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Author Topic: Thoughts on gamergate  (Read 30178 times)

Lady Door

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #100 on: December 02, 2014, 12:37:47 AM »
Potential fallacies to attribute to the responses:

"If I were going to be arguing about GamerGate, I would never bring up anything else. Therefore, she must be failing because she is no longer focusing solely on GamerGate." or "If I had a dog that was ill, I wouldn't be on Twitter, therefore because she is on Twitter she must not care about her dog."
- Mind projection
- Moral high ground (implied)
- Psychologist's (with special attention to "if" since they're coming from what they assume is an objective reflection of their own behavior)

A whole bunch of red herrings:
Ad hominem + abusive fallacy
- "She's a terrible person for not paying 100% of her attention to her sick dog, why should we listen to her?" followed by aggressive personal insults and threats

Appeal to emotion
- "She has a sick dog. She's ignoring that poor thing in favor of arguing against us. How pathetic!"

Argumentum ad baculum (implied association)
- "If you're on her side, you're the scum of the earth and you deserve every bit of abuse we're sending her way."

Fallacy of relative privation
- "Why is she talking about her sick dog? Games journalism is under siege!"

Tu quoque
- "She says she cares about women in gaming, about gaming as a whole, but she obviously doesn't care about her dog. If she doesn't care about the dog, how do we figure she cares about anything other than her own selfish desire for attention?"

--

Then again, abstraction is completely lost on the people willing to attack a woman over the anonymity of the internet (or even without it), nevermind doing so while dealing with a tough personal emergency, especially when she goes to her social media followers for support.
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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #101 on: December 02, 2014, 03:44:53 AM »
And all of that is without getting into the people who are apparently sending pictures of mutilated dogs to her corporate e-mail account that she can't hand off to someone else to read.

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #102 on: December 02, 2014, 07:13:50 AM »
Yeah, that one gets really dirty.  Someone made a twitter account for her dog and then tweeted at her with "lol I'm going to die soon".  And then they sent pictures of dead animals to her work email.  And while I'm listing super shitty harassment that happened in the last 24 hours, pretty sure this is illegal dude.

But the story I found really interesting today was this one:

https://storify.com/hnrysmth/transphobia-and-notyourshield

Someone really dug deep into notyourshield to figure out how they managed to exist in the gamergate culture (which has gotten more extreme of late).  It's...fascinating, if a little depressing.

Grefter

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #103 on: December 02, 2014, 11:53:12 AM »
For what it is worth, the guy that did the twitter account is pretty demonstrably a different guy than whoever emailed the dead dog pictures to her work email.  The guy who made it talked to some people and he mentioned he was going through some bad shit and lashed out cause he thought it would make him feel better.  It didn't and he regretted it.  Has since been deleted.  Also with the plus that if it was deleted with the same Twitter name it will be tied up for a month (thanks for that bit of Twitter Trivia having read about this nonsense in the last two days), so no one can jump on it and do more shit.  Small light in that I suppose?

Also a pretty well put together thought piece by Zoe Quinn
https://medium.com/@zoequinnzel/lets-talk-about-ethics-in-games-journalism-6a2fd89069ae
Which is obviously completely invalidated because she totally had sex with someone once, but you know, in case you want to read words written by someone that cares about "video games" more than discussing in public the activities involving her genitals.
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Lady Door

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #104 on: December 02, 2014, 07:28:50 PM »
Mm. I’m going to step in it again.

I would not say Zoe's response is any more balanced than the #GG side of things, though it is decidedly less violent about making its point. She’s riding on a high horse, sure that being attacked is a sign she’s on the righteous path. (Galileo gambit/argumentum ad martyrdom, bias blindspot)

She belittles games writers that are, by her standards, abusing the industry perks by focusing on stature rather than bettering the industry. She also comments on their personal behavior:
Quote from: Zoe Quinn, “Let’s Talk About Ethics in Games Journalism
You end up meeting them sometimes at industry events trying to impress you at the open bar with a clumsy pickup line and a flash of their badge as though you were part of their loyal viewership of five.
(argument from motives, fundamental attribution error, ultimate attribution error)

She is painting with very broad strokes when she says enthusiast press is a hotbed for low-level amateurs where very few “grow out of it,” even if she qualifies the assertion with an off-handed “Obviously not all enthusiast press is like that, or even most, but it’s definitely A Thing that has been floating around the industry as long as I’ve been a part of it.” (judgmental language, appeal to authority)
 
Quote from: Zoe Quinn, “Let’s Talk About Ethics in Games Journalism”
You end up with a decent number of small sites stocked with people who don’t know much about the actual craft of writing churning out mediocre regurgitation of press releases, … with a level of professionalism resembling a ‘radio station’ created with schoolyard friends where you record songs off the radio and talk over them.

That’s not even targeting #GamerGate, that’s targeting folks who aren’t already in the industry. It’s something the chosen few rise out of (“My heart goes out to anyone who has to work for people like that as they try to grind out something for a place that actually deserves their time and effort.”). It’s a slew of articles wherein the first mistake is how shitty their grasp of grammar is (appeal to accomplishment, fallacy of division, judgmental language).

I’m actually fine painting #GamerGate with broad strokes. I think I’ve mentioned before that anyone asinine enough to claim that #GamerGate covers true paragons of ethics in journalism is not perceptive enough to understand that such an association completely undermines their point and really doesn’t merit the hurt cry of the unjustly pilloried. (guilt by association)

Weirdly, she spends a lot of the article talking about all the hypocrisy of the #GGers claiming ethics violations and no time at all covering what she would really consider the pursuit of ethics in journalism other than to note those people fronting for it from #GG are wrong because of where they’re coming from. (guilt by association, Bulverism, negativity effect)

She does acknowledge there is an ethics problem, but she discounts disclaimers because of one ridiculous example (fallacy of the lonely fact). I do agree that trying to disclose all relationships in any context is too unwieldy, and the answer is less about shutting down the people who develop too many contacts as it is about encouraging those people to moderate their bias resulting from it. But the extreme example discounting the need for any disclosure goes too far.

And so it goes. It’s a subject people are passionate about and it tends to encourage an echo chamber. (confirmation bias, backfire effect) I don’t really believe there’s a middle ground here (argumentum ad temperantium/gray fallacy - also leading into Okrent’s law) but that’s not an answer either.

The excerpt from Katherine Cross's paper is excellent and I'll have to read the full piece.
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Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #105 on: December 02, 2014, 07:39:10 PM »
Katherine Cross has written top-notch stuff about not just Gamergate but the involvement of women in nerd culture in general. She's pretty awesome.
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Cmdr_King

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #106 on: December 02, 2014, 09:04:04 PM »

Weirdly, she spends a lot of the article talking about all the hypocrisy of the #GGers claiming ethics violations and no time at all covering what she would really consider the pursuit of ethics in journalism other than to note those people fronting for it from #GG are wrong because of where they’re coming from. (guilt by association, Bulverism, negativity effect)


That seems to be intentional actually.  She's more making/summarizing a case that #GG itself is an ethics problem to toss on top of the pile of them the game press has.  Which makes her last paragraph rather disingenuous, but eh.  Being needlessly heavy handed seems to be a personal quirk for her.
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Grefter

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #107 on: December 02, 2014, 09:15:23 PM »
Usual disclaimer, Grefter loves him some Gonzo writing, I tend to champion it well past the point where it is actually a good thing.  Due to its very nature your mileage will drastically vary.

One thing I would note that makes more sense of Quinn's article is that it is a Gonzo piece, there is a reason she links to Gonzo Journalism in this part here.

Quote
Sometimes I still write one-off articles about these things for places like GiantBomb, Gamasutra, and Kotaku, because I think there’s value in having a wide variety of backgrounds writing on our medium and industry — a developer will have a different perspective than an academic who will have a different perspective from the critic, hardcore enthusiast, journalist, gonzo writer, and so on and so forth. This is great because each perspective brings a new way of thinking and talking about games to the table.

Which of course is set up later with the (valid IMO) claim that most gonzo writers aren't actually journalists, they don't have the same standards to be held up to (ie this isn't their day job, they should try, they likely don't have the same peer review circle).  Which reads like making your own get out of jail free card for your article which is a bit problematic.

So ignoring the arguments though, do you necessarilly disagree with some of the points Ash?  Like to be super stupid and anecdotal here.  This site itself has had us as a community flirt with reviews and the like, we have always been aligned to games media as a thing.  Out of the lot of us there is what, 4 of us that went pro in anything in the industry (You, Andy, Met and Laggy?) out of the four only yourself has anything to do with the media side of the industry directly. 

I think the point there is more that there is a hedge industry of enthusiast journalism that isn't professional, has no desire to be so and shouldn't really be expected to.  Like can you imagine how fucking frustrating it would have been for someone trying to go pro doing articles with us for the front page?  We would be infuriating to work with because we are just in it for giggles (to which we would obviously have been pushing them to be trying elsewhere as well...), actually driving to go pro is fucking hard, especially if you don't want to start up your own little niche.

The broad strokes for the enthusiast market is 100% done to mock up the more "sinister" Techraptor segment even more.  The belittling the enthusiasts for trying to get their mack on with their ill gained press pass is a humanising technique.  They are losers, they are the underdog etcetc.  And yes it does place "The Industry" on a plateau as well in the same stroke.  Compare that to these guys that aggressively seek to go in for a profit!  The evils!

It is 100% an appeal to emotion to highlight hipocrisy amongst some of the big "news" sources that are coming out of this stuff.  She hyperfocuses on one example, but it is spreading beyond just Techraptor.

For example

http://imgur.com/RhZcUn6 Here you can see an annoucement from The Ralph Retort announcing they are having an interview with RooshV for his paid for sponsored slot.  So all well and good right, they have transparency in their advertising that looks like regular content?  Only really if you don't understand the issues with Native Advertising.

It gets worse though, it isn't just straight up accepting pay for access to an audience, but who they are accepting it from.  I needed to look up RooshV.  It quickly turns dark.  This is what it is about

http://www.rooshv.com/i-started-a-new-web-site-reaxxion-com

Quote
I’m starting a video game site even though I haven’t played video games seriously since the year 2000 (Starcraft was my jam). I don’t even play mobile games. I won’t blow smoke up your ass by pretending I’m a gamer or have a deep commitment in furthering game technology. My only commitment is with helping men.

I aim to protect the interests of heterosexual Western males, a category I’m in. The far-left is trying to censor and criminalize masculine behaviors that are normal. They want to relabel consensual sex as “rape” and relabel innocent flirting as “harassment,” and as I learned with #gamergate, they’ve successfully infected the gaming industry and gaming journalist sites by damaging the very nature of gaming development to fit their extreme political agenda. So while I don’t play video games, the idea of starting a pro-#gamergate site is compatible with my overall mission.

Which speaks for itself really plainly right there.  Straight up paid for backing by an MRA but it is okay because they are open that he has paid for it, and it is totally relevant because he is opening a game news site so we thought you would like to know.  It is just a chance for our advertisers to get together with a target audience that we think they could be really keen on.

So when she is calling all this stuff out, I do think it brings up a pretty important topic of, if you are going to campaign for Ethics in games Journalism, you probably want to run a pretty tight ship on that front and there is definitely some sites that associate themselves to the movement that do some hella skeevy things.





As an aside, I think one of the biggest harms to the Gonzo style ultimately is that it gets labelled Gonzo Journalism.  Sadly most of us aren't Hunter Thompson and most definitely don't deserve to be even remotely closely associated with Journalism.  I am not sure if that means Gonzo really shouldn't be a style outside journalists?  But it is so appealling and fun to do, I don't know if I could comfortably editorialise (poorly) in another style.

Sort of edit (CK posted while I was writing so not real edit but don't want to work into structure of ramble) - CK, have you ever known a piece like that to be a light touch?  You appeal to anecdotes and personal experience for effect.
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Cmdr_King

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #108 on: December 02, 2014, 09:28:26 PM »
Sure, sure.  I more mean that that is the style Zoe uses in general.  From what I've seen Depression Quest is essentially that as well for example.
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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #109 on: December 02, 2014, 09:46:09 PM »
Just in here to quickly reply to CK, because I don't feel I'm really qualified to speak about most of this stuff. Depression Quest is definitely not over-the-top or heavy-handed. I played through it from start to finish, and it is actually significantly (more significantly than I can put into words) more light-hearted than Depression is. It's much easier and far cheerier, IMO. Some of my absolute best days, while medicated, equal the days in Depression quest that are its "worst/lowest." And I what I have is classified as low-grade.

Lady Door

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #110 on: December 02, 2014, 09:51:45 PM »
Highlighting logical fallacies isn't necessarily to discredit her points. It's nearly impossible to write any argument without succumbing to a few of them. "Fallacy" is a lot like "theory" in that it doesn't mean what the colloquial usage implies.

That said: I agree with what she's getting at, but not how she's getting there. The article's actually a good example of what I mean when I say both sides take blame for shaping the arguments. The #GG side is violent about it, but the anti-#GG side is holier-than-thou.

If I had to choose a side (and I don't), I'd definitely be anti-#GG specifically because I find the tone of #GG unbearable even if we're not including the scum of the earth attaching themselves to the name. It does the argument no favors to attack people right back the way she paints some aspiring games journalists as maladjusted creeps.

I agree there are some really horrifying sites popping up in response to the furor. Approaching the subject in a deliberately bigoted way -- and achieving a following while doing so -- tests the limits of my idealism. I will not ever condone that vehicle as a constructive force in the fight.

To pretend that's all a single group is disingenuous at best, harmful at worst. Even if you agree, generally, that "#GamerGate" represents hate, viewing the misguided or just plain wrong in the same light is just compounding the problem that ended up feeding the "gamers are dead" article.

Gamers are dead. "Gamer" doesn't mean anything except some amorphous group of people who partake in games, usually of the vidya persuasion. But "gamer" as a descriptor of a person who plays electronic games is so broad as to be meaningless: it now encompasses your granny as much as your asshole, gun-nut neighbor teabagging the competition while hurling slurs.
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Cmdr_King

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #111 on: December 02, 2014, 10:17:53 PM »

Gamers are dead. "Gamer" doesn't mean anything except some amorphous group of people who partake in games, usually of the vidya persuasion. But "gamer" as a descriptor of a person who plays electronic games is so broad as to be meaningless: it now encompasses your granny as much as your asshole, gun-nut neighbor teabagging the competition while hurling slurs.

I've been torn on that really.  On the one hand, I've long since taken it to mean "someone for whom video games are a primary hobby", the same way that while technically "cinemaphile" just means you like movies, taking the term as a descriptor means that seeing movies and discussing them and the art thereof etc etc is a big deal for you.

On the other hand, like fuck I'm going to describe myself in the same terms as #GG.
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Grefter

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #112 on: December 02, 2014, 10:22:00 PM »
Not sure if it is a more isolated cultural thing, but when I tell people I am into gaming there is a decent chance I have to explain I am into video games and not gambling.  Sometimes clarify it isn't table top (;( if only).  No one has mistaken me for raising hens yet at least.
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Lady Door

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #113 on: December 02, 2014, 10:30:20 PM »

Gamers are dead. "Gamer" doesn't mean anything except some amorphous group of people who partake in games, usually of the vidya persuasion. But "gamer" as a descriptor of a person who plays electronic games is so broad as to be meaningless: it now encompasses your granny as much as your asshole, gun-nut neighbor teabagging the competition while hurling slurs.

I've been torn on that really.  On the one hand, I've long since taken it to mean "someone for whom video games are a primary hobby", the same way that while technically "cinemaphile" just means you like movies, taking the term as a descriptor means that seeing movies and discussing them and the art thereof etc etc is a big deal for you.

On the other hand, like fuck I'm going to describe myself in the same terms as #GG.

Pretty much. But ask someone who doesn't identify as "someone for whom video games are a primary hobby" what the word means to them. (Though it probably would have been easier to get an objective answer before #GG poisoned the well.)

Not sure if it is a more isolated cultural thing, but when I tell people I am into gaming there is a decent chance I have to explain I am into video games and not gambling.  Sometimes clarify it isn't table top (;( if only).  No one has mistaken me for raising hens yet at least.

Yeah, it's become a term larger than its pop culture origin. That's the problem: it lacks precision. It means different things to different people but, as I mentioned above, a layperson's understanding of "gamers" when related to the video kind is much more likely to go along with that which appeared in the "Gamers are dead" articles.

--

To jump back in, having read that Katherine Cross article Zoe linked to, I feel more strongly that the one-sided attacks are getting out of hand. She makes some really excellent points about the things #GamerGate is doing wrong, and she acknowledges once that there's a big problem to be aware of:

Quote
When I wrote about the subject I warned fellow feminists that the tendency to view our opponents as irredeemable enemies could easily take on a life of its own.

Then she goes and steps in a big pile of irony.
Quote
GamerGate had taken an inflexible ideological stand, named their enemies with expansive fervour, and set about persecuting and prosecuting them. They became judge, jury, and executioner, with no court of appeal.

My absolute biggest pet peeve in any charged argument is the inability or unwillingness to identify that the writer is using the same damn rhetoric. "They are <insert gross generalization here>" comes in blue and red, liberal and conservative, pro and con. I am an absolute staunch supporter of moderate/grey debate. I don't generally believe in black/white analysis. There are very, very rarely any problems so concrete in such a large sample. Someone who relies on calling these large groups out, as a whole, to build up their argument becomes suspect.

And so, while Zoe and Katherine do reflect my feelings on a platonic level, I really don't know whether they're having the positive impact they're hoping to have.

Attacking someone because their dog is dying and they shared it on social media is whack no matter who does it. Claiming "your side" is "above that" may be true, but you're just fanning the flames by implying "their side" -- inclusive for lack of exclusion -- is mud-dwelling.

EDIT: Grey debate serves no purpose but analysis, btw. I am shitty at taking sides because I try too hard to be empathetic.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 10:39:23 PM by Lady Door »
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Cmdr_King

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #114 on: December 02, 2014, 10:48:19 PM »

Pretty much. But ask someone who doesn't identify as "someone for whom video games are a primary hobby" what the word means to them. (Though it probably would have been easier to get an objective answer before #GG poisoned the well.)


Yeah, but that's true of all aspects of geekdom.  The difference between a fan and a fan is what it is.  You just try to take the connections and make the conversations you can.

That said I think that, as with all those other terms, the channels for those who identify that way are still there, and they do still exist as a distinct marketing group (which is really what group labels boil down to, "people I can collectively address to sell an idea or product").  You just have that higher margin of miscommunication.  I mean, think of it this way.  You can market something as 'for Christians', and despite that descriptor technically describing something like 70% of people in the country you will largely hit the people you mean to talk to (the people more likely to buy a song if it is called Christian, etc).
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Lady Door

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #115 on: December 02, 2014, 11:12:24 PM »
True.

Self-identification is what I was talking about, too. Do people you think of as gamers think of themselves as gamers? The ones who do are going to respond differently. Again with the context: "Gamers, check out the exciting new installment in this award-winning series!" is not the same as "Exclusive inside look: what's new for gamers" even if it's talking about the same thing.

That's pretty much what my job is, figuring out how to get at the right people. "Gamers" isn't enough. I'm combing through a 300+ page report on the many, many different types of audiences for the many, many different types of games. In mobile. Games journalism rarely touches mobile, but that's because mobile gamers, on the whole, don't read games articles. I'm willing to bet that's because mobile gamers don't consider themselves gamers.

So who does? And who is more likely to assume that someone speaking to "gamers" is speaking to them?
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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #116 on: December 03, 2014, 05:08:36 PM »
Quote
When I wrote about the subject I warned fellow feminists that the tendency to view our opponents as irredeemable enemies could easily take on a life of its own.

Then she goes and steps in a big pile of irony.
Quote
GamerGate had taken an inflexible ideological stand, named their enemies with expansive fervour, and set about persecuting and prosecuting them. They became judge, jury, and executioner, with no court of appeal.
In this case I think there's two different groups being referenced.  The "enemies" named are LW1, LW2, LW3, LB (also known as Zoe Quinn, Anita Sarkeesian (and Macintosh as he's connected to her), Brianna Wu, and Randi Harper).  Oh, and Leigh Alexander as well, who never really got a codename, but seems to have joined the "can never be forgiven" list.

You can however, call yourself a feminist, and then say that you support gamergate, and be accepted into the group, provided you don't push feminism issues too hard.  Gamergate literally has people who call themselves feminists, and will proudly say so whenever they get the chance as a way to try to deflect criticism.  Although their most famous one the rest of the world tends to argue is not a feminist at all, and I'm inclined to agree when she makes statements like this:

https://twitter.com/CHSommers/status/537661828743299072

---------------------

On the subject of gamer

This is actually one area in which my views have changed more towards the gamergate stance.  Totalbiscuit has made some solid arguments that the word is genuinely important to some people's identity, particularly people in the autism spectrum.

And I'm sure if I look around this forum enough, I can find a post by Zenny saying something along the lines of "how sad and lonely do you have to be to identify only with 'gamer' and nothing else?"  But that would just be getting into ad hominem again.  Yes, such people exist for whom gamer is the primary thing they identify with.  Yes, in some cases that means they might not have much else going on in their lives, but that just means that the gamer identity is more important to them relatively.  I think it's fair to say "don't badmouth gamers as a group if you are a journalist for gamers".


That said, the next logical leap would be asking whether we should extend the same branch to people in gamergate, and I would argue no.    It's a hashtag that has existed for three months, that people do leave.  It's not like "gamer" which people may have identified with for their whole life.  You could ask, as LD does, whether it's productive to bring the subject up at all.  But I'm a lot less concerned about hurting someone's identity if I criticize gamergate.

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #117 on: December 03, 2014, 05:50:00 PM »
The irony is really just that she cautioned fellow feminists that absolutes about the opposition being the enemy can take a life of their own, then goes and takes an absolute about the opposition being the enemy. Ironic too that she says they're the enemy because they name their own enemies and persecute and prosecute without any checks or balances. Sound familiar? Again, different forms of action but same underlying rhetoric.

GamerGate =/= gamer, though it's not exclusive of gamers. Gamer is an identity that exists without exclusion. There are people for whom gamer is the identity around which they wrap their lives, sure, but quite a few more make it just one aspect of their identity.

Whether you agree with them or not, whether you think of "them" as a single entity or not, saying that you don't care about offending them because of their self-identification is still an attack. I'm not saying it's not warranted -- I fully recognize that you're likely to run across the strong, violent rhetoric with a gamer identifying with GamerGate -- but it's still antagonistic.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2014, 07:41:30 PM by Lady Door »
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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #118 on: December 03, 2014, 09:52:52 PM »

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #119 on: December 04, 2014, 12:04:53 AM »
Very relevant, very well put.

I should stop talking when there are plenty of people in the community doing a better job of getting my points across than I ever could.
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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #120 on: December 04, 2014, 08:58:58 AM »
Came here to post that link yeah.

Whether you agree with them or not, whether you think of "them" as a single entity or not, saying that you don't care about offending them because of their self-identification is still an attack. I'm not saying it's not warranted -- I fully recognize that you're likely to run across the strong, violent rhetoric with a gamer identifying with GamerGate -- but it's still antagonistic.

I'm talking more in terms of "protected group or not" here.  My position is that the videogame specialist press probably should speak neutral to positively on the term "gamer".  I don't feel they have the same obligation with the term gamergate (or the opposition to gamergate).

So if a journalist says something like "I don't approve of harassment", I don't give a lot of merit to arguments like "That journalist is acting unethically" (which some people will try to claim).  However, I do feel a journalist, at least one meant to serve gamers could be argued as acting unethically if he calls gamers "pungent beta male bollock-scratchers".

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #121 on: December 04, 2014, 09:14:57 PM »
http://blog.practicalethics.ox.ac.uk/2014/12/limiting-the-damage-from-cultures-in-collision/

Oxford Practial Ethics blog has a post examine and expanding this same post.  Still parsing it myself, but pretty decent response to what essentially looks like a Twitter rant.
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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #122 on: December 05, 2014, 09:45:31 AM »
Pretty interesting article by a guy who routinely criticizes online journalism, and was summoned by gamergate to do an AMA on KiA:

https://betabeat.com/2014/12/i-was-summoned-by-gamergate-heres-what-i-saw/

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #123 on: December 06, 2014, 03:37:12 AM »
Nice article yeah.

I need help:
Youtube now recommends thunderf00t videos for me because I watched the Sarkeesian Effect for science.
What do I do to escape this.

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Re: Thoughts on gamergate
« Reply #124 on: December 06, 2014, 09:37:10 AM »
Nice article yeah.

I need help:
Youtube now recommends thunderf00t videos for me because I watched the Sarkeesian Effect for science.
What do I do to escape this.

You could watch this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsdIHK8O5yo