Nyarlathotep's Dungeon: Week 38 (Girlchan in Paradise)

[Nephrite]

"Perhaps I need to completely re-design things. Sometimes I wonder if I simply don't take this seriously enough..."

Snow vs. Floor 7
Dhyer vs. Floor 3
Nitori vs. Floor 1



Team Dhyer's Matches

Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes

"Ah... heroes. They usually take all the spotlight, don't you think? Well, I've dedicated part of my own dungeon to those who serve faithfully in shadow of those heroes... but who never get truly regonized."


Team Nitori's matches

Floor 2b: The Forboding Forest

"Hah! Welcome, fools, to this forest of mystery. It is here that you will all find certain doom. You will have to face those who have been lost themselves inside its formiddable brush, the natural denziens of this lush land... as well as a terrifying final encounter that will chill you to the very bone! So enter, if you dare, into this land of madness..."


Team Miata's Matches

Floor 1: Starting off Again

"Ah, a new challenger. Let us see what you can do, then.

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Team Dhyer | Ness, Cielo, Nina1, Raja, Seifer (Status Symbol)
[Floor 4: Midgame]
Team Dhyer vs. Kyra, Raja and Gryz
Team Dhyer vs. Palom, Porom, Cid and Yang
Team Dhyer vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita
Team Dhyer vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer and Shiho
Team Dhyer vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud and Reis

Team Nitori | KOSMOS, Arc, Sasarai, White Wizard and Marisa
[Floor 2b: Earlygame]
Team Nitori vs. FFT Red Chocobo, Black Chocobo and Yellow Chocobo
Team Nitori vs. Razzly, Turnip, Funguy and Neo-Fio
Team Nitori vs. Erk and Serra
Team Nitori vs. Spar, Frog and Bo
Team Nitori vs. Rude, Reno and Lete River Ultros

Team Miata | Lenneth, Aika, Alicia, Kevin (Firefly) Strago
Team Miata vs. Hrist, Big Joe and Gorudo
Team Miata vs. Rand, Cecil and Duran
Team Miata vs. Blissey, Axem Green, Sharanda (LoD) and Lucius
Team Miata vs. Milon Z and Kainazzo
*Full Heal
Team Miata vs. Laggy Fantasy Tactics Queklain

[DjinnAndTonic]

Team Miata | Lenneth, Aika, Alicia, Kevin (Firefly) Strago
Team Miata vs. Hrist, Big Joe and Gorudo - They gang up on Kevin, but he tanks their damage (or not, and Lenneth/Alicia revive/heal him), Strago OHKOs them all with overpowered-for-now Aqua Rake.
Team Miata vs. Rand, Cecil and Duran - It might take two Aqua Rakes.
Team Miata vs. Blissey, Axem Green, Sharanda (LoD) and Lucius - Takes forever, but none of these healers have infinite healing. Lenneth and Alicia do. Aika's Alpha Burst is also infinite, so this team just outstalls the healers and conserves Strago's MP.
Team Miata vs. Milon Z and Kainazzo - Aika has fire to take one of them out quickly. Alicia concentrates on healing while the others pile on with their best damage. Should take them out long before anyone dies, though even if they do, there's a full heal.
*Full Heal
Team Miata vs. Laggy Fantasy Tactics Queklain - This team is pretty overpowered at this level, so kneejerk is this should be no problem with full resources.

[SnowFire]

For reference: my writeup on Aika / Gilder for roughly when they get their various special moves.  Optional if you want to go by my interp, but writing this here for future reference.

Team Miata | Lenneth, Aika, Alicia, Kevin (Firefly) Strago
Team Miata vs. Hrist, Big Joe and Gorudo
Team Miata vs. Rand, Cecil and Duran - Kill Duran, not enough offense remains to kill Kevin, heal up.
Team Miata vs. Blissey, Axem Green, Sharanda (LoD) and Lucius - Hypothetical earlygame Aqua Rake is insane even though Strago has enough gas for like 2 castings.
Team Miata vs. Milon Z and Kainazzo - Beatdown on Kainazzo.
*Full Heal
Team Miata vs. Laggy Fantasy Tactics Queklain - Is Chicken Race MT/GT/ST?  I know vanilla Nightmare is area target, and Lenneth & Alicia need to be near each other to unleash Soul Crushes.  Still, I guess you can argue Kevin is from an ARPG, so he wanders off to a corner where only he gets hit, and Team Miata gets enough damage in before Leneth / Alicia eat Chicken / Paralysis.

[Dhyerwolf]

Aww, no more quirky 3 choice Floor 4s. That said, for perhaps the first time yet, feels like Status Symbol actually is beneficial! Let's see if it's enough.

Not even home to see my notes on what I have and don't at this point, but doesn't feel relevant. This floor is a notable ease up.

Team Dhyer | Ness, Cielo, Nina1, Raja, Seifer (Status Symbol)
[Floor 4: Midgame]
Team Dhyer vs. Kyra, Raja and Gryz- All 3 PCs here have something that Status Symbol hits! Raja durability is Raja durability, and I have plenty of healing and they have no sources of damage that go near each other remotely. And as always, using MT against me means enabling Seifer.
Team Dhyer vs. Palom, Porom, Cid and Yang- Three enemies here have something SS is good against! Yang is now horrid. Cid is always horrid. Twins have good things, but of the ST variety and are slow. Lightning Resistance at least slows down Cielo! Pick off Porom and the fight is fairly easy to control.
Team Dhyer vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita- Again, 3 enemies all have some status that blocking is great! Albel and Roger aren't much on damage though, and really function well...as statusers in this environment. Peppita is Peppita, which is to say a little headachey. Hey, she can of course now use Healing Dance with more effect...which of course limits her damage, and no cheap status to help there at all. While less sure here, this doesn't seem to dangerous I think
Team Dhyer vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer and Shiho- This fight...is kind of bad for floor 4. They can really overkill 1 enemy. And no great gem knockers, so they can get decent damage next turn between Lawfer and Belenus, but yeah.
Team Dhyer vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud and Reis- Well,  lots of ST or small AoE, and not even paricularly great at that without some massive penalties. Reis is Reis, Cloud real big thing is quick status, because the damage is soooo slow, and W8 is a kickass DL tranlsation/spoiler.

Yep, SS was finally a benefit on this floor. A good chunk of the really dangerous moves where completely neutured, leaving a lot of ST damage at best.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Team Dhyer | Ness, Cielo, Nina1, Raja, Seifer (Status Symbol)
Team Dhyer vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud and Reis- Well,  lots of ST or small AoE, and not even paricularly great at that without some massive penalties. Reis is Reis, Cloud real big thing is quick status, because the damage is soooo slow, and W8 is a kickass DL tranlsation/spoiler.

Yep, SS was finally a benefit on this floor. A good chunk of the really dangerous moves where completely neutured, leaving a lot of ST damage at best.

Yeah, I agree with this.

I will note that by this floor, Seifer's damage is starting to lag since he's getting compared to a PC cast with multiple GFs per party member and the ability to cast drawn/carded spells more freely. Even assuming that Seifer is getting phantom junctions to let his stats sort of keep up with the core team's, his Limit damage isn't vastly outpowering the mid-level spells or Boosted summons. Still good, but not overpowered anymore.

That said, SS rapes this floor anyway. Dhyer passes.

[Nephrite]

Admittedly, the floor probably could be a little more interesting. I realized it had been a while since I updated and didn't want to make six hundred floors so I'll improve that one. Don't worry, you'll have some options for 5. (Probably low-healing vs. reverse floor again)

[Dhyerwolf]

Team Dhyer | Ness, Cielo, Nina1, Raja, Seifer (Status Symbol)
Team Dhyer vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud and Reis- Well,  lots of ST or small AoE, and not even paricularly great at that without some massive penalties. Reis is Reis, Cloud real big thing is quick status, because the damage is soooo slow, and W8 is a kickass DL tranlsation/spoiler.

Yep, SS was finally a benefit on this floor. A good chunk of the really dangerous moves where completely neutured, leaving a lot of ST damage at best.

Yeah, I agree with this.

I will note that by this floor, Seifer's damage is starting to lag since he's getting compared to a PC cast with multiple GFs per party member and the ability to cast drawn/carded spells more freely. Even assuming that Seifer is getting phantom junctions to let his stats sort of keep up with the core team's, his Limit damage isn't vastly outpowering the mid-level spells or Boosted summons. Still good, but not overpowered anymore.

That said, SS rapes this floor anyway. Dhyer passes.

Isn't Nyarly's stuff essentially scaled to the DL (aka: Seifer never really gets any worse even level scaling up due to lack of GF)?

[DjinnAndTonic]

It... might be?

Can you think of another example where it might matter?

[Clear Tranquil]

I thought that too ... Which means even enemy Pep doesn't get Magical Dance or Dream Hammer right? (Healing Dance > Magical Dance chains give her an endless loop of HP and MP recovery at max where she never runs out of the HP or MP required to use them -unless you OHKO her - ... which I don't know if it even matters here because I'm not sure if Albel/Roger can ever do enough damage to break an endless stall >_>)

[Nephrite]

Enemies are always scaled to DL while teams grow like they would in-game.

[SnowFire]

But PC Seifer in the DL freezes at Floor 2 or so which is the last floor you use him on.  So I'd see Seifer as nearly totally static after that point.  (Which is fine for Seifer.)  If you want to assume hypothetical mid-to-late game Seifer, I'd give him access to the same junctions everyone else is, because if you did hack him in you'd be able to do that.  The only reason this is relevant, really, is that perma-Floor 2 Seifer never runs into damage cap concerns, while Floor 5+ Seifer is unhappy that he stops at 9999 MT limit damage, especially if you're using a "with junctions" damage average.

[dude789]

Miata and Nitori pass, but I don't think Dhyer can beat the SO3 floor fast enough for them not to devastate his mp so he gets beat on the last fight.

[Dhyerwolf]

SO 3's MP damage is mostly just ST, and only one of 3 is at all good at all. That one is also the one with the MT healing, and using MP damage means she's not healing the team. Albel is a bit below average at it (and means he takes a damage drop) and Roger is just bad at it. Even worse, they can't leave Raja alive or else going for MP busting is pointless. Granted, also needs to see MP Busting hitting through SS, which I could see going either way.

[DjinnAndTonic]

But PC Seifer in the DL freezes at Floor 2 or so which is the last floor you use him on.  So I'd see Seifer as nearly totally static after that point.  (Which is fine for Seifer.)  If you want to assume hypothetical mid-to-late game Seifer, I'd give him access to the same junctions everyone else is, because if you did hack him in you'd be able to do that.  The only reason this is relevant, really, is that perma-Floor 2 Seifer never runs into damage cap concerns, while Floor 5+ Seifer is unhappy that he stops at 9999 MT limit damage, especially if you're using a "with junctions" damage average.

Would you rank that Seifer as a 1.0 dungeon pick?

[SnowFire]

I'd probably rank Seifer as 1.5, though a mehish 1.5.  I'd generally rather have FF1 Knight who has durability and minor healing at the cost of explosive MT damage, but Seifer is solidly better than FF1 Monk in most situations, who's proven his worth as a solid 1.0 in some teams.  That said, there were always be some borderline characters who are tweakable in cost.  No point in punishing somebody because they chose underpriced picks.

[Random Consonant]

Team Dhyer passes

Team Nitori... sure, tenative pass

No vote on Team Miata.

[Clear Tranquil]

Teams Nitori and Miata vs Dungeon

Team Dhyer vs Dungeon - Not sure why Peppita wants to waste her time trying to keep useless scrub allies alive instead of going gung ho Peppita style with Power Dance/Faerie Friend > Faerie Friend. That said I'm just assuming Dhyer's team manages to bumrush/status her out before she's able to wreak any real havoc~

[Bardiche]

Note: Alicia gets Heal at level 8, not inclined to let her start with it. That said, I think all three teams pass each of the floors.

[SnowFire]

Lenneth has Heal from the get-go IIRC, and depending on how you interpret the Dungeon, arguably both of them can't spam it the same turn anyway.

[Bardiche]

Miata passes even without Alicia's Heal, though, but I just felt it should be mentioned. Djinn was hyping her Healing so much, even though VP2 Level 8 isn't exactly "starting out". Lenneth is beastly at floor 1, though.

[074]

Team Dhyer | Ness, Cielo, Nina1, Raja, Seifer (Status Symbol)
[Floor 4: Midgame]
Team Dhyer vs. Kyra, Raja and Gryz - statused.  Kyra takes some time to go down, but is otherwise good.
Team Dhyer vs. Palom, Porom, Cid and Yang - Status Symbol takes care of the worst of what these guys can do in theory.  Low Yang respect in general, and lol palom and porom durability.
Team Dhyer vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita - None of them can revive, but Peppita gets some pretty nasty damage in.  Or heal.  She gets taken out first.  Status Symbol FTW here.
Team Dhyer vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer and Shiho - I'll buy Dhyer's argument.
Team Dhyer vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud and Reis - Okay...Cloud's potential status is blocked, fortunately, which leaves this a slugfest.  If Cloud wants to try anything meaty, he's honestly going to get slammed during chargetime.  Cielo is relegated to healer/status as FFT equips are easily arranged to screw lightning, and Ness can't really do much magically himself to W8.  But on the plus side, everyone's pretty much stuck as ST, and there is no shortage of healers.  I'm going to wager a guess that Dhyer's team can pull it through easily.

Team Nitori | KOSMOS, Arc, Sasarai, White Wizard and Marisa
[Floor 2b: Earlygame]
Team Nitori vs. FFT Red Chocobo, Black Chocobo and Yellow Chocobo - Red Choco tries to meteor Marisa. Black ends up biting it before he moves, and then Red goes down.  Yellow is mocked.
Team Nitori vs. Razzly, Turnip, Funguy and Neo-Fio - ...uh, lol CC?
Team Nitori vs. Erk and Serra - Serra goes asplode.  Then Erk goes asplode. 
Team Nitori vs. Spar, Frog and Bo - ...healers that have mediocre healing, decent durability, mediocre damage, and no revival.  And if I remember correctly, Spar has the wrong statbuffs anyway.
Team Nitori vs. Rude, Reno and Lete River Ultros - This...can get nasty.  No fire and I don't quite know how well Sas' healing is so far.  Abstain for now.

Team Miata | Lenneth, Aika, Alicia, Kevin (Firefly) Strago
Team Miata vs. Hrist, Big Joe and Gorudo - BIG JOE!!!111one
Team Miata vs. Rand, Cecil and Duran -This would take a while...except that I remember that Strago has Aqua Rake, which just so happens to be an obscure element and fairly decent early on.  Kevin eats the first few hits, Lenneth MRs one of the others and starts her beatdown.
Team Miata vs. Blissey, Axem Green, Sharanda (LoD) and Lucius - Healers.  For the most part, this is a rather 'bleh' match.  They might eventually pummel Strago with staffwhacks.  Might.
Team Miata vs. Milon Z and Kainazzo - We once resort to Lenneth and Kevin Beatdown.  Milon Z sucks horribly and only has the semblance of physical durability due to Darkness spoiling the only one with an actually competent physical.
*Full Heal
Team Miata vs. Laggy Fantasy Tactics Queklain - Queklain eats it to physical beatdown from hell, the way I see it.  Might Reinforce is possibly involved.  At least, that's what I'm buying for now.

[Bardiche]

Team Nitori vs. Rude, Reno and Lete River Ultros - This...can get nasty.  No fire and I don't quite know how well Sas' healing is so far.  Abstain for now.

I'm guessing Sasarai has 3 or 4 L2 charges at this time. Not sure because Suiko3 magic charge progression. He shares his offence with Kindness Rain, though... which means he cannot use his Earthquake more than twice or he won't have any juice to heal in the final fight.

Kindness Rain is 400 HP on the entire party. Around endgame, people have average of 416 HP. The 400 HP figure is augmented by Sasarai's MGC stat, which is quite high. Consider it full healing+status healing.