Author Topic: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one  (Read 66902 times)

NotMiki

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Rocky: you do know what an A-bomb is, right?
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The Duck

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #827 on: May 25, 2017, 11:25:45 PM »
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts_law/senate-republicans-consider-changing-custom-that-allows-democrats-to-block-judicial-choices/2017/05/25/d49ea61a-40b1-11e7-9869-bac8b446820a_story.html?utm_term=.56223d27cb2a

Among all the bad things that could happen in an all-Republican government, this is definitely one of the most alarming ones.  Especially aggravating since this rule was observed with a Dem prez & Dem Senate in 2012-2014.

The blue slip rule is actually sorta fine (means that Texas is more likely to get Republican judges, California more likely to get Democratic ones), but I can actually see getting rid of it if the gears grind down too hard (e.g. Trump doesn't get to nominate ANY blue-state justices, Obama can't nominate ANY red-state justices).  Doing it this way is incredibly infuriating from a process perspective.  You want to make this change and not be hypocrites?  Fine.  Do it this way:
* For judicicial vacancies opened in 2014 and before, ask Schmuer for a list of judges.  Vote them up even if you hate them.  THere was a Dem Senate then.
* For judicial vacancies opened from 2015-2016, when control was split, agree on a 50/50 slate.  Or heck, if you want to really get fancy, a 25/50/25 slate where half your list is just unconditionally approved, and the other half requires at least one Senator from across the aisle to approve as well, so there's a "moderate middle" that the likes of Manchin or Collins can live with.
* For new vacancies, fine, go make a stream of Republican judges.  The Dems will repay that should they ever retake the Presidency.

This is fantasy-land of course, the Republicans will just shove through all Republicans and be rewarded for their obstructionism under Obama and nobody will care about boring procedural cheating.

Ranmilia

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #828 on: May 27, 2017, 01:17:47 AM »
in case any of you wondered what it's like in The Christian Bubble, here's an editorial from the Statesman today.

Quote
Herman: Vote my way on bathroom bill, or I’ll have God fire up holy blowtorch,

    Austin American-Statesman 26 May 2017 Ken Herman Commentary kherman@statesman.com; 512-445-3907

RALPH BARRERA / AMERICAN-STATESMAN 2015
Steven Hotze, president of the Conservative Republicans of Texas and publisher of crtxnews.com, leads an antigay marriage rally in March 2015 on the south steps of the Capitol.

While we’re waiting to see what the Legislature does about bathroom and locker room usage by our transgender neighbors, you might want to know that God has been asked to train his considerable wrath upon those who oppose the so-called bathroom bill.

But first, our word of the day: imprecatory.

It’s new to me. I like learning new words. Looks like this one means “to invoke or call down (evil or curses), as upon a person.”

So it’s a potentially useful word. I heard it from Steven Hotze of Houston, a longtime player in really, really conservative politics in Houston and Texas. He’s a big backer of Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick, a major backer of the bathroom bill you’ve heard too much about.

Hotze used “imprecatory” in a recent posting on the Conservative Republicans of Texas News’ website crtxnews. com. Hotze is its publisher, and he is none too happy with Texas legislators who differ with him on issues such as abortion, same-sex marriage and which bathrooms transgender folks should use. All of those are issues on which there is plenty of room for reasonable discussion and debate. I bet there are officeholders with whom you disagree from time to time.

But have you ever called for an imprecatory prayer against those folks?Vote Probably not. In fact, you’ve perhaps called for a supportive prayer for folks with whom you disagree, because you’re mature enough to realize that, disagree though we do at times, many of us are God’s children and there’s more that unites us and blah, blah, blah.

Please keep reading and see if you agree with me that Hotze perhaps has gone a bit too far with his prayer request posted on his website. I think you’ve crossed some line when you pray prayers invoking phrases like “consumed, collapse, rot and be blown away as dust.”

That just sounds a bit excessive to my ears. See how it sounds to yours:

“There are Texas legislators who call evil good and good evil,” Hotze wrote, “who support the murder of unborn babies, who pervert God’s holy plan for marriage between a man and a woman, who accept, affirm and celebrate those who promote and choose to practice sodomy and other perverse, deviant, wicked and evil sexual behaviors, and who would allow perverted men and boys, who sexually fantasize that they are women, to enter women’s and girls’ bathrooms, showers and locker rooms.” See what I mean? And Hotze has a plan for what should happen to these folks. He asks God to carry out the plan. And he asks that you join him in praying for the carrying out of his plan. Remember the meaning of imprecatory?

“Pray this imprecatory prayer for the wicked state legislators,” Hotze asks. Here’s the imprecation: “In the name of Jesus, I prophesy and declare: May all the individuals serving in the state Legislature, and their staff, who support, promote and practice sodomy and other perverted, sexually deviant lifestyles, who support the killing of unborn babies, and who hate God’s Law and God’s Word, receive just retribution from God for their evil actions.

“May they receive what their unfaithful ways deserve. May they be consumed, collapse, rot and be blown away as dust from their current positions because of their wicked works, thoughts and deeds. May people scorn them and nations abhor them. May their punishment lead them to repentance and faith in Christ. May God’s will be done in their lives.”

I don’t know. Sounds a bit excessive. I’m generally just good with voting against politicians I don’t like.

OblivionKnight

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #829 on: May 27, 2017, 01:20:13 AM »
Just let the damn state secede already
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
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Ranmilia

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #830 on: June 19, 2017, 11:35:37 PM »
https://thenewinquiry.com/dispensing-gods-care/

'nother good article on why this is happening.  I see a lot of this not being well understood outside of The Christianity Bubble.

Cmdr_King

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #831 on: June 19, 2017, 11:53:27 PM »
I usually forget the details on that one, but it definitely fits with general calvinistic intent which I already attributed to... well honestly more than just the Christian Right but especially them.  Dunno if most people are cynical enough to really grok it though.
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

OblivionKnight

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #832 on: July 18, 2017, 02:33:29 PM »
http://www.cnn.com/2017/07/18/politics/how-the-republican-health-care-bill-fell-apart/index.html

Tons of articles on this everywhere. 

Having said that, the last time the healthcare bill died, someone dropped a phoenix down on it, sooo....we will see
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
[19:27] <+Terra_Condor> Han Kicks First?
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Vader intercepts.
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

Shale

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #833 on: July 18, 2017, 10:44:51 PM »
This was the Senate's Phoenix Downed version -- they followed the same pattern of "extreme right-wingers and moderates both badmouth the bill, so they come back with changes for the nutjobs and trust the moderates to fall in line," only this time neither side would fall in line (except Ted Cruz). It really seems like they might have to go back to the drawing board instead of reusing the shitty-ass AHCA model.
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dunie

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #834 on: July 24, 2017, 11:04:20 PM »
grapevine says the vote is near

OblivionKnight

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #835 on: July 24, 2017, 11:54:09 PM »
This was the Senate's Phoenix Downed version -- they followed the same pattern of "extreme right-wingers and moderates both badmouth the bill, so they come back with changes for the nutjobs and trust the moderates to fall in line," only this time neither side would fall in line (except Ted Cruz). It really seems like they might have to go back to the drawing board instead of reusing the shitty-ass AHCA model.

While that's the logical assumption,  until a failed vote happens,  I won't be betting against party solidarity any time soon
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
[19:27] <+Terra_Condor> Han Kicks First?
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Vader intercepts.
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

OblivionKnight

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #836 on: July 28, 2017, 12:17:42 PM »
HOLY SHIT THE MAVERICK ACTUALLY EXISTS!

I was this close to shitting myself when that vote came through
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
[19:27] <+Terra_Condor> Han Kicks First?
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Vader intercepts.
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

Shale

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #837 on: July 28, 2017, 01:05:24 PM »
WHAT EVEN IS REALITY
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dunie

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #838 on: July 28, 2017, 01:51:31 PM »
Fuck a Maverick. Fuck him being called a hero and people clapping for his actions over female senators Murkowski and Collins who stood firm in their fucking convictions. Fuck him, fuck the clappers. and fuck living on the edge of a three person group that could affect the lives of millions.

NotMiki

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #839 on: July 28, 2017, 03:31:58 PM »
Also let's give Democrats credit for being so innately not-awful that we take it for granted!
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superaielman

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #840 on: July 28, 2017, 05:47:43 PM »
Fuck a Maverick. Fuck him being called a hero and people clapping for his actions over female senators Murkowski and Collins who stood firm in their fucking convictions. Fuck him, fuck the clappers. and fuck living on the edge of a three person group that could affect the lives of millions.

Whatever you feel about McCain politically, he is an honest to goodness hero who has spent his life serving his country. I have plenty of bones to pick with him, but dumping on him in that way is uncalled for.
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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #841 on: July 28, 2017, 05:56:42 PM »
Eh.  Letting people stew for days on whether they will live or die for a bit of political grandstanding is worth a "fuck you" at the least.
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.

NotMiki

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #842 on: July 28, 2017, 06:44:06 PM »
Not a McCain fan, but I don't think he had made this decision days ago - it seems to have been a response to Ryan's failure earlier that night to guarantee skinny repeal wouldn't be voted into law as-is.
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Lady Door

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #843 on: July 28, 2017, 07:01:41 PM »
I agree with dunie. While I'm glad he flipped on this issue, did everyone just suddenly forget how horrid McCain has been these last few months (years???)?  Are we just going to completely ignore that the president threatened a senator's state's federal funding in an attempt to "guide" this (and fucking kudos to her for calling that ridiculous bluff)?

And what about the TWEETING that destablised the LGBTQ military members and supporters, only to be responded to by the DoD releasing a statement saying "now wait a minute"?

What the actual fuck is going on in there?
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NotMiki

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #844 on: July 28, 2017, 07:24:36 PM »
I wrote a lot of colorful things about the transgender ban on Facebook.  Figured I'd spare the forums.
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Shale

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #845 on: July 28, 2017, 07:31:54 PM »
Not a McCain fan, but I don't think he had made this decision days ago - it seems to have been a response to Ryan's failure earlier that night to guarantee skinny repeal wouldn't be voted into law as-is.

On that note: If they were serious about wanting that guarantee, they could have included a "poison pill" amendment in the skinny repeal nonsense to guarantee that the House wouldn't pass it as-is; for instance, "this bill does not take effect until the year 3000." Or, "Henceforth, the Speaker of the House must conduct all official business while wearing a full-body monkey costume." You have to go to conference unless the House and Senate pass exactly the same document, so putting in something that makes the bill self-defeating would be enough to make sure that step would happen. They chose not to because "we're DEFINITELY going to conference next, no way we just pass something and slap it into the U.S. Code over the weekend" was bullshit. At the very least, they wanted to have that option if conference talks went nowhere.
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OblivionKnight

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #846 on: July 28, 2017, 08:04:56 PM »
Don't misunderstand me, my calling him a Maverick is more about the shock that he actually broke from party lines on this vote. As others have said, he has made terrible voting decisions based on the party line for a long time, despite speaking out publicly against them (see: the last 6 months asst least). I respect the man as a military hero, even though I don't support his political views.    Senators Collins and Murkowski have as stated made consistent efforts against the party line, and I have a lot of respect in them for that.

But yes in general, I am still going "what the fuck" after the events of this week. The transgender band being posted through Twitter is ridiculous. If people want to serve honorably in the military, just fucking let them.  There are no exorbitant costs of transgender care, so there's another reason for this ban in between the lines...

This is just a ridiculous amount of bullshit thrown out at once. I wonder if they're trying to put so much crap out at once that anything major is lost in the dust?
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
[19:27] <+Terra_Condor> Han Kicks First?
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Vader intercepts.
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

NotMiki

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #847 on: July 28, 2017, 08:53:35 PM »
This is just a ridiculous amount of bullshit thrown out at once. I wonder if they're trying to put so much crap out at once that anything major is lost in the dust?

People keep attributing these moves to a conscious strategy.  That's what normal people pretending to be crazy would do.  These people are actually crazy, and the reason Trump does stuff like this is probably because he ate paint chips as a toddler and now he has no impulse control.  At this point, given the sprawling evidence we have before us, assigning a logical motive to Trump is nuts.  You only do it because your mind is trying to make sense of something that makes no sense.

Trump fired Comey, then bragged about it to the Russians because he genuinely thought firing Comey would ease the pressure on him.

Trump tweeted that he's banning transgender military service because the House GOP had an embarrassing squabble about whether the Pentagon should cover costs of gender reassignment surgery, and Trump thought, "no trans people, no problem!"

He thinks he's Alexander the Great and he sees Gordian knots everywhere he looks.
If he had any idea who Alexander the Great was or what the Gordian knot was, he'd think he was like that guy.  But he doesn't, obviously.

EDIT: Argh I did it too. fix'd.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2017, 08:57:55 PM by NotMiki »
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SnowFire

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #848 on: July 28, 2017, 09:04:45 PM »
The fact that this bill got as far as it did is horrifying, and in an ideal world, every Republican who was up for re-election in 2022 (i.e. "safe" from primarying for a time) would have been in revolt.  But I'll take 3 Republicans in revolt over none, so sure, credit where credit is due.

Re McCain, I think that the problem is that people interpret 'maverick' in the wrong way.  There's 'maverick' meaning "moderate", so something like Collins or Manchin, and there's 'maverick' meaning "has actual principles they put ahead of advancing the party."  McCain is quite conservative but has his own drum he marches to.  So expecting him to be a cuddly Democrat in disguise is going to get you bit.  What McCain is useful for is that there's a lot of "process" / "values" principles that have unfortunately become politicized that used to be, or at least *should* be, non-partisan.  "Is torture bad", "should unlimited money slosh around in politics", "are immigrants real people", etc.  In that, he unfortunately does deserve praise.  (Alternatively, "most other Republicans deserve scorn", if you must.)  Who knows why he voted the way he did, but the best guess seems it was process related, also possibly brush with death related.  Who knows.  Also, on the process note, fuck all the Republicans who whined about the way Obamacare was passed (in a chamber that had 59 Democrats) but didn't see any issues with how BCRA was attempted to be passed.

Dunie, just focusing specifically on the McCain attention vs. Collins & Murkowski...  well, McCain was the surprising vote is the thing. In the alternate universe where Portman & Heller were steadfast Republican opponents from start to finish, and Jodi Ernst or Deb Fischer cast the surprising vote to push the bill off the cliff, then it'd be Ernst getting all the attention.  It's the marginal vote that matters.

Re NotMiki on the trans-in-the-military issue, my budgetary foo is weak, but couldn't Trump have simply announced that the military will no longer pay for any costs related to gender reassignment surgery if that was his angle, not from Budgetary authority (which rests with Congress), but from his powers as Commander in Chief?  I'd certainly think it'd work in reverse, i.e. Obama ordering the military to let it happen without need for Congressional intervention.  (Granted, not sure it matters whether it was the paint chips making him not notice this obvious option, or if he genuinely did want to throw a bone to the religious right by doin' some ol' fashioned gay bashing.  My money is slightly on the gay bashing, FWIW.)
« Last Edit: July 28, 2017, 09:07:14 PM by SnowFire »

Cmdr_King

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Re: Is there a politics thread? Guess I'm making one
« Reply #849 on: July 28, 2017, 09:06:41 PM »
POTUS:  Please abuse prisoners while making arrests.  Police: *thunderous applause* https://twitter.com/ShaunKing/status/891020515980267522
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<NotMiki> I mean, we're talking life vs. liberty, with the pursuit of happiness providing color commentary.