Nyarlathotep's Dungeon: Week 71

[Nephrite]

"Ho ho... I suppose some changes truly are in order. Let's see what happens this week."


Link to the Dungeon Wiki!

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Team dude | Cecilia, Ramza, Worker 8 (Firefly), Kyra, Ditto
[Ramza: Chemist]
[Floor 1: Starting off Again (Beginning of the game)]
Team dude vs. Hrist (VP1), Evil Gaia, Big Joe, Guido and Gorudo
Team dude vs. Bronzog, FFT Knight and Kwanda Rossman (S1)
Team dude vs. Blissey, Axem Green, Augst and Lucius
Team dude vs. Mist Dragon, Whelk, Wingraptor (FF5) and Garland (FF1)
Team dude vs. Laggy Fantasy Tactics Queklain

Team Monkey | Rikku, Virginia, KOS-MOS (Body Charge), Nall
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes] [Flash Hit, Cosmic Cog and Moon Spark]
Team Monkey vs. Hahn, Tia, Gadwin, Luna, Mareg and Shana
Team Monkey vs. Palom, Porom, Edward, Cid and Yang
Team Monkey vs. Albel, Adray, Noel and Chisato
Team Monkey vs. Yumei, Badrach, Aelia, Lorenta and Grey
Team Monkey vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf, Olan and Reis

Team Trips | Yuri1, Fogel, Cielo, Yukiko, FF5 Mime (SSL)
Floor 5b: Ribbon Almark
*Status does not have an effect on this floor. Attacks which inflict status may still be used.
Team Trips vs. Ryu1, Crono and Ness
Team Trips vs. Mitsuo the Hero, Adachi and Shadow Teddie
Team Trips vs. Adramelk, Velius and Hashmalum
Team Trips vs. Lashiec and Dark Force 2
Team Trips vs. Seymour Flux and Seymour Omnis

Team Random | Fogel, Rune, Tidus  Marco, Raja (MT)
Floor 7a: The Elemental Ties that Bind
Team Random vs. Sasarai, Land Umber (SD3) and Scarmiglione-Z (FF4DS)
Team Random vs. Barbariccia, S2 Luc, Tiamat (FF1) and Flik
Team Random vs. Kary, Ho-oh, Yukiko and Rubicante (FF4o)
Team Random vs. Suicune, Marle, Lenus, Umi (Cthulu) and Cagnazzo (FF4DS)
Team Random vs. Id, Sephiran and Ashera


Firefly - The first attack of each enemy will be redirected at the bearer of this sealstone. Multitarget attacks will focus on the bearer only. (E.g. MT Attack will hit the bearer # of allies times. (A 5 person party would have them be hit 5 times.))

Multitarget - All attacks are MT, however the damage/healing/status hit rates are halved and at maximum 50%.

Status Symbol Law - Team is fully status, debuff and ID immune, but has damage done to them increased by 1.1x and damage done by them decreased to .9x.

Body Charge - Increases the health, damage and effective speed of a character by 1.3x and decreases damage to them to .7x, but increases the cost of the character by 1.5x (rounded to nearest half point, .5s are 1.0s).

[Dhyerwolf]

Team Monkey | Rikku, Virginia, KOS-MOS (Body Charge), Nall
Rikku- Speed, MT Sleep, Silence or Blind+Damage, ST Buffs Protect, Shell or Haste, ST Stone
Virginia- 55% HP Boost, 10% Mag Boost, 10% Def, 44% Res, 10% Speed,
Spells: 50% Sleep, 35% ID (Vulnerable enemies are either 25% or 50%), Status Healing, Holy, Reflect, Dispel, Valiant, Replay
Protection from ID, Sleep and Dark and Light Magic
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes] [Flash Hit, Cosmic Cog and Moon Spark]
Team Monkey vs. Hahn, Tia, Gadwin, Luna, Mareg and Shana- A new addition. If Gadwin was here last week, I don't think Trips team would have made it past this fight. As such, Gadwin adds more slow MT/solid ST. Rikku runs in and statuses most of the team out first for easiness.
Team Monkey vs. Palom, Porom, Edward, Cid and Yang- Virginia blocks Sleep, Rikku can get resistance, so Yang can do little. Edward isn't reliable enough (Blocking Sleep makes him good things not turn 1). So...yeah, Rikku unleashes nasty MT herself
Team Monkey vs. Albel, Adray, Noel and Chisato- Rikku unleashes nasty MT
Team Monkey vs. Yumei, Badrach, Aelia, Lorenta and Grey- At least I get VP block a status so MT sleep game is now out. Not like it's an issue here anyways.
Team Monkey vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf, Olan and Reis- MT Sleep is out again too and MT Silence and Blind do little. Damage against W8 isn't so hot here, but Rikku could have stalled for a mix, and those would do the trick.

Team Trips | Yuri1, Fogel, Cielo, Yukiko, FF5 Mime (SSL)
Floor 5b: Ribbon Almark
*Status does not have an effect on this floor. Attacks which inflict status may still be used.
So uh...this team is just getting a damage/durability penalty this floor with no benefit.
Team Trips vs. Ryu1, Crono and Ness- First glance was that this fight improved a fair amount, but then I remembered that Crono's revival is not exactly anywhere close to full. They'll be able to take out Ness and then Crono, and Ryu taking a turn to transform doesn't exactly make him dangerous. This is certainly better, but for the most part not sure adding Crono really will ever change anything.
Team Trips vs. Mitsuo the Hero, Adachi and Shadow Teddie- Shadow Teddie starts with a  fearsome MT 5HKO or ST 4HKO. Mitsuo at least has about 60% MT damage (no way I'm seeing Megidalaon double twice), and can make it Ice so it hits weakness against Yukiko. Adachi has 33% MT KO since physicals here. The ones who don't fall in the first wave of attacks can do 0.8 MT combined. Cielo has 0.8 durability; Yukiko has .76. They are both being OHKOed at once essentially, and the enemies are extremely durable. Yuri spends all his time reviving, Mime can double that, but no one is healing then. Loss here.
Team Trips vs. Adramelk, Velius and Hashmalum-
Team Trips vs. Lashiec and Dark Force 2- If the team didn't lose earlier, this could also be a worry. It's close as it all depends on eliminating either one of them. Fire/Holy weakness on Lashiec helps for Yuri/Yukiko, but this is extremely close (do about 2.3 PC HP damage focused for the team).
Team Trips vs. Seymour Flux and Seymour Omnis- And I avoid thinking much about this fight. MT is good here, although Fogel now isn't as good (Omni and Morti's defense; Flux's auto protect counter) Also depends heavily on Reflect since topic notes it as ST spells (But...is it more that Reflect gets ST or that so few FF X spells are MT that it doesn't have get tested enough. MT is pretty much just Ultima I think?). Also, Mortechis and Seymour Omnis may just MTKO first (Off 114% speed), so would need Yuri to go in between (Which...is likely

[superaielman]

Pass to team dude. Abstain on team monkey.


Team Trips | Yuri1, Fogel, Cielo, Yukiko, FF5 Mime (SSL)
Floor 5b: Ribbon Almark
*Status does not have an effect on this floor. Attacks which inflict status may still be used.
Team Trips vs. Ryu1, Crono and Ness- Ness can be overwhelmed but it takes a full team beating on him.
Team Trips vs. Mitsuo the Hero, Adachi and Shadow Teddie- Fight depends if Adachi can get a turn or not.  Yuri+Fogel are unquestionably faster. SSL means that Cielo/Yukiko are slower. Mime is probably slower too.  Yuri oepns with Sandalphon and uses Sanctuary. This should prevent anyone from dying offhand. Yukiko/Mime heal, Fogel/Cielo go on offense. Should be enough.
Team Trips vs. Adramelk, Velius and Hashmalum-Should be able to blitz the fight out.
Team Trips vs. Lashiec and Dark Force 2- I kneejerk SSL Cielo beating out the PS4 bosses. He can open with Rakukaja, freeing Yuri to blast the PS4 bosses with Pulse. Lassic/DF can kill off Yukiko and Mime (They might be able to blitz Yuri out with Shadowbreath/another gate, but Yukiko can just revive making that a wasted effort). Yuri heals. Pulse+two Fogel physicals+one Cielo physical should be enough to off Lassic. Yuri should survive a single Shadowbreath at this point, meaning he can revive his teammates and get back in decent shape before the final boss.
Team Trips vs. Seymour Flux and Seymour Omnis- Unsure. This involves a lot of numbercrunching about buffs and the like. Flux having full life is a major problem though, he'll have to die first. Neph, do stat breaks work on this floor?


Team Random | Fogel, Rune, Tidus  Marco, Raja (MT)
Floor 7a: The Elemental Ties that Bind
Team Random vs. Sasarai, Land Umber (SD3) and Scarmiglione-Z (FF4DS)- Fogel can OHKO Sas before he can do anything nasty.
Team Random vs. Barbariccia, S2 Luc, Tiamat (FF1) and Flik- Too much blitz potential, I think. Flik and Luc can both do bad things to the team.
Team Random vs. Kary, Ho-oh, Yukiko and Rubicante
Team Random vs. Suicune, Marle, Lenus, Umi (Cthulu) and Cagnazzo (FF4DS)
Team Random vs. Id, Sephiran and Ashera

[Nephrite]

5b was designed such that people cannot buff themselves (because it's a status), if that changes anything anywhere.

Stat breaks... I'd lean no, unless there was a good argument for them not to be status... percentage-based increases might work, I guess?

EDIT: If the dis-allowing of buffs/debuffs makes Trips lose then throw it out since I didn't clarify that well enough originally, though.

[SnowFire]

Team Random vs. Kary, Ho-oh, Yukiko and Rubicante

Neph, didn't you say you were nerfing this fight before?  It was totally beatable before, it just *required* some fire resistance which is actually pretty common.  Adding Yukiko means that immuning fire no longer gives a team quite a freeroll, and she can do stuff like revive Rubicante.  And I don't see anyone on Team Random with Fire resist...  Tidus & Marco I know don't get it, and I don't think the rest have it particularly anyway.  Anyway, the team absolutely must rushdown Rubicante (Who picks his FF4DS form) before he unleashes Sunny Day'd Inferno MT overkill.  To do that, Random has 2x Fogel turns (off Hastega'd Marco Trans-Turn) + a Rune turn = ~1.8-2.0 PCHP damage?  Suspect that is not enough.

[Nephrite]

My bad, it's FF4o Rubicante, not the DS one. Not sure it changes anything but I meant to put that there.

[Random Consonant]

I doubt that it does.  I kind of went "dear god I am screwed either way" when I saw my options and went welp.  Fail for me.  Good enough run but dear god the obvious problem with my team bites me fierce here.

[Dhyerwolf]

Team Trips vs. Mitsuo the Hero, Adachi and Shadow Teddie- Fight depends if Adachi can get a turn or not.  Yuri+Fogel are unquestionably faster. SSL means that Cielo/Yukiko are slower. Mime is probably slower too.  Yuri oepns with Sandalphon and uses Sanctuary. This should prevent anyone from dying offhand. Yukiko/Mime heal, Fogel/Cielo go on offense. Should be enough.

Sanctuary really is not going to help much. Barring someone just using Dekaja, much of the damage comes from Megidala, which Sanctuary should not even affect? Yukiko would still go down, since the rest of the MT is hitting her weakness, which should offset Sanctuary. Mitsuo has like 4 PC durability (more to physical. Fogel needs 8 turns to kill him with that durability) and Teddie has more, so it's not like this fight can be blitzed.

Yukiko/Mime should not be valid for healing unless Mime is sub Yukiko speed. He should be after Yuri or Cielo. Also, SSL doesn't affect speed, just hits to damage and durability.

[superaielman]

Megidala is physical?

[Dhyerwolf]

Isn't P4 Almighty effectively non-typed?

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Megidola runs off Magic for whatever is worth. It bypasses both phys and magical reflection (-karn spells), but feels a bit of a stretch saying Megidola doesn't run into mdef given it -does- ram into P4 Con (the only durability stat) and runs off the non-physical offensive stat.

[Dhyerwolf]

Hmm, right. I don't know why I was thinking ITD (maybe the ignoring the Karns). Doesn't change much to me since it just mean that Yuri's turn will be completely cancelled by Dekaja. Of course, I didn't even realize this, but if Yuri goes Sandalphon, his attacking is also so much worse since all three enemies null Holy (And Yuri 1 does have that problem of effectively never having the SP to switch).

[DjinnAndTonic]

Teams dude and Monkey pass. Particularly like Dude's Chemist Ramza/Firefly Worker 8 combo.

Team Trips fails... really? An SSL team on the no-status floor?

Team Random... probably fails? I'll await some arguments since FF4o Rubicante doesn't get that much durability respect from me. And taking out Yukiko isn't that hard for Rune... I dunno.

[ThePiggyman]

For the FF4 fight on Team Monkey's floor, didn't Yang have claws that inflict Charm, or Confuse? If he can't Sleep Rikku, he can surely mess her up with Charm/Confuse, no?

Gonna wait to vote on Monkey's team.

Team Dude passes. Worker 8 almost solos.

Initial thought for Trips is a fail, since Seymour Flux's Cross-Cleave delays whoever hit it hits, and it's ITE. Combined with Ultima from Omnis, that might take out most of the team. And according to the stat topic, Omnis using Ultima doesn't slow him down. I guess strong magic damage or some MT Protect of some kind would make this fight a lot more manageable, but the lack of both makes this ehhhh. Mmmyeah, regrettably a fail.

Fail for team Random. I don't think they can go through the fire fight without losing the revivers. Raja literally explodes to fire damage, Kary's physical is strong, and Marco isn't exactly durable. Yukiko needs to be taken care of, too, so that she doesn't revive anyone herself. Too much to handle here. They could potentially get through this fight, but Fogel and Tidus can't take on the rest of the floor. Man, you need fire resistance or magic protection/immunity to have a chance with this fight.

[Dhyerwolf]

Team Random | Fogel, Rune, Tidus  Marco, Raja (MT)
Floor 7a: The Elemental Ties that Bind
Team Random vs. Sasarai, Land Umber (SD3) and Scarmiglione-Z (FF4DS)- Lots of ST or slow MT.
Team Random vs. Barbariccia, S2 Luc, Tiamat (FF1) and Flik- Luc has 60% MT off 119% Speed, Flik has solid ST off 114% speed. I guess that Flik could pikc off Rune, and then Barby could pick off Marco, and then Tiamat could pick off Raja.
Team Random vs. Kary, Ho-oh, Yukiko and Rubicante (FF4o)- Yeah, by endgame, Yukiko is even nasty to kill (Revival, Auto-Sukukaja). Irrelevant, but still
Team Random vs. Suicune, Marle, Lenus, Umi (Cthulu) and Cagnazzo (FF4DS)
Team Random vs. Id, Sephiran and Ashera

Team Dude passes

[dude789]

I think Trips and Random fail. Team Monkey passes. My team also passes. Worker 8's damage should be pretty good right now and Ramza and Kyra can keep him alive with items and Medice.

[Random Consonant]

Oh right a new team got in and I can actually vote on it.

Team dude passes, don't think he has any real problems with floor 1.

[SnowFire]

What was Floor 5a?  If it was the old reversal floor, I'm just going to assume that Hatbot picked for Trips, since SSL teams laugh their way through that one since it's so dependent on "instant death" life.  Not thinking too hard about Team Trips anyway, seems possible it could make it through but unlikely to happen.

Team Monkey hype seems to resolve around MT status use items.  Too lazy to look it up and see if there are any flaws in that plan, but sounds good, so pass.

Team dude is on the first floor, so pass.

I'm not *quite* as sold on Team Random dying as others are now that it's FF4o Rubicant, since he does have 3 revivers...  even if PS4 revival is scrubby.  If the team can survive to Tidus setting up Hastega, this isn't bad if they can wipe out all the MT spam; Hastega'd Marco spamming 2x good revives a turn is hard to beat.  But yeah, this requires Marco surviving, Rune playing reviver rather than blitzer, and all the MT enemies being knocked out since revival at 25% HP (12.5% HP for Raja !) is asking to be dead very soon.  But yeah, even if he makes it through, it's pretty borderline.

[Dhyerwolf]

Hatbot probably does answer my question of how Trips landed on this floor; SSL teams generally should not need to reverse revive on floor 5a though since so much less can actually hurt them (Crono-Magus tends to be the most dangerous fight and that's now irrelevant).

[Nephrite]

Re: Dungeon Floor 5
« Sent to: Nephrite on: May 07, 2012, 08:10:59 PM » ReplyQuoteDelete
Floor B



EDIT: 5a for reference

Floor 5a: Ceaseheal
*On this floor, restoration of HP and MP are reduced to 10% (of whatever they normally were (ANY healing is 10%, even if it was overkill full healing)) and revival may not be used.
Team vs. Reno, Rude and Elena (Midgar forms)
Team vs. Krin, Karn and Jane
Team vs. Yulie, Nina4 and Yukiko
Team vs. Mua, Golem and Cecil
Team vs. Berle

[Dhyerwolf]

So the old reverse heal was just removed?

[Nephrite]

Correct. It was a problematic floor.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

It was pretty much broken both ways, come to think of it. Got mangled something fierce by high-profile healers and ID slingers, but could and would completely wreck parties that didn't have a specific counter to the insanity. The nature of the beast.

[Nephrite]

Clearly I need a (toned down) Reverse Sealstone.

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Team dude | Cecilia, Ramza, Worker 8 (Firefly), Kyra, Ditto
[Ramza: Chemist]
[Floor 1: Starting off Again (Beginning of the game)]
Team dude vs. Hrist (VP1), Evil Gaia, Big Joe, Guido and Gorudo
Team dude vs. Bronzog, FFT Knight and Kwanda Rossman (S1)
Team dude vs. Blissey, Axem Green, Augst and Lucius
Team dude vs. Mist Dragon, Whelk, Wingraptor (FF5) and Garland (FF1)
Team dude vs. Laggy Fantasy Tactics Queklain - This floor kinda doesn't want to have to deal with Firefly W8. That and it's floor 1.

Team Monkey | Rikku, Virginia, KOS-MOS (Body Charge), Nall
[Floor 4: Diff'rent Strokes] [Flash Hit, Cosmic Cog and Moon Spark]
Team Monkey vs. Hahn, Tia, Gadwin, Luna, Mareg and Shana - Doesn't Rikku start getting the broken status whoring of doom now? Ginny also runs at better speed than usual due to Cosmic Cog, and I guess I could be nice and say X-BUSTER is floor 4. But the relevant part here is Rikku, so there it goes.
Team Monkey vs. Palom, Porom, Edward, Cid and Yang - KOS evade and sleep resistance work well to mitigate Ed and Yang. Past that, Rikku Rikkus it up.
Team Monkey vs. Albel, Adray, Noel and Chisato - And yeah.
Team Monkey vs. Yumei, Badrach, Aelia, Lorenta and Grey - um yeah.
Team Monkey vs. Worker 8, FFT Cloud, Beowulf, Olan and Reis - I suppose. Maybe I'm badly overselling Rikku, but oh well.

Team Trips | Yuri1, Fogel, Cielo, Yukiko, FF5 Mime (SSL)
Floor 5b: Ribbon Almark
*Status does not have an effect on this floor. Attacks which inflict status may still be used.
Team Trips vs. Ryu1, Crono and Ness - The team gets a fair bit of leeway here, I think. Yuri+Fogel+Mime+Cielo can handle Ness and then things flow.
Team Trips vs. Mitsuo the Hero, Adachi and Shadow Teddie - Holy -crap-. Team Trips goes first full-on, rips Adachi in half, probably undoes Mitsuo's shield... and then gets mangled by Yukiko weakness - Mabufula x2 actually adds up, and Mitsuo likely finishes off both revivers from there. Then, it's uphill for the team. Mind Charge on Shadow Teddie could also mean troubles.
Team Trips vs. Adramelk, Velius and Hashmalum -
Team Trips vs. Lashiec and Dark Force 2 - -ASSUMING THEY SURVIVED- the P4 team, I want to say they'd get kinda mangled here. Holy shit, Phantasy Star 4 bosses x2, Neph? You need utterly nutsy buffing to work this out - or something like 3x PC HP worth of ST offense before one gets a turn, which is a bit of a tall order to accomplish. I don't think Team Trips quite has the tools needed here.
Team Trips vs. Seymour Flux and Seymour Omnis

Team Random | Fogel, Rune, Tidus  Marco, Raja (MT)
Floor 7a: The Elemental Ties that Bind
Team Random vs. Sasarai, Land Umber (SD3) and Scarmiglione-Z (FF4DS)
Team Random vs. Barbariccia, S2 Luc, Tiamat (FF1) and Flik - Before any of the healers/revivers get a turn, this fight can kill all of them between The Shredding, Tornado and Flik (if Flik pelts Rune, Tiamat handles Marco/Raja without a fuss). Barbie+Luc by themselves can off literally anyone they want and leave the rest of the party hurting as well, and I'm pretty sure I'm more generous to Luc damage and speed than Dhyer is.
Team Random vs. Kary, Ho-oh, Yukiko and Rubicante (FF4o)
Team Random vs. Suicune, Marle, Lenus, Umi (Cthulu) and Cagnazzo (FF4DS)
Team Random vs. Id, Sephiran and Ashera