Nyarlathotep's Dungeon: Week 48

[Nephrite]

"Hmph. So you've come out victorious again. Let us see what happens this week..."


Team Super vs. Dungeon Floor 4
Team MOUSTACHE and dude vs. Dungeon Floor 3

Link to the Dungeon Wiki!

----------------


Team Super | Edgar, Maxim, Zemeckis and Hydra, Hawk, Kyra (Speed?)
[Floor 5a: Ceaseheal (After Midgame)]
*On this floor, healing effects are reduced to 10% (for both sides) and revival may not be used.
Team Super vs. Reno, Rude and Elena (Midgar forms)
Team Super vs. Krin, Karn and Locke
Team Super vs. Yulie and Yukiko
Team Super vs. Mua, Fred and Cecil
Team super vs. Berle

Team MOUSTACHE | Athos, Adray, Moulder, Bartz with a Moustache, Alakazam (MOUSTACHE Sealstone)
[Bartz: Monk (Mastered), Blue Mage (Mastered), Chemist (Mastered), Red Mage/Time Mage]
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes]
Team vs. Hahn, Tia, Luna, Mareg and Shana
Team vs. Palom, Porom, Edward and Yang
Team vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita
Team vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer, Arngrim and Shiho
Team vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf and Reis

Team dude | Deis2, Emily, Jerin, Bowswer (Speed?), FFT Priest
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes]
Team dude vs. Hahn, Tia, Luna, Mareg and Shana
Team dude vs. Palom, Porom, Edward and Yang
Team dude vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita
Team dude vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer, Arngrim and Shiho
Team dude vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf and Reis


Speed? - The speed of the bearer is set to 120% average speed and may not be increased. The rest of the team is set to 95% of their normal speed (not set to 95% period) and may have their speed increased.

MOUSTACHE - Allows the team to have 12 points because of the power of 'stache.

[superaielman]

Team Super vs. Reno, Rude and Elena (Midgar forms)- Warla should soften the damage up from the turks enough for Maxim to live (He has Valor at this point, which restores 60ish% HP when focused on the floor). Elena can't use charm first turn either. Kill a turk, heal damage, go from there.  Making sure Maxim keeps his MP refreshed with IP MP healing is a good idea  as well.
Team Super vs. Krin, Karn and Locke-Easy enough. Noiseblaster/sleep team, heal as needed, smash.
Team Super vs. Yulie and Yukiko- Noiseblaster owns this fight.
Team Super vs. Mua, Fred and Cecil- Warla/Telele make this fight controllable enough.  
Team super vs. Berle- Maxim has five shots of Valor at this point, which is enough to carry the day.

[Dhyerwolf]

Team Super | Edgar, Maxim, Zemeckis and Hydra, Hawk, Kyra (Speed?)
[Floor 5a: Ceaseheal (After Midgame)]
*On this floor, healing effects are reduced to 10% (for both sides) and revival may not be used.
Team Super vs. Reno, Rude and Elena (Midgar forms)- They certainly can kill these ones. I suppose Defense Up should allow the MT healing to outpace someone. Kyra and Maxim both have 10% (and can Maxim MT this at 5% MT?). Elena has the craptastic (But still!) MT damage and Confusion, are is the dangerous one. Does get a turn though. They do add up to nearly PC HP if taken literally, so...the argument for Kyra dying is there. They need to heal to full if she doesn't die to keep her alive.
Team Super vs. Krin, Karn and Locke- Locke blocks Confuse, other two are faster than Edgar, and they do 75% together.
Team Super vs. Yulie and Yukiko- Yukiko only halves Confuse, so that's easy
Team Super vs. Mua, Fred and Cecil- Oh...um...things are not looking as great here. At 15% for standard deviation, Fred is faster than 120%, but Mua is not. If you see SD higher than that...Fred and Mua attack before Edgar meaning Confuse doesn't even come into play. I believe that they+Cecil kill Kyra turn 1 (Note, this is also true with Earth Shields which are 2 equips, 5 users out of cast of 70ish though). I'm not sure there's much point in anyone else attacking besides Air Anchor. Fred at least gets another turn, then Edgar could status him, then Mua gets another turn and get's statused, and then Edgar could Air Anchor them. Gut reaction is one will probably get in another turn (be hit by ally at right time), given the team 3 more attacks. They kill Hawk or Maxim (Only if attacks aren't too spread out. Two healings gets Maxim out of trouble). If statused is blocked...scenario is much the same but then Maxim definitely dies if they aim at him.

Note: If Edgar doesn't have Air Anchor, this turns so incredibly ugly and it's probably a loss here.
Team super vs. Berle- Berle has...a lot of PDur. Solo boss, so not scaled. 11 PC HP PDur to me. Edgar/Zemeckis and Hydra/Hawk is likely the team coming in. When Metaguard is down, they do approx (+.25+.5+.5+.4fuck if I know on Hawk)...so about 1.65 PC HP. They need about 6 open turns, during which Berle gets about 18 attacks to me. No healing though...so Hawk is gone in 3, and then...the damage hemorrhage spells bad things. The team making it is likely dependent on allowing Earth Shields (Although...hmm, without blocking status, Mua and Fred just snipe at each other. They lose a turn, but it's also just another turn that Cecil gets.

Team MOUSTACHE | Athos, Adray, Moulder, Bartz with a Moustache, Alakazam (MOUSTACHE Sealstone)
[Bartz: Monk (Mastered), Blue Mage (Mastered), Chemist (Mastered), Red Mage/Time Mage]

Bartz MT status appears to be Mind Blast (1 Turn MT Paralysis)
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes]
Team vs. Hahn, Tia, Luna, Mareg and Shana
Team vs. Palom, Porom, Edward and Yang- I believe this team has at least 3 status healers that aren't Bartz, so not an issue. Bartz does need to be in a class slower than average speed though or else...Edward/Yang status out Alakazam and Bartz, Bartz misses his turn and Palom gets a turn and IDs Bartz. Porom can follow up statusing Adray. Athos can try OHKOing Palom, but not sure it's taking to me. I guess Adray might be faster than Palom though, but looking at the speed spread for FF 4, probably not. This isn't a problem, just noting that Bartz needs to be slower than the status healers to get his turn.
Team vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita- Well, Bartz does need to be slower than the 3 SO 3 characters. Realized that I don't know really all SO 3 attack speeds well enough here. Peppita and Albel are fast, Roger is slow generally? If so, Alakazam>fast SO 3>FE>Bartz>Roger>Adray. Peppita does get to ID Bartz and Albel gets to status...Moulder let's say. Alakazam and Athos take out Peppita, but Roger can then status Alakazam. Hmm, Albel can then to take status Athos, but...Athos should resist status enough. I'd say he status cures someone, but Roger should just restatus giving Albel another shot. Wouldn't like the chances here. Not...too confident on the team here if they are being outsped. Tentative no, but very very unsure.
Team vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer, Arngrim and Shiho
Team vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf and Reis

Team dude | Deis2, Emily, Jerin, Bowswer (Speed?), FFT Priest
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes]
Team dude vs. Hahn, Tia, Luna, Mareg and Shana- Pretty easy
Team dude vs. Palom, Porom, Edward and Yang- Ditto. Deis blocks Sleep and so on average gets her ID out on a twin. The speedsters can take out the other twin.
Team dude vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita- Can't ID Peppita, but the level of speed means they should take out before she gets a turn. The other two aren't dangerous.
Team dude vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer, Arngrim and Shiho
Team dude vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf and Reis- I'm just guessing if they get here intact, they should be fine.

[Yoshiken]

I can't really vote on my team's floor, mostly because I can make literally no sense of SO3 attacks in the DL, but I'm going to point out that, on a status-heavy floor, I've got Galuf, Adray, Athos and Moulder able to heal status, and the only one who doesn't, 'Zam, inflicts the opponent with any status he's inflicted with. Add in the Reflect with Alakazam (50% reduction on all physicals against the party for 5 rounds?) and Disable (so no single character can spam the same status) and I'm suddenly a lot better off. I'd imagine Athos/Adray can take out someone between them, leaving Alakazam free to attack someone else or Disable Albel, stopping that team from out-racing my status healers.

[Clear Tranquil]

Peppita and Albel are fast, Roger is slow generally?

Peppita's Kaboom (ID)/Magic Hook (Chaos) are relatively fast yeah. It's mainly her OTP power cannon moves like Faerie Friend and Dream Hammer that have slow start ups. Also I don't usually go by/factor in attack speeds but if I did it's possible Peppita's dances have initiative since Peppita doesn't have to draw out the circle for their effects - attack buffing, healing/MP regen, status to start taking place, even for example if Peppita cancelled from a dance ASAP into something else like an offensive move (Power Dance > Kaboom) she/allies would have been buffed/their HP/MP would have been regened some or enemies might have already been statused (and it terms of the offensive buff it would still last for thirty secs after Peppita had stopped dancing/until she used it again or w/e) The dances can also be started up and have their effects immediately start taking place from range as well. I ... don't know if I would call them initiative exactly but definitely see their buffs/etc coming into place a lot faster than stuff like Faerie Friend. Compared to SO3 characters with symbology Peppita's dances have no casting times before their effects start taking place i.e you don't have to wait like with a character casting a spell. Which considering that Panic Dance is MT/huge AoE and has a 84% chance of inflicting confusion per tick on enemies w/th no/low status resist (i.e in SO3 against something like the tiny devil creatures w/th only 16 SA (SO3's terms for status resist)  at 38 ticks per full dance and that's not counting chaining 'em ... is pretty darn evil for the DL/dungeon if it's taken as initiative/coming out quite fast. In short Panic Dance is broken >_> There's extremely little chance targets not completely to confusion will resist it.
Also again with attack speeds some people might see Peppita's Frozen Daggers/Magic Hook, Albel's Air Slash as initiative. Most of Peppita and Albel's physical attacks/counters are fairly fast too yeah. Roger's skills/attacks are definitely slower than theirs' for the most part yeah.

For dude's fight Albel/Peppita have their counters for melee physicals (definitely allow them to counter base physicals myself) and they have the Elemental Leather/Eleven Cloak respectively for Bolt X/Missile (absorb for Peppita, half damage for Albel) Albel gets half damage for Fireball/Freeze too!

[Nephrite]

How do levels effect Power/Panic/Magic dance?

[Clear Tranquil]

Power Dance is a straight up MT ATK/STR boost from 1.75% at base skill level up to a max of 2.85% at skill L10 - basically Peppita boosts the attack power of herself and allies by triple with Power Dance at L10. There is a further slight boost to Power Dance's buffing when it is used in a skill chain thanks to SO3's cancel bonus boost system but as far I know nobody has ever bothered/cared to figure out the exact % of this probably because the innate/base buffing rate of the skill is already close to doube/triple attack anyway and people assume the cancel bonus/chaining makes up the difference. At the least she's not getting beyond triple attack boosting from it. As far as I know.

Healing/Magical Dance basically MT regen a really crappy amount of HP/MP at L1 (45~ HP,  23 MP) per tick at the rate of one tick per second up to a decent amount of HP/MP per tick at skill L10 (450 HP/185) at the rate of one tick per 0.2 seconds (basically up to a max of 38 ticks at L10) Unlike with Power Dance though there is a significant and obvious difference when the recovery dances are used with chains/cancel bonus (up to 1350 HP per tick at 300% cancel/chain bonus w/th Healing Dance L10 for example and irrc 700~ MP per tick w/th Magical Dance L10) Basically at L1 recovery comes out slow with time between each tick with crappy amounts recovered per tick to recovery coming out much faster at skill L10/ rapid fire ticks with much better amounts recovered per tick. Cancel bonusing chaining makes Healing/Magical Dance slightly better at L1 too but still no where near as good as at skill L10. Would if it be helpful if I found out again exactly how many ticks there are at skill L1 though? All I remember is it's significantly less than the amount of ticks used at skill L10 >_> Also I could recheck the max amount of MP restored w/th a 300% cancel bonus =-)

[Nephrite]

It's mostly relevant for Panic Dance here, I think.

[superaielman]

Donno how much Kyra has, 100% sounds right. Maxim has 60% ST and 15% MT. Valor is gross overkill on healing (2000 ST, 500 MT). 

Kyra also has the speed sealstone on this floor, since Warla/Telele is going to make or break me here.

[Nephrite]

How much MP would Maxim have around now? Valor is pretty expensive, right? (30?)

[Random Consonant]

Enough for around 5 shots at full MP, but MP healing IPs do exist at this time.  F5 is around the time Lexis leaves IIRC so somewhere between 150-170.  The MP healing's 25% mMP, so he's restoring enough to give him another shot of it.  Dunno how many shots he'll actually need or how many times he'll need to use MP healing though.

[Clear Tranquil]

@ Yoshi Cure Condition from Adray only removes Poison/Paralysis/Petrification not Freeze/Chaos (confusion) =/ Basically in S03 there is no status recovery/protection for chaos other than it wearing off naturally. That's if the inflicted target hasn't already been defeated from it since S03's confusion can reduce HP/MP to zero with HP/MP sapping in the addition to the disabling actions thing/the status can also break the game's damage cap with the sapping too (so can SO3's Poison) - or sometimes but not always a character/enemy inflicted by it might get knocked out of it from being hit by another attack.

The Disable on Albel thing might still work though.

@ Neph I don't have any other hard data on Panic Dance other than it's hit rate of inflicting chaos/confusion at 84% per tick on enemies with low status resistance but we do have data here which was taken against enemies with average status resistances thanks to OK =-)

Panic Dance
X: Inflicts Confusion at a 50% rate, rising by 5% per level to a max of 100%; 20 MP, 15 Fury
O: Inflicts Confusion at a 50% rate, rising by 5% per level to a max of 100%; 6% MP, 35 Fury

Against average it's 50% MT/AoE confusion/chaos with zero skill use, increased by a further 5% to the base 50 with each additional skill level up to a max of 100% at L10 - so basically a 50% hit rate per use at L0/1 and 100% at L10.
This is per - use - though and doesn't factor in chaining/cancel bonus/full spamming of the status from a full fury gauge with or without Berserk.

[dude789]

Team dude | Deis2, Emily, Jerin, Bowswer (Speed?), FFT Priest
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes]
Team dude vs. Hahn, Tia, Luna, Mareg and Shana: Emily takes out Tia if necessary to prevent status shenanigans. Bowser, Deis and Jerin drop the MT bomb on everyone else. Mareg or someone might survive, but they're not threatening.
Team dude vs. Palom, Porom, Edward and Yang: Yang can status someone but Emily and Deis can both take out a twin by themselves and Jerin and Bowser can take on out together. Either way the twins are going down before they get a turn. To make matters wose, if he tries to status Emily he might fail because the Haziness Rune gives her pretty damn good evasion.
Team dude vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita: Not sure how SO3 counters work but if they aren't ITE then Emily has a pretty good chance of dodging them. Regardless, Peppita isn't getting a turn. She can block Thunder, but Deis and Jerin can still hit her with Fire or Ice just fine and between those two and Bowser they should be able to knock her out before she gets a turn. 
Team dude vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer, Arngrim and Shiho: Bunch of average speed characters so Bowser, Jerin and Deis work together to considerably weaken them. Some of the tougher ones might survive but Emily can put them over the edge with damage. Worse case scenario Deis IDs one of them, Emily smashes a mage and Jerin uses confuse which should neutralize enough of them to prevent a PWS. They leave one of the weaker guys alive and heal up if necessary.
Team dude vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf and Reis: Enemies just get out blitzed here. Beowulf is the first target to avoid status, but he should go down quickly and Cloud and Reis will take some damage in the process. They might lose a member or two, but it's the last fight of the floor and Jerin should have revival by now if things go poorly.

Abstain on Super. I'm not sure how I view Valor on this floor and even if it's 60% healing, I'm not sure that it's enough.

Mustache passes. Athos is still godly and Alakazam is still a bit stronger than he is at endgame (this is probably the last floor though, most pokemon are getting close to their last evolution). FF4 and SO3 floors might be troublesome, but I think they have enough status healing to get through.

[Random Consonant]

Team Super | Edgar, Maxim, Zemeckis and Hydra, Hawk, Kyra (Speed?)
[Floor 5a: Ceaseheal (After Midgame)]
*On this floor, healing effects are reduced to 10% (for both sides) and revival may not be used.
Team Super vs. Reno, Rude and Elena (Midgar forms)
Team Super vs. Krin, Karn and Locke
Team Super vs. Yulie and Yukiko
Team Super vs. Mua, Fred and Cecil
Team super vs. Berle - Abstain.  Valor can be used as regular healing just fine ingame, but I'm not sure how well it can be kept up or how much super needs it.

Team MOUSTACHE | Athos, Adray, Moulder, Bartz with a Moustache, Alakazam (MOUSTACHE Sealstone)
[Bartz: Monk (Mastered), Blue Mage (Mastered), Chemist (Mastered), Red Mage/Time Mage]
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes]
Team vs. Hahn, Tia, Luna, Mareg and Shana
Team vs. Palom, Porom, Edward and Yang
Team vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita
Team vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer, Arngrim and Shiho
Team vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf and Reis - I'll buy it.

Team dude | Deis2, Emily, Jerin, Bowswer (Speed?), FFT Priest
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes]
Team dude vs. Hahn, Tia, Luna, Mareg and Shana
Team dude vs. Palom, Porom, Edward and Yang
Team dude vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita
Team dude vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer, Arngrim and Shiho
Team dude vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf and Reis - Pretty sure dude's team handles this easily

[Nephrite]

The floor also reduces MP recovery to 10%.

EDIT: Or it will next time. It doesn't for Super's team right now because I told him otherwise.

[SnowFire]

Mustache and dude pass.

[Clear Tranquil]

I'm still not convinced on Yoshi's team. Under Dhyer's scenerio after the first round Bartz is ded, Peppita's ded, Moulder is chaosed by Albel, Adray can't cure chaos, 'Zam is chaosed by Roger, Athos is the only one left unstatused to cure status after turn one.  If Albel's chances of chaosing Athos straight away are not good even with Berserk for Aura Wall chains then he might as well chaos Adray instead. Roger is chaosed from chaosing 'Zam ok. Athos status cures 'Zam and 'Zam finally gets the chance to use Disable and stop Albel's chaos spamming. Albel might be able to finish off Moulder with straight damage by this stage though since chaos has sapped Moulder's health down and it's no longer at full. If not ... chaos is going to be wearing off and the remaining characters on Yoshi's team getting turns again but the same applies to Roger too for more chaos shenanigans. Albel might well be able to utilise Vampire Flash effectively here in order to stall for time and keep healthy until he can use Aura Wall again. Ehh ... it's not impossible the remainder of Yoshi's team might eventually still come out on top in this slugfest and eventually break Albel/Roger and their slugging/stalling game. Doesn't seem like they'll be in very good shape for the next fight regardless though =/ Alternatively instead of Peppita going for Kaboom spam to ID Bartz she opts for the faster Panic Dance and manages to chaos at least three perhaps four of Yoshi's team right off the bat (Adray/'Zam/Moulder) Skill levels for Panic Dance and/or spamming it via full fury gauge might even get through Athos' status resist too. Even assuming no skill levels/spamming/Berserk for Panic Dance for Athos ... Peppita chaosing multiple others of Yoshi's team frees up Albel/Roger shots for a go at chaosing Athos. Gonna happen sooner or later.

[Nephrite]

I would say in that situation, Athos just obliterates Albel and then they wait the chaos out for Adray to revive Bartz.

[superaielman]

Team dude | Deis2, Emily, Jerin, Bowser (Speed?), FFT Priest
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes]
Team dude vs. Hahn, Tia, Luna, Mareg and Shana- Mmm, I kneejerk Tia going first and using sleep, which will slow the team down some. Deis is unlikely to be effected and Priest immunes sleep, so it won't be enough. Hahn dies before he gets a turnd ue to blitzing.
Team dude vs. Palom, Porom, Edward and Yang- Yang puts Bowser to sleep. Em+Deis should knock out one twin, and Jerin/Priest should.. if Priest blows the MP on holy. I think she'll do that here, just to be sure. They leave Edward alive and Jerin/Priest get the team healed up.
Team dude vs. Albel, Roger Huxley and Peppita- Peppita needs to die. Terrorize+Em should be enough for that, and if not a Priest physical should seal the deal. Priest's MP won't survive this fight, though- Albel or Roger should kill what's left. They are going to start to work on Jerin's MP as well.
Team dude vs. Gandar, Belenus, Lawfer, Arngrim and Shiho- Terrorize+Em should splatter Gandar, Deis+Jerin should kill Shiho. Belenus/Lawfer/Arngrim get to gangbang the PC of their choice at this point- even with terrorize, three PWSes is brutal. They'll choose to knock out Emily, who is the biggest offensive threat on the field.  Deis/Jerin/Bowser should be able to kill one of the PC's left, which means the fight is in hand.
Team dude vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf and Reis- I don't think they have a prayer here. The reviver is dead, the best offensive unit is dead. The team has problems even damaging worker, and Beo/Cloud/Worker don't give a damn about Terrorize.


Abstain on Yoshi's team, still hammering it out.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Super passes, kneejerk is that Noiseblaster and Zemeckis/Hawk damage save the day... who needs healing?!

Yoshi and dude are getting creamed by SO3 shenanigans. It's not really an overpowered fight, it's just that people seem to keep forgetting about it when they make their teams (myself included!).

[Yoshiken]

Djinn: How, exactly? The worst I'm seeing that is having one person down at the end of the fight, since I have copious amounts of stat healing and revival, as well as being able to splat Peppita down stupidly quickly. (I know I personally can't vote on it, but I still prefer to see the arguments for/against it. And I'm not attacking you for saying it, just curious as to why you think that fight is so problematic. )

[dude789]

Yeah, same question as Yoshi. Almost everyone on my team out speeds them and they more than have the ability to take out the dangerous ones before they move.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Not so much losing on that fight specfically, but it's such a resource drain that the following fights are too much.

[Yoshiken]

Athos and Moulder don't exactly struggle for resources, for one, and Alakazam is statusing out someone by being hit alone - he's not spending much, if anything, on this fight. (Only Disable and one shot of Psybeam, if anything.) Bartz is the main reviver, so he's the one I'm seeing down, if anyone. That means the only ones who would be drained of resources would be Adray, and that's only if you see him doing everything, which I highly doubt given how much else is in the team. Keep in mind that my team (and dude's as well, actually) are blitzing the characters so quickly that it's bordering on "Get a round, win". That means that resources on attacks aren't an issue at all, and the healing throughout is only done enough to cut it down to the lowest threat level before healing up completely.
On the whole, it shouldn't be a huge drain on healing resources (for those that are split) and shouldn't be enough of a drain to care on offensive resources.

[dude789]

Same deal with my team. Peppita's going down quickly and Albel and Roger are going to be Terrorized so their mp damage will be significantly reduced. They might lose mp, but the rest of the SO3 characters are getting taken out on the next turn.