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Author Topic: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)  (Read 1081 times)

Tide

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Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« on: March 04, 2016, 04:02:52 AM »
We had a tie last week in Pool F:
Winner - Team Sun.

There will be a tiebreaker this week for the other two teams. As for Pools:

DRAGONS
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Genevieve(VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3)
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1)
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Yuri (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT)
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3)

Spoiling Skies
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Genevieve (VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3)
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1)
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT)
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3)

Clones
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Genevieve (VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3)
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1)
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT)
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3)

Tiebreaker:
Team GodHand vs. Team Princesses 
Riou (Suiko), Geddoe (Suiko3), Lazlo (Suiko4) vs. Princess Toadstool (SMRPG), Nina2 (BoF2), Clarissa (WA:XF)

« Last Edit: March 04, 2016, 04:44:54 AM by Tide »
<napalmman> In Suikoden I, In Chinchirorin, what is it called when you roll three of the same number?
<@Claude> yahtzee

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Tide

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Re: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2016, 04:45:54 PM »
DRAGONS
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Genevieve(VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3) = Genevieve tries, but her teammates are mostly cannon fodder for the Dragons. Zog and Sara are even vulnerable to taking extra damage from magic! But Discrim unfocuses with 3 people and Zog probably won't die unless he eats one that is focused, so then the other team just gangs up and takes her out. Juan is still asleep and Cliff is kinda bad when MP busting isn't a concern.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1) - Pretty certain on this as well. Team Dragons can eliminate someone on the other side without much trouble, while their own team members won't fall to one turn from the enemy.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT) - Same problem as with Gene. If Zeal didn't have the 1/2 unlock or have her busters be pure counter moves, this COULD be interesting (both Zog and Sara are vulnerable to HP-1). As is, everyone gangs up Yuri and even if he doesn't get one rounded, he is definitely heal locked and will eventually run out of Sanity and die. Afterwards, Zeal herself is fodder for three people who can chip around her limit phases.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3) - The enemy team is surprisingly competent. Anyway, Ryu MUST transform immediately because both Citan and Harken outspeed and Beatrice can sleep him to which he has no answer for. But then what does he do? The problem for the Dragons is that Zog and Sara are both slow. They need to kill Mao because Mao has MT Revival. Also, because it isn't full, if he kills Harken, she just revives her and now we have OHKO Maximum Risk crazies. He also can't leave Citan alone because Citan can make his Haste MT (at which point, they are in deep. Hasted Harken? Jesus) or cast a Shield to lower the damage from Zog on Beatrice or Mao. He also can't leave Beatrice unchecked because if Mao gets a chance to SURGE her, all of sudden that magic damage becomes a lot more competent (plus she has MT Feeble Mind). All in all, this just feels stacked against the other team. Even if Ryu manages to make some headway, his other team mates aren't fast enough to take advantage of it. If he takes out Mao, Citan can haste Harken at which point, really bad things happen and even if he kills Citan, Mao can revive him.


Spoiling Skies
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Genevieve (VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3) - I assume that the shields can stack. It costs 7 AP, but it shuts down most forms of offense but physical techs. Unfortunately, Gene has an unique physical ability in Contaminate Energy and all of Cliff's BSes are pretty much unique. Vyse is probably dead before doing anything else significant (Contaminate Energy + one Cliff BS chain will certain do it). Aika gets the first turn but can't do anything with it (confusing simply gets enemies to attack her), so that's pretty much that.
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1) - Oh right, I forgot about Breaks and Ayla mostly spamming techs. What Snowfire said basically then.
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT) - Also unsure. Dual shielding works pretty well until they get to needing to chip around Zeal's Half HP phases. They have to drop shields at this point but I dunno if they can safely blow past it. I assume that they won't but Zeal needs 2 turns to really screw Team Skies over (Hallation + Poke), and most likely, Enrique can drop Quika to make sure they have a speed advantage before this point. So Team Skies should still win. Yuri, hiliariously does not matter as he gets shut down by Dual Shields so the enemy team just pokes him until he dies.
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3) - Skull Shield doesn't stop Citan's deathblows to me and certainly doesn't stop Harken's deadlier techs. So that's out. Aika has to drop Delta shield or Beatrice sleeps all of them to death. So Aika's turn is locked and Vyse can stop the two fastest people on the other team. Citan and Harken gang up on Aika and kill her. At which point, now they are vulnerable to sleep so GG.

NOTE: I may not have a full grasp of how the shields work or missing something on Team Skies; might need to re-evaluate/delete stuff.

Tiebreaker:
Team GodHand vs. Team Princesses 
Riou (Suiko), Geddoe (Suiko3), Lazlo (Suiko4) vs. Princess Toadstool (SMRPG), Nina2 (BoF2), Clarissa (WA:XF) - Turn order is: Clarissa > Riou > Toadstool > Geddoe >= Lazlo > Nina. Team GodHand has two dudes with MT OHKO damage, but there is a fatal flaw in their team: Only Geddoe has sleep/silence blocking.  I am assuming he can block both with one blocker because otherwise, Toadstool just uses the status that he isn't blocking and locks the entire enemy team down with that. Note that the status has a 99% chance of working. This is really really bad because team GodHand's big MT damage comes from using their true runes. If he can block both at the same time, then the strat for Princesses is probably to have Clarissa can Rob turn at 75% to stop Riou, then Sacrifice + Psych Bomb to take out Geddoe. Lazlo can ID someone (probably Nina), but Clarissa can rob turn again, and use Encourage to push Toadstool's turn forward to MT Silence/Sleep. If he takes out Clarissa, Nina can Death Riou. And if he takes out Toadstool, same situation, but Rob Turn this time on Lazlo after using Death on Riou. While there are lots of dice rolls to this, I don't think the odds side with Team GodHand.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2016, 02:41:33 PM by Tide »
<napalmman> In Suikoden I, In Chinchirorin, what is it called when you roll three of the same number?
<@Claude> yahtzee

<Dreamboum> Everyone is learning new speedgames!
<Dreamboum> A bright future awaits us gentlemens
<Pitted> I'm learning league of legends
<Dreamboum> go fuck yourself

Dhyerwolf

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Re: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2016, 03:29:34 AM »
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1) - I think? The other team has no magic sans Keith, and I assume Enrique and Aika can take out Ayla since Izlude is getting shut down and Keith's magic is pretty bad.

Keith's magic is his best damage (which is true of all SH 1 PCs), which is MT and has decent ID attached, and Ayla does have some 4HKO magic. That said, the best bet is probably Enrique throwing up Justice Shield and Aika confusing Keith to keep him locked down, so I'm not sure the fight changes dramatically.
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Pyro

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Re: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2016, 07:14:11 PM »
DRAGONS
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Genevieve(VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3): I think they overwhelm them with MT damage.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1): there isn't much healing here, even if Keith kills Ryu1 they are boned by Zog + Sara's combined MT damage.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Yuri (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT): I don't think Yuri's buffs keep him alive vs. that MT offense? Zeal isn't beating Zog+Sara by her lonesome self.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3): This is a little brutal.

Spoiling Skies
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Genevieve (VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3): Contaminate Energy.... although team SS might just blitz her. Juan and Cliff add in a lot of damage too.
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1): Playing defensively can only go so far here (Izlude's breaks/Keith's Deathblade Jiru/Magic, Ayla's techs/MT magic?)
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT): Sure? They do blasting past limits well.
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3): Techs and other nasty things here.

Clones
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Genevieve (VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3): They kill Gen fast, and while Juan/Cliff may kill one they get cleaned up after.
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1): Megid -> Clean up works?
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT): Yuri gets his clock cleaned quickly and then Zeal can't handle all 3.
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3): Zzz?

Tiebreaker:
Team GodHand vs. Team Princesses
Riou (Suiko), Geddoe (Suiko3), Lazlo (Suiko4) vs. Princess Toadstool (SMRPG), Nina2 (BoF2), Clarissa (WA:XF): That's a lot of MT damage. Clarissa can use Rob Turn on Riou and then Sacrifice on Lazlo..... But it just feels like it isn't enough slowing down team Godhand. Lazlo will survive the Sacrifice and do MT nastiness, and Geddoe will do MT nastiness and that won't leave much left.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2016, 04:38:10 AM »
Quote
Team GodHand has two dudes with MT OHKO damage, but there is a fatal flaw in their team: No silence blockers.

Geddoe blocks both silence and sleep. Also, there's a decent chance he's faster depending on which spell he uses. (Probably not with the spell which OHKOs Toadstool, to be fair.

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SnowFire

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Re: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2016, 12:49:08 AM »

DRAGONS
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Genevieve(VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3)
Dragons offense on turn 1 is kinda garbage, so Genevieve HP hype is very, very important.  I guess I'll lean toward disrespect in this instance.   
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1)
Izlude might be in the air for some of this damage, and I think Ayla can resist Fire and has a notable speed advantage, but sure.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Yuri (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT)
Reminder: Zog & Sara's best damage is MT.  So it's gonna trigger MP-0 counters from Zeal's hands, at least from me, which will make their offense crap afterward, for all that this might not matter vs. Zeal's suspect HP.  It's all about if Yuri can survive...  I think he can, just drain off Ryu's initial attack & have Zeal use Hallation, which will kill Ryu and keep Yuri healthy..
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3)
Citan wrecks.

Spoiling Skies
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Genevieve (VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3)
Cliff & Genevieve have named specials, so no spoiling.
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1)
Too many special moves that Skull Shield doesn't work on.  It'd turn off Deathblade Jiru, and combined with Delta Shield stop Keiths' magic, but that leaves Enruique focusing and Ayla still throwing damage down, so yeah no.
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT)
Delta Shield turns off offense, which leaves a Yuri buff game...  but something like Focus, Focus, Delta Shield, would be 10+ 7 - 2 = 15 SP, or 25 SP at the start of round 2, which means Pirate's Wrath murders someone extremely dead.
Vyse, Aika, Enrique (SoA) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3)
Buff game + specials.

Tiebreaker:
Team GodHand vs. Team Princesses 
Sure, I'll buy Silence hype, even if Geddoe immunes it.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2016, 01:48:57 AM »
Sara's best damage is ST, for what it's worth. Zog loses a lot by going ST, though, yeah.

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DragonKnight Zero

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Re: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2016, 03:08:44 AM »
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Genevieve (VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3)  I think.  Blitz down Genivieve, 3 on 1 takes out Cliff, and Explode a napping Juan?
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1)  Dummo.  Izlude's 52% evasion piercing Weapon Break will neuter Claude's offense and can cripple the others.  Add Keith tricks and the danger of leaving Ayla at low HP; that's a lot to threaten with.
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT)
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3)  Little known trivia is that Body Control prevents negative status when it activates.  Doesn't affect the outcome here.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Heavy Team Tourney (H Group)
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2016, 03:10:23 AM »
DRAGONS
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Genevieve(VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3): Juan goes first but can't really do much, Ryu transforms, Gen + Cliff... can't even kill Ryu, weirdly, because Gen's best targettable attack is physical. getrekt.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1): Keith will ID Ryu anyway, so Ryu just tosses a rang, which pretty much ensures that Zog's followup damage is gonna be a bad time.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Yuri (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT): Ryu stabs Yuri with a ST attack. Yuri gets a turn here, so he should... super-buff probably. But even with that, he dies to Zog / Sara. Sure, I'm willing to hype Zog's MT triggering a MP-0 counter which makes Zog bad thereafter, and maaaybe Zeal can use the buff to now kill Ryu before he can transform, though I have my doubts since the transform is initiative turn 2... but even then she's gonna hve a lot of trouble outslugging Zog + Sara physicals since her best MT damage is physical.
Zog (BoF1), Sara (BoF1) and Ryu (BoF1) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3): Uhh Ryu should probably transform or sleep is a thing, Citan can always Haste Beatrice in that case. Citan probably hastes himself, since he knows he'll get another turn, Harken just uses her MT. Zog/Sara can unleash hell at this point, Gale + Sara physical is the way to go... but that probably doesn't kill Harken even, and if it did Mao still exists. Char isn't an option, woof you do not want to do that with Harken around. I have no idea then. Maybe, maybe, that damage combination kills Mao. Let's say it does. But now Citan gets multipe turns, and he can say, poke Zog twice then Harken uses Burst Breaker and positively explodes the whole enemy team. And Citan can still deal whatever Zog/Sara can still muster.

Abstain on SoA, not gonna vote on a whole team from a game I haven't played.

Clones
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Genevieve (VP), Juan (Suiko3), Cliff (SO3): Juan goes first and does a lot of stuff, Cliff probably faster than Claude so may well finish him off. Or Cress? Chaz can ID Juan or Megid for decent damage, but I think this team's in some trouble. Cress isn't stopping Genevieve from getting a turn... let's say Chaz Megid and Cress kill Juan, but then Gen + Cliff kill Chaz, and I don't think Cress can solo from here, though it's possible.
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Ayla (CT), Izlude (FFT), Keith (SH1): The opening Megid is tough for this team to recover from, Keith surely dies before he gets a turn and Ayla/Izlude can't cut 'em down fast enough.
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Yuri Hyuga (SHs), Queen Zeal (CT): At best, Yuri gets a buff off, again, then dies. Chaz can patch up even buffed Zeal damage pretty easily from there.
Chaz (PS4), Claude (SO2), Cress (ToP) vs. Citan (XG), Lady Harken (WAs), Beatrice (WA3), Mao (SH3): Hasted Nightmare. Chaz might resist it but uhhhh this is insurmountable given how good Citan/Harken are.

Dragons 3-1
Clones 2-2

Erwin Schrödinger will kill you like a cat in a box.
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