Author Topic: Books  (Read 173708 times)

Grefter

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Re: Books
« Reply #50 on: February 29, 2008, 09:54:22 PM »
It also works pretty well like that because Pratchett has described Discworld Death as just one of many Deaths and whatnot.  And the Discworld being a mirror of the "real" world in so many different obvious ways (both plot and well literary stuff) it would make sense for them to be similar.
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Twilkitri

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Re: Books
« Reply #51 on: March 02, 2008, 11:37:59 AM »
The Sum of All Fears - I forgot about the freakish number of coincidences that happen in Clancy. If that doesn't bother you though it's pretty good. So many people that die off just for the sake of dying off (For example, there's some guy that, if he had been in the story earlier he was so minor I don't remember him, dies in a car crash nearish the end. And then some other guy wonders why he hasn't shown up yet a little later. And that's the extent of his involvement in the story.) Again this depends on whether that bothers you or not. In any case I found it pretty engrossing. Albiet somewhat depressing because I can imagine some of the political side of things happening in the real world.

I started to read Clancy several years ago, but stopped for some reason... I should start back up.

OblivionKnight

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Re: Books
« Reply #52 on: March 03, 2008, 04:38:17 AM »
Been on a reading/movie binge recently.  Figured I'd start here first, but just one book.  Granted, this book is awesome.

World War Z, by Max Brooks. 

This is the same guy who wrote the humorous Zombie Survival Guide.  However, this isn't a joke book - Brooks outlines an actual zombie apocalypse (theoretical, of course), and fills it with loads of social commentary and a unique perspective that really illustrates an understanding of multiple cultures, ideals and mechanics of the world at large.  The book is written as a collection of interviews of survivors of the war, giving a good perspective of the world's reactions to a world-wide zombie outbreak.  It's...a great social commentary and an excellent read either way.  Great if you like social commentaries, zombie books, post-apocalyptic novels, etc.  Really a good book I'd suggest to anyone looking for something good to read.  I'm thinking I'll be reading it again soon.  Just really good.
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

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[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

Lady Door

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Re: Books
« Reply #53 on: March 03, 2008, 05:55:52 AM »
Good Omens- Everything about this is awesome.  Read, minions.

You know what? If you could get Andrew to do this, PLEASE DO. I've been singing the praises of that book to him for about six years now, and I bought it for him, and you'd think because I'm his girlfriend he might take a hint, but he still hasn't read it.

... then again, I'm a Gaiman fangirl. See my name here and all.

I've been reading Gone with the Wind. I'm named after one of the characters, and it was one of my mom's favorite books and movies ever, so she bought it for me for Christmas and said, "Here. Read." So I have been, though it's slow going thanks to the class reading that's getting in my way. I'm rather enjoying it, which is surprising me a little. Not my usual fare. Only about 1/2 way through -- will decide fully when it's over.


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Grefter

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Re: Books
« Reply #54 on: March 03, 2008, 08:01:37 AM »
How can someone as angsty and Andrew not have read Sandman?

Find a chair.  Beat him with it until he reads it.
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Captain K.

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Re: Books
« Reply #55 on: March 07, 2008, 07:47:33 PM »
Dead to Me by Anton Strout:  Basically it's Men in Black with the supernatural instead of aliens.  Non-original concept aside, it's a good read and rather witty.

Angelmass by Timothy Zahn:  Not bad, but Zahn couldn't keep a consistent time period for the story.  It's supposed to be very far in the future, but he keeps throwing in anachronistic modern-day phrases that throw off the mood.

Dragons of the Dwarven Depths and Dragons of the Highlord Skies by Weis and Hickman:  Typical Dragonlance - you either like it or you don't by now.  I do wish they wouldn't make the fucking kender the focal point of EVERY SINGLE BOOK.

Grefter

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Re: Books
« Reply #56 on: March 07, 2008, 10:03:35 PM »
Angelmass by Timothy Zahn:  Not bad, but Zahn couldn't keep a consistent time period for the story.  It's supposed to be very far in the future, but he keeps throwing in anachronistic modern-day phrases that throw off the mood.


Read Armageddon the Musical by Robert Rankin for a Dalai Lama who makes fun of this very trope (while being the Anti Christ who runs the worlds most successful television station).
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The king perfect of the DL is and always will be Excal. - Superaielman
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Fudozukushi

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Re: Books
« Reply #57 on: March 08, 2008, 12:30:07 AM »

Dragons of the Dwarven Depths and Dragons of the Highlord Skies by Weis and Hickman:  Typical Dragonlance - you either like it or you don't by now.  I do wish they wouldn't make the fucking kender the focal point of EVERY SINGLE BOOK.


Again?  Good dammit, this is too much.

AAA

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Re: Books
« Reply #58 on: March 11, 2008, 06:12:46 PM »
So I finally read all the WoT books. Crossroads of Twilight was shit, Knife of Dreams was pretty good though. Jordan's habit of just shoving import plot events just into the middle of a paragraph like it's no big deal amuses me. Really wish he didn't have such a thing for Elayne though. "Oh hey Elayne's bitchy because of pregnancy as opposed to just being a bitch anyway that's really fucking fascinazzzzzzzzzzzzz".

It was a good read, though. Hope book 12 is as good.
Don't think of it as a novel. Think of it as a chance to retroactively win every argument you have ever walked away from.

Bouke

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Re: Books
« Reply #59 on: March 11, 2008, 09:19:00 PM »
Gave up on WOT many moons ago. Book 9 was the lastest one back then. Too bad he died though.
I fear for George R. R. Martin's health also.

Currently reading;

-Leo Tolstoj : Anna Karenina
-Ludovico Aristo : Orlando Furioso 2nd part (Canto 26)
-Bible (Old Testament, right after Jozua)

Just finished;

-Lots of Oscar Wilde (notably Importance Of Being Ernest, Dorian Gray, House Of pomegranades collection and pretty much all the rest of his short stories,)
-Marcel Proust A la recherche du temps perdu; first four books (next up; The Captive & The Fugitive)
-Boethius: Consolation of philosophy
-Orlando Furioso 1st part (D'uh)
-Dostoyevski: Crime & Punishment

And a bunch of graphic novels including Watchmen, V, Sin City, Dark Knight Returns & Strikes Again, Sandman and the first 8 volumes of Cerebus. Yay.

Shale

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Re: Books
« Reply #60 on: March 11, 2008, 10:26:22 PM »
Finished Global Frequency. Kicks ass, there needs to be more. First volume had better villains than the second, and the climax went a bit too far over the top for my taste, but eh, nitpicking. Solid pacing and stories, lots of good art, plus the general novelty of an anthology-style comic series are all appreciated. Even more bitter the TV show died now. Ah well, at least there's other Warren Ellis stuff out there to get. I should start Transmetropolitan sometime, I've already heard all the good stuff about it and knowing the writer is quality gives me another reason to shell out.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2008, 01:05:17 AM by Shale »
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BaconForTheSoul

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Re: Books
« Reply #61 on: March 24, 2008, 07:38:24 PM »
Running with Demons, Knight of the Word, Angel Fire East. (Brooks)

Reread all 3 of these this weekend since I'd forgotten a lot of details.  Still pure win, and now that I know it leads into his newest Shannahra series I may have to start reading those too.

Nothing really stood out with any of these 3 books, but they were just all around solid, lacking and real flaws.

superaielman

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Re: Books
« Reply #62 on: March 26, 2008, 02:59:13 AM »
In the presence of mine enemies- Great standalone novel by Turtledove. The story itself isn't so breathtaking, it's the setting- it's 2010 and set in the heart of Berlin in a world where the Nazis win WW2. The story's centered around the few surviving jews and how they handle living in a country that thinks it's killed every one of them decades ago.

Just a very good character work- Alicia and her father are both good, as are the bit characters. 

I think Guns of the south is better (Far more compelling, and frankly less depressing than a Nazi controlled world) But this book is very much worth reading anyway.
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OblivionKnight

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Re: Books
« Reply #63 on: March 30, 2008, 03:11:00 AM »
Speaking of Turtledove...

SPOILERS WILL BE IN HERE!!!

Super had been kicking me into reading him years ago.  Hadn't had time until recently.  Damn sad I hadn't done it before - he is excellent.  I just finished reading the first 2 novels in the Worldwar series, In the Balance (ItB) and Tilting the Balance (TtB).  First thing I have to say?

TURTLEDOVE.  KNOWS.  HIS.  SHIT.

The thing that's impressed me most so far is that he knows everything, down to the little tiny bits of information that you wouldn't expect someone to pay attention to in an alternate history novel, but him doing so makes it so much better.  Case in point, he makes special note of the German Panther Ds in TtB - great tanks, but they had major fuel issues, as well as some other problems.  Not until the Panther G did the Germans have what could be considered the ultimate tank of the war, with all the problems of the other Panthers (A and D primarily) finally being fixed.  He's also good to mention how the Germans won with their armour - the Panzer I's and II's that conquered Poland and France won not because of being superior to their competition (well, in Poland's case, their competition were horses, but details), but through superior tactics.  Hell, he even mentions the T-34 and KV-1, and draws comparisons between the Lizards and the Russians in frighteningly good detail - even with better equipment, the Russians couldn't fight the Germans properly with their airpower and tactics.  Hell, he's good to mention how radar and cracking the Enigma won the Battle of Britain moreso than anything else.  This guy knows his shit, and I am impressed.

He also is able to extend this to the characters.  I wasn't expecting him to make Molotov such a major player, or Groves for that matter.  Hell, I wasn't expecting him to even put Hitler or Roosevelt in - those are two people very, very hard to portray properly in any media, but he does it, and he does it well.  Hell, Skorzeny is probably the one I've been most impressed with - he's captured nearly perfectly as the bastard he is, and smart as that.  He plays along with everyone else, particularly Jaeger, amazingly well.  Molotov is also fantastic - his first appearance aboard the Fleetlord's ship was...so perfectly Molotovian. 

In addition, he's great at drawing parallels between real world experiences, and making things work in the timeline.  By this, I mean that he's not just making up a new timeline - the things that happen are following a logical progression.  There's none of this doomsday weapon shit at the last minute - everything that's happening is happening around the same time it would in the real world timeline, just somewhat inverted.  Example?  The Russians are the first to develop nukes, around 1944, due to acquiring more atomic material from a raid on a downed Lizard ship than any other nation, and having a headstart on it all.  However, they have one, and due to their craptastic infrastructure and lack of good facilities to produce more, they look like they're stuck for a while.  Guess what issues the Russians had/have in real life?  In another example, Jet power is developing a little earlier, but still around the same level it normally would - it's not like the Meteor or the ME262 is on par with the Lizard fighters yet.  It's nice that the Lizard technology isn't giving humanity some insane, immediate advantage - the Germans capture a tank, but don't know what to do with it, beyond the basic levels of improving armour.  Same with the British capturing a Lizard fighter plane.  Humanity is advancing at the normal rate it can, aided a little bit by the captured technology, but it's not like they've now gained the ability to build the Death Star or something.  That would ruin this.  Turtledove does a great job of keeping things believable, which helps the alternate history style he's going on.  The Lizard technology is perfectly believeable - we have all of it now, just not to the extent the Lizards do. 

It's also filled with some great themes so far.  These include: adversity as an advantage, sex, racial tension, sex, adaptability, sex, coming to terms with trauma, and sex.  Did I mention sex?  Everyone seems to be having it right now >_>  Which is actually relevant!  The differences between the Lizards and the Humans are entirely cultural and biological - technology is similar, but the Lizards are slower, more careful, while Humanity is far more adaptable and changing.  Sex helps to portray this - the Lizards are fascinated by it, since this doesn't happen to them except during breeding periods.  The contrast between the two species is great.  It seems crazy, an alien invasion during World War II, but it's not unbelievable - if they came pulling in X-Wings and Star Destroyers, and humanity still was fighting back, then I might be a liiiiiiitle skeptical. 

It's great to see that he also has to pit humanity against humanity at points - the Poles and Jews siding with the Lizards sounds despicable, but...well, I'm sure I don't have to tell people why they might do this.  It's a moral dilemma, and it's handled well.

Turtledove is also great at pointing out the ingenuity of humanity.  Pissing into a Lizard sensor is golden (lol punz!).

Also, I love his writing.  Such winning lines:

"Teerts wished the Race would drop a plutonium bomb on on Hiroshima.  But what were the odds of that?"

Are gold.  I've laughed more than I thought I would while reading these books - these lines are golden.  Really looking forward to the rest of the series.

Characters thus far!  Ignoring the real life ones, who have been handled amazingly well so far.

Bagnell and RAF crew - Didn't do much in the first book until they got shot down in Germany.  Then we got to see them come to terms with accepting an enemy as an ally, and getting back up in the air.  Then, when we get to book 2, they get stuck with the Russians and the Germans mediating a hellish conflict between the two, a disasterous offensive against a well-guarded outpost, and then they have to piece together the resistance to the Lizards.  This looks like more developing later.

Goldfarb - Similar to the above, he's a radar operator, who stages the rescue of his cousin from a prison.  Otherwise, pretty normal overall.  The Brits are pretty normal, overall >_>  However, they are exceedingly funny - their wit is fantastically written, and they strike me as overall the best comedic characters so far.

Yi Min - Hahahahahaha!  You got what was coming to you, asshole.  Hahahahahahahaha!!!  Fucktard drug-dealer killed by a drug-addicted alien.  Perfect!

Ludmilla - Female Soviet pilot, and a great character.  Her relationship with Jaeger is fantastic, and it really helps punt home the fact that this war is humanity against alien - I like this relationship, and really hope it continues to grow.  She's fearless, great with words, and very thoughtful.  Love her.

Jaeger - The other half of the relationship, and one of my favourites here.  The German perspective and the Soviet perspective are excellent.  Jaeger really exemplifies the basic combat soldier (while the Brits exemplify the air warrior, and Ludmilla, for all that she is a pilot, exemplifies duty and commitment to cause more than any particular soldier designation), and is amazingly smart and well-written.  He's very open in what he says, and is a great, great, amazingly great counterpart for Skorzeny.  Just the chemistry with the two is fantastic.

Shultz - He's either providing more Jaeger, or a foil for Ludmilla and her NKVD policeman Sholudenko.  He's the stereotypical German soldier - womanizing, haughty, but fantastically loyal and dutiful, not afraid to speak his mind and not afraid of death, even in enemy-held territory.

Jens Larssen - Poor fucking Jens.  Nearly killed, then his wife marries another man and has his baby because she thinks he's dead, then she decides to foget him, then his research team abandons him, then he gets VD from someone who shows him some kindness and affection.  Holy shit, this guy gets kicked in the balls.  But you know what?  I hope to hell he doesn't sell humanity out to the Lizards, but I can understand it.  Pedaling alone on a bicycle across the entire country, with nothing anymore?  It's what war will do to you.

Russie - It wouldn't be WWII without a Jewish perspective.  Leading his people to the Lizards to escape the Nazi extermination, he made a tough as hell choice for his people.  Honestly, I don't blame him - who would care about humanity after what the Nazis did?  However, he comes to fight back, when he realizes the Lizards intend to do the same thing for the world, and he saves the day with great propaganda and fabulous Talmudic reasoning.  Great.       

Mutt - Can't forget the other foot-soldier of the war.  Manager of a baseball team is promoted to Lieutenant, woos a lesbian almost to the point of breaking her.  I like his perspective as the addled veteran.  His book 2 conclusion, crying over the lesbian nurse, is...interesting.  Not sure how I feel yet.   

Yeager/Barbara - Poor Jens.  His wife leaves him for a minor league baseball player.  I can't help but feel some personal slight against Barbar, and feel empathy for Jens, though I can see what she was thinking.  Her decision to stay with Yeager made sense, but damned if I don't think anyone on any side handled it well at all.  It's hard to separate these two from Jens, but I think that's the point - thse two are designed specifically to provide that contrast of war - what happens when the soldier (or scientist) returns home to what he thought he had, and finds he had nothing?  Plus, there's finding happiness after what you once had was lost.  It's a give-take thing here, a great contrast between the two, for all that...well, POOR JENS.

Liu Han/Fiore - Poor dead Fiore.  Was not expecting him to die.  And it seems like Liu is poised to be a founding mother of Communism in China.  An experiment in human experimentation, it's interesting to see how her little Chinese World eventually expans with the help of the "foreign devil", and how it still stays once it's cut off.  Interested to see what happens to her child.

Atvar - To quote him at the end of Book 2: "I don't know"  This guy is going to get shit at the start of the next book, I can see that.  Being commander in chief can't be fun.

Teerts - Perfect portrayal of Japanese torture and prisoner treatment.  Ugh.  I feel sad for the guy, despite him trying to bomb humanity into the ground.  Why did it have to be the Japanese? 

Drefsab - I really wished he lived longer - the Skorzeny rivalry would have been neat to see expand further, watching as the Lizard became more human-like to beat his crafty opponent.  He really did get better, and seemed to have control of his drug addiction.  It just goes to show you not to shoot up in the middle of a fire-fight. 

Ussmak - My favourite of the Lizards.  His perspective is like that of Jaeger's - he's a tank driver, except he is the most human of the Lizards.  His crewmembers die, he becomes alone, gets addicted to a drug, goes through hell with a new crew who get killed due to stupidity, gets caught up in a crew that does drugs and causes them to get mauled by the Germans under Jaeger, and then finally fixes himself, and things seem right, with a new crew that he trusts and works with.  I love this - he's adapting to the problems that are kicking him in the ass, and kicking back. 

Favourites so far are Jaeger, Ludmilla and Ussmak.  Of the real-lifeys, Molotov, Skorzeny and Groves.

Favourite scenes?  Oh, there are some great ones, top 3 or so, no particular order:

1) Molotov talking to Atvar in space.  To paraphrase:
ATVAR: Our Emperor shall rule over your planet.
MOLOTOV: Emperor?  Oh yes, we had one at one point.  About 20 years ago, we killed him and his entire family.  I helped. 
ATVAR: ...

The sheer funny factor of that is how straight-forward Molotov was in saying it.  And how crazily the entire Lizard group reacted to it.

2) Russie deciding to help the Lizards when he sees German soldiers pissing on a Jewish Grave.  Damn strong scene there - he got his sign from Heaven, alright.

3) The end of book 2, which I summarized with Atvar's character.  "I don't know"  Humanity develops nukes, and now both sides are at a deadly standstill.  Great way to end the book.

Looking forward to starting the next book tomorrow, Upsetting the Balance, assuming I have time at work.
[11:53] <+Meeple_Gorath> me reading, that's a good one

[19:26] * +Terra_Condor looks up. Star Wars Football, what?
[19:27] <+Terra_Condor> Han Kicks First?
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Vader intercepts.
[19:27] <%Grefter-game> Touchdown and Alderaan explodes in the victory

superaielman

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Re: Books
« Reply #64 on: March 31, 2008, 02:40:28 AM »
Ludmillia is based on part of a real person IIRC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyudmila_Pavlichenko
« Last Edit: March 31, 2008, 02:44:27 AM by superaielman »
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NotMiki

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Re: Books
« Reply #65 on: March 31, 2008, 04:09:15 AM »
Read the 2 Twelve Kingdoms books currently out, 'Sea of Shadow' and 'Sea of Wind'.  Good stuff, and well translated (they don't shy away from throwing in all the requisite Chinese characters, people's modes of speech reflect their class/origin, and the technical language stuff, really integral to understanding the world, is as it should be).

*Spoilers*

Differences between the anime are large, notably that Yoko's classmates never go back with her (and barely exist as characters), and the king of Kou never appears or dies (though it's implied he's going to die of the sitsudou disease).

2nd book is almost exactly the same as the anime, but without reference to Taiki and his king mysteriously disappearing.

Broadly, I agree with the changes they made for the anime version, jazzing up the story with Kou's appearance and Yoko's time as a peformer (and making Rakushun more transcendantly awesome), but they really coulda skipped dragging her classmates along, frankly.

Hope the series garners enough interest for continued translation; the third story arc in particular watches like something that would be better off as words on a page.
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Dhyerwolf

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Re: Books
« Reply #66 on: April 06, 2008, 12:20:13 AM »
Brandon Sanderson- Elantis. Excellent book and very captivating! He now definetely feels like an excellent choice to ghostwrite the final WoT book. Shame this appears to be a standalone book, because it leaves enough room open for a sequel. Oh well, his second Mistborn book should be in paperback relatively soon.
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Dunefar

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Re: Books
« Reply #67 on: April 06, 2008, 01:15:42 AM »
I've been on a history/alt history kick lately.

In the Presence of Mine Enemies:

It's okay. It's a 'what if the Nazis won WW2, managed to stay together and not succumb to corruption, then take over the rest of the world?' sort of affair in the early 21st century. It focuses on a group of hidden Jews living in Berlin undercover.  Anyway, it's okay. The characters are decent to passable, though the plot's far too much like the fall of the Soviet Union to get anything but eyerolls from me. At heart it's a slightly twisted retelling of the end of the Soviet Union with a different nationality skin over it.

It's great if you wanna go moon eyed over Nazis, I guess.

10 Ways Hitler could've won WW2.

Eh. It's a collection of short stories and essays on how Hitler could've triumphed. They're a mixed bag - a few are good, some are mediocre, and a couple are hokey and farfetched. I can buy an attempt at Sealion(Even if it's going to collapse in a few days, unbenowst to England) getting a new Parliament and a peace deal. I can buy the Soviets making a bigger cock up of the early war and collapsing. But Hitler becoming some sort of brilliant naval officer, making a big navy(While the powers did nothing, and like hell they're going to ignore that, the Washington Naval Treaty be damned. It's not like the Germans were the only ones capable of ignoring it.), and somehow, even with the resources a navy would take, still having the exact same land triumphs? :psyduck:.

It's good light reading, though if you know your stuff a few of the stories will give you a headache.
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Hunter Sopko

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Re: Books
« Reply #68 on: April 06, 2008, 01:45:19 AM »
For more like that, try The Hitler Options. It's a much more analytical collection of essays on the subject. I read it a long time ago though. I should reread, since long stints at work are stretching my reading material thin. From what I remember though, they're more general What-Ifs (What if D-Day had been thwarted, what if Hitler had bypassed Stalingrad instead of sending troops to the grinder, etc).

Dunefar

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Re: Books
« Reply #69 on: April 06, 2008, 01:51:51 AM »
For more like that, try The Hitler Options. It's a much more analytical collection of essays on the subject. I read it a long time ago though. I should reread, since long stints at work are stretching my reading material thin. From what I remember though, they're more general What-Ifs (What if D-Day had been thwarted, what if Hitler had bypassed Stalingrad instead of sending troops to the grinder, etc).

I haven't read that particular book, but I'm familiar with the themes. It's interesting about them, since most WW2 What-Ifs end with the Nazis still beaten. Hitler making a two front war was an act of mammoth madness. Germany might've been able to eventually beat just the Allies at the start of WW2(Barring the US.). Germany might've been able to beat the Soviets by themselves or get them to collapse. The problem is that most of them don't really change much in the end. No Stalingrad? The strained lines mean that the Germans collapse in the Caucauses if they go that way or just run out of men. Stop D-Day? The allies simply try again with a bigger punch, or even at best, fail and all of Europe turns red. You really need a Germany fights perfectly scenario to win against all the enemies it had along with a lot of luck.

Granted, WW2 up to the Fall of France was damn near that. If England had bowed out of the war then, they might've pulled it off. Maybe. Otherwise, there's too much industry and manpower lined up agaisnt the Germans once the USA and the Soviets are involved.
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Re: Books
« Reply #70 on: April 06, 2008, 07:03:44 PM »
Speaking of Turtledove!

Opening Atlantis: Very solid stuff. Stories from the colonial age as Britain, France and Spain expand onto the eighth continent, Atlantis (nothing mystical about it, that's just what the settlers named the place). Not too weighty yet, but the stories are good and the history is suitably alternate - one weakness of his more recent work, I've thought, is following actual events too closely, and this doesn't. It's also cool to see how the political side of things shakes out differently as a result of the first colonists being merchant fishermen with no government officials along for the ride.
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Re: Books
« Reply #71 on: April 11, 2008, 08:58:14 AM »
The Great Hunt:  Siuan Sanche is the Amyrillin?  Oh snap!  Damn your spoilers, New Spring!

Beginning was decent, the bulk of the middle largely sucked, and the ending was good.  Selene and Lilandrin were so fake that I wanted to beat the protagonists with the obvious stick.

Maximum Ride - the Angel Experiment:  Characters were good, the writing wasn't.  He aimed below his target audience's intelligence level.

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Re: Books
« Reply #72 on: April 14, 2008, 08:43:41 AM »
Green Mars - Finally picked this back up.  It is still some of the best work I have ever read.  Ann Clayborn chapters are just wow.  They are so emotionally intense.  Finally got onto the Sax Russell chapters so they are more upbeat and one of characters I consider an ideal (especially after the first half of Red Mars where the characters have aged and are no longer broadly brushed archetypes, which technically they are built up as in at the start as a way to build up lot of characters fast, being the way people do tend to see each other at first and ending up being a way to break up those archetypes by making them split off from each other.  Oh gods I could go on about the awesome literary methods used throughout this series for a very long time.) but yeah they will be a bit less emotionally involving. 

I probably would have said before rereading them that Sax was my favourite character but man, Ann is giving up a really good fight in the reread now that I am older and have a much greater appreciation for literature.  She is angsty like all true art is, but soooooooo sympathetic.  She is completely and totally broken as a person it is fantastic.

If you haven't read them before, read Red Mars, Green Mars and Blue Mars by Kim Stanley Robinson dammit.  If you have read it when you were younger like I did?  Do it again, the books are fucking amazing.

Edit - No Sax wins.  He is just... Sax Russell.  Just so completely and totally unadulterated awesome.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2008, 03:18:29 PM by Grefter »
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Re: Books
« Reply #73 on: April 14, 2008, 04:21:26 PM »
The Great Hunt:  Siuan Sanche is the Amyrillin?  Oh snap!  Damn your spoilers, New Spring!

Beginning was decent, the bulk of the middle largely sucked, and the ending was good.  Selene and Lilandrin were so fake that I wanted to beat the protagonists with the obvious stick.

Have to disagree, I thought the parts where Rand was in Cairhein were some of the best parts of the book. The dinner party at Barthanes was especially ownin in general. And yeah, Selene wasn't meant to hold up to any serious thought from the reader, which was the point. Rand is still very, very green, and Hurin/Loial are basically nonentities there.
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Re: Books
« Reply #74 on: April 19, 2008, 05:34:05 PM »
G11 series (Mistaken Identity, Planetfall, Colony).  Surprisingly very good.  My thought process, though, was:

"You can't report on that in the Books topic--that's like talking about fanfiction or something."
"But it's been published into three books."
"Okay sure, but it still has traces of its internet fiction origins."
"Such as?"
"It has sexual content!"
"Less than the Song of Fire and Ice series, to be perfectly honest, and that's probably the most talked about series in these topics."
"Well...the pacing could be improved."
"The pacing was ultimately fine, seeing as I lost a lot of sleep reading it, and it actually distrated me away from both TF2 and WAXF."
"The editing could be better--it has the occasional grammatical error."
"True, and that's the biggest strike against it, but so does Eve Zaremba's White Noise, and I reported on that book--small-scale publishers don't find 100% of grammatical errors."
"What about the non-grammar typos?  What about the mathematical inconsistencies in the story?"
"Pfft, even the best edititng ever doesn't always save you from those.  Look at Harry Potter--Dudley got a Playstation before it was released, and the population of Hogwarts doesn't add up."

Anyhow, surprisingly good series.  Best books I've read since...well okay, the last book I read before this was a rereading of Ender's Game, which doesn't seem like a fair comparison (although hmm...I guess it doesn't do as much with subtle emotional situations as the G11 books).  Actually they have a lot of parallels now that I think of it--kids trapped on a space station being manipulated by an authority figure.  The big contrast is that Ender's game takes a very masculine perspective (battle room, etc), whereas G11 takes a very feminine perspective (interesting/awkward emotional situations).  Granted, another way they differ is that G11 was clearly designed as a trillogy (with interesting cliffhangers at the end of books 1 and 2) whereas Ender's Game was not.  Hmm...additionally, Ender is an all-round genius, whereas Steve is...rather specialized.  One thing the book did reasonably well for me is to draw me into the perspective of someone who rather fails at Science (in a Science Fiction setting, no less).  The author drops just enough scientific terms to help you visualize the setting, then has the main character's attention drift away from the conversation.

Overall, probably ranks in my top 5 book series, and is something I do plan to reread, if only to go back and pay more attention to various characters at the start of the series.