Poll

So who is it going to be?

Obama
22 (66.7%)
Romney
1 (3%)
3rd party
6 (18.2%)
No vote
4 (12.1%)

Total Members Voted: 32

Author Topic: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)  (Read 7759 times)

Dunefar

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Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« on: September 08, 2012, 07:30:41 PM »
With the US election coming up, I'm curious to how the DL plans on voting and why. Feel free to do so even if you're not part of the US.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2012, 08:11:05 PM »
Gary Johnson. Part protest vote, part thinking he is the best person for the job.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #2 on: September 12, 2012, 12:16:02 AM »
Obama.

The way the US works, third party votes are just that... protest votes. Otherwise I'd vote for Paul Krugman or something.

So between Obama and Romney I would rather have Obama as president. Romney is overly demonized by democrats right now but even though he has governed as a moderate in the past he would still be the leader of the modern Republican Party, which pushes for a flatter tax schedule and is in general far too bellicose in matters foreign. They also adamantly deny that humans can cause climate change, and their intransigence on this issue is absolutely unacceptable. Republicans also believe the root of our economic woes is 'structural' and a result of 'too much government', with their proposed solutions being cutting spending and taxes. The. Economy. Is. Bad. Because. Of. A. Lack. Of. Demand. Tax cuts can help with this, but when they disproportionately effect the most wealthy they don't help as much (the wealthy spend less of their income, generating less demand), and since the national debt is so scary to politicians those less effective tax cuts inevitably mean spending elsewhere is cut or not increased and so what you get is a more regressive tax code and a demand gap that has not been bridged as effectively (if at all!). Spending or lower-class tax cuts would be more effective at  this point in time. Also they flirt with the gold standard, which would have put deflationary pressures on our currency in the middle of our crisis (largely caused by debt, which gets much worse with deflation). In short the modern Republican party is one that has wedded itself to ideas that are quite detrimental to the wellbeing of our nation [Flatter tax code, testosterone-driven foreign policy, and a macroeconomic outlook that is based on a belief in magic rather than the study of what has actually happened). This is without even touching on social issues, where Republicans have made the political calculation that opposing equal rights for gay people will result in more vote counts, hence blighting the lives of many of our fellow citizens to pick up a few votes from the religious right.

In the US, you only vote for PEOPLE in the primaries, and after that it's entirely between picking Republicans to have power or Democrats. And I'd much prefer Democrats.

Anyways, just look at our recent experience:
Republicans in power: More regressive tax schemes, more large scale foreign wars, DOMA.
Democrats in power: More people with health care.

One of these things is not like the other.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2012, 05:19:09 PM by Pyro »

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2012, 12:44:05 AM »
Honestly, end of the day, talking strictly policy and likely goals in a term?  I don't think Obama and Romney are terribly different.  romney is probably a little more anti-regulation, but I also don't think Obama will actually accomplish any kind of regulation or financial reform in a second term, and Romney will likely leave well enough alone in a first term.  That said, Romney will probably be doing a number of things against his own, personal goals because he's lashed himself to a party that hates science and reason, and as such there's no meaningful choice except to vote for Obama, since the democrats are pretty unlikely to get anything done that actually makes things worse.

Unfortunately I feel like the best we can hope for is "stay the course, don't let yahoos who'll make shit worse get elected" for the foreseeable future.  Until either one of the other parties steps the fuck up and is a legitimate force in politics, or until the republicans scrap their entire platform in favor of something that's not mind-bogglingly unsustainable, we're just not going to make any meaningful progress towards a better country.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2012, 01:27:42 AM »
Obama. I'm not, at the moment, particularly fond of either party but my social beliefs mean I will, more or less, never be able to vote Republican.

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2012, 11:38:09 AM »
Obama.  I'd vote for Jill Stein  if I thought she had a snowball's chance in hell of winning, and would honestly prefer Gary Johnson over Obama, but of the two realistic winners Obama's the clear choice as far as I'm concerned.  Really, anyone but Romney.  A Romney defeat would be a rejection of the Republican party's policy of obstruction and goal of "Make sure the other guy fucks up" and may actually make them a party to realistically take seriously in the future. 

Also, I gotta ask.  Who is the Romney vote?  Dune, is that you??

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2012, 01:59:51 PM »
I like several things Romney has done for Massachusetts (healthcare, for example). I don't like how this action seemed to vaporize in party politics until it came out that he backed a similar healthcare system the Republicans have constantly derided. I don't like party politics. It is exhausting. I don't care anymore about who says what about who - it's all fodder. I am only voting for Obama because I support "gay rights," "female rights," and "minority rights." I don't like Obama and war. I don't like Obama and his timetable. I do, however, love everything the First Lady's is doing for nutrition. And in light of celebrity-president, I also like Obama's patience. I am only voting for Obama if I vote, but I am seriously considering not casting a vote (not because my -vote doesn't count-; it totes does since I vote in statewide elections as well). Chatting with poli sci PhDs about the tangibility of voting and supporting partisanship and a gluttonous and wonky election process has made me think over "Why I want to vote," and I have a couple sticky notes on my wall with answers, but I'll wait for the first one to fall and choose that. If it's anything about peripheral rights, pft, no point in voting (and I have tons of reasons for peripheral rights).

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2012, 06:38:55 PM »
Obama. I'm not, at the moment, particularly fond of either party but my social beliefs mean I will, more or less, never be able to vote Republican.

Pretty much this dead on the nose. Don't like the economics of either party. One party disgusts me morally, the other only makes me roll my eyes at times. Pretty clear cut.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2012, 07:01:49 PM »
Voting for Jill Stein. She's a little bit of a lefty for me in some aspects, but I am disgusted at the level of attention the environment is getting beyond stupid, uneducated opinions on the subject. Would vote for Obama if I was in a swing state likely.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2012, 11:13:38 PM »
I like several things Romney has done for Massachusetts (healthcare, for example). I don't like how this action seemed to vaporize in party politics until it came out that he backed a similar healthcare system the Republicans have constantly derided. I don't like party politics. It is exhausting. I don't care anymore about who says what about who - it's all fodder. I am only voting for Obama because I support "gay rights," "female rights," and "minority rights." I don't like Obama and war. I don't like Obama and his timetable. I do, however, love everything the First Lady's is doing for nutrition. And in light of celebrity-president, I also like Obama's patience. I am only voting for Obama if I vote, but I am seriously considering not casting a vote (not because my -vote doesn't count-; it totes does since I vote in statewide elections as well). Chatting with poli sci PhDs about the tangibility of voting and supporting partisanship and a gluttonous and wonky election process has made me think over "Why I want to vote," and I have a couple sticky notes on my wall with answers, but I'll wait for the first one to fall and choose that. If it's anything about peripheral rights, pft, no point in voting (and I have tons of reasons for peripheral rights).

In a country where note voting is seen as lazy and whatnot, if the politics are bothering you have you considered protest voting instead of just not voting?  It is a tiny tiny voice, but it is still more of a voice if you roll up and vote for "Fuck all you twats and all this is bullshit" than it is to say nothing.  You might at least make one vote counter laugh.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2012, 04:11:17 AM »
In a country where note voting is seen as lazy and whatnot, if the politics are bothering you have you considered protest voting instead of just not voting?  It is a tiny tiny voice, but it is still more of a voice if you roll up and vote for "Fuck all you twats and all this is bullshit" than it is to say nothing.  You might at least make one vote counter laugh.

Oddly enough, independents cast some of the wildest protest votes there are, esp. if it's third party. It's not just the politics that bother me, but the entire electoral process. That said, casting a vote just to cast a vote doesn't resonate for me. And I will be honest, I've heard such toss-away votes articulated as simply voting against both Democrats and Republicans, and that's not my interest either.

There's plenty of other outlets for my voice to be heard without recurring elections each four years.

Americans, at least progressive Americans, view not voting as an ignorant decision in not exercising your rights. I understand this argument, but such a 'right' to vote is guided along a partisan system anyway. For a little background, I've voted since I could.

TL;DR,  I'm thinking more about my vote as not just a 'vote' or tangible statistic, but really as my beliefs in the democratic process of society today. As such, a protest vote doesn't mean much to me. 

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2012, 07:22:54 AM »
Cool cool, just making sure you had it in mind.  I was saying it as someone who in a society where you have to vote actually went out of his way to legally organize not to have to vote on year because I was traveling during one of the elections and was amazingly disgusted with both our major parties at the time.  I still regret not throwing my usual Green vote in the ring.  Given we use preferential voting as well I could have thrown Labor and Liberal towards the bottom (there is some third parties that belong below them still)).
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2012, 05:47:49 PM »
Also, I gotta ask.  Who is the Romney vote?  Dune, is that you??

Yep. I don't have a particularly strong opinion about this election, but I figured someone should give him a vote.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #13 on: September 16, 2012, 04:20:23 AM »
I'm likely going to be a poll-worker again this year. Can't wait.

Voting Obama for much the same reasons as articulated by Pyro.

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #14 on: September 16, 2012, 06:34:56 AM »
Hey, pity is a campaign strategy of sorts. Just not a winning one.

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #15 on: September 17, 2012, 07:45:59 AM »
Appparently you can't vote third party in Oklahoma unless that candidate meets a petition signature requirement and has no write-ins so uh... that's pretty terrible!
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #16 on: October 09, 2012, 07:56:33 AM »
There's not a particular lot of thought going into why I'm voting for Obama.

As time goes by, I think I'm increasingly agitated at the private sector's complete inability to handle anything outside of making a temporary huge profit. Couple that with my social stance of "Anything goes", I can't see me voting for a Republican again, until they either change their platform entirely, or come up with an incentivization program for infrastructure that actually looks like it might work out better than the government building something.

I don't much care for either party, but comparing contemporary republicans to contemporary democrats is like comparing apples that actively hate about 75% of my friends to oranges that are OK with lying to my face about being corporate shills. I'll take the liars over the people actively destroying the lives of my friends and family.

Furthermore, economic conservatism, I think, is either a dead idea, or an idea that neither Republican nor Democrat actually ascribes to.
I am for -profitability- of a nation. And the benefits of slashing taxes and lowering spending is.... not the way to economic prosperity, and this is a pretty open-and-shut case. It allows a select few percentage people at the very, very top live a somewhat more prosperous life while actively fucking over everyone else. These monied individuals might actually affect GDP so much that the -numbers- show a wealthier nation, but looking at the numbers to determine wealth is a really small part of the picture.

The key to being profitable is actually making investments. Infrastructure. I live in Michigan, and we pretty much always take the shortest term solution to a problem of infrastructure, and it frustrates the living crap out of me. So much of our state budget is tied up in building and rebuilding our road system, because we use cheap building materials and also salt the roads every single year at winter. Would it cost a lot more to invest in a more durable road? YES. But it would also free up money in future years to help with our Education sector, which is failing. Or our Police or Fire services, which are also failing. Or our state healthcare, which is already failed. People who currently claim to be fiscally conservative are completely short-sighted about the long-term implications of economic investment, and I simply cannot trust them anymore with my money.

Furthermore, along this argument, it's telling looking at what conservatives actually want to cut. PBS, NASA (not that dems are Pro-NASA), Welfare, FOOD STAMPS.... Cutting PBS and NASA are like deleting your computer's text files to free up space on your 500 GB hard drive. And Food Stamps being a debated issue in 2012 in the United States--- I would argue that that, alone. ALONE that is a reason to not vote for one of the two main parties. Food Stamps are THE single most efficient government expense we currently have. It's an extremely small amount of government spending, and it pays itself off either at near-complete levels, or more-than-complete levels year after year. That one of the two parties considers this something that can be cut, or at least DEBATED cutting to rile up their base is some combination of unfathomable stupidity and pants-shitting evilness that I honestly might consider not voting Republican for that issue alone.

There's also a distinct unawareness (and complete dishonesty) of how the deficit works and where it actually comes from. The majority (or possibly a plurality. It's definitely the largest percent) of the US debt is not owed to China, Canada, Britain, or whatever. It's owed to the United States of America. Specifically, private corporations that... honestly, maybe we should consider taxing more. Instead of saying "Gee, I'll pay you back", I'm actually fairly A-OK with the government saying "Fuck you. You need us to operate your business and we need the money you're using to pay extravagant salaries to your CEOS to operate our country. Either YOU take care of your workers, or WE WILL" And really, that's only if people absolutely have to see the deficit go down. It doesn't have to.

There are only a handful of countries in the WORLD that operate without a federal deficit. Most of these are Middle Eastern nations with an insanely high oil profitability and also insanely shitty public service spending. The three first world nations are South Korea, which arguably has the best infrastructure on the planet, showing that, YES, spending a shit ton of money to upgrade your technology might actually become profitable, Norway, which is one of the most socialist countries in the world, and Iceland, which just declared fucking bankruptcy, so who the fuck knows if looking at a goddamn deficit can tell you anything.

To be somewhat back on point, infrastructure and investment are very important ideas to me, and while Obama has been disappointing at best on this subject, Mitt Romney is actively -bad-. He wants to cut programs that are efficient, take up little of our expenditure, or -both-. He supports lower taxation for the population in the areas of the very rich and of corporations, which is where we get the bulk of our actual income from. He has repeatedly talked about expanding the size and scope of our military, which is already oversized, already not properly built for the operations we use it for, against the advice of our actual military leadership, who want decreased big fuckin' boats and guns and troops and more specialists, and it's also one of the least efficient government expenses we currently have. Mitt's personal track-record on infrastructure and wealth-creation is terribly, TERRIBLY bad. My friends in Massachusetts gave me insight into this handy shit-sandwich.

So yeah. I'm gonna vote for Obama. I'm not too thrilled with what kind of a president he's been, but Mitt could goddamn actually win this election, particularly if debates keep going the way they have been, and that would be an unmitigated disaster. I'd otherwise vote third party, but I'm not sure for whom. Republicans are supposedly the party of financial stability, but I've tried my best to show why that's laughable in the light of the contemporary GOP's rhetoric. You have a guaranteed human right to -vote- for your president in this country, so I mean, feel free to vote Romney if you really want. Just keep in mind that on both social and economic policy, a vote cast in this direction is Objectively Wrong.

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #17 on: October 09, 2012, 01:24:47 PM »
Quote
Furthermore, economic conservatism, I think, is either a dead idea, or an idea that neither Republican nor Democrat actually ascribes to.

I don't think economic conservatism has anything to do with either party. The shitshow that is military spending alone makes me roll my eyes at most republican small government types, and the ones who only want government interference on moral issues (Abortion) generates the same type of fuck off response.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2012, 05:17:38 AM »
Hey, I'm alive!

Obama.

Honestly, I follow politics so minimally, I usually don't have a strong opinion.  That having been said, Romney's plan to improve primary care access is to have people use the emergency department as a primary care centre. 

This is the dumbest idea I have ever heard, and, while I think Obama doesn't have a great grasp on healthcare, it sure as hell beats Romney's understanding.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2012, 05:10:07 PM »
When humanity stands strong and people reach out for each other...
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #20 on: October 19, 2012, 08:15:08 PM »
http://www.isidewith.com/results/168228653

More striking than the extent to which I agree with Jill Stein and Obama is the extent to which I disagree with Romney.  Doesn't that guy do anything right?
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #21 on: October 19, 2012, 08:46:53 PM »
I'm sorry, that made me laugh. Wow.
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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #22 on: October 19, 2012, 09:37:44 PM »
http://www.isidewith.com/results/168327287

I did not know we had a JUSTICE Party. They sound agreeable, although I am trying very hard not to think of Vault 11 here.

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #23 on: October 20, 2012, 01:38:42 AM »
http://www.isidewith.com/results/168754813

How in the world can I even have a 7% with Romney? What the fuck?

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Re: Who are you planning to vote for? (US presidential election)
« Reply #24 on: October 20, 2012, 02:09:17 AM »
You can click his name if you want to see the breakdown.
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