AMERICAN Ogre Battle: March of the Black Queen (A rebalancing mod)

[superaielman]

Can you make random encounters visible/change what they are on each map, Neph?

[Nephrite]

I can't make them visible but I can change what they are and where they spawn.

[Nephrite]

Does anyone have a strong feeling one way or another about letting Amazons promote into Dragoners? I'm not sure I can change the voices but I might be able to...

[superaielman]

Turn them into the female fighter class? That'd make sense. I half did that to witch on a lark. Said class would still need massive improvements across the board to not be putrid but yeah, workable.

[Nephrite]

So here are a few ideas:

Vampires can recruit both Werewolves and Beastmen. I want to make Blood Kiss's storebought somewhere, any ideas?

I'm going to add Beastmen to the Neutral encounter list in Sirius' locale, along with Werewolves.


Faerie class is completely removed. I'm sure everyone is sad to hear it.

Faeries replaced with Sirens, a promote from Witch. Front Row attack will be Cerberus attack set (Fire/Charm) and back is 1 Random magic. Might make an Undead Ring promotion to something else here.

Deneb given unique Wicca class (Replaces Pixie). Front row attack will be... something, maybe 3x Stun, back row will be Endora's magic set. (Icecloud, Firewall, Thunder, Jihad, Phantom, Gale) I think I want to give her unique class the Princess leader effect.

I will most likely be importing almost all of Super's ideas, I really like the idea of Knights being able to heal in the back row, just gotta make sure it's useful without being overpowering.

I'm trying to think of other people who might deserve more unique classes (Galf comes to mind).

I also want to add a promotion for the Lord, but I don't think it's possible. What I may do is change the four lords so they're a lot more unique, in that one can focus on Strength, one on Agility, one on Int and... uh... I dunno what to do with the fourth.

[superaielman]

Knights still have shit INT at first. I doubt it'll be overpowered offhand. Of course, who knows how it'll work. The Samurai Class in particular could be nasty *in theory*, but man those defenses fail.

Deneb- That all sounds reasonable.

For Galf? Make him a custom Lich with the Princess bonus. It's the only way I can think to justify his cost.

In general, I'd say to both expand neutral recruits and recruiting from towns by giving characters more stuff to pick up earlier. Vampires- Make them recruitable in Pogrom. Blood Kiss is kind of blah as a storebought, and that way people who really want to recruit them can do so early.  If you can make the neutral encounter item storebought and cheap, do that.

As far as custom classes go? Galf and Deneb are the ones that make the most sense.

[Nephrite]

http://finnshore.webs.com/ram.sram-map.txt This is for Djinn, this file has Gilbert, Rauny and Norn's base Reputation meter in it! We may be able to modify the others... It's all mostly mumbo jumbo to me but maybe you can make some headway with it.

[DjinnAndTonic]

r e c r u i t   G i l b e r t   a t   3 8 E 8 5   i n   r o m   m i n i m u m   5 0   r e p u t a t i o n
 
 r e c r u i t   N o r n   a t   3 9 8 6 5   i n   r o m   m i n i m u m   6 0   r e p u t a t i o n
 
 r e c r u i t   R a u n y   a t   3 9 C D 8   i n   r o m   m i n i m u m   6 5   r e p u t a t i o n

This is what I see regarding reputation. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to have any other information about reputation here?

And the rest of the document is talking about SRAM addresses, which is basically temporary info (for Savestate-hacking essentially). You can't change any of the stuff at these addresses permanently with HEX-editing. (You could do it with a Gameshark-type program, though, but that's really cheap hacking.)

Now, just looking at the addresses there, though, this COULD be useful information. The SRAM stuff is all in the $70000-ish block, while these three addresses are notably in the $39000-ish area, which IIRC, is where most of the hacking you're already doing is happening, so I'm pretty sure this isn't Savestate data (though obviously it's related since CurrentReputation would be saved in SRAM).

I -think- if you poke around those addresses, you'll find the HEX values of 50, 60, and 65 ($32, $3C, $41) near there and you can edit those numbers to change the Reputation requirements for those 3 characters.

If you tell me a little more about how Reputation works in-game, I may be able to deduce more, though.

[Nephrite]

Yeah, sorry for not being specific enough -- it only has those three.

If I go to the location of that in the Hex Editor: 38C85 (minus 200 for it being unheadered) the value of 32 is there, and I know that's 50 in decimal value, so you're correct.



Reputation in-game is a meter on the side that goes from 0 to 100. It affects almost all the recruiting in the game (and most of it requires it to be halfway or better).

I thought that maybe there'd be an equal value between the three addresses but there wasn't, although If I can figure out what exact reputation requirements are for the other characters I can probably find them somewhere near those addresses.

[DjinnAndTonic]

The game is over a decade old and no one's documented numerical Reputation Requirements yet?

[superaielman]

I'd guess that 50/65/80 (Dragoons) would be the high end of the rep range needed for PC recruits, but not 100% on that one.

I'm not a huge OB fan, but I'd really like to see the bosses suck a lot less (lol Gares). 

Maybe giving them more support if you can (maybe Gares could come with Liches and dragons or something).

Or just a straight up boost.

You have to be careful about raising boss HP *too* much. Supertank bosses would just encourage tarot spamming the living fuck out of them. Better support would help some, but by and large dangerous boss support you use a fool card on.

Other thoughts: I would definitely say making the starting pool of recruits more varied is a good thing. Having access to say a ninja and an angel in the common recruit pile would be neat and would encourage using different builds. If you're tweaking the opinion leader, I would strongly suggest more defensive than offensive boosts- after all, it's game over if he dies.

[Nephrite]

$4F Lord (Phantom) - Increased Physical resistance to 50, Black Resistance to 50, Alignment to 50.

Increased Int per level to 5 and Agility to 3.
Replaced Phantom with Meteor, increased Front Row attacks to 3 and back row to 2.

Reasoning: This guy sucked. I want to make him the magical focus lord while still being able to be put in the front row if so desired.


$50 Lord (Good) - Increased Physical resistance to 50, Fire to 40, Cold to 40. Increased Strength per level to 4, agility to 4 and Intellect per level to 5.

Front Row attack is now 3x White-Strength Based attack and back is 2x Icecloud.

Reasoning: Guy was pretty good originally but having Banish was... odd. This one is a little better at fighting and has a base white attack as well for DEMON SLAYING.


$4E Lord (Sonic)  - Back row attack now 2x Iainuki.
Strength per level 5, Agility 3, Intelligence 1. Physical Resistance now 65.

Reasoning: Physical Lord. No real reason to give him much more. Gave him another Iainuki, this way you need to choose between front row attacks or back row with backlash.


$51 Lord (Thunder)

Raised resistances to at least 50 across the board. Front row attack is now 2x Strength Gale and back row is 2x Thunder. Strength/Agility/Int is now 4 per level.

Reasoning: Having two AoE attacks Makes the Thunder Lord stand out a little more. Much more well-rounded.


Angel-

Increased Banish in back row to 2x.

Beastman- Increased agility per level from 2 to 3, int from 1 to 2.

Beast Master - 3x attack in front or back row. Increased agility per level to 4. Now promotes at level 10, 10-65 Alignment

Black Dragon - 3x Physical in front. Increased alignment max to 45.

Cerberus - Can promote at level 12, 0-100 alignment.

Cherubim - Banish in back row now 3x, now promotes at level 8, 50-100 Alignment.

Cleric - No change.

Cockatrice - 2x Gale up front and 3x Petrify in back, Increased stats per level to 4/5/2. Raised Weight type to Dragon level, should be easier to get High Sky with one.

Coffin - No change. TANK

Demon - 2x Nightmare in back replaced with 1x Meteor. Increased Str/Agi/Int per level to 4. Can now promote with up to 50 alignment.

Devil - 3x Strength Black attack up front, 2x Meteor in the back. Can now promote at 16. 5 Strength and 5 Int per level.

Doll Master - 3x Physical up front, 2x Acid in the Back. Now gains 3/3/4 for stats. Physical resistance is now 46. 50-100 Alignment.

Doll Mage - Strength is now 2 per level. Physical resistance now 40. Alignment now 35 to 75.

Dragon - Increased agility and int per level to 2.

Dragon Master - 3x Melee up front, 3x Magic in the back. Stat gains are 4/4/3, Resistances are all 55 except for White and Black which are 40. Now promotes at level 12, 0-100 Alignment.

Dragoner - Now promotes from Amazon starting at level 5. All resistances now 50 except for White and Black, which are 40. Melee up front, Magic in the back, 2x. Can promote from 0-100 Alignment.

Eagleman - Backrow Thunder replaced with MT Thunder. Strength and Int gains boosted to 3. Now promote at level 8. 45-100 Alignment.

Evil One - Now use Str-Inferno in back row. 3 attacks both places. Strength and Int gains now 4 per level. Now promote at level 14. 0-45 Alignment. Base cost now 1100

Faerie - Replaced with Siren class, promotion from Witch. 2x Fire or Charm up front (Cerberus) 1x All Magic in the back. 4 HP Per level, 5 Int per level. Promoted at level 10, 0-50 Alignment. Black resistance 55, White Resistance 35.

Ghost - No Change.

Gold Dragon - 4x Melee up front, 2x Icestorm in the back. 5 Strength, 4 Int. 60-100 Alignment. Level 15.

Golem - 1x Quake in the back row. 2 Agility per level.

Gryphon - 3 Strength per level. Physical resistance raised to 50. Increased Weight priority to Dragon-level, should be easier to get High Sky with one now.

Halloween - HP per level raised to 5, Strength to 4. Raised physical resistance to 70, lowered Fire Resistance to 30. Can now be recruited by Deneb by default.

Hawkman - Strength per level increased to 3, 2 attacks from the back.

Hellhound - No change.

Imp - Increased strength to 3 per level. Now get 2 Nightmares in the back.

Iron Golem - Now promoted from Rock Golems at level 16. 4/3/3. 3x Melee up front, 2x Quake in the back.

Knight - Now get 2x Healing in the back row. Knight now gets 2 Int per level.

Kraken - Strength increased to 5 per level, agility to 3. Physical resistance increased to 75. (they honestly aren't that bad, really)

Lich - 3x Magic in the front row, 2x Aoe Magic in the back. Base cost is 2500 and cost per level is 400. Fire resistance reduced to 45. Now promotes from Undead Staff from Mage.

Lycan - 2 Attacks in front and back. Now gains the same stats as Tigermen during the day.

Mage - Alignment 0-35, level increased to 11.

Mermaid - 3/3/3 for levels, Phys resistance up to 40. 2 Blizzard in the back row.

Monk - Now promoted at level 16. 55-100 Alignment.

Muse - 55-100 Alignment.

Ninja Master - 4x Attack from the front, 2x Aoe in the back. 0-50 Alignment.

Ninja - Can now lead units. (why couldn't they before?)

Nixie - 3x Melee in front, 2x Icestorm in back. 4/5/5 Now have 45 Phys resist.

Octopus - Strength increased to 3x per level.

Paladin - Now use Healing+ (Aoe) 2x in the back. 4 strength per level, 3 int per level. 60-100 Alignment.

Phantom - Promotes from Ghost at level 12

Pixie - Replaced with Wicca class (Unique to Deneb) Front row is Charm/Fire (Cerberus), back row is 2x Endora's Magic. Also grants 1 extra attack if made leader. 32 Physical Resistance, 60 everything else, 80 Black, 25 White.

Platinum Dragon - Renamed Bahamut. 4x Cold in the front. 12 HP per level, 4 agility, 5 int. Phys resistance to 70. Promotes at level 20. 55-100 Alignment.

Princess - No longer gives +1 attacks as a leader. Now has 2x Jihad up front, 2x Starlite in the back.

Pumpkin - 3/3/2 Phys resist to 50.

Ravenman - 3xMelee up front, 2x Firestorm in back. 3/4/3 50 Phys resist. Promotes at level 15 from Eagleman.

Red Dragon II - Renamed to Flarebrass. 4x Melee up front. Int to 4 per level. 25-65 alignment.

Red Dragon - 3 Melee up front. 25-65 Alignment.

Rock Golem - 1 Quake in the back. 2 Agility per level.

Salamand - Renamed Salamander (?). 4 Fires up front, Promotes at 20. 4 Agility, 5 Int. Phys to 70.

Samurai Master - 4 Strength per level, 3 agility. Phys resistance to 60. 2x Iainuki in the back. 55-100

Samurai - Phys resistance to 50. Promotes at level 6.

Seraphim - 4 Halos up front, 2 Jihads in the back. 3 Strength, 5 intellect. Promotes at level 16. 65-100 Alignment.

Shaman - 50-100 Alignment.

Silver Dragon - 3 Melee up front. 55-100 Alignment.

Skeleton - Promotes to Wraith!

Soldier - Unchanged.

Sorceror - Will be removed and replaced with another class.

Sylph - Likewise.

Tiamat - 3x Acid up front. Max Alignment is now 45.

Tigerman - 3x Lifesuck up front.

Valkyrie - Unchanged.

Vampyre - Renamed to Vampire, because seriously. 3 attacks in front and back. Might change the Charm to the Cerberus Fire/Charm versions.

Werewolves - Unchanged.

Wild Man - Renamed Berserker (I think that fits, if not we'll see). 2 attacks in the back row now, 0-55 alignment.

Witch - 3 SLAPs up front. 2 Strength per level.

Wizard - 10-75 Alignment.

Wraith - Promotes from Skeleton at level 12. 2 Attacks in the back row.

Wyrm - Increased Phys. Resist and Fire Resist to 50, lowered Cold to 30.

Wyvern - Now get 3 attacks in the front and back. 0-100 Alignment. 60 Phys and Fire, 25 Cold. 2 Int per level.

Zombie Dragon - Now promotes from Tiamat at level 22. 2x Acid from the front, 2x Evilring from the back. This may seem like a downgrade from Tiamat, but they tank damage much much better so it's a tradeoff between offense and defense.

[Nephrite]

Just posting some thoughts:

Give monsters a third branch, i.e. Octopus->Kraken->Moby or something.

I could pretty easily take four of the classes used by Giants and give them to Octopi, Hellhounds, Wyrms and Gryphons.

I'd also like to add something else for Hawkmen... make them promote to Eaglemen then go from there to Ravenmen or something (Probably call it Vartan).

[superaielman]

Off the cuff reactions: Tone Dragoner/Dragon Master down. They're just notably better than every other class in the same timeframe right now (Knight, Wildmen, etc) due to killer resists. I'd make Dragon Master resists comparable to Knights/Samurai, so averaging 40ish or so across the board.  Also, I'd give Werewolves the same stat growth in the day and night as well.

Is any general access class going to get the extra attack per battle skill, now that princess doesn't have it? If you want to make a third version of those monster classes, go for it. Each class should get an extra attack and improved resists (+5) across the board. Needs to be a late promotion like the final dragon class, though.

With you generally raising stats, I would caution against raising enemy levels much. You will slam into stat caps hard late in the game at L35-40.

[Nephrite]

I can tone Dragoners down, but I like the idea of Dragon Masters being a bit better mainly due to them requiring an item to get to that promotion level. I COULD just let them promote through levels and then use the Stone to promote them to like, Dragon Lord or something...

[superaielman]

Oh, you need the stone of dragos to go from dragon tamer to master? never mind, in that case.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Hey, I've been playing around with OB lately because of you. What effect do Dragoners/Dragon Masters have on Dragon-type units? It seems like a small damage boost, and hardly encourages using them together, which seems odd...

If possible, you could tone down the Dragoners and give them a better damage bonus for Dragon-type units, which could be interesting. Assuming that's how it works and that we can find how to edit that bonus.

[Nephrite]

There is such a thing as Class Compatibility, which effects exactly what you're suggesting. I can change the compatibility, but I'm not sure I can change the actual effect... I think it caps at +4 to STR/INT/AGI, which, as you've said isn't a huge deal.

Well, it's a big deal at the beginning, I suppose.

EDIT: I believe there's a -second- way that determines the difference between Leaders and members works... I think it has something to do with the stat differences between the Leader and members of that unit, though I'm unsure. I THINK it means that if you have a class lead a unit with 0 Strength, 0 Agility and 200 Int, it will decrease the STR/AGI of the members of that group but give them a bonus of INT.

[Nephrite]

Also posting palette information in case I change anything with that:

0E723: Battle palettes by class (2 bytes each). I've got no clue how palette data is stored.

bits 00-04 sub-palette 3 index
bits 05-09 sub-palette 2 index
bits 10-15 sub-palette 1 index

sub-palettes start at 25FAD, 10 bytes each (2 bytes each color, R5G5B5A1)

This is how the actual palette is assembled:
color 00 0x0000 full black (transparent) (0,0,0)
color 01 0x0001 almost full black (visible black) (8,0,0)
colors 02-06 defined by sub-palette 1
colors 07-11 defined by sub-palette 2
colors 12-14 defined by sub-palette 3
color 15 0x7FFF full white (248,248,248)

[Nephrite]

First post updated to contain all class changes thus far.

[Scar]

Sounds good to me. What else are you going to change? You are moving around enemies so they aren't so easily smashed. You are modifing stats and making some classes fail less, cool. What about smarter enemies? Or more waves or something? I do not know how these things work. What about new translations or different characters joining you?

*shrug*

[Nephrite]

I'd rather not increase the number of waves because the game already gets pretty boring halfway through. What I can at least do is improve the quality of the enemies so they're a bit less bad.

As for translations... I'm not sure where that data is stored so I'm not sure there's anything I can do.

[Nephrite]

First iteration of the patch is out. Names have not been changed yet due to some bugs I encountered but the units themselves should be up-to-date.

I also haven't changed Neutral encounters yet.


YOU MUST APPLY IT TO AN UNHEADERED ROM.

[Nephrite]

http://www.mediafire.com/?01165qep23vtu5x This should be a link to the current patch, I've constructed it such that it can be used on a Headered or Unheadered version of the game.

[Grefter]

Michael Wilson is caving to pressure from the Headered ROM lobby.  This is going to be felt at the polling booths.  Richard Hawk for pres 2012 campaign is gaining on you.