What Games Are You Playing: 2008

[Shale]

Honestly, just knowing the game's premise this doesn't surprise me at all. "Hey, you end up fighting the person you set out to fight at the beginning of the game." But in general? Yeah, see Zenny.

[Idun]

It's not even that. It's someone complaining about FFXII and then going "I guess I'll have to play WA4 instead argh the pain." Which is madness since, y'know, WA4 doesn't suck.

I suppose for further clarification: I never enjoyed any of the WA games. I didn't enjoy the battle system (though WA4's is fine), and I feel like regurgitating every time I read or hear some of the dialogue from that specific game because it's so  . . . sugar-coated. I don't know if it is perprtuated throughout the entire game, because the last time I attempted at playing WA4 was back in '07. I just passed the Calucion Pass. . . . went through that underwater pathway, pass the sky-like terrain and fought those monsters AND those puppet girls. The only scene that was good from that progression was Raquel being able to block that time shifter guy's attacks because Raquel is Raquel. Otherwise, all of the dialogue that involves much of the "main characters" I suppose is just gross.

As for Final Fantasy XII, I remember loving the game til I dropped at the beginning. I left no part of the map untouched, which means I was in a surplus of JP. Now, however, I didn't grind in the temple prior to returning back to Bur-Omisace [I was busy fighting zombies which give you lolnoexplol]. Voila, I have to fight a judge and I get my ass handed to me plenty o f times. Plenty. I mean, I truly tried 2 times, the other times I was chatting and such - but I'm underleveled. I figure I'll go ahead and do some Hunts, and I like doing them in the order that I acquire them and I got owned by some dragon. It's just frustrating. I want to progress through the storyline RIGHT NOW, but I can't. So I said fuck it, let's play a much more relax game in terms of grinding and get my mind off of FFXII. Taliewren's been complaining that I still haven't finished it, so I'm biting two bullets at a time~

[Strago]

Mother 3 - Just finished it. Rope Snake for Godlike. The rest of the game... was disappointing. Some developed thoughts later, maybe.

[Cmdr_King]

I can't imagine I've never said it before, but it's worth repeating that Wild ARMs plot, in every entry in the series, is and will always be pure, undiluted cheese.  They seem very aware they are more idealistic than small children and seem to take some joy in being as over the top and tropetastic about the process as they can.  ultimately it doesn't matter if you find merit in the underlying plot concepts and characters or not, if cheese isn't your thing you're best off just hitting mute and ignoring the screen preemptively (I don't... think the series has discovered Scene Skip yet.  Maybe WA5?  Beena while since I've played WA4 myself.)

That said, finding WA4 gameplay just okay while relishing every minute of FFXII gameplay... well, I think it's safe to say there's a great gap in our values, so just toss a Your Milage May Very here and carry on I guess.

[AAA]

Grand Theft Auto 4-I started this yesterday, but I wanted to wait until I had a better feel for how thing's go before I started talking about it. So far things have been very positive. This is probably the best attempt at building a living, immersive city in any videogame I've ever played. It's just a lot of fun to drive around and watch people. The TV shows, radio, cabaret performances, there's a ton of shit to look at and explore. I even caught a performance by a street preacher entirely on accident(but sadly failed to run him down).

The controls have taken a lot of time to adjust, though. Switching the car controls from the standard "X is gas, B is brake" type control scheme, along with the very different car physics, is still a bit of a challenge, but I'm getting used to it. I've only been in one gunfight so far, so I don't know anything about the new cover system, but targetting seems alright. Only done a few story missions so far, so the jury's still out on that. So far so good, though.

The best thing so far is getting Niko drunk during a date and then watching him ramble on about his girlfriend. Then trying to hail a cab.

[Anthony Edward Stark]

Mother 3 - Just finished it. Rope Snake for Godlike. The rest of the game... was disappointing. Some developed thoughts later, maybe.

Flint and the Rope Snake are the two best-written characters in the game. I do have to say, I found Chapter 1 to build my expectations up too far. It's really well-written and paced, in my opinion, and does a good job of developing Flint in particular.

It's like... EarthBound didn't really try, focused on other stuff, so I didn't care. Mother 3 built up my expectations and then never followed through.

[Grefter]

SO1 Remake - Oh yeah I forgot to say that if you like SO2 then you totally fucking need to buy this (Super I am talking at you specifically).  It keeps some of the dodgey things with SO1 recruitment and does require some ludicrous amounts of backtracking back and forth at the start, but it is thankfully about a hundred million times better by having an overworld map instead of the world being a series of interconnected labyrinths like SO1 is (For example I am up to the point where I flipped the game off last time and quit over it where you go like half way across the world and a ship crashes next to the starting village, so you have to go back there.  No seriously, fuck you game for that).

Anyway yeah it is still completely and totally broken like SO2, but if you really like SO2 that is kind of part of it ultimately.

[Sierra]

That said, finding WA4 gameplay just okay while relishing every minute of FFXII gameplay... well, I think it's safe to say there's a great gap in our values, so just toss a Your Milage May Very here and carry on I guess.

Because I'm lazy. Though I guess should add a helping of "Ahaha, FFXII plot" to the mix.

[Idun]

That said, finding WA4 gameplay just okay while relishing every minute of FFXII gameplay... well, I think it's safe to say there's a great gap in our values, so just toss a Your Milage May Very here and carry on I guess.

I didn't say I relished FFXII gameplay still, after the experiences I've recently had with it. To be honest, I liked it more than WA random encounters and moving on hexes; but each game has its own mechanic and to me, both games have facets to their system that are good.

But that said, both fail.

[DjinnAndTonic]

That said, finding WA4 gameplay just okay while relishing every minute of FFXII gameplay... well, I think it's safe to say there's a great gap in our values, so just toss a Your Milage May Very here and carry on I guess.

Because I'm lazy. Though I guess should add a helping of "Ahaha, FFXII plot" to the mix.

Eh, the actual plot of FF12 isn't too bad, really. It's certainly not 'fine literature' and parts of it are a little convoluted... but the narrative is pretty tight, with no gaping plotholes. The villains have understandable motives and the history of Ivalice is expanded upon. Overall, the actual sequence of events isn't too horrible. The biggest complaint I have with FF12's story is it's complete lack of characters. None of the playable characters really have anything to do with the plot, except Ashe, who's basically just a vehicle who forces you to watch the story unfold. The NPCs and villains, while not offensive, still aren't anything exciting really.

While I'm all for FF12 hate personally, hating a game's plot for simply being average seems pointless (it might even be slightly-above-average considering the stylish-ness of presentation?).

Not to mention how the game gives us such wonderful quotable phrases like "I'm Captain Basch von Rosenburg of Dalmasca!" and "Don't listen to Ondore's lies!". ...>.>;; Really, it's practically the next 'Fruely'...

-Djinn

[AndrewRogue]

My real question, I think, is why you are playing a game you seem to dislike... to replace a game you seem to dislike.

[Meeplelard]

I dunno; FF12 really shows how its an incomplete story.

Everything regarding Cid and the Occurria is just so forced.  Cid's a nobody character until you meet him then he's OMG BIG VILLAIN! ...who has 2 more scenes and then he's done.  And they force that Balthier connection too (I stand by its forced; yeah, he eludes to it earlier, but egads do they do nothing with it.  The actual conneciton felt pointless too; the whole "he's stuck in the scenario cause of it!" I don't buy since Balthier shows no signs of actually being trapped.)
(and note I purposely avoided mentioning what the actual connection is for spoiler purposes; being vague = good in these scenarios!)

I mean, the last dungeon (or rather, the 10 minute teaser leading to the final boss <.<) of the game really felt on par with the first quarter of the game (Eg where there was actual plot); suddenly Vayne's being a political threat (with Venat being forced in so he can pull ANOTHER SUPER FORM!  Really, though, going off what the plot was like, they could have just pulled something like ULTRA MANUFACTURED NETHICITE MODE! and avoided using a cliched plot failure like Venat), there's actual character interaction, Gabranth is IMPORTANT again, and by extension, Basch's role is restored (Basch really was somewhat important...just then FF12's plot went under the rug, and only Ashe mattered *sighs*), what have you; this ending part is actually well done, cause you know, it was the intended ending.  Just the stuff between the Leviathan blowing up, and the ending arc was clearly rushed together just cause they didn't know what direction to go in, firing the original writer and such, etc.

Really, pretty much everything, plotwise, after the Leviathan fails, barring Al-Cid.  Well, Cid himself isn't too bad, but his role is just so forced (he has good VA though)...pretty much like everything.

This is why FF12's plot kind of fails; it does a pretty good job early on, but then drops it and instead of trying to continue en route with how the game use to be going, they just delve into tropetastic elements to push the plot along.

[Xeroma]

FF12 is everlasting proof that you should never have a writer be a director.

Isn't that right, Niu?

[Hunter Sopko]

Didn't it have three different directors?

[Xeroma]

One of them was the plot writer, Yasumi Matsuno. I don't remember the specifics but he fucked stuff up bad and his mess had to be fixed by Akitoshi Kawazu[the SAGA DIRECTOR. Yeah.]. Niu knows this shit way better than I do though.

[Meeplelard]

From what I understand, he was taking way too long the way things were going, so they got rid him in order to speed things up.

[Niu]

Mastuno is being TOOOO ambitious and trying to squeeze EVERYTHING in. From his sub SaGa level battle mechanics to his entire Ivalice world view and his usual politic crack. The result? The game took what? 3 or 4 year and is no sight getting done. Consider the graphic and everything, to visualize the entire intended plot line is just.... It could be feasible if you use FFT like graphic and stuff, but this is FF12 for the love of god. Ultimately Kawazu is forced into the mess to clean it all up by cutting everything he can cut.

Thus, Van and Panello wave good by to their characterization. The gathering of the Judges also goes poof. Drace gets drop off when she only appear to times. All the Ocurria back plot gets thrown out, which then hurts Cid's character dramatically as well. The politic crack got removed as well, so El-Cid suddenly become useless. And Vayne.... end up as Dycedarg Mk.2, when his relationship with his father and brothers really isn't the way it is presented in game.

How ironic that of all people that Kawazu is the one put in charge to cut everything.... When Kawazu himself having problem with literally every SaGa in that he couldn't squeeze everything in.....

VPDS- Gelm..... has too much hp, really, this is not funny, especially how abusive her MTs are due to the system restriction. And couldn't spam support spells as much made the fight even more atrocious.
Anyway, Seraphic Gate is unlocked after seeing all three endings. The parody is just too fun, and take multiple cycle to see them all.

BTW, the path split goes like this.
Ch.2 change depends which city you choose at start.
Now, if you use no feather at all in ch.2, you are in to good end route. Use feather once and you go into normal route, use twice and head for bad end route.
Each route has their own separate chapters from ch.3 to last boss.
To see all chapters, you stay in the route in head into in ch.3 and don't switch out.
Using feather in good end route well drop you into normal route by next chapter, and drop you into bad end route in next chapter if you are in normal route.
So make up your mind from the start and stick to one route after you got in.

[Hunter Sopko]

Was the original intended plot at least interesting and/or good? Is there a place where they posted the entire original story?

[Idun]

My real question, I think, is why you are playing a game you seem to dislike... to replace a game you seem to dislike.

That is the best question asked yet. It seems like it's one of my games I'm more than 50% finished with, and I keep being told to finish it. So I might as well. It's an easy game. The other possibilities were Grandia III, SOTeOT, and some others I can't remember which I'm also almost done with but it would take a second to get used to the battle mechanics again.

[Grefter]

SO1 Remake - So I got Mavelle and Ronyx as he is being called now.  And I have full access to item creation equipment so the game is going to die right about now.

Edit - I just wish the game was already documented enough to have a Customisation FAQ as good and fully worked out as Krutststers is for SO2.  Quick examination shows things are working roughly the same as SO2, the seeming complete inability for like half the cast to learn Originality is bothersome, bypassable with Orchestra, but it puts a damper on significant testing because of annoying menu shuffling.

[Sierra]

While I'm all for FF12 hate personally, hating a game's plot for simply being average seems pointless (it might even be slightly-above-average considering the stylish-ness of presentation?).

It's not that it's average. It's that it's totally absent for long stretches of the game. FFXII clearly wanted to have an epic plot, but the actual game got in the way. But this has mostly been covered by now. I'd contest the game having much going for it in terms of style. I wasn't really impressed in this regard.

Not to mention how the game gives us such wonderful quotable phrases like "I'm Captain Basch von Rosenburg of Dalmasca!" and "Don't listen to Ondore's lies!". ...>.>;; Really, it's practically the next 'Fruely'...

Sure, but connecting "Basch lives!" and the plot to support the latter is just silly. Do people hype Lufia 2 plot just because it gave us "You little hoochies?"

[Grefter]

People hype FF4 for Spoony bard and FF6 for fucking Kefka lines which are about as funny as a piece of ply wood.

A budding young male stripper declaring themselves to be a 35 year old war veteran and having people even contemplate the possibility that he is not the Ondor that he speaks of as having lies is actually worth noting against that competition.  Not that I am going to defend FF12 plot.  I still consider the opening a pointless load of drivel.  Misdirection and misleading plot setup is all well and good when it has a goddamned point, which the opening doesn't other than going OMG EPIC PLOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Anthony Edward Stark]

I hype FF6 for not making me sit through anything more than the most basic of character exposition if I don't want to, KotOR2 style.

[Grefter]

FF6 does of course have its points as a game and even at its plot.  Quotable lines about submariners and self help books are not those points however and chances are that is the thing you are going to get hyped at about on the internet instead of you know, praising a 16-bit game for approaching things like suicide, extreme isolation and death of a paternal figure all in a single sequence which actively forces the player to fight against the almost inevitable sequence.

[Xeroma]

SO1 Remake - So I got Mavelle and Ronyx as he is being called now.  And I have full access to item creation equipment so the game is going to die right about now.

Edit - I just wish the game was already documented enough to have a Customisation FAQ as good and fully worked out as Krutststers is for SO2.  Quick examination shows things are working roughly the same as SO2, the seeming complete inability for like half the cast to learn Originality is bothersome, bypassable with Orchestra, but it puts a damper on significant testing because of annoying menu shuffling.

I didn't even use a FAQ for 90% of it and I got weapons with 700+ power right around then. <_<