always means a Brave -> HP Chain.  For support skills, its usually "learn some extension of that ability", like "Speed Boost+" is just an upgrade of Speed Boost, or "Disable Counter Attack" is learned from Counter Attack.
Note that all Brave -> HP Chains require to be equipped like any other skill; you'll see what I mean when you get them.
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Shale

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1401 on: May 16, 2011, 08:40:52 PM »
I've already hit the CP limit with Vaan, actually - I can't equip Torrent without stripping out some other skills. So I can definitely see how that would help.
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Tide

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1402 on: May 17, 2011, 05:41:20 AM »
Chrono Trigger: Up to the Ocean Palace. Been streaming this as I play with various people (Super, Meeple, OK and Trancey are the usual suspects). If you have Skype, you're free to join me as I play through it. I haven't really been paying attention though so I've done awesome things like walk into a fight with my entire party at 1 HP, then promptly wipe.

A couple of screen shots for your viewing pleasure:

« Last Edit: May 17, 2011, 05:45:56 AM by Tide »
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Tonfa

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1403 on: May 17, 2011, 11:51:00 AM »
There are a bunch which are "Fire and pray"; ideally you use these to punish bad blocks, but alas, its not as good against the AI which sometimes just cheats with dodges.

The AI never does anything physically impossible, so if the followup fails it just isn't an airtight link.
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Meeplelard

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1404 on: May 17, 2011, 03:58:33 PM »
There are a bunch which are "Fire and pray"; ideally you use these to punish bad blocks, but alas, its not as good against the AI which sometimes just cheats with dodges.

The AI never does anything physically impossible, so if the followup fails it just isn't an airtight link.

It does the physically improbable though; people have noted the AI RELIABLY does things that most humans could not do remotely reliably.  One example is dodging a near point blank Level 3 Great Attractor; humans can TECHNICALLY do this, but most won't be able to pull it off. The AI?  Probably manage it 7/10.
And naturally, "Mind games" does not apply to the AI, as its never actually surprised.

Now granted, there are exploits that work on the AI that won't work on the human, cause its patternized and such (AI tends to get tripped up by Meltdown Level 2 + Holy (Combo) pretty well, doesn't work nearly as well on a human), but really, this just emphasizes that HUman Combat =/= AI Combat, hence why "Vs. The AI" tends to be ignored.  It proves little one way or another.


Granted, "The AI Cheats" is something that applies to most Fighting Games like this.  They'll pull off stuff that no human can, be it physically impossible stuff (pulling off charge moves when they clearly were NOT charging.  SF2 AI Guile's Flash Kick is the probably the most iconic (and the most offensive) example of this), or having some inhuman telegraphing skills making them capable of blocking you no matter what minds you do (I am told that MvC3 Very Hard tends to do that), etc.  Of course, this is offset by the AI generally always being exploitable once you know how (how exploitable and how easy to exploit varies from game to game), in ways that a human wouldn't fall for, so the AI is always BEATABLE, but its never a good replication of human combat, for these things.

Why do I specify fighting games where the "AI Cheats"?  Cause for Action games, generally you are NOT the same playing field as the enemy, so the things are weighted heavily from the get go, and the key there is figuring out how to use that to your advantage, work away your disadvantages, etc.  RPGs, unless the game is really stupidly programmed (I was told it was proven by hackers that the AI DOES cheat in Hoshi, as the RNG IS skewed in their favor; this...would match my experiences, for all that yes, it could still be psychological), the AI is usually bound by the same laws as humans are, even wtih the RNG, and the RNG favoring the AI just tends  to be "your luck sucks", not the AI cheating (you remember the bad luck more than the good luck cause in things like FE, one bad crit from the enemy can completely screw you over after hours of work of getting a lot of awesome RNG moments in your favor, that 3% Crit hitting will be remembered, and that "AI CHEATS!" mentality kicks in.)

In Fighting Games though, AI has access to all the same stuff humans have IN THEORY, but then certain factors kick in from programming that do not kick in with humans, such as human reaction time generally won't be as fast as the AI (though, this is partially offset by humans having a much deeper draw of reactions to choose from, so they'll do some really un-conventional shit to get out of scenarios the AI would never use.)
« Last Edit: May 17, 2011, 04:17:58 PM by Meeplelard »
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[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
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Fenrir

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1405 on: May 17, 2011, 04:42:22 PM »
Mirror's Edge: Finished Chapter... 5? Love this game so far, wouldn't mind it to force me to do more crazy walljumps.

Torchlight: Finished. Took me around 85 deaths. The final boss was weird. Somehow, the best strategy to use against him is to just smack him like every random boss, run around after he summons its 4000 dragons with Hamstring, wait until he sacrifices them all for... God knows what reason (this doesn't seem to heal him, make him stronger, or anything?), then smack him again. Repeat for half an hour because he has ten million HPs. (and because melee vanquisher is really bad) Fun game, could use some balance.

Outland: In the sky. This is probably the best game on XBLA, honestly. "Platformer with Ikaruga's mechanics" is as good as it sounds, level design and boss battles are top notch.

Shale

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1406 on: May 17, 2011, 04:54:47 PM »
Yeah, blocking in situations where it should be nigh-impossible to reliably predict you is the hallmark of fighting game AI. Play Soul Calibur 3 on hard or very hard sometime, and marvel at the AI's ability to guard all your attacks but punish your feints, even if they look exactly the same at the point where you'd have to hit the button. Or to start ducking a sixtieth of a second before a throw would connect.

Anyway, finished Vaan's chapter and the first set of Report scenes. Fighting Zidane with Kuja was a giant pain in the ass - see above re: bullshit dodging.
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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1407 on: May 17, 2011, 07:04:45 PM »
Heavenly sword- Tried this. 1P beat em up with lag and some truly horrendous controls in the shooting section? I'll pass.
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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1408 on: May 17, 2011, 09:54:37 PM »
Started back up on a few games in celebration of finals being over.

Working through The Witcher, just finished Lakeside.  Fun plot, great sense of narrative and fantastic VA pretty much top to bottom, particularly Geralt.  What I particularly like about it is that you're forced to make choices and pick sides, but the options you're provided with always reflect not only the complexity and all-around unfairness of the situation but also that Geralt gets it.  Combat could stand to be more interesting, but it's just as well for me that it isn't.  Game's choppy as hell on my poor PC.

Also finishing up WA4

Started P3: the Answer.  Having a main that's not quite so overpowered makes poor choices by the AI rather frustrating, but I like how the story, such as it is, is shaping up.

Desktop Dungeons: played this a little bit, got bored.  I think that perhaps mc and I have diametrically opposite views of what makes games fun.  Dealing with limited resources ain't bad, but crunching numbers for overall effectiveness bores me.

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1409 on: May 17, 2011, 10:54:08 PM »
What I particularly like about it is that you're forced to make choices and pick sides, but the options you're provided with always reflect not only the complexity and all-around unfairness of the situation but also that Geralt gets it.

You'd almost think RPGs could have role-playing in them or something.

Random Consonant

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1410 on: May 17, 2011, 11:57:14 PM »
Shining Force 3 Part 1 - Beaten.  Second-to-last battle is mildly puntworthy for all that the game gives you an out there, but otherwise game is pretty much decent so far.

NotMiki

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1411 on: May 18, 2011, 12:00:57 AM »
RPGs have plenty of role-playing.  What's different in this case is that you're role-playing someone who's cool.
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Strago

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1412 on: May 18, 2011, 12:10:05 AM »
Huh. Bought the Witcher 2 this afternoon, but the damn thing won't install. Getting the following message after the install bar sits at around 2% for five minutes or so:

Feature Transfer Error
Feature: Required Files
Component: Data
File: E:\data2.cab
Error: Data error (cyclic redundancy check).

Anybody who knows anything about computers have a clue as to what's going on, here?

dude789

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1413 on: May 18, 2011, 01:20:55 AM »
My sister and I have started a play through of Pokemon Ruby using only grass types. It's been pretty interesting so far. There aren't that many grass types in the third gen, but we looked over the ones that were available and decided that a team of Breloom, Sceptile, Vileplume, Cradily, Tropius, and Shiftry would give us enough variety to get through (if we wanted to bother with trading we would have brought over a Lotad and Ludicolo would have bumped Cradily or Tropius.) We're about to start that large route that leads to Fortree City. The most difficult fight so far has been Maxie who took 4 tries followed by Brawly who took 3. Flannery and Norman also provided good fights.

The biggest problem with Maxie was his Golbat. At the time we had a Nuzleaf, a Gloom, a Breloom and Grovyle. Wing Attack 2HKOs all of my pokemon except for Breloom who gets OHKOed and it outspeed's everyone except for Grovyle. The first fight I was completely stunned by how much damage his wing attack did to my team, but after I lost I was able to develop a strategy. Breloom's offense was so good that he could beat Mightyena easily, and he could take out Camerupt with some help from Gloom. Since the fight takes place on a mountain, Nature Power turns into Rock Slide so my strategy was to have Grovyle Screech Golbat and take off some of it's health with Quick Attack so Nuzleaf can finish it off with Nature Power. The second attempt, Mightyena gets put to sleep by Effect Spore so Norman switches it out to Golbat and it takes too much for my team to take out Golbat. I get him, but Camerupt is able to take out the rest of my team. Third attempt, Screech misses twice and Wing Attack critical hits Nuzleaf. Fourth attempt, everything goes smoothly and I'm able to take them all out.

My main problem against Brawly is that I didn't really have enough of a team  for Leech seed to stall him out well especially because Nuzleaf was really unhelpful for that fight. Also, Grovyle has a defense lowering nature so every pokemon in my team had really shitty defense. First time fought him I forgot about Machop's guts ability and paralyzed the Machop and wondered why Karate Chop was one shotting everyone after only one Bulk Up. Second Time Machop used too many Bulk Up's early and I wasn't able to deal damage quickly enough. The third try was pretty close and I was able to have Nuzleaf live long enough against Makuhita for Leech Seed to kill.

Flannery and Norman both came down to the last pokemon but I knew that they would both be close fights and I never felt like I had lost control in either of them. Roxanne was easy because of the type advantage, and Shroomish had evolved to Breloom by Wattson so he was able to Mach Punch the Magneton. 

Overall, Nuzleaf, Shroomish, Grovyle and Oddish were all pretty close in usefulness, but Breloom is easily the most useful now that he's evolved. Grovyle was surprisingly bad for a while, but he's been starting to come into his own by being faster than everything and Leaf Blade means that he has good damage. Gloom has been solid but desperately needs a better attack than Acid. Nuzleaf struggled until the Bullet Seed TM, but is now a useful if not awesome member of the team. He knows Fake Out which is nice for getting extra Leech Seed/Poison damage and Nature Power is pretty helpful, but his stats are pretty meh. I'll probably give him the upcoming Leaf Stone and have Gloom wait until I get dive. Cradily is pretty bad. He's difficult to kill, but he can barely hurt anything. He can take out opponents with Toxic and Ingrain, but that's really boring.

jsh357

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1414 on: May 18, 2011, 04:10:03 AM »
Heh, cool.  I did a Flying only run last year in Emerald, and Wattson was a royal pain.  Once I got Salamence it was all over though

AndrewRogue

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1415 on: May 18, 2011, 05:50:03 AM »
Portal 2: Was good. Vaguely inferior to Portal 1. Haven't finished co-op with Ash yet, though.

Billy vs Snakeman: Ash was playing time based Facebook games and I have been watching Naruto while at work. Double whammy. Its still okay.

Vindictus: I deeply wonder how a certain company I work for succeeds when they have competition like this.

Dragon Age 2: My laptop is a fucking bitch. Into Act 3. Dragging a little bit, but still decent. Character plots needed to be tied tighter to plot.

Mass Effect 2: Insanity run. Jedore took like, 30 tries. Fucking Krogan.

Tide

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1416 on: May 18, 2011, 06:19:06 AM »
Front Mission 4: Skype replay. Currently ongoing on Mission 8 or something.
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Lord Ephraim

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1417 on: May 18, 2011, 06:54:39 AM »
Dragon Age 2: I don't know. Despite being able to talk, Hawke is without a doubt less developed than most silent mains.  He's pretty much the WRPG equivalent of Matthew in Golden Sun:

Respond everything with  :) or  ;D or  >:( or  ???.  What Hawke actually says is irrevevant, because the dialog is so rushed and boring.  

Other PCs are equally just as bland (hurr hurr Varric makes more dwarf jokes). Having Fenris and Anders in the same party is nothing but a whine fest: "Mages are bad!" "No! mages are being oppressed! Free the mages!" Isabella is a pirate and must act like one and I have no idea what Merrel's point is besides "HAVE A BLOOD MAGE". Reminds me of your party members in Golden Sun.  

Gameplay is at least flashy, quick and fun. Building your characters in the early game allows some different party synergy but in the end you get enough skill points to master all the good skills while you don't bother with the rest, kind of like class building in Golden Sun.

Then there's all the stupid fetch quests you have to do.  None of which actually ties into the main story but you find your self doing it anyways, cause you need the money for more stuff! Just like in......Golden Sun? <_<

*runs from Grefter*

Fallout New Vegas: Honest Hearts -  Automatically better than Dead Money since you can at least bring some of your weapons (75 lbs exact) and it's more wide open exploration like Point Lookout.  The new weapons are a bit lazy (more reskin pistols and armor) and perks require too much of the shitty Survival stat.  Oh well, another 5 extra levels and I'm practically maxed out on all my major combat skills.

Currently have an Indian following me around and won't shut the fuck up.  The game won't let me dismiss him either and I'm not on hardcore mode. Yao Guais are actually threatening since I didn't take my power armor and shooting their legs doesn't seem to slow them down.  I don't know really much what's going on so far but it's decent DLC so far.

Weather mods will fuck up the scenery there. Day/Night cycles are messed up and the water is green, like mutant green.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2011, 06:56:26 AM by Lord Ephraim »

Anthony Edward Stark

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1418 on: May 18, 2011, 07:54:50 PM »
From what I recall, the water in southwestern Utah is a pretty weird color, to be fair.

Either way I'm sad that I wasn't the one who got to massacre New Caanan.

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1419 on: May 18, 2011, 08:20:23 PM »
So Finally beat FF4 from a GBA cartridge I forgot I ever owned, not much to say other then fuck that games back attack rates, everything else about it was pretty much forgettable.

Picked up some more games on my way home from work, upon letting Hatbot decide I should play Disgaea 2 first.

Disgaea 2:  This games dialogue amuses me.  Also tossing people and making towers is strangely fun.

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1420 on: May 19, 2011, 01:24:07 AM »
Shining Force 3 Part 2 - So a useless fatass healer tried to put up a brave face but then people were like bitch please.  Then we went through a cave and rescued a ninja chick who is probably still a better ninja than Ryu Hayabusa.  Then the useless fatass healer got eaten by worms and nobody cared.

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1421 on: May 19, 2011, 05:09:19 AM »
Finished Honest Hearts. Great for exploration in particular, some fun fights, and the Survivalist journals show that Obsidian has a knack for writing evocative pieces using only text.

Meeplelard

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1422 on: May 19, 2011, 07:23:58 AM »
Devil May Cry 3 Very Hard:  Beat it as Dante.

Not much to say on highlights, its about what you'd expect of a DMC mode called "Very Hard".  Beowulf was notable for being really hard, and taking a good number of attempts, and Vergil 3 remains one of the best fights in the series; I probably wouldn't have beaten Vergil 3 if his AI didn't fart a bit near the end using only some of his basic moves instead of his advanced ones (as in, the moves I could dodge and punish more reliably due to more practice!), but whatever, I'll take it!

Arkham, meanwhile, raises the bullshit meter up.  He actually beat me with PIXEL RAGE AT ONE POINT; its just frustrating, not fun, and a very poorly designed fight overall...really gives off DMC2 vibes, cause its a fight that promotes "Sit back and spam guns" ...in a game where Guns are NOT an overpowered ranged weapon of doom so...uh, yeah.  Doesn't help that the only way to melee him is with DT, which is fine...except they REMOVE DT for the 2nd half of the fight due to a quirk in the system.  Not to mention a lot of ways you take damage is from shit you just can't see, due to camera angles, and how his attacks actually BLEND IN with him, and you can't even tell sometimes if he's attacking, moving, or his general proximity.

Easily the worst designed fight in the game (much like how The Savior is easily DMC4's worst designed fight.)  This fight and the GOOD ones just establish what makes DMC boss fights work, and that's how you generally mix up how you do things.  You actually feel like there are opportunities for genuine melee to get in damage, and otherwise, Guns work as a means to keep chipping (and potentially build up DT), and you slowly feel like you're learning the fight and its nuances.  The good fights like Beowulf, Vergil, Nevan, etc. in DMC3 Very Hard all gave me this feeling of "ok, I'm slowly getting the hang of this!"  combined with getting a feel for how much damage I'm taking.  Arkham?  Damage was both inconsistent, and a lot of cheap bullshit deaths, and I could never tell if I was improving or just getting lucky. 

(for the record, I did the entire game with no items, sans Arkham, who after about 3 and a half hours of failures, INCLUDING several ridiculously close ones, I just said fuck it and Vital Star spammed him.)
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1423 on: May 19, 2011, 08:50:00 AM »
Trinity Universe: Lots of good things about this game. Character diversity isn't one of them, sadly. DL-wise, there's some uniqueness from their starting mana and weapons, though. Also, DL-legal Prinny is always notable!

The best part of the game is probably the character dialog and how surprisingly well the crossover characters work together with the original cast. I also highly approve of the dungeon design - simple, short, timed, good reward-vs-risk, and best of all: Hunting Points. I do like being able to clear out random encounters and then explore without the nuisance. That little bit of control makes the entire dungeon process much more rewarding.

After a lengthy debate in chat, I will admit that the game is too breakable to really get much out of the battle system unless you impose your own limits to get some challenge. I think if the game didn't hand out level-ups like "Have You Been Saved?" pamphlets, there might be more to praise. I hear that Neptunia is a lot like this, but with a more interesting battle system. I may actually try that.

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Re: Playin' any games today, Flying Nun? (WGAYP - 2011 Edition)
« Reply #1424 on: May 20, 2011, 01:54:28 AM »
Bangai-O HD: Played the demo. It's not remotely as terrible as Spirits, but I still can't fathom why anybody would buy it when the N64 version is so easily emulated and actually a game instead of a collection of gimmick maps.
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[23:02] <Veryslightlymad> CK dreams about me starring in porno?
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