Author Topic: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)  (Read 1090 times)

superaielman

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Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« on: August 09, 2012, 03:12:44 AM »
See the Heavy pool for details.

Luca- Dwarf power, go! Sadly held back by a bad weapon type in the DL.
Tita- Did well in Proving Grounds light, which doesn't say much.
Black Wizard- Racially insensitive wizard rides again!


Luca (TAY) vs Guy (Lufia 2)
Luca vs Mareg (G2)
Luca vs Bow (BoF2)
Luca vs Rafa (FFT)
Luca vs Sazh (FF13)
Luca vs Ilyana (FEs)
Luca vs Cotton (Saga)
Luca vs Colette (ToS)
Luca vs Chidori (Pers3)
Luca vs Zieg (LoD)
Luca vs Nina (BoF3)
Luca vs Freed Y (S2)

Tita (Trails) vs Guy (Lufia 2)
Tita vs Mareg (G2)
Tita vs Bow (BoF2)
Tita vs Rafa (FFT)
Tita vs Sazh (FF13)
Tita vs Ilyana (FEs)
Tita vs Cotton (Saga)
Tita vs Colette (ToS)
Tita vs Chidori (Pers3)
Tita vs Zieg (LoD)
Tita vs Nina (BoF3)
Tita vs Freed Y (S2)

Black Wizard (FF1) vs Guy (Lufia 2)
Black Wizard vs Mareg (G2)
Black Wizard vs Bow (BoF2)
Black Wizard vs Rafa (FFT)
Black Wizard vs Sazh (FF13)
Black Wizard vs Ilyana (FEs)
Black Wizard vs Cotton (Saga)
Black Wizard vs Colette (ToS)
Black Wizard vs Chidori (Pers3)
Black Wizard vs Zieg (LoD)
Black Wizard vs Nina (BoF3)
Black Wizard vs Freed Y (S2)
"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself"- Count Aral Vorkosigan, A Civil Campaign
-------------------
<Meeple> knownig Square-enix, they'll just give us a 2nd Kain
<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...

SnowFire

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2012, 06:09:11 AM »
Tita (Trails) vs Guy (Lufia 2) - BUT BUT BLIND
Tita vs Mareg (G2)
Tita vs Rafa (FFT)
Tita vs Sazh (FF13) - To even have a vague chance, Tita needs to be allowed an initiative S-Craft to beat out Protect / Haste.  Blind is not useful against Ruin, Sazh can make confuse unlikely to hit and it's not really a problem even if it does hit, so Sazh should easily win this even for the damage average with Hope & Vanille as Commandos.
Tita vs Ilyana (FEs)
Tita vs Colette (ToS) - Spoils elements, has okay HP anyway.
Tita vs Zieg (LoD) - Zieg's got like a 6HKO or something according to the stat topic, damned if I remember him from in-game.

superaielman

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2012, 02:26:07 PM »

Luca (TAY) vs Guy (Lufia 2)- Guy can heal, Luca can't.
Luca vs Mareg (G2)- Same game, better at it.
Luca vs Bow (BoF2)- Luca can't overcome the healing.
Luca vs Rafa (FFT- Think she can stay alive just long enough with the Earth clothes setup, along with an evasion from the elf mantle.
Luca vs Sazh (FF13)- Goes first and buffs up. That should be enough.
Luca vs Ilyana (FEs)- Ilyana runs smack into Luca elemental defenses.
Luca vs Cotton (Saga)- Luca should manage the 2HKO here.
Luca vs Zieg (LoD)- Zieg sucks.
Luca vs Nina (BoF3)
Luca vs Freed Y (S2)- Thunder resistance and durability should trump Freed's superior speed.

Black Wizard (FF1) vs Guy (Lufia 2)- I don't buy BW's status being turn two here. 
Black Wizard vs Mareg (G2)- Think he can squeeze out a status win here? Mareg's MDef I remember being bad.
Black Wizard vs Bow (BoF2)- Bow offense is bad.
Black Wizard vs Rafa (FFT)- No status.
Black Wizard vs Sazh (FF13)- Should be able to outrace Break.
Black Wizard vs Ilyana (FEs)- Ilyana is fairly status resistant in FE10 and isn't doubled by average the way she is in 9.
Black Wizard vs Cotton (Saga)- Status.
Black Wizard vs Zieg (LoD)- Kneejerk.
Black Wizard vs Nina (BoF3)- Someone please tell me Nina3 can immune ID and not just resist it.  Her HP is low enough to get killed by XXXX otherwise.
Black Wizard vs Freed Y (S2)- Should be able to outslug.

Luca: 5-5
BW: 3-6
"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself"- Count Aral Vorkosigan, A Civil Campaign
-------------------
<Meeple> knownig Square-enix, they'll just give us a 2nd Kain
<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...

Jo'ou Ranbu

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2012, 04:01:09 PM »
Nina immunes every status, stat-bust, draining and ID with her default setup. The real question there is whether she 3HKOs BW before he 3HKOs back. Truly a legendary fight.
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> HEY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> LAGGY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> UVIET?!??!?!
[01:08] <Laggy> YA!!!!!!!!!1111111111
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> OMG!!!!
[01:08] <Chulianne> No wonder you're small.
[01:08] <TranceHime> cocks
[01:08] <Laggy> .....

Random Consonant

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2012, 09:43:35 PM »
Black Wizard (FF1) vs Guy (Lufia 2) - Kneejerk.
Black Wizard vs Mareg (G2) - This, on the other hand, I'm sure of.
Black Wizard vs Bow (BoF2) - Yep.
Black Wizard vs Rafa (FFT) - Amazing.  Negative respect for Truth means Rafa has to win this with stick beats.  DoS BW 4HKOs, HP/Faith may bring this to a 3HKO, Rafa needs status protection, so her damage is a 5HKO, BW awesome durability may bring that to a 3HKO, and Thief Hat being awesome and blocking one of BW's statuses means she's going first.  Alternatively, she could forgo petrify blocking for a mantle and hope that reduces it to below turn 2, thinking that's enough.
Black Wizard vs Ilyana (FEs) - FE10 Ilyana isn't *that* incompetent, no.
Black Wizard vs Cotton (Saga) - Status.
Black Wizard vs Colette (ToS) - Status, I think.
Black Wizard vs Zieg (LoD) - Edit: still going with this despite holy crap durability fail because DoS BW damage plot
Black Wizard vs Nina (BoF3) - Nina3 3HKOs?  That's fight to me.
Black Wizard vs Freed Y (S2) - Status, I think.  I assume DoS BW status is somewhat better, anyways.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2012, 12:05:42 AM by Random Consonant »

Jo'ou Ranbu

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2012, 05:36:30 PM »
Black Wizard (FF1) vs Guy (Lufia 2) - Eh sure.
Black Wizard vs Mareg (G2) - ^^
Black Wizard vs Bow (BoF2) - Simply amazing.
Black Wizard vs Rafa (FFT) - Amazing.
Black Wizard vs Ilyana (FEs) - Ugh. Ilyana is doubled... but BW runs out of Flare charges after the first swipe and otherwise he eats counters/fails too much to deal damage. Worse: he doesn't even two-round with physicals (...), and Ilyana 3HKOs him while his own claim to do that is amazingly sketchy. Since I also take the harshest XXX scaling... um yeah he needs three turns minimum to win and he's likely triggering counters on one of those to boot. Dear -god- what a failurefest.
Black Wizard vs Cotton (Saga) - 20HKO+awful speed+status vulnerability against BW is a winning combo.
Black Wizard vs Chidori (Pers3) - Goes first, is a sliver away from OHKOing and doesn't even get 2HKOed back. Chidori, you're fucking -incredible-.
Black Wizard vs Zieg (LoD) - EDIT: WHAT THE HELL, ZIEG.
Black Wizard vs Nina (BoF3) - Nina 3HKOs. Off pure HP, BW would 2HKO back, but I'm dearly hoping Nina's o_o Int (Momo's is O_O) raises her above 74% PC HP against magic.
Black Wizard vs Freed Y (S2) - EDIT: Freed 2HKOs? Goooooooodbye.

I feel like a goddamn janitor.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2012, 03:57:29 PM by Jo'ou Ranbu »
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> HEY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> LAGGY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> UVIET?!??!?!
[01:08] <Laggy> YA!!!!!!!!!1111111111
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> OMG!!!!
[01:08] <Chulianne> No wonder you're small.
[01:08] <TranceHime> cocks
[01:08] <Laggy> .....

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2012, 11:20:16 PM »
Luca (TAY) vs Guy (Lufia 2): 3HKOs, isn't 3HKOed. IPs only tilt this more in his favour.
Luca vs Mareg (G2): As above, only Mareg is faster than Luca anyway. Luca might actually succeed in 3HKOing him but it doesn't matter.
Luca vs Bow (BoF2): Healing.
Luca vs Rafa (FFT): Luca 3HKOs, Rafa 4HKOs (takes 5 rounds to kill on average), but any time she hits herself offsets more than a hit from Luca, and she's faster. So basically she needs to heal at least once in turns 2-3, and at least once again on turns 3-4. She has a 51% chance to heal each turn. I think overall she wins this on average... around 57% of the time? I guess I could be argued that I should demand 67% odds from this but eh, holistically these numbers are an underestimate because sometimes you can reduce Sky Demon's size. So 50% threshold works.
Luca vs Sazh (FF13): Brave/Protect, then 3HKO while not being 3HKOed (or even 4HKOed).
Luca vs Ilyana (FEs): Can withstand 3 attacks and 2HKO if the second attack is Big Throw. (One Big Throw does not get her 3-2'd.) That's assuming she doesn't resist elements.
Luca vs Cotton (Saga): 2HKOs, which is all you need to beat Cotton. Hooray for slashing damage.
Luca vs Zieg (LoD): Zieg is pretty bad.
Luca vs Nina (BoF3): Nina is also pretty bad.
Luca vs Freed Y (S2): 3HKOs, isn't 3HKOed. Both are pretty average outside of Luca's HP.

Tita (Trails) vs Guy (Lufia 2): Blind then petrify eventually. Guy might be able to do this if Torrent is magical but the odds are still against him due to speed and Tita's ability to pull out an S-Craft if she regenerates the SP from the initial blind.
Tita vs Mareg (G2): Blind not being useful means beastman smash.
Tita vs Bow (BoF2): Blind can be healed away, damage can be healed away, confuse just makes Bow attack her. Nothing Tita does sticks, here.
Tita vs Rafa (FFT): Rafa is kinda fragile so Tita can win on her second turn if Rafa doesn't heal the first. Of course, on average, Rafa does heal on the first. So Tita won't win until her third turn. Unfortunately for her she's dead by then.
Tita vs Sazh (FF13): Needs to blind and then confuse, but Sazh can leave her almost dead before then, so I doubt that works.
Tita vs Ilyana (FEs): 2HKOs, this is easy.
Tita vs Cotton (Saga): Petrify.
Tita vs Zieg (LoD): Um she possibly one-rounds, certainly needs two turns at most and Zieg doesn't 2HKO anything.
Tita vs Nina (BoF3): See above, replace "Zieg" with "Nina".
Tita vs Freed Y (S2): Just faster, so this is another victory via blind.

Black Wizard (FF1) vs Guy (Lufia 2): Guy MDef is below average, it doesn't take much to make Break turn 2.
Black Wizard vs Mareg (G2): See above.
Black Wizard vs Bow (BoF2): Bow has no way to close the deal here.
Black Wizard vs Rafa (FFT): Rafa blocks stone and optimises her physical otherwise. She 3HKOs and outpaces any other status or damage.
Black Wizard vs Sazh (FF13): Does Sazh 2HKO here without buffs? Um, wow.
Black Wizard vs Ilyana (FEs): All of BW's worthwhile attacks ignore both doubles and counters. Ilyana has no trouble just outslugging though; she 2HKOs.
Black Wizard vs Cotton (Saga): Break.
Black Wizard vs Zieg (LoD): Zieg 3HKOs. Does BW 2HKO before then? Do I see Zieg below 0.74 mdur? ... yeah, I probably do.
Black Wizard vs Nina (BoF3): I assume her Int takes at least 11% off spell damage. Could be wrong of course. See Snow then, she 3HKOs first.
Black Wizard vs Freed Y (S2): Freed 2HKOs and though he goes second, his MDef is average so he doesn't succumb to BW status.

Black Wizard 5-5
Luca 5-5
Tita 5-5

All lights are equal, but some are more equal than others. They did largely beat different opponents which was at least interesting.

Rafa, Sazh 3-0
Mareg, Bow, Ilyana 2-1
Guy, Nina, Freed 1-2
Cotton, Zieg 0-3

Erwin Schrödinger will kill you like a cat in a box.
Maybe.

Jo'ou Ranbu

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2012, 11:27:40 PM »
Holy crap, Zieg is -that- bad? How much HP does he have anyway?
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> HEY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> LAGGY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> UVIET?!??!?!
[01:08] <Laggy> YA!!!!!!!!!1111111111
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> OMG!!!!
[01:08] <Chulianne> No wonder you're small.
[01:08] <TranceHime> cocks
[01:08] <Laggy> .....

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2012, 11:38:01 PM »
12000 and averagish defence. I'd eyeball average damage around 2000 at that point. (Melbu has 42k and better defences, and he's tanky but not some unstappable death tank; I certainly don't see each of his 10k HP forms as above PCHP even after defences, soo...)

Erwin Schrödinger will kill you like a cat in a box.
Maybe.

Jo'ou Ranbu

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2012, 11:58:03 PM »
Under that average, Zieg scores 0.6x PC HP for me on the spot. Yeah, changing my votes so hard.
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> HEY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> LAGGY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> UVIET?!??!?!
[01:08] <Laggy> YA!!!!!!!!!1111111111
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> OMG!!!!
[01:08] <Chulianne> No wonder you're small.
[01:08] <TranceHime> cocks
[01:08] <Laggy> .....

superaielman

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Re: Proving grounds: Yep, bringing this back again. (Light)
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2012, 08:45:32 PM »
Updating all three PGs tomorrow. Get your votes and edits in now!
"Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself"- Count Aral Vorkosigan, A Civil Campaign
-------------------
<Meeple> knownig Square-enix, they'll just give us a 2nd Kain
<Ciato> he would be so kawaii as a chibi...