Author Topic: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!  (Read 35362 times)

Lord Ephraim

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #200 on: March 12, 2017, 07:31:58 PM »
I threw down $$$ for 80 orbs and got Klein, Olwen, Lachesis, Reinhardt, and Chrom.  Since then, I lost count.

All I remember is that my f2p orbs got me Eirika, Raven, Jeorge, Fae and Linde.  I accidentally sent a 5* Corrin home because I was sorting through the 8 four stars I had sitting around.  Bartre and Effie are the only units I used feathers on.

The Julia is +4.  Lucina is +1. No other merged units.

Meeplelard

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #201 on: March 12, 2017, 09:36:21 PM »
Beat Ursula's map with Lucina, Nino, Catria, and Felicia.  Felicia ended up not doing much since she wasn't high enough level.  Ultimately, position Nino so Ursula aggros her, and Nino kills her on turn one, then run away, Catria tanks the Ninja, while Lucina runs into a position to buffer the melee guys.

Doubt I'll do Lunatic.
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Captain K

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #202 on: March 13, 2017, 04:16:19 PM »
Beat Lunatic Ursula.

Level 36 FRobin killed Ursula, then the Axe Knight.  Level 36 is minimum needed because otherwise her damage is too low to kill the knight in a timely manner.
Level 40 4-star Effie killed everything else.
Olivia made double actys.
Serra healed Effie.

SnowFire

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #203 on: March 13, 2017, 09:56:21 PM »
I figured I'd give this a try.  Solely for science of course.  Time to make Eph jealous with that level 3 3 star Bartre:



Discussed in-chat, but the lowest score is probably 50, with a +5 score for each friend (max 10).  Sadly one of Shale or Eph accepted my friend request before I won my 1 battle, so I got 55 rather than 50, but suspect that was still sufficient for the above achievement.  Higher numbers are better, right?  100,001 sounds pretty good, way better than suckers like Sopko at 2,000 or whatever.

Also, does the plot ever delve into who exactly this imposter pretending to be Anna is?  Using axes is fine (see this image for scientific proof of axe-Anna), but, like, everything else is wrong.  Oh well.  She seems like she gets a pretty useful form in the DL from Elf's stat topic, at least.  Who cares if you're 2HKOed by average physical damage if you also double average speed with good damage and a teleporting axe and Astra to blow up stallers.  Not so many ranged physicalers who can avoid counters, and good MDef helps out when counters don't.   Sharena looks pretty solid too, and Alfonse is okay.  Virion...  probably wants his Awakening form.  And...  that's that for guaranteed characters.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2017, 09:57:52 PM by SnowFire »

metroid composite

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #204 on: March 14, 2017, 06:50:19 AM »
Quote
Also, does the plot ever delve into who exactly this imposter pretending to be Anna is?  Using axes is fine (see this image for scientific proof of axe-Anna), but, like, everything else is wrong.  Oh well.  She seems like she gets a pretty useful form in the DL from Elf's stat topic, at least.  Who cares if you're 2HKOed by average physical damage if you also double average speed with good damage and a teleporting axe and Astra to blow up stallers.  Not so many ranged physicalers who can avoid counters, and good MDef helps out when counters don't.   Sharena looks pretty solid too, and Alfonse is okay.  Virion...  probably wants his Awakening form.  And...  that's that for guaranteed characters.

Shareena is legit the third best blue right now (and the top two are super, super rare).  Both Laggy and me upgraded her all the way to 5 star.  (My only 5 star upgrade so far; his second).

There should be more guaranteed characters than those, however.  There's a rotation of special maps that get you two copies of a character (a 1 star and a 2 star version).  Characters in these maps range from decent to great.  Like...you can get Ovelia, who is a very good Dancer (need to promote to 3 star before she can learn Dance).  Pretty sure you can get Lissa who's the best healer right now since she has a full heal instead of healing for like 8.  You can get Cecilia who is really nice for levels 1-30 or so, because she's ranged and 3 move and has weapon triangle on colourless units (archers, ninjas, and healers).  She drops off at levels 31-40 because she goes from being 2-3 speed slower than most of the enemies you're fighting to 5-6 speed slower, and thus suddenly becomes quite fragile, when she felt somewhat tanky before due to often having weapon triangle advantage.  You get Subaki who...isn't considered great but if you scroll up a bit to the video I posted you'll see that he was instrumental in a strat for beating the Ursula map with all 3 star units (he's a physical wall pegasus knight; he's just...very specialized).  So...yeah, watch the daily rotation under special maps for a bunch more free characters.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #205 on: March 14, 2017, 07:17:03 AM »
If we want to be pedantic, Olivia is the worst dancer in the game right now yuck yuck. We'll see how Ninian compares... very soon! (But yes, Olivia is by far the best free character and well worth anyone's time to pick up.)


I'm very skeptical at the claim that Sharena is the third best blue. Third best lance-user, maybe? Even that feels a bit of a stretch, but I can see saying she's better than all but two of Azura, Cordelia, Catria, Ephraim, Abel, and Effie... maybe. Add Linde (not to mention Corrin F, Nowi, Robin M, and the brave tomes of oneshotting Takumi) to that list and yeah, no way. Like I'm comparing Sharena and Corrin F right now and I can't see how Sharena is better? Sharena has more damage but Seal Res and Draconic Aura make up for that to a large degree; Hone Atk is better than Fortify Def; Dark Breath's debuff is more potent and comes out faster than Fensalir's; and Corrin has more physical bulk. Rally Attack is nice, as is not being weak to the Falchion, but that doesn't feel like enough here.


But that's not what I came here to post! Beat the Lunatic final battle (no light blessings obviously because I'm not a filthy casual). I ran a party of Olwen, Klein, Eirika, and Lyn. Olwen, with Eirika's buff, could one-shot Xander through his buffed res, which is huge because Xander has monster atk and def and 1-2 counters so taking him down quick and painlessly was a big deal. Lyn's job was to bait Veronica with Klein waiting in the wings; both combined could kill her. One thing I did have to learn to be careful of was to NOT have Eirika buff Klein on this turn, though, because otherwise Veronica will reverse that buff (she doesn't reverse the buffs of her primary target, just anyone else caught in her Savage Blow AoE). With the two problem targets gone, the main priority was keeping Olwen safe (not a bad map for it) because she almost OHKOs the red sword user too, such that anyone else can finish. But... yeah mostly it was a matter of taking out the two named characters with a minimum of damage taken and I could mop up.


Battles like this and the grand hero battles are the highlight of the game I think; kinda disappointing that there may not be many more (once every two weeks is not enough).
« Last Edit: March 14, 2017, 02:46:45 PM by Dark Holy Elf »

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SnowFire

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #206 on: March 14, 2017, 07:25:49 AM »
metroid: I meant in a DL-sense, actually.  Since Elf just posted an as-of-mid-March stat topicy thing.  All the rotating free characters come at 1 or 2 stars which seems like a true waste of time compared to any random 4-star from an orb pull unless you have tons of promotion items...   and more generally, if you aren't paying attention, seems like you can miss them.  Anna/Alfonse/Sharena/Virion are the only truly required you-will-definitely-play-a-few-maps-with-these characters it seems.  (Sure, they might be 2 stars too, but you don't have any better options.)

I did actually get a 1-star Olivia, then after realizing it was 1-star, said "but why" since Dance requires 3 stars as you noted.  Subaki just might be the sole character I'd want to grind up as a break-in-case-of-emergency character, though.  (I also have Palla/Catria/Est, so he can join in for flyerpremacy.  Also also he's apparently vaguely fast now after being the slow Sky Knight in Fates?!  Will wonders never cease?)

Captain K

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #207 on: March 14, 2017, 07:28:08 AM »
Sharena's claim to fame is a high base stat total, which earns you more points in the arena.  She has 2 movement which is good considering the people with higher BST are armor characters.  She has no weaknesses to exploit, and makes everyone around her better with buffs.  And she fares well against the 1 million red sword users in the game.

Laggy

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #208 on: March 14, 2017, 07:43:16 AM »
Third best blue in the arena meta context (the competition being Linde and Azura). In a pve context where you fight all sorts of randomized enemies your list is probably more correct.

To extrapolate more on Captain K, Sharena is the highest non-dragon/armored unit BST (177), although skill transfer will probably mitigate this advantage some, has a solid stat distribution, and isn't a flyer that instantly dies to Takumi. Falchion weakness is a big, big deal because of the popularity of Lucina/Marth (and Julia to a lesser extent) - Nowi still gets run for her BST but F Corrin pretty much never does, for all that I agree that F Corrin looks great on paper she's weirdly low statted for a dragon.

I really like Catria and if I had a properly natured one I'd consider running her with the upcoming skill changes despite her weakness to Takumi (she was my preferred blue unit for a long time), but most of the others in your list have clear holes (in a arena context) that Sharena really doesn't. Brave weapon users all suffer from low stat totals and/or being prone to dying as a consequence of their specialization and generally below average speed (detrimental to score streaks), Ephraim is slow and dies to mages, and Effie has 1 move (people still run her anyway but I personally can't stand it).

Also Sharena goes great with Nino, who is popular right now and my personal favorite unit, but that's much more specific synergy of course.

(For the record I still think arena scoring being based on BST is stupid but it is what it is.)
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Lord Ephraim

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #209 on: March 14, 2017, 08:51:25 AM »
Arena now rewards you with more feathers if you hit the 4000 score mark.  A 4500 score can get you around 4500 feathers a week.  Plus looks like you can earn 200 daily from quests.  Really depends on which bonus units you have.  Klein is my highest BST bonus unit and I can get around 4550.  That's enough for the top 3000.

5900 a week isn't too bad.  However, there is no longer daily 2 orbs instead a max of 2 orbs a week.  More importance of upgrade your current units that rolling the dice.

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #210 on: March 14, 2017, 01:22:47 PM »
First taste was free and now it is full price and I don't know what to do with myself.
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Meeplelard

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #211 on: March 14, 2017, 02:50:27 PM »
Decided to do a pull on the new banner because I have mythril to spare.  I could use some colorless!

*2 Red, 2 Green, 1 Blue*

...screw it, I'm going all in!

3 3* Dupes no one cares about, 5* Cain, and 5* Fae.  Actually pretty good since Cain is my first 5* Mounted unit, and Fae my first 5* Green unit.
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Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #212 on: March 14, 2017, 04:05:33 PM »
Laggy: Oh yeah, if you're scaling for BST that makes more sense, though it still feels like you're trying to have it both ways? If Corrin is inferior to Sharena due to having -7 BST despite a better combat performance, then surely Sharena is also inferior to Effie due to having -6 BST (and combat which is... lateral for sure; knights are weird). Certainly the folks going for super-duper high scores love Effie and I've hardly heard a peep about Sharena out of them (although a big part of this is that you can't get Sharena at 5*, so getting her costs you 20k feathers and thus offsets many weeks of better arena performance; Corrin is similar). For that matter, at a certain point you can also argue Effie is better than Azura or Linde in the super-duper-high scores arena meta for the same reason, which shows how ridiculous said meta is, and on the whole I'm not terribly interested in discussing it.


Also, I had really hoped the 2 daily free orbs would continue. With them gone, and Lucius a staff user (whyyy), and no new high-level maps in the current crop, the game is definitely running out of things to interest me now. Two weeks until the next GHB I guess? Blah. At least there are some new quests.

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Laggy

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #213 on: March 14, 2017, 04:37:42 PM »
I mean, it's all about comparing the tradeoffs right? You don't need to tunnel vision max BST in evaluating stuff like that. Effie and Sharena actually share very similar roles for instance in that they tend to be blue walls that bait red sword lords out to their death, but Sharena brings in 2 move (much more flexible + viable offensively, two auras (Fortify Def/her weapon) at the cost of 6 BST.

Azura and Linde are ranked highly despite their low BST because they're just that good - Azura being a dancer who can also play the blue wall bait (a role so important oftentimes two blues are run, again because of the overabundance of red sword lords, and Dance's power speaks for itself to the point where plenty of people run Olivia just for it and Hone Attack despite being a pretty bad combat unit), and Linde having such ridiculous nuking potential that she can overrun teams by herself.

F. Corrin is an example of a unit that I respect a lot on paper but what the arena meta tends to boil down to is "how consistently can you win without taking any unit losses for a 7 win streak", which means the criteria is slated towards how high of a BST can you achieve while still reliably and safely winning - and she doesn't tend to make the cut there over Sharena (as Sharena is solid/stable enough to fill her blue wall role and generally avoid dying). It's possible to evaluate this and weigh BST into said evaluation in the context of the current arena meta without having it be the sole determining criteria. Certainly some people WOULD posit Effie as the best blue for the reason you stated, but I find her drawbacks too much to use her and still get a flawless win streak so I don't.

You may be right in that ranking such things is too subjective as a result but considering that arena is the main place to get feathers still I don't think you can really just dismiss such considerations out of hand, assuming you're playing for that and all.

The new daily quests incidentally aren't that bad in replacing the daily orbs (you'll get 1 orb and 200 feathers a day, and they give a free Dueling Crest so you can get 6 arena runs in - definitely pushing arena). The overall dearth of non-arena content is an issue though and one I suspect won't really go away given their current content track, so if you aren't into arena, you're probably going to be bored, yes.
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Shale

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #214 on: March 14, 2017, 04:41:50 PM »
My main problem with the arena quests is that the orb reward requires killing 20 level 10+ enemies, and there's no guarantee you can get there in six fights thanks to people using three-person teams or three level 40s with a level 1 deadweight to game the matchmaking.
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Laggy

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #215 on: March 14, 2017, 04:44:55 PM »
The orb reward doesn't require arena kills. You can kill stuff in training tower and get your orb.

The shitty arena matchmaking pre-40 is definitely a thing, yeah, but it's pretty unlikely that you can't score at least 1 win on Beginner on your three daily runs even so, and that 1 win nets you a Dueling Crest for 3 more tries that day. The feather rewards are at 2 and 4 wins respectively so you don't need to win all 6, either.

I would suggest finding a 40 baseline team you're comfortable with though as the matchmaking and meta in general really stabilizes out there, and if you aren't going for rank you don't need flawless runs, you just want to clear the Offense rating hurdle (3k before for 1600 feathers, now 4k for 2500 feathers potentially if you can make it)
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Shale

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #216 on: March 14, 2017, 05:00:41 PM »
Huh, it didn't even occur to me that the arena quests could be fulfilled outside the arena.

Problem with finding a good level 40 team is that there's no such thing as a good level 40 team with Odin or Sully on it, so when I'm going for score (until they finally update the bonus characters) I'm going with a gimped team. Once I'm done with score runs, Lucina/Effie/Minerva/Takumi all the way.
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Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #217 on: March 14, 2017, 06:44:03 PM »
Ooh, I didn't even realise that the new arena quests were daily, cool. Still not happy about the orb flow being halved but that takes away some of the sting.

Shale: Do you have Robin-F? By all accounts she's respectable enough; nothing special but probably an improvement over Sully and should be workable in a team if levelled up as 4*. I actually think the bonus characters are one of the clever moves of the arena, since it means you will need to try to vary your team week to week (and get you to try to pull new characters, which of course is the real reason they exist but oh well) and building the rest of your team around the strengths/weaknesses of the bonus character you use is a fun exercise.

Quote
You may be right in that ranking such things is too subjective as a result but considering that arena is the main place to get feathers still I don't think you can really just dismiss such considerations out of hand, assuming you're playing for that and all.

I'm certainly not dismissing the arena as a whole out of hand! As you said, it is the best way to get feathers (although you should probably avoid hyping a unit who requires 20k feathers to be effective at that, as I said) and a valid part of the game to discuss. However the nickel-and-diming over small BST differences is really only something you need to worry about if you're going for the Absolute Best Scores as a matter of pride. Like... I got top 10000 last week with a team that included Olwen (lowest 5* BST in the game), so you pretty much have to be going for top 5000 or even 1000 for this to matter. And once you're there the meta warps significantly; I've seen people explicitly note that Takumi is no longer useful then because his BST is too low, for instance. This is a concern which is reflected in no other aspect of the game, additionally, so overfocusing on it means your definition of "Nth best unit" becomes extremely niche and of value to very few people.

I mean, even moreso than these sorts of discussions already are, obviously. :p

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Laggy

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #218 on: March 14, 2017, 07:32:17 PM »
I actually think the bonus characters are one of the clever moves of the arena, since it means you will need to try to vary your team week to week (and get you to try to pull new characters, which of course is the real reason they exist but oh well) and building the rest of your team around the strengths/weaknesses of the bonus character you use is a fun exercise.

Agreed on this. I thought it was annoying at first but it does freshen up the arena meta and I don't generally mind being given something to do (i.e. leveling up a hero to use as the bonus) in the interim. It helps a lot that the latest GBH unit is always in the arena, so I had F Robin leveled and ready for her arena season beforehand. Same deal with Ursula - you may want to level her if you don't intend on trying to pull the current banner heroes.

Incidentally the current crop isn't that great. Karel looks to be a better Lyn archetype but still suffers from her same issues (a bit too prone to dying because of the requirement to get knocked down in HP to be good), and Ninian... well, if you're going for a super dragon team (Tiki/Nowi/Ninian as the base) she's a solid fit there, but otherwise she's just another dancer with a Falchion weakness attached to her. Hitting Res is generally cool of course, but doesn't make up for that and a really niche C ability.

Healers suck, Lucius really should've been a blue light mage (whyyyy). Jaffar might be usable but I'm skeptical, when Kagero is very clearly the best ninja and even she doesn't get run that much (blah blah BST reasons).

Also... the random non-focus/non-GBH heroes looks like they might be units weak to the GBH for whatever reason. You'll note Jagen and Sully are both blue cavalry alongside F Robin (although the translation isn't perfect... Jagen has ridiculous Res that actually makes him not that vulnerable!) Could be a coincidence, but I recall Narcian being paired up with like... Catria in his bonus run as well? So an observation to keep making, in any case. Next week see if we have red cavalry there for Ursula to wreck.

Quote
This is a concern which is reflected in no other aspect of the game, additionally, so overfocusing on it means your definition of "Nth best unit" becomes extremely niche and of value to very few people.

I mean, even moreso than these sorts of discussions already are, obviously. :p

That's what tier lists basically already ARE, to be fair. <_< No disrespect meant to trying to rank heroes objectively based on their overall performance versus like, a random crop of units from Tenth Stratum or the Lunatic GBH battles/later story chapters; I find those maps very cool and would normally agree that that's the norm for any sort of evaluation! But specifically tier lists are catered towards the high-end competitive spectrum, which in this game is pretty much arena, and I personally find that the most interesting to evaluate even if, yes, it applies to a generally small portion of the game's content. Since feathers mostly come from there it's still kind of an important thing to look at even for casual players.

I may be nickel and diming BST too much and you can definitely clear the newly minted 4k offense hurdle with even 4* heroes mixed in your group. Having a bad arena fight (losing multiple units) is always going to cut into your score way more than running a single-digit BST drop on a unit that you feel performs better, so point conceded there. I do think you're overestimating the opportunity cost of promoting Sharena through feathers over using 5* units, though. A lot of people pull shit all for 5*, and oftentimes what they'll get won't even be that good or have bad natures that hamper their performance significantly or whatever. The main advantage of feather promotion is that you get to pick exactly who gets slotted into your team, and it's really hard to find a team that Sharena ISN'T a good pick on. There's also no way to pull her normally so if you ever intend to use her she isn't a bad promotion pick regardless (by far the best of the three starting story units), and the sooner you get a good comp going the better you can consistently score in arena for more.

You're probably on the money that's why most people don't talk much about her, though, but every testimony I've seen for people who have bothered has been nothing but glowing (and you can add mine to the list). There's something to be said about just having a consistently solid unit with no real flaws, and being a sturdy blue in a sea of red. (Will again throw my acknowledgement that F Corrin looks great and is probably being underrated; even with Falchion weakness I think she wins 1v1 against them anyway, worth noting she 2HKOs Lucina and wins off of baiting for instance. She wishes Julia hadn't been introduced as a focus hero, though.)
« Last Edit: March 14, 2017, 08:06:37 PM by Laggy »
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Meeplelard

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #219 on: March 14, 2017, 08:08:57 PM »
So a 2* Draug is a bonus reward for Paralogue Quests.  That's...actually pretty darn nice since Armored Units are really hard to get, and they didn't give out any via special map quests, it gives an actual opportunity to do those pesky Armor Unit March quests. 

Wouldn't shock me if he was placed there specifically because they realized that situation.  It's one thing to say "Lance user" or "Mounted User" or something because there's a lot of them, but there's like 4 Armor units total, and there was all of one Focus Banner with them thus far, having a monthly quest that requires one is a dick move, so wouldn't shock me if that was them realizing their flub and this being the band-aid fix for it.
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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #220 on: March 14, 2017, 09:31:28 PM »
Yeah, with Draug I'll actually have four armour knights, hitting every colour, so I should be able to beat that quest which has nagged me since the start of the month.


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That's what tier lists basically already ARE, to be fair. <_< No disrespect meant to trying to rank heroes objectively based on their overall performance versus like, a random crop of units from Tenth Stratum or the Lunatic GBH battles/later story chapters, I find those maps very cool and would normally agree that that's the norm for any sort of evaluation! But specifically tier lists are catered towards the high-end competitive spectrum, which in this game is pretty much arena, and I personally find that the most interesting to evaluate even if, yes, it applies to a generally small portion of the game's content. Again though, since feathers mostly come from there it's still kind of an important thing to look at even for casual players.

The high-end PvP has its place, although notably that's not what Fire Emblem tier lists generally measure, and I question if it's what most FEH ones measure. Takumi is generally high on those lists and if you're going for the Absolute Highest Scores he's not considered that great. So clearly if they are focused on arena they aren't focused on the highest end of it. (More likely they're not focused on any one aspect at all, instead trying to reflect different things depending on the preferences of the individuals discussing/voting on them, much like we are. And honestly that's okay. Checking up on random tier discussion searches, I certainly see debate out there as to whether BST should be factored in or not, and if so, how much, so good to know we're not alone!)

Feathers certainly matter of course; I never implied they didn't! We all want feathers. Why do we want feathers? I can see too main reasons:

(a) You want to promote a favourite
(b) You want to make your team stronger for story fights/GHBs/you just like having a strong team, okay

Most notably feathers should not be used strictly for getting better arena scores arena because sinking 20k into a unit for arena purposes is a losing bet; you finish be a tier lower for 40 weeks in a row and still break even, and it's virtually unthinkable that one unit will make that big a difference anyway (especially with months of draws and potential meta shifts in between).

Now it's fine to promote Sharena because you think she'll be a good combat unit (and as you say, she is!) and that she will fit your team well, but if the point is "her BST will help me get more feathers" then you need to get off that hamster wheel. I realised this myself when I was considering promoting 4* Effie!

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Will again throw my acknowledgement that F Corrin looks great and is probably being underrated; even with Falchion weakness I think she wins 1v1 against them anyway, worth noting she 2HKOs Lucina and wins off of baiting for instance. She wishes Julia hadn't been introduced as a focus hero, though.

Yeah Julia is bad times for all that she's bad times for most blues (Sharena survives with single-digit HP, which don't get me wrong is better! but still a bad matchup, she can't take that + even a single hit from Lyn, for instance). The Falchion weakness is a concern but it just means that Corrin(/Nowi) vs. Falchion user are neutral and bloody affairs (both sides get Atk x 1.2). Honestly, weakness hits are worst when neutral, in many ways; you were losing WTD matchups anyway, and WTA matchups are still winnable, just neutral ones become clear losses and this is bad. Having run both Corrin and Tiki extensively, the dragon weakness is a substantially bigger issue for Tiki.

Beyond that, Corrin's def is high enough to mostly laugh at lance users in addition to her obvious advantages against red. Archers don't do well against her either (charge up her limit + get hit by Seal Res so you can more easily kill them before they get THEIR limit) so she kinda has that same sturdy feel that you describe. Only 12 other characters in the game equal her def and of those only one other is even within 5 speed of her (i.e. they all have to worry about doubles hitting their lower res). That character is Subaki, which is really freaking weird because Subaki is more or less the slowest pegasus knight in the series.


ps get on IRC when you have a chance, Laggy, I want to talk TF7 with you

Erwin Schrödinger will kill you like a cat in a box.
Maybe.

metroid composite

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #221 on: March 14, 2017, 09:33:01 PM »
CorrinF is currently A+ on the tier list, while Shareena is S; not that I always agree with the tier list, but it's worth looking into why.

Part of it I think is just dragon weaknesses.  Usually you look for your blue to counter Marth and Lucina, CorrinF often can't.  Part of it is the lower attack power (8 less).  CorrinF trades attacks for debuffs after hitting a target, which means you need a followup attack.  Usually in Arena you would rather just one-shot.  Her speed is one slower, which...does get her doubled by Linde, and means she can't double Takumi if she's +SPD or he's -SPD.  It's better to hit RES in general, but Shareena being my fastest unit can double and kill basically any high res low def mage, which is nice, cause my other characters eat counters.

I mean, CorrinF and Shareena are close in power level regardless, the game is fairly balanced.

RobinM is good, although was recently moved down a tier.  He's slow.  He literally can't beat at least one red sword lord 1v1 (Ryoma).  His base stat total is super low (like...same as Cecilia), which is fine when countering Takumi (also low BST), but suffers a little if you actually try to kill higher stat total red units.

Effie is good, but specialized.  One shots red sword lords, literally all of them.  No chance to counter even.  But has weaker matchups vs neutral and bad weapon triangle.

Nowie is the other bluenon the same tier as Effie/Shareena.  27 speed, but has all three of def, res, and distant counter.  Dragon, though, so has those weaknesses.

SnowFire

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #222 on: March 14, 2017, 09:37:06 PM »
So, random question: how does the game determine Dragon weakness?  Is it equipped weapon, or is it plot?  (i.e. do CorrinM / Sophia eat dragon weakness too?)

Also minorly whined about it already, but tsk tsk at giving Ninian an attack (and thus Dragon weakness...?).  They shoulda made her the ultimate buffer or the likes...  although granted, that's potentially a very centralizing role to have if her power level is high enough.  (I rolled up a Ninian, so definitely no need to grind up that Olivia now.)

Lord Ephraim

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #223 on: March 14, 2017, 09:51:22 PM »
If you use a dragonstone you are a dragon.  CorrinM and Sophia are not dragons.

Did another crate session for this banner and got Karel, Ninian and another (off banner) Tiki.  Tiki #1 is -HP/+Def, Tiki #2 is -HP/+Atk.  I really don't know which one is better.

Meiousei

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Re: Fire Emblem Heroes Topic: You knew this was coming!
« Reply #224 on: March 15, 2017, 01:39:36 AM »
I have been turned very salty right now by my rolls. got nothing but dupes this time and a -Atk Kagero and Tharja. It's the Sibling banner over again.


Meanwhile, I got Ursula to 5* because the Reinhardt I have is so stat f'd it's not even funny and because I actually liked her in FE7.  Next on my list is Male Corrin for getting to 5*