Nyarlathotep's Dungeon: Week 116

[Nephrite]

"Hmm... I wonder if this is the limit of new blood? Well, let's give you a fair chance at trying again!"


Link to the Dungeon Wiki!

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**Full Heals reset limit and other types of gauges when teams pass through them.
**Characters that join after the start are locked into the relative stats they have at that time until they would officially join.



Team Piggyman | Ramza, Aika, Shadow (MT), Sharanda, Bowser
[Ramza: Ninja | Item, Martial Arts, Auto-Potion, Move HP-Up] (Time Mage, Oracle, Geomancer, Monk, Chemist)
Floor 5b: A Less Fair Fight
*Enemies on this floor have 1.5x Health
Team Piggyman vs. Marcello & Evil Jessica
Team Piggyman vs. Empyrea
Team Piggyman vs. Rhapthorne & Dhoulmagus 2

Team MICHAEL | Rika, Arnaud (MT), FFT Chemist, Yulie, Juan
Floor 3a: Unified Strength
**On this floor, party HP is pooled together.  If someone is fatally statused, likewise if a character is hit with gravity, that health should be removed.
Team MICHAEL vs. Crono, Marle, Lucca, Frog and Robo
Team MICHAEL vs. Adramelk, Velius and Queklain
Team MICHAEL vs. Seymour Omnis

Team Random | Yuri2, Hilda, FFT Chemist, Raquel (Speed?), Raynie
Team Random vs. Big Joe, Evil Gaia, 10 Jogurts, VP1 Hrist, Euram Barrows, Gobi, A DQ1 Slime, Garland and Igglanova (PS4)
Team Random vs. Cecil and Rosa
Team Random vs. Augus and Joker (BoF2)

Time Capsule Team Rozalia | Chris(TWR), Tidus, Ephraim, Jane, Nall
[Floor 1: Starting off Again (Beginning of the game)]
Team Rozalia vs. Big Joe, Evil Gaia, 10 Jogurts, VP1 Hrist, Euram Barrows, Gobi, A DQ1 Slime, Garland and Igglanova (PS4)
Team Rozalia vs. Cecil and Rosa
Team Rozalia vs. Augus and Joker (BoF2)


Multitarget - One person on the team's actions all become Multitargetted. However, the damage of regular attacks, the healing of all spells that restore HP or MP, the status rates of status spells or attacks and the effect of buffs or debuffs (rounded down to the nearest half point in the case of Pokemon) is reduced by 33%. (Deadly Fingertips has a 67% chance of inflicting ID for example) Moves that were originally MT are not affected by this. This sealstone may be moved. In the case of revival, this affects the amount of HP restored, not the chance of revival occuring. Moves that have two types of effects (healing + buffing) are both decreased.

[Nephrite]

Can a team who originally lost to Floor 1 years ago finally get by now that Chris uses a True Water Rune!? (probably not)

[Magic Fanatic]

Time Capsule Team Rozalia | Chris(TWR), Tidus, Ephraim, Jane, Nall
[Floor 1: Starting off Again (Beginning of the game)]
Team Rozalia vs. Big Joe, Evil Gaia, 10 Jogurts, VP1 Hrist, Euram Barrows, Gobi, A DQ1 Slime, Garland and Igglanova (PS4)
Team Rozalia vs. Cecil and Rosa
Team Rozalia vs. Augus and Joker (BoF2) - Given what we know now of Jane and Sucker!, I don't think this team can actually lose before it gets really going.

I'll consider the other ones later.

[ThePiggyman]

I haven't played DQ8, so I just need to clarify a few things before analyzing my team. A lot of the bosses have Waves of Ice, which seems to be an entire-field type Dispel move. Would it be seen as removing Delta Shield and Invisible status? Based on how it's worded in the topic, my gut reaction is yes, but figured I'd have someone who's played the game clear that up for me.

[SnowFire]

Magic Fanatic: Does Jane's evade start out as good as it ends up, at 63% evade?  (I realize that "start out" is inherently weird with late-joining temps.)

That said, assuming so, I agree, pass for Team Rozalia.  No MT for fight 1, but not really any threat either, so whatever.  Should surely be able to chip through Rosa critical status and avoid a cover, Cecil alone is worthless; and Sucker spam handles Augus, while Chris's healing handles Joker's MT 3HKO.

Piggyman: I'd *definitely* see Wave of Ice as ruining Vanish, 100%.  Delta Shield is more interp swingier, but I'd probably see it canceling that too.  (Which is not to say that Delta Shield isn't worth spamming anyway, knock 'em down to just 3 actions rather than 4.)  That said...  I see that Dhoully 2 got added to the final fight.  Does your team have fire resistance or something?  Seems like a rough fight, I don't think you can rushdown either boss with the 1.5 health modifier, they're both similar speeds (a bit below average), and Rhapthorne has a MT OHKO himself.  Dhoulmagus does Wave of Ice -> Sharp Arrows .30 PCHP MT; Rhapthorne does Burst + Arm Smash for like .98 PCHP MT damage.  Ramza will survive that thanks to Auto-Potion, but like nobody else (unless uh INTERCEPTOR triggers?  Can he trigger against MT?!  Don't think so...).  Although...  if the entire party just smashes Dhoulmagus in the face on round 1, then Ramza hits him with his good Ninja damage, Dhoulmagus is dead and Rhapthorne wastes round 2 due to using his big smash round 1.  From there, Ramza solos?  As long as Sleep-blocking is legal on Floor 5, at least.

So on second thought, think Piggyman has that fight after all.  (Haveb't looked at fight 1, though.  Empyrea should be doable.)

[Jo'ou Ranbu]

Jane has game-best evade by a ridiculous margin in all her temp stints. ACF's stat curves are very well defined - heck, I'd argue her evade is -better- because lategame enemies get their ACC jacked up.

[Dhyerwolf]

Team Piggyman | Ramza, Aika, Shadow (MT), Sharanda, Bowser
[Ramza: Ninja | Item, Martial Arts, Auto-Potion, Move HP-Up] (Time Mage, Oracle, Geomancer, Monk, Chemist)
Floor 5b: A Less Fair Fight
Ramza- 125% Speed Area, 65%-70% damage, Low Revival and ST Healing
Aika- 118% Speed, Delta Shield, Can Heal occasionally
Shadow- Probably in 110% range to me speedwise. Image, averagish MT damage
Sharanda- 119% Speed  (or 123% depending on what boots are storebought at this point), cries at physicals, tanks magic, Physical probably gains 150 SP damage or so (Don't think Arrow of Force is this floor, but could be argued), 50% STish magic (maybe trailing off now), 33% MT (see previous), Revival and MT Healing are here on some level
Bowser
*Enemies on this floor have 1.5x Health
Team Piggyman vs. Marcello & Evil Jessica- Not like these guys are too durable even at 1.5 PC HP. I think the danger is less damage and more Marcello casting Waves of Ice and Jessica trying to Kasnooze things...but wait, DQ 8 Sleep kind of sucks right? Throw in Shadow blocking, Ramza blocking, Bowser maybe blocking, and they should be okay. Luckily they suck at rushing Sharanda, although if deep sleep hits, but hurts a bit since she's the MT healer.
Team Piggyman vs. Empyrea- This could be a bit slowgoing, because Empyrea just has fun killing things (Shadow first obviously). I guess it will just be a loop of Ramza reviving Shadow, someone healing with up, Empyrea killing him again before he tosses out Image.
Team Piggyman vs. Rhapthorne & Dhoulmagus 2- So, I guess Ramza is opting for Fire halving. Also, Auto-Potion at this point is not a great soloing strategy thanks to 70% activation. Yeah, don't see them preventing either from getting a turn, which is bad. I generally gut Rhapthorne at a bit over 2 PC HP normally, so we'll say 3 here. Assuming that Aika is DSing turn one, enemies can do about 2 PC HP. Which means that even which Ramza living, he still can't eliminate Rhapthorne next turn (and if Rhapthorne has 2.2 HP, then Ramza missing needing another 2 turns and Rhapthorne gets another turn). However, it feels like Ramza is relying on Auto-Potion hitting too many times (at least twice, which is already 49%). Gut reaction is...fail? I think. Note that since my own DQ 8 notes are gone, gut checking a bit based on the topic. If I'm overrating Rhappy's durability, that will help.

Team MICHAEL | Rika, Arnaud (MT), FFT Chemist, Yulie, Juan
Floor 3a: Unified Strength
**On this floor, party HP is pooled together.  If someone is fatally statused, likewise if a character is hit with gravity, that health should be removed.
Team MICHAEL vs. Crono, Marle, Lucca, Frog and Robo- Rika IDs someone. MT Slowdown then works well.
Team MICHAEL vs. Adramelk, Velius and Queklain- So this match though. So the enemies have a few great things going for them. The first is that no one on Neph's team is great at damage, except Juan, who even if attacked turn 1 waits until his next turn to act. The second is that Rika's buffing tricks are just not worth much here. The third is that their status just wrecks. Velius is...not badly durable (HP is passable, awesome support). Adramelk...you can kill all the support before him? Queklain fights alone of course. But...status out Yulie, status out Chemist, status out whoever ( don't think Rika was status healing, so basically after Yulie and Chemist are out anything sticks. Probably Juan if Rika woke him up). Also, Fear Magic is 0 CT Arnaud can slow them all, but it's not like that's buying a lot of time (Hell, Queklain is probably faster than him?). Just...you want a lot of upfront damage here or lots of status healing generally.
Team MICHAEL vs. Seymour Omnis

Team Random | Yuri2, Hilda, FFT Chemist, Raquel (Speed?), Raynie
Team Random vs. Big Joe, Evil Gaia, 10 Jogurts, VP1 Hrist, Euram Barrows, Gobi, A DQ1 Slime, Garland and Igglanova (PS4)- Hilda at least has AoE for the Jogurts.
Team Random vs. Cecil and Rosa- Raquel smash
Team Random vs. Augus and Joker (BoF2)- Raquel smash/tank most of their damage

Time Capsule Team Rozalia | Chris(TWR), Tidus, Ephraim, Jane, Nall
[Floor 1: Starting off Again (Beginning of the game)]
Team Rozalia vs. Big Joe, Evil Gaia, 10 Jogurts, VP1 Hrist, Euram Barrows, Gobi, A DQ1 Slime, Garland and Igglanova (PS4)
Team Rozalia vs. Cecil and Rosa- Assuming Ephraim should double Rosa or something
Team Rozalia vs. Augus and Joker (BoF2)- Jane.

[Nephrite]

How fast are the three FFT Demons post an MT'ed Slow Down?

Also, does Yulie have Turn Shift by this point? I wonder if it might be worth it to do something like

Rika pokes Juan
Arnaud Slow Downs
Yulie Turn Shifts Juan

But I don't know if those things go off before the Zodiac Demons get their moves off, because I don't know what, if any CT their moves had.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Queklain is extremely fast (9 speed to an average which is probably uhhh 6.5 or so). Him vs. Jude would be a question, him vs. Arnaud is not. The other two demons are nowhere near as fast (-1 speed a chapter later, +1 speed 2 chapters later), though should still break average if not by much.

Empyrea's attacks aren't ITE so Shadow gives her all sorts of headaches (Interceptor). On the other hand, Shadow doesn't block sleep so the first fight is scarier than you're giving it credit for I want to say. Rhapthorne being above 2PCHP (before the floor buff)... is very weird to me (I have him around 1.4ish? Generally see Ruin as PCish since I killed him at the start of round 3) but uh it really depends on monster teams and timbrels of tension and all sorts of other variables so it's not unreasonable or anything.

[Dhyerwolf]

Yes, Interceptor does help a lot there. Forgot about that.

DQ 8 memory at endgame is so hazy, but was pretty much going on the stat topic here. Average at endgame is about 1950, so before anything else, I guess Rhappy is at the 3 PC HP region. I was thinking that I prorated boss HP about 20-25% for CT, but I can't remember if that's 1 CT or 2 CT. So yeah, I guess Timbrel of Tension should make him worse (probably not in the 1 PC HP area to me, but it's a game I tried to mostly blank on). Change that to a tentative pass.

[ThePiggyman]

Looks like there's a couple of interp swings for my team's fight, but not knowing them, I guess I'll just have to go with the analysis of someone who does know the game. If Dhyer thinks I pass, I'll say I pass, too, haha.

And I can actually vote on Team Rozalia! With Chris having True Water Rune, I'm pretty sure he has at least 2 or 3 shots of Kindness Rain, which is pretty much an MT full heal this early, isn't it? The charge time on it might be a little slow early on (though healing spells went off very quickly in general in S3, so maybe not even?), but I hardly think that matters. Pass for this capsule team.

[SnowFire]

Sure, if Piggyman can beat fight 1, I'll buy a general pass for his team.  Do agree that Auto-Potion isn't reliable enough to make Ramza soloing Rhapthorne trivial, but I scale Rhappy's HP which should be enough to make that fight not last a real long time.

For Team MICHAEL...  hrmm, I was all set to vote for him, but then I notice Queklain has his never-used-in-game Chicken Race to Paralyze Arnaud, better than the 50/50 Sleep/Death Sentence combo.  So...  no Slow Down.  Then Yulie & Chemist get nailed, and now Juan has to solo or something.  Ow.  fail.  That FFT fight is pretty rough without lots of up-front damage as noted, or lots of badass status healing.

I already voted pass for Team Rozalia.  I'll also vote pass for Team Random.  Augus & Joker still scary but Speed? Raquel should help bum rush 'em down.

[Random Consonant]

Team MICHAEL fails to the Lucavi fight.  Abstaining on myself because I'm kind of tired of hyping my own teams <_<.

[DjinnAndTonic]

Floor one teams SMASH~

Unsure on Team Michael. I usually give Lucavi their human->demon form-chain, though I don't think that's the intention here. It might actually help Michael's team since it gives them more time to set up things.

Piggyman... My DQ8 boss respect is pretty high since I avoided grinding like the plague in that game... I'm gonna go with fail.

[Pyro]

Team Piggyman | Ramza, Aika, Shadow (MT), Sharanda, Bowser
[Ramza: Ninja | Item, Martial Arts, Auto-Potion, Move HP-Up] (Time Mage, Oracle, Geomancer, Monk, Chemist)
Floor 5b: A Less Fair Fight
*Enemies on this floor have 1.5x Health
Team Piggyman vs. Marcello & Evil Jessica: Between them Marcello and Jess can pull off 68% MT damage while putting out 67% MT sleep, or do 93% MT damage without the sleep. That's harsh. I don't think the team has the blitzing or MT healing to handle this. Maybe if they pour resources to Miranda, who is a magic tank, to put out White Silver Dragons with Ramza trying to refresh her MP. But she is vulnerable to that Sleep. And it takes two Ramza Ethers/whatever to restore her to full MP? Ugly.
Team Piggyman vs. Empyrea: Empyrea isn't too much of a threat? Delta Shield and ST physical damage are her only real recourse and that is easily handled.
Team Piggyman vs. Rhapthorne & Dhoulmagus 2: Uh. Rhappy alone can cap out turns that border on MT OHKO. Dhoulmagus 2 adds 61% to that, and they HAVE MT physical damage to mess up Sharanda but fierce. The team falls here, even if they somehow make it past the first two bosses.

This floor is pretty damn twisted.

Team MICHAEL | Rika, Arnaud (MT), FFT Chemist, Yulie, Juan
Floor 3a: Unified Strength
**On this floor, party HP is pooled together.  If someone is fatally statused, likewise if a character is hit with gravity, that health should be removed.
Team MICHAEL vs. Crono, Marle, Lucca, Frog and Robo: Rika's ID would come in handy here.
Team MICHAEL vs. Adramelk, Velius and Queklain: Team doesn't have the blitzing or status protection to take this I think. Queklain opens with an MT 50% debilitation and it just goes downhill from there.
Team MICHAEL vs. Seymour Omnis: The team could take this if they made it here.

Team Random | Yuri2, Hilda, FFT Chemist, Raquel (Speed?), Raynie
Team Random vs. Big Joe, Evil Gaia, 10 Jogurts, VP1 Hrist, Euram Barrows, Gobi, A DQ1 Slime, Garland and Igglanova (PS4): No MT........ Doesn't matter. They take down the 'threats' first and it's trivial from there. Chemist has revival?
Team Random vs. Cecil and Rosa: Speed Raquel does mean things here.
Team Random vs. Augus and Joker (BoF2): And FFT Chemist is too high a priority and can be healed while they wail on him.

Time Capsule Team Rozalia | Chris(TWR), Tidus, Ephraim, Jane, Nall
[Floor 1: Starting off Again (Beginning of the game)]
Team Rozalia vs. Big Joe, Evil Gaia, 10 Jogurts, VP1 Hrist, Euram Barrows, Gobi, A DQ1 Slime, Garland and Igglanova (PS4): Ew.
Team Rozalia vs. Cecil and Rosa:
Team Rozalia vs. Augus and Joker (BoF2): I'm not sure at all. Tidus isn't helpful this floor I don't think. Unless he has Haste? Maybe he does. Eh, sure. Jane hype might work too. I don't know.

[Dhyerwolf]

Pyro, at least for the third fight, Sharanda won't fear physicals too much since she'll have some SP. They can deal with the first fight because Auto-Potion helps a lot and they really have little luck at killing Sharanda. Third fight basically depends on them rushing Rhapthorne. His turns are dangerous, but his speed and HP are not.

[Dark Holy Elf]

Tidus tends to learn Haste in Kilika (though not early in Kilika) which uh early FFX is kinda weird (lots of scenes, scattered relatively short gameplay bits) so your call as to what floor that would be part of.

[Dhyerwolf]

Also under the impression that DQ 8 base sleep has naturally horrible duration. And Ramza can heal her with a Remedy if needed.

[ThePiggyman]

Team Piggyman | Ramza, Aika, Shadow (MT), Sharanda, Bowser
[Ramza: Ninja | Item, Martial Arts, Auto-Potion, Move HP-Up] (Time Mage, Oracle, Geomancer, Monk, Chemist)
Floor 5b: A Less Fair Fight
*Enemies on this floor have 1.5x Health
Team Piggyman vs. Marcello & Evil Jessica: Between them Marcello and Jess can pull off 68% MT damage while putting out 67% MT sleep, or do 93% MT damage without the sleep. That's harsh. I don't think the team has the blitzing or MT healing to handle this. Maybe if they pour resources to Miranda, who is a magic tank, to put out White Silver Dragons with Ramza trying to refresh her MP. But she is vulnerable to that Sleep. And it takes two Ramza Ethers/whatever to restore her to full MP? Ugly.
Team Piggyman vs. Empyrea: Empyrea isn't too much of a threat? Delta Shield and ST physical damage are her only real recourse and that is easily handled.
Team Piggyman vs. Rhapthorne & Dhoulmagus 2: Uh. Rhappy alone can cap out turns that border on MT OHKO. Dhoulmagus 2 adds 61% to that, and they HAVE MT physical damage to mess up Sharanda but fierce. The team falls here, even if they somehow make it past the first two bosses.

For the first fight, if MT healing is a concern, Sharanda also has Healing Breezes, which are MT 50% healing, so she can alternate between Healing Breezes and Dragoon healing, which doesn't force Ramza to use two Ethers to restore her MP. Sharanda is arguably immune to status (excluding ID) when she's a Dragoon, too, if that makes any difference. Bowser and Ramza also immune Sleep.

As for the third fight, like Dhyer mentions, I can make sure Sharanda has plenty of SP whilst fighting Empyrea, which might make surviving the ensuing damage more realistic.

[Pyro]

http://www.rpgdl.com/wiki/index.php?title=Dungeon_Stuff#Sharanda

Sharanda doesn't get healing breezes.

[Clear Tranquil]

I think that list/guide is outdated now. It was based on the assumption Sharanda got attack items only, if I remember right it was something I helped with. Apparently it's all store boughts now though~

Healing Breezes are store bought items.

[ThePiggyman]

http://www.rpgdl.com/wiki/index.php?title=Dungeon_Stuff#Sharanda

Sharanda doesn't get healing breezes.

Like CT says, all storebought items are usable for Sharanda now, and that's how just about everyone else has been voting. If you're interested, here's a list of items that are storebought, and when they're obtained.

Floor 1 - Healing Potion (ST, 50% healing), Angel's Prayer (ST, 50% revival), Body Purifier (ST, heals physical status), Mind Purifier (ST, heals mental status), Burnout (ST Fire item), Spark Net (ST Thunder item), Spear Frost (ST Water item), Meteor Fall (MT Earth item), Dancing Ray (MT Light item)
Floor 2 - Sun Rhapsody (ST, full MP healing), Dark Mist (ST Darkness item), Fatal Blizzard (MT Water item), Spinning Gale (ST Wind item), Gushing Magma (MT Fire item), Thunderbolt (MT Thunder item)
Floor 3 - Healing Breeze (MT, 50% healing), Pellet (ST Earth item), Trans Light (ST Light item), Black Rain (MT Darkness item), Rave Twister (MT Wind item)
Floor 4 - Healing Fog (ST, 100% healing), Depetrifier (ST Petrify healing),
Floor 5 - Panic Bell (ST, Confusion), Stunning Hammer (ST, Paralysis), Poison Needle (ST, Poison), Midnight Terror (ST, Fear)

Healing Rains (MT, 100% healing) and Spirit Potions (100 SP added) are never store-bought.

I think if people continue to use Sharanda in teams in future, this should be put into the Guidelines, to avoid confusion.

[Nephrite]

You can add it in yourself if you'd like.

I think she probably needs a point increase since I'd forgotten about the healing items, though.

[ThePiggyman]

You can add it in yourself if you'd like.

I think she probably needs a point increase since I'd forgotten about the healing items, though.

Yeah, even despite her physical durability woes, I've always thought Sharanda is a bit of a steal at 2.5 myself.

Also, how do I add it to the wiki? Seems like I need to log in to do so, but it doesn't recognize my name (assuming the RPGDL and Wiki accounts are linked).

[Magic Fanatic]

They're not, actually.  You'll need to create a separate account to use on the Wiki, but it can be the same name as what you have here.