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Author Topic: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP  (Read 3106 times)

Pyro

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #25 on: May 09, 2012, 01:00:41 AM »
My nitpicking was that it requires a lot of interpretations to go very much in Elincia's favor. Exp spread to the maximum extent, no evade scaling at all, 50%+ evade = win , and giving her Authority to just barely net her a win.

You are correct on the other issue, Insane Death is just a 5% chance to kill anything Insane at the end of the turn.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #26 on: May 09, 2012, 02:37:59 AM »
Pyro: If you want to hype a smaller party for FE10 (leading to more people hitting higher levels, yes, which leads to Elincia capping out and other catching up more), why don't you do that for other FEs too? You made a stat topic to push the FE8 average level down; reversing this trend for FE10 is something I find confusing. That said, you're still free to do it, but don't act surprised when many people do not.

Regardless, even then Elincia will be much better than in Meeple's stat topic. She will still retain some sort of level advantage (unless you see everyone hitting 20 I guess...), and additionally she gained a lot more from going from L10 to L20 because her growths are extremely good and she doesn't ram caps hard during that time like many others.

(As an example: Speed's the most relevant stat, and going from Level 10 to 20, Elincia gains 7 points of speed. By contast, Micaiah gains 3.5, Mia gains 2, Nolain gains 0.6, and Calill gains 0.)

Quote
The evade thing is an ooooolllld argument that I actually figured I had mostly won.

"Won?" No, everyone just got tired of the same argument repeated forever and agreed to disagree. Hell, the main person who even agreed with you went and came up with a different interp entirely (one similar to the one I used in the D&D topic, yes). I'm pretty sure the "evade as another form of durability" interpretations will leave Cthulhu short of a OHKO anyway, since it's something Elincia is clearly pretty far above average in.

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #27 on: May 09, 2012, 09:36:30 PM »
Godlike

Ashera (Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn) vs Mewtwo (Pokémon Series) - Standard Ashera win scenario, really.
Charlton Blunt (Wild ARMs XF) vs Terra Branford (Final Fantasy VI) - blah blah blah Ultima!
Cidolfas Orlandu (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cid Raines (Final Fantasy XIII) - Think I see him as durable enough for this.
Mei-ling (SaGa Frontier) vs Apocrypha (Radiant Historia) - Dunno Apocrypha well enough.

Heavy

Galcian (Skies of Arcadia) vs Wakka (Final Fantasy X) - Not really Wakka's strong point, though his Overdrive Reels might have an argument? I dunno.
Legretta (Tales of the Abyss) vs Nel Zelpher (Star Ocean: Till the End of Time) - IIRC Legretta is still vulnerable to Stun, so I'm thinking Freeze hits just fine.
Chie Satonaka (Persona 4) vs Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millenium): ID ID ID~
Cthulhu (Cthulhu Saves the World) vs Elincia (Fire Emblem Series) - Authority bonuses for all noteworthy FE10 chars gets all my hype.

Middle


Dekar (Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals) vs Ashton Anchors (Star Ocean: The Second Story) - Think I see Ashton as significantly fast enough to double fairly often here and that sinks Dekar's durability advantage.
Hope Estheim (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Nina (Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter) - Not giving the full status resistance options to the FF13 cast. The storebought ones aren't enough to stop Nina's IIRC.
Yukiko Amagi (Persona 4) vs Syphide (Valkyrie Profile: Silmeria) - Kneejerk
Sara (Breath of Fire) vs Warlock (Suikoden IV) - Kneejerk

Light

Sazh Katzroy (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Kahn (Breath of Fire IV) - Don't think Sazh has enough damage to change this.
Piccolo (Suikoden III) vs Mia Ausa (Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete) - Same game but better at it.
Locke Cole (Final Fantasy VI) vs Nina Wyndia (Breath of Fire III) - Yay Locke!
Elena (Final Fantasy VII) vs Tricia (Soul Nomad & The World Eaters) - Terrible match-up for Tricia, but Elena sucks enough that it doesn't matter!

Pyro

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #28 on: May 09, 2012, 10:29:34 PM »
Sorry to have annoyed you (again).

I will defend the FE8 topic because the experience curve is crazy steep and endgame enemies just can't get even a smaller group of folks to 20/15. 20/12 was higher than what I would consider 'average' too. Unless you do the Tower or maybe fight all of the Demon King's summoned monsters? I'd bet Equal Exp nets it even lower, with Colm and Marisa liking that thanks to being really really easy to level.

I have no objections to anyone taking whatever endgame level for FE10 (I'd argue the bosses should be held to a better standard, as you really are supposed to bring your 'A' game to the final 5 fights). I'm just shocked in general by how good that leaves Elincia. I shouldn't have brought it up, as I'm mostly just trying to figure out how Elincia got so crazy awesome while I wasn't paying attention. I didn't look at her as a dueler at all after my entry in the ranking topic.

This whole thing is kind of moot anyway, as it really boils down to "does Elincia avoid 100% accuracy attacks turn 1". I think the answer to that question is the only real deciding factor in the match. This also means the Authority thing is moot except for scaling relative evasions, which I should totally check out. Even I'd figure Elincia to win if she is more than 2x as durable as average (with everyone having the +15 at endgame).

SnowFire

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #29 on: May 12, 2012, 12:29:50 AM »
For whatever it's worth, I didn't realize Cursed Sword OHKO'd quite as solidly as Pyro's stat topic hypes it as.  The Insane Death argument is a distraction I think; if Cthulhu misses, there is just no way he's surviving Elincia's counter and then Elincia's attack.  4x Insane Amiti hits?  Stun doesn't matter.  (If Cthuhu really wants to win with Insane Death, he spams Unstoppable Healing and hopes Stun doesn't kick in, for all that his HP is still edging downward anyway).  That said, I was assuming Elincia survived a Cursed Sword hit, which she apparently doesn't.  (More level blather nobody cares about: I think equal XP, for all that it's unrealistic since most people probably do focus a little come endgame and also swappable Paragon exists, is a good baseline *minimum* endgame level.  If being perfectly fair knocks Titania to lvl. crazy, she should be that level.  Flip side, I'd call lvl. 10 a floor for everyone else.  If you're trying to use a project character, you aren't going to equal XP them, you're going to make them at least playable.  So I'd use Equal XP lvl.19 Elincia, but the averages are higher than the Equal XP topic uses since the Dawn Brigade & other projects would be using their Meeple-topic values.  And apparently even full-on equal XP Elincia should die to Cursed Sword.  But that's just me.)

Anyway, d100 = 48.  Hrmm.  Is that a hit?  It's borderline (since Elincia probably doesn't have quite 52 raw evasion to me)...  let's roll again!  A 50.  Ah screw it, edited to an abstain.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2012, 12:34:59 AM by SnowFire »

Lance

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #30 on: May 12, 2012, 07:02:27 AM »
Godlike
Ashera (Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn) vs Mewtwo (Pokémon Series)
Charlton Blunt (Wild ARMs XF) vs Terra Branford (Final Fantasy VI)
Cidolfas Orlandu (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cid Raines (Final Fantasy XIII)

Heavy
Galcian (Skies of Arcadia) vs Wakka (Final Fantasy X)
Legretta (Tales of the Abyss) vs Nel Zelpher (Star Ocean: Till the End of Time)
Chie Satonaka (Persona 4) vs Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millenium)

Middle
Dekar (Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals) vs Ashton Anchors (Star Ocean: The Second Story)
Hope Estheim (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Nina (Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter)
Yukiko Amagi (Persona 4) vs Syphide (Valkyrie Profile: Silmeria)
Sara (Breath of Fire) vs Warlock (Suikoden IV)

Light
Sazh Katzroy (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Kahn (Breath of Fire IV)
Piccolo (Suikoden III) vs Mia Ausa (Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete)
Locke Cole (Final Fantasy VI) vs Nina Wyndia (Breath of Fire III)

Cmdr_King

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #31 on: May 12, 2012, 07:27:29 AM »
Godlike

Ashera (Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn) vs Mewtwo (Pokémon Series)- If Psychic had about 20 uses I'd definitely see Mewtwo taking this.  hmm.  I wonder if 16 uses from PP Up would do it... too bad PP Ups are not a storebought item like the vitamins.
Charlton Blunt (Wild ARMs XF) vs Terra Branford (Final Fantasy VI)- mmm... right.  Disease.  Yeah, Terra probably needs a turn of healing to properly finesse his HP.
Cidolfas Orlandu (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cid Raines (Final Fantasy XIII)- Yeah sure.
Mei-ling (SaGa Frontier) vs Apocrypha (Radiant Historia)

Heavy

Galcian (Skies of Arcadia) vs Wakka (Final Fantasy X)
Legretta (Tales of the Abyss) vs Nel Zelpher (Star Ocean: Till the End of Time)
Chie Satonaka (Persona 4) vs Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millenium)
Cthulhu (Cthulhu Saves the World) vs Elincia (Fire Emblem Series)

Middle


Dekar (Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals) vs Ashton Anchors (Star Ocean: The Second Story)- No vote.
Hope Estheim (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Nina (Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter)- At least, I assume veil gives some Death resistence.  Added to the accessory, should hold Nina to a turn way-too-many success on that.
Yukiko Amagi (Persona 4) vs Syphide (Valkyrie Profile: Silmeria)- Yukiko just doesn't have any way to amp up her offense.
Sara (Breath of Fire) vs Warlock (Suikoden IV)

Light

Sazh Katzroy (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Kahn (Breath of Fire IV)- When elf votes line up with my kneejerk ("Sazh doesn't have enough time to kill Kahn before dying") I take it as a sign.
Piccolo (Suikoden III) vs Mia Ausa (Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete)- Piccolo still holds the speed advantage by a lot, unless Mia just wants to be 2HKOd straight up.
Locke Cole (Final Fantasy VI) vs Nina Wyndia (Breath of Fire III)- Nina's thing is kinda sucking at damage, Locke's is getting stronger as you damage him.
Elena (Final Fantasy VII) vs Tricia (Soul Nomad & The World Eaters)
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Nephrite

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #32 on: May 12, 2012, 02:09:09 PM »
Godlike

Ashera (Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn) vs Mewtwo (Pokémon Series)
Charlton Blunt (Wild ARMs XF) vs Terra Branford (Final Fantasy VI)
Cidolfas Orlandu (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cid Raines (Final Fantasy XIII) -- I have to give credit to FF13 bosses for durability on the account of them requiring you to heal a lot more often than most randoms...
Mei-ling (SaGa Frontier) vs Apocrypha (Radiant Historia) - Hm... Boss Meiling might win this? Eh, abstain.

Heavy

Galcian (Skies of Arcadia) vs Wakka (Final Fantasy X) - I'm willing to give some leeway on armor forging.
Legretta (Tales of the Abyss) vs Nel Zelpher (Star Ocean: Till the End of Time)
Chie Satonaka (Persona 4) vs Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millenium)
Cthulhu (Cthulhu Saves the World) vs Elincia (Fire Emblem Series)

Middle


Dekar (Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals) vs Ashton Anchors (Star Ocean: The Second Story)
Hope Estheim (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Nina (Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter)
Yukiko Amagi (Persona 4) vs Syphide (Valkyrie Profile: Silmeria)
Sara (Breath of Fire) vs Warlock (Suikoden IV)

Light

Sazh Katzroy (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Kahn (Breath of Fire IV)
Piccolo (Suikoden III) vs Mia Ausa (Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete)
Locke Cole (Final Fantasy VI) vs Nina Wyndia (Breath of Fire III)
Elena (Final Fantasy VII) vs Tricia (Soul Nomad & The World Eaters)

Talaysen

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #33 on: May 12, 2012, 06:08:57 PM »
Godlike

Ashera (Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn) vs Mewtwo (Pokémon Series)
Charlton Blunt (Wild ARMs XF) vs Terra Branford (Final Fantasy VI)
Cidolfas Orlandu (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cid Raines (Final Fantasy XIII)
Mei-ling (SaGa Frontier) vs Apocrypha (Radiant Historia)

Heavy

Galcian (Skies of Arcadia) vs Wakka (Final Fantasy X)
Legretta (Tales of the Abyss) vs Nel Zelpher (Star Ocean: Till the End of Time)
Chie Satonaka (Persona 4) vs Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millenium)
Cthulhu (Cthulhu Saves the World) vs Elincia (Fire Emblem Series)

Middle


Dekar (Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals) vs Ashton Anchors (Star Ocean: The Second Story)
Hope Estheim (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Nina (Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter)
Yukiko Amagi (Persona 4) vs Syphide (Valkyrie Profile: Silmeria)
Sara (Breath of Fire) vs Warlock (Suikoden IV)

Light

Sazh Katzroy (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Kahn (Breath of Fire IV)
Piccolo (Suikoden III) vs Mia Ausa (Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete)
Locke Cole (Final Fantasy VI) vs Nina Wyndia (Breath of Fire III)
Elena (Final Fantasy VII) vs Tricia (Soul Nomad & The World Eaters)
« Last Edit: May 13, 2012, 05:30:24 PM by Talaysen »

Twilkitri

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #34 on: May 13, 2012, 02:51:11 PM »
Heavy

Galcian (Skies of Arcadia) vs Wakka (Final Fantasy X)
Chie Satonaka (Persona 4) vs Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millenium)

Middle

Dekar (Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals) vs Ashton Anchors (Star Ocean: The Second Story)

Meeplelard

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Re: RPGDL 2012 Season 1, Week 3: Cid/Cid OTP
« Reply #35 on: May 13, 2012, 09:53:33 PM »
Godlike

Ashera (Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn) vs Mewtwo (Pokémon Series): He can buff to minimize Ashera's damage, heal, then destroy the Auras.  His speed is what lets him do this.
Charlton Blunt (Wild ARMs XF) vs Terra Branford (Final Fantasy VI): Don't think its quite as one sided as people are making it out to be, but yeah, its in his favor.
Cidolfas Orlandu (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cid Raines (Final Fantasy XIII): I think Orlandu has the offense and speed combination to punch past Raine's scary phase.
Mei-ling (SaGa Frontier) vs Apocrypha (Radiant Historia): I'd vote on this, except for the fact that I only know half the duelers!

Heavy

Galcian (Skies of Arcadia) vs Wakka (Final Fantasy X): I think Galcian would take this WITHOUT Eternum, so yeah, not annoyed as I usually am by him sneaking wins with that.
Legretta (Tales of the Abyss) vs Nel Zelpher (Star Ocean: Till the End of Time): Nel's got the offense to get past Legretta, I wanna say.
Chie Satonaka (Persona 4) vs Rune Walsh (Phantasy Star IV: End of the Millenium): Pretty sure Chie wasn't immune to Instant Death so...
Cthulhu (Cthulhu Saves the World) vs Elincia (Fire Emblem Series): More inability to votingness!

Middle


Dekar (Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals) vs Ashton Anchors (Star Ocean: The Second Story): Ashton will be doubling Dekar every now and then! Pity Ashton isn't 2HKOing Dekar, so that's kind of moot.
Hope Estheim (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Nina (Breath of Fire: Dragon Quarter): Was gonna vote Nina but then remembered Veil...
Yukiko Amagi (Persona 4) vs Syphide (Valkyrie Profile: Silmeria): Heal war, one has limitless uses, the other does not.
Sara (Breath of Fire) vs Warlock (Suikoden IV): Sara Heal Locks.

Light

Sazh Katzroy (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Kahn (Breath of Fire IV): Buff, outlast or something.
Piccolo (Suikoden III) vs Mia Ausa (Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete): Resists Lightning if she loses speed; that's enough to win the slugfest.
Locke Cole (Final Fantasy VI) vs Nina Wyndia (Breath of Fire III): Faster, Nina can't really do anything without avoiding giving Locke more damage.
Elena (Final Fantasy VII) vs Tricia (Soul Nomad & The World Eaters): Kneejerk.  EDIT: Wait, confusion doesn't work on Women...well then, kneejerk in the OTHER direction!

« Last Edit: May 13, 2012, 09:55:23 PM by Meeplelard »
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