Author Topic: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4  (Read 1218 times)

Cmdr_King

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Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« on: August 18, 2014, 05:06:29 AM »
Godlike

Gongora (Lost Odyssey) vs Persephone (Wild ARMs 5)
Sora (Kingdom Hearts Series) vs Arceus (Pokémon)

Heavy

Oerba dia Vanille (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)
Alfina (Grandia III) vs Bacchus D-79 (Star Ocean: The Last Hope)

Middle

Serperior (Pokémon) vs Ranger (Bravely Default)
Fuka Kazamatsuri (Disgaea 4: A Promise Unforgotten) vs The Jackal (Bravely Default)

Light

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI)
Rubella (Child of Light) vs Luke fon Fabre (Tales of the Abyss)
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Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2014, 05:18:45 AM »

Godlike

Gongora (Lost Odyssey) vs Persephone (Wild ARMs 5): Uh. This could easily be wrong, but yeah chances are Persephone gets to use her nasty damage and I don't think Gongora has the raw slugging to deal with that.

Heavy

Alfina (Grandia III) vs Bacchus D-79 (Star Ocean: The Last Hope): Blocks paralysis, so should be able to turtle through what Alfina does.

Middle

Serperior (Pokémon) vs Ranger (Bravely Default): Ranger completely helpless against defence-buffing, is my guess.

Light

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI): Uh surely. Archer can block the status tricks and outslugs because everyone outslugs, and can probably do the needed damage to punch through Empowerer spam thanks to charge options.
Rubella (Child of Light) vs Luke fon Fabre (Tales of the Abyss): I have no clue. I think this is the first match where Rubella specifics would decide things.

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Maybe.

SnowFire

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2014, 05:20:07 AM »
Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI)

The DBZ match, I see.  Lots of grunting on all sides as they charge up, then Cyan dies.

superaielman

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2014, 12:33:25 PM »
Heavy

Oerba dia Vanille (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)- Status resistance screws up Sab strats. Counters otherwise just give Vanille too many issues. Healing doesn't do any good; she can't outlast Elsa's bullets due to perfect shot/skills.

Light

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI)
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Magic Fanatic

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2014, 01:23:25 PM »
Middle

Serperior (Pokémon) vs Ranger (Bravely Default) - Serperior is completely helpless to Killer Bow spam, is my guess.
Fuka Kazamatsuri (Disgaea 4: A Promise Unforgotten) vs The Jackal (Bravely Default) - The evade (with D4 Axes) and starting defense give Fuka fits, while The Jackal doesn't give two flips about Dream Girl.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2014, 05:20:00 PM »
By Killer do you mean the slayer skills? If so, uh, those do less damage than Ranger's basic physical and are completely irrelevant. Speaking of which, Ranger's basic physicals are a 5HKO before Serperior starts buffing (and an 8HKO by the time Ranger gets her first turn, for instance... it only gets worse from there).

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Maybe.

Magic Fanatic

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2014, 05:30:31 PM »
No, not the Slayer skills.  The Killer Bow is storebought in Eternia in chapter 4 and (as far as I know - according to a few resources) has a 25% chance of ID attached to it.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2014, 05:35:09 PM by Magic Fanatic »

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2014, 05:36:39 PM »
Ah, okay, that makes more sense.

My issue with that is that the entire cast can use the Elven Bow (bow rank has nothing to do with accuracy or status accuracy, Ranger gets no credit for that) so allowing that means the entire cast gets 25% ID. On a cast which can attack four times a round, so really the entire cast has ~68% ID turn 1. That isn't the type of thing I find legal at all; a parallel is FFX which has a storebought Sleepstrike (= 100% sleep) weapon for everyone. If you allow these sorts of things then okay, but... personally I wouldn't, allowing a non-unique status-weapon is no different than handing out non-unique spells to a cast, IMO.

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SnowFire

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2014, 05:38:27 PM »
Well, the compromise from the original BD stat topic ideas thread would be to let added-effect status work for classes that have an S in that weapon, so Ranger gets instant death / paralysis / confuse bows, and Ninja gets instant death (since bows & daggers are the big status weapons IIRC).  I don't do it myself since S = unique feels a tad arbitrary, but that'd be reasonable.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2014, 05:46:40 PM »
As you said, it's completely arbitrary. It's like giving Relm status magic because she has the highest magic stat.

EDIT: Although to play devil's advocate, there is a case to say Ranger here because she does have an innate passive ability that boosts accuracy which DOES make statusweapons more potent... slightly? (Not really, I think, because BD status weapons seem to make a status check if at least one hit lands, which almost always happens.) The parallel there would be allowing Wakka all FFX statusweapons (which of course is actually irrelevant, he has all the relevant status anyway). Obviously I don't buy it at all, but it's the best argument I can think of and certainly better than using completely irrelevant weapon ranks (which only affect damage, for a tactic which has -nothing- do do with damage) as the basis.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2014, 05:49:01 PM by Dark Holy Elf »

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Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2014, 10:18:04 PM »
Godlike

Gongora (Lost Odyssey) vs Persephone (Wild ARMs 5)
Sora (Kingdom Hearts Series) vs Arceus (Pokémon)

Heavy

Oerba dia Vanille (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)
Alfina (Grandia III) vs Bacchus D-79 (Star Ocean: The Last Hope)

Middle

Serperior (Pokémon) vs Ranger (Bravely Default)
Fuka Kazamatsuri (Disgaea 4: A Promise Unforgotten) vs The Jackal (Bravely Default)

Light

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI) - The reign of Archer continues
Rubella (Child of Light) vs Luke fon Fabre (Tales of the Abyss)
When humanity stands strong and people reach out for each other...
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SnowFire

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2014, 03:23:29 AM »
As you said, it's completely arbitrary. It's like giving Relm status magic because she has the highest magic stat.

Well, the respectable argument to me is more based on in-game reasonableness.  Something along the lines of:
The DL allows characters to set up their equipment beforehand for spoiling purposes which is usually something you can only do for a boss fight; vs. randoms, you must equip something capable of dealing with any random encounter, not a single specific encounter formation.  Status vs. bosses isn't usually a winning proposition in BD.  Therefore, twinking your equips for status should only be allowed for something 'respectable' vs. a wide variety of enemies.  Using a slightly older bow for a small damage cut - or just the 25% Confuse default bow - is reasonable.  Using an E-rank damageless pure status option (e.g. Assassin Dagger for the likes of Pirate) will get you hosed vs. randoms that immune the status.  Therefore, the first is legal, the second is illegal.

--
Admittedly, this logic breaks down somewhat for the likes of White Mage, who wouldn't really care too badly about losing a Rod or Staff vs. randoms since physical damage is a lost cause anyway, so equipping Assassin Daggers becomes more reasonable.  (The in-game reason not to is that they'd lose any progress toward a big Rod / Staff special when a boss rolled around.)  Anyway, devil's advocate, etc.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2014, 05:14:10 AM »
I'll point out that a Pirate with a D-rank Assassin Dagger is probably the most damaging user of the Assassin Dagger in the game (because the jump from D to even S is only like 20 points, and Pirate's awesome Str should account for more than that), and one of the few which clearly breaks average endgame defence. I don't really think running 25% instant death weapons is really practical for random-fighting in-game (seriously, if you want instant death that late you'll run something like Death Spellblade) so I'm not inclined to give the Assassin Dagger much respect... but I agree that the Elven Bow on a ranger is far, far closer to a practical setup than most others (because of the S in bows, the skill which buffs normal physicals, and the accuracy boost) so I'm actually less inclined to disrespect it than I am most of the others, even if I won't be allowing it personally.

It should be noted of course that Ranger with a Killer Bow allowed is very definitely a Heavy (turn 1 instant death off above average speed! And evade doesn't really slow it down unlike many status weapons) but that's not Magic's problem of course; he didn't nom the character.

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074

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2014, 05:32:04 AM »
Heavy

Oerba dia Vanille (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4) - Yeah.  Evasion and resist screw with status and offense too much, and Elsa outshoots the healing.  Ouch.
Alfina (Grandia III) vs Bacchus D-79 (Star Ocean: The Last Hope) - This is pretty clear-cut.  Bacchus blocks paralyze, outslugs Alfina effortlessly.  Hell, there's an argument for blindsiding anything with a notable charge delay, but that just tips a onesided match even more in Bacchus' favor.


Light

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI) - Cyan is Meeplina on Ice.
<+Nama-EmblemOfFire> ...Have the GhebFE guy and the ostian princess guy collaborate.
 <@Elecman> Seems reasonable.

Dhyerwolf

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #14 on: August 19, 2014, 07:17:53 AM »
It should be noted of course that Ranger with a Killer Bow allowed is very definitely a Heavy (turn 1 instant death off above average speed! And evade doesn't really slow it down unlike many status weapons) but that's not Magic's problem of course; he didn't nom the character.

And in fairness, as it gives basically everyone turn 1 ID, means that there is arguably no PC Lights (which is fine in and of itself, but given that many of them for turned up in Light in some fashion or another makes me think that no one is considering this)

Godlike

Gongora (Lost Odyssey) vs Persephone (Wild ARMs 5)- Gj Gongora on getting this far when no one is really sure what you do.

Light

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI)
Rubella (Child of Light) vs Luke fon Fabre (Tales of the Abyss)- Well, I think allowing half an OL bar gives this to Luke. I...suspect that without that this may turn in the other direction (Luke is too MP limited and Rubella's durability is decent. I think he'll run out of punch before OL and before her healing runs out). They are both pretty borderline L/M as fighters though (Rubella's speed and the chance of auto-healing at low HP strikes me as maybe a bit much for Light. But yeah, I guess it depends on how damage averages come out).
...into the nightfall.

Cmdr_King

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2014, 10:58:20 AM »
Godlike

Gongora (Lost Odyssey) vs Persephone (Wild ARMs 5)
Sora (Kingdom Hearts Series) vs Arceus (Pokémon)- Arceus has no real answer to Second Chance.  Convoluted nonsense with Future Sight isn't viable because if memory serves that resolves at the very end of the third round after it's cast, so Sora would have to let it knock him down to 1HP then eat fatal damage on the next turn which would be dumb.

Heavy

Oerba dia Vanille (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)- No vote.
Alfina (Grandia III) vs Bacchus D-79 (Star Ocean: The Last Hope)

Middle

Serperior (Pokémon) vs Ranger (Bravely Default)
Fuka Kazamatsuri (Disgaea 4: A Promise Unforgotten) vs The Jackal (Bravely Default)- Multi-acted basic physicals you say.  Yeah Fuka sure doesn't like those one bit.

Light

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI)
Rubella (Child of Light) vs Luke fon Fabre (Tales of the Abyss)- She's probably faster and... Luke has very little in the way of ways to make himself hit harder or do things besides hit stuff.  So strong kneejerk, although if she were sufficiently below average durability he could squeak a 2HKO which would probably put too much pressure on her resources?  Seems a bit unlikely though.
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Jo'ou Ranbu

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #16 on: August 24, 2014, 07:46:41 PM »
Sora (Kingdom Hearts Series) vs Arceus (Pokémon) - Arceus lacks truly good answers to: Graviga, Stopga, Second Chance and Aeroga. At the very -worst-, Stopga => Graviga x2 ends this fight in a hurry and there isn't much of anything capable of killing Sora in one turn without status.

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics) vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI) - Jesus christ.
Rubella (Child of Light) vs Luke fon Fabre (Tales of the Abyss) - Yeah, this fight really needs stat topic specifics. Rubella likely wins if she isn't 2HKOed, but that might be sketchy even with Aurora, Genovefa and Finn generally dragging durability averages down (her defense needs some work, even though she stands around the higher end of the HP averages).
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[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> LAGGY
[01:08] <Soppy-ReturningToInaba> UVIET?!??!?!
[01:08] <Laggy> YA!!!!!!!!!1111111111
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Cmdr_King

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Re: Futurama 2014 Season 2, Week 4
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2014, 03:21:13 AM »
Godlike

Gongora (Lost Odyssey) vs Persephone (Wild ARMs 5)- iiii
Sora (Kingdom Hearts Series)- iii vs Arceus (Pokémon)

Heavy

Oerba dia Vanille (Final Fantasy XIII) vs Elsa Eliane (Front Mission 4)- ii
Alfina (Grandia III) vs Bacchus D-79 (Star Ocean: The Last Hope)- iiii

Middle

Serperior (Pokémon)- iii vs Ranger (Bravely Default)- i
Fuka Kazamatsuri (Disgaea 4: A Promise Unforgotten) vs The Jackal (Bravely Default)- ii

Light

Archer (Final Fantasy Tactics)- iiiiiiii vs Cyan Garamonde (Final Fantasy VI)
Rubella (Child of Light)- i vs Luke fon Fabre (Tales of the Abyss)- i  [22:20] <Hatbot> I'd choose Suberted Rhyme every... occasion, CmdrKing.
CK: She is the female you
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.