Author Topic: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)  (Read 43990 times)

Rozalia

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #25 on: July 06, 2009, 05:39:24 PM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon - Random Zombie man who does nothing but get battered by Cecil. 2
Cagnazzo - I'm going out on a limb here and give him a 7 for actually doing quite a lot unlike his fellow fiends. Has several towns attacked, has Cecil kicked out of the city, Kills two party members, corrupts several soldiers to further do his bidding and kills the King of Baron.
Valvalis - Does nothing. 2
Rubicant - Has two good scenes and overall the best of the four fiends personality wise as the others mostly don't have one. 5.
Golbez - 6. All 6 points for being smart enough to place a trap door in front of the crystals.
Baigan - He amused me strangly as Baigan actually thought he, a crummy little guardsman could stand up to an elite dark knight in combat. Gets a 5
Zemus/Zeromus. One of the few things I'd give a 1

superaielman

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #26 on: July 06, 2009, 05:52:01 PM »

Final Fantasy 4:

Milon: DNR
Cagnazzo: DNR
Valvalis: DNR- First three fiends just exist to be major plot bosses.
Rubicant- 6/10. Worked for what he was.
Golbez- 6/10.
Baigan- DNR
Zemus/Zeromus. 1/10. Yeah, completely unneeded.

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death- 1/10. Tree. Fails.
Gilgamesh- Don't remember him.

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka- 3/10. Ugh.
Gestahl- 5/10
Ultros-4/10. Few good lines, but generally was annoying.
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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #27 on: July 06, 2009, 05:53:10 PM »
Sure, will actually do this group.

Final Fantasy 4:

Milon - 3/10. Eh.
Cagnazzo - 4/10. Bishu bishu dokode~
Valvalis - 4/10. Is Nitori but less evil.
Rubicant - 8/10. He was... surprisingly interesting.
Golbez - 1/10. No.
Baigan - 2/10. No+.
Zemus/Zeromus. - 1/10. Space flea.

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death - 5/10. See Tonfa.
Gilgamesh - 9/10. See Tonfa.

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka - 7/10. Quirky/snappy/cruel. Works.
Gestahl - 4/10. Eh. Even my first time through I felt Gestahl was kinda ineffectual.
Ultros - 7/10. Good lines ingame, but this is one character the DL's probably soured me on badly.

Random Consonant

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #28 on: July 06, 2009, 05:58:22 PM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon - Was there.  1/10
Cagnazzo - Actually did some stuff, but was otherwise there.  2/10
Valvalis - Was there.  1/10
Rubicant - Actually stood out!  Not sure how many villanious figures were actually honorable in the genre at the time, but hey, it was at least somewhat interesting at the time.  4/10
Golbez - Lamer with a lame plot twist.  2/10
Baigan - Screw you Baigan you don't even deserve a rating.
Zemus/Zeromus - RAR I AM HAET.  1/10.

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death - Emo tree.  2/10
Gilgamesh - Punch clock villan.  Like with Rubicant, it seemed somewhat interesting at the time, also, was amusing.  Not wonderful, but it beats the crap presented thus far.  6/10.

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka - Hmmmm... on the one hand, treacherous minion who plotted and backstabbed his way into godhood... on the other hand, ate babies.  5/10.
Gestahl - Boring.  2/10.
Ultros - Less relevant and less interesting than Gilgamesh.  Likely more amusing though.  Eh.  5/10.

Talaysen

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #29 on: July 06, 2009, 09:20:03 PM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon - FF4/10
Cagnazzo - FF4/10
Valvalis - FF4/10
Rubicant - FF4/10
Golbez - FF4/10
Baigan - FF4/10
Zemus/Zeromus. - FF4/10

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death - tree/10
Gilgamesh - 7/10

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka - 6/10 - Uweehehehehe
Gestahl - 5/10
Ultros - 8/10 DON'T TEASE THE OCTOPUS KIDS

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #30 on: July 06, 2009, 09:51:33 PM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon 5/10
Cagnazzo 5/10
Valvalis 5/10
Rubicant 6/10
Golbez 5/10
Baigan 5/10
Zemus/Zeromus. 5/10

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death 6/10 extra point for being a tree at one point
Gilgamesh 7/10 amusing enough

Final Fantasy 6:
 
Kefka 8/10 Finally, a good villain
Gestahl 5/10 meh
Ultros  7/10 see Gilgamesh
 
 
 
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Dhyerwolf

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #31 on: July 06, 2009, 09:55:19 PM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon: 1/10
Cagnazzo: 2/10
Valvalis: 1/10
Rubicant: 5. Decent for what he is.
Golbez: I know he had some plot...but...
Baigan: 1/10
Zemus/Zeromus: 1. You know villains are bad when they are two distinct entities and are still grouped together
Write In: Kain: 1. You fail as a villain or a hero.

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death: Don't remember FF 5 enough
Gilgamesh: Ditto

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka: 8. I...well, I think Kefka is kind of horrible. Most of the time, all I really wanted to do was bash his face in. If this was a "How much do you like this villain," then Kefka would get a 0. But he was really, really effective, and certainly an effective hatable villain is definetely a good one, for all that not the type I even remotely like.
Gestahl: 4. I guess he at least somewhat fulfills a role successfully.
Ultros: Hmm, rating as a villain...4. Too irrelevant/out there to work really as a villain. A few points for humor. Opposite of Kefka in that he'd score a lot better if it was "How much do I like you?"
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SnowFire

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #32 on: July 06, 2009, 11:24:27 PM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon, Cagnazzo, Valvalis - 5(DNR?)/10.  They're all effective henchmen, but that's it.  Milon coming back from the dead was moderately badass for its time, and the fight is not bad if you don't notice that your party switched rows / how to switch back.
Rubicant - 6/10.  Honorable = heal you up for a good fight?  I guess.
Golbez - 3/10.  I hate 90% of mind control plots.  Gets minor points for being an early one, but meh.  Actually recovers points for the "Go to the Moon with FuSoYa to kick ass" plot point, I guess, but as a villain, meh.
Baigan - DNR.  The instruction manual says you'll betray me, so yeah.
Zemus/Zeromus - Zeemus isn't that bad.  Sure you find out about him way late but he mostly gets credit for Golbez's actions.  4/10, penalized a bit for little screentime.  Zeromus?  ....3/10.  The "I will always survive so long as hatred is in the hearts of men!" or whatever final speech wasn't bad, but that's all he has.  (And eh, since Zeromus is specifically Zeemus's hatred, Zeromus feels a notable step above Necron, who truly was out of nowhere.  He's more Cloud of Darkness level.)

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death - 4/10.  EVIL TREE.  Conflicted, since he wasn't bad as a presence villain (he does actively mess with your party and the world repeatedly), but his motivation was so incredibly "mwahaha" that it's hard to take him seriously.  Less personality than Kefka, too.
Gilgamesh - 6/10.  Passable.

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka - 9/10.  Actually not a member of the Kefka fanclub, but see Dhyerwolf.  He's a villain that inspires lots of hate which is good.  He also interacts with the entire plot, and is constantly at the battle lines messing with your party, something I respect.
Gestahl - 3/10.  I thought Gestahl was semi-serious with the peace treaty deal.  Making it just a ploy because RARGH KEFKA WAS RIGHT even though he's crazy...  bah, you just suck.
Ultros - 8/10.  Amusing comic relief.

Dark Holy Elf

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #33 on: July 07, 2009, 12:36:42 AM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon: 3/10. I kinda like the Fiends for some reason I can't justify.
Cagnazzo: 4/10.
Valvalis: 3/10.
Rubicant: 5/10. His honour stood out in a SNES game.
Golbez: 4/10. HAND OF FATE aside, he was pretty imposing when on the stage, just... eh.
Baigan: What the hell? DNR. Notably less plot than, say, Astos or Borghen or Vargas or Gigames/Garuda, none of which were worth ranking (and I agree with this).
Zemus/Zeromus: 1/10. See Tonfa.

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death: 2/10. I could never respect him at all for some reason. His lines in the remake helped. Oh well, cool theme song at least.
Gilgamesh: 8/10. Awesomeness at last!

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka: 8/10. I'm not a huge fan, but he's, like, the first RPG serious villain of any real worth whatsoever. So I bump up his score for that. One-liners are at least amusing, too.
Gestahl: 4/10. Better than the FF2 Emperor, but still same complaints apply.
Ultros: 9/10. Ultros is amazing. An octopus who jams up your opera and flies through the skies on a... pink... something. I don't think I can recall a single Ultros scene that didn't have me laughing. Well, maybe his opening scene, that was more crying. Still.


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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #34 on: July 07, 2009, 01:06:27 AM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon - 3/10 - Memorable enough, had a decent fight. Zombie bosses are cool in general. Very Resident Evil, you know?
Cagnazzo - 3/10 - Tempted to rank him lower as he wasn't memorable despite having a lot more direct influence in the plot.
Valvalis - 9/10 - Is apparently a lesbian. That's enough. Also, she is probably the most memorable fight in FF4 for me. She was pretty difficult when I was a kid...
Rubicant - 7/10 - I like the fiends. I really do. Rubicant healing you was awesome. Still wondering if he's wearing clothes under the mantle...
Golbez - 5/10 - NB4 'I'm your brother' twist was too common! Also, FF4 felt like a Star Wars homage anyway.
Baigan - 2/10 - He totally had me going with that 6th party member deal when I was a kid.
Zemus/Zeromus - 1/10 - Ugh. Hated this fight. Plot?! What plot?

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death - 6/10 - Worked as an ambiant villain.
Gilgamesh - 8/10 - Yes I liked his one-liners.

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka - 9/10 - Kefka fanboy and let's leave it at that. Extra-game material helps his case a lot, too.
Gestahl - 5/10 - He played Celes, Terra, and Leo well. The scene where Kefka fried him was also surprisingly potent.
Ultros - 8/10 - Damn you purple octopus, stop killing the old man! I really wish I knew anything about his motivation, though...
TUNNEL ARMOR - 99999/10 - Best plot villain ever!

Lance

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #35 on: July 07, 2009, 04:53:01 AM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon - 1/10. Shows up out of nowhere, gets his butt kicked, and falls off a cliff.
Cagnazzo - 3/10. Actually did something important, but the lack of plot hurts him a bit.
Valvalis - 3/10. She...helps Kain redeem himself? Yeah, sure, that counts for something.
Rubicant - 6/10. Gets a nice chunk of plot and does some pretty nefarious things, but he's not actually evil. Nice to see a villain with honor -- there aren't enough of those.
Golbez - 4/10. He was okay. Nothing special, but he wasn't notably bad.
Baigan - 1/10. Most obvious betrayal ever. (My group already has 5 members, dang it!)
Zemus/Zeromus - 2/10. Random incarnation of evil with no plot and no motivation aside from being...well, a random incarnation of evil. Gets an extra point for actually being a pretty cool fight.


Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death: "Ha ha ha ha! I shall now merge all the realities, thereby destroying them in the process and bringing about total annihilation! Ha ha ha ha!"
Heroes: "Okay. Um...why?"
X-Death: "Why?! Well...um...it's...I mean...because I'm evil, that's why! HA HA HA HA!!!1!1"
Yeah, no. You suck, tree. I hate you. 1/10

Gilgamesh - 5/10. Fairly competent lackey who manages to be both a threat and an entertaining comedy relief character at the same time. Not bad.


Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka - 9/10. Probably the first RPG villain to demonstrate a truly evil side that was both convincing and effective. He seriously made me uneasy when I was a kid. Even after all this time, he's still one of the best.
Gestahl - 3/10. Generic evil emperor #1347. Gets extra points for that bitchin' mustache.
Ultros - 1/10. Annoying and useless.

Dunefar

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #36 on: July 13, 2009, 01:43:00 AM »
I'm updating tonight or tomorrow. Get your votes in now!
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Luther Lansfeld

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #37 on: July 13, 2009, 02:32:12 AM »
Final Fantasy 4:

Milon- 1/10
Cagnazzo- 3/10
Valvalis- 3/10
Rubicant- 5/10
Golbez- 5/10
Baigan- DNR
Zemus/Zeromus- 1/10

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death- 6/10. He's pretty funny in FF5a.
Gilgamesh- 7/10. Sure.

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka- 3/10. Screw Kefka.
Gestahl- 5/10. Good at what he does; being an incompetent bastard.
Ultros- 7/10.
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Dunefar

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #38 on: July 13, 2009, 04:41:51 PM »
Notes/Clarifications:

Minimum score is a 1, zeros will be scaled up to 1.

Any non rank that doesn't say DNR will be treated as a no vote.  If you want to DNR do so by all means, as I'm erring on the side of being inclusive. Just make sure that you put DNR so I know what's up.

Write-ins are okay too. I'll include them if they get a fair few votes.

Results!

Final Fantasy 4:

Milon: 2.6, 15 rankers (3 DNRs)
Cagnazzo: 3.25, 16 rankers (2 DNRs)
Valvalis: 2.86, 15 rankers (3 DNRs)
Rubicant: 5.73, 17 rankers.
Golbez: 3.93, 16 rankers.
Baigan: DNR (2.2, 10 voters.)
Zemus/Zeromus: 1.88, 17 rankers.

Kain also got a single write in vote.

Final Fantasy 5:

X-Death: 3.5, 13 rankers.
Gilgamesh: 6.84, 13 rankers.

Final Fantasy 6:

Kefka: 6.67, 17 rankers.
Gestahl: 3.76, 17 rankers.
Ultros: 6.00, 16 rankers (1 DNR)

More coming in the next post.
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Dunefar

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #39 on: July 13, 2009, 05:04:22 PM »
Top ten highest ranked villains:
1. Gilgamesh: 6.84, 13 rankers.
2. Kefka: 6.67, 17 rankers.
3. Ultros: 6.00, 16 rankers (1 DNR)
4. Rubicant: 5.73, 17 rankers.
5. Garland/Chaos: 4.89, 14 rankers.
6. Leon: 4.33, 6 rankers.
7. Xande: 4.30, 10 rankers.
8. Golbez: 3.93, 16 rankers.
9. Gestahl: 3.76, 17 rankers.
10t. The Emperor: 3.50, 6 rankers.
10t. X-Death: 3.50, 13 rankers.

Top ten lowest ranked villains
1. Zemus/Zeromus: 1.88, 17 rankers.
2. Milon: 2.6, 15 rankers (3 DNRs)
3. Hein: 2.83/DNR, 6 rankers.
4. Valvalis: 2.86, 15 rankers (3 DNRs)
5. Cloud of Darkhess: 2.90, 10 rankers.
6. Cagnazzo: 3.25, 16 rankers (2 DNRs)
7t. The Emperor: 3.50, 6 rankers.
7t. X-Death: 3.50, 13 rankers.
9. Gestahl: 3.76, 17 rankers.
10. Golbez: 3.93, 16 rankers.

Den of Rejects:

Baigan: DNR (2.2, 10 voters.)

Failed Writeins:

Kain(1.0, 1 vote)
Tunnel Armor(10, 1 vote)

---

Not a bad group, we finally had a few interesting villians! Kefka cleaned up despite a few anti-votes and FF4 provided both low ranking fodder and our first DNR. Will it be the last? Remember, I'm being inclusive, so DNRs are fine. (Especially since I vet these through chat before posting them, and you know how chat is.)

Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra
Rufus
Heidigger
Scarlet
Sephiroth
Reno
Rude
Elena
Jenova
Tseng
Hojo
Palmer
Don Corneo

Final Fantasy 8:

Edea
Ultimecia
Seifer
Fujin
Raijin
Adel

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja
Brahne
Thorn/Zorn
Necron
Lani
Beatrix
Garland
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Dunefar

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #40 on: July 13, 2009, 05:15:55 PM »
Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra: 3/10. Gets a few points for his one big scene. He wasn't bad for what he was, but he had no time and was killed off early on.
Rufus: 6/10. Had style.
Heidigger: 2/10. Gasbag.
Scarlet: 2/10. Slappy bitch.
Sephiroth: 5/10. Yeah, he has issues, but he worked in the context of the game and in having style. I don't think Seph can be defended well in FF7, but I don't think he's trash, either.
Reno: 5/10. Vague apathy.
Rude: 5/10
Elena: 4/10: She irritated me a few times.
Jenova: 1/10. Bleh.
Tseng: DNR.
Hojo: 7/10 Creepy.
Palmer: DNR
Don Corneo: 2/10.

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja: 1/10. Emo. WAH LIFE ISN'T FAIR LET'S THROW A TEMPER TANTRUM AND KILL EVERYTHING WAAAAAAAAAAAH. Bitch please.
Brahne: 2/10. Sucked.
Thorn/Zorn: 2/10.
Necron: 1/10. Hi Zer-er, Necron. So how's shit hanging? Uh huh. Right. Gotcha.
Lani: 2/10.
Beatrix: DNR.
Garland: 4/10.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2009, 05:18:14 PM by Dunefar »
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Tonfa

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #41 on: July 13, 2009, 05:31:28 PM »
Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra: 2/10. Lamer.
Rufus: 8/10. I admit this is mostly on style,(and AC scoring some bonus points), but damn if he isn't one smooth criminal. Has the occasional utterly bizarre motivation (hey guys we TOTALLY NEED the Tiny Bronco) but that's more of a byproduct of FF7 writing.
Heidegger: 5/10. Gya ha ha. Memorable jerkface, even if there isn't much to him.
Scarlet: 3/10. Kya ha ha. Less memorable jerkface.
Sephiroth: 7/10. I just don't know. Mindrape at Northern Crater is very effective scene and he is a compelling driving force for the plot, as well as a memorable character, but it's just such a mess.
Reno: 8/10. Just a really likable guy doing his job, which happens to pit him on the opposing side most of the time.
Rude: 5/10. Needed to play off the other Turks, but doesn't leave an impression on his own.
Elena: 5/10. Again, plays off Reno well.
Jenova: DNR. Agh. No.
Tseng: 6/10. I like him. Damned if I can explain why though.
Hojo: 5/10. Creepy bastard, not much more to it.
Palmer: 6/10. aww yeah
Don Corneo: 7/10. Ultra-creepy bastard. His end was very satisfying, so Algus Principle applies.

Final Fantasy 8:

Edea: 2/10. Eh complete lack of caring.
Ultimecia: 2/10. Kokokokokokoko.
Seifer: 7/10. Hilariously inept.
Fujin: 8/10. Her GIMMICK was very amusing, and made the normal voice scene where she tells Seifer he's gone too far off the deep end very effective.
Raijin: 6/10. Needed to play off Fujin, but somewhat amusing in his own right as well.
Adel: 1/10. What the hell?

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja: 1/10. Go away emo kid.
Brahne: 2/10. Uh...a point for hatability? I dunno.
Thorn/Zorn: 2/10. That gimmick got old fast.
Necron: 1/10. hahahahahahahahahahaha
Lani: 2/10. Don't care.
Beatrix: 3/10. Don't care slightly less.
Garland: 5/10. Great presence for the short screentime he's given. Getting punked out by Kuja that easily was lame, though.
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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2009, 05:41:26 PM »
Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra: 2/10.  Pretty much fails.
Rufus: 5/10.  People act like he has more depth than he does; having played FF7 many times and looked at his exact scenes though? No, he was sincere in his speech, and the only time he really stands out is his one scene mid Disc 2 where he talks about how "people need a scape goat."  Beyond that, he's pretty much just...kind of there, as half his scenes are mostly him just saying "Good, lets follow Sephiroth...and Heideggar, STOP LAUGHING."  Not being a total moron doesn't hurt though.
Heidigger: 3/10. Token Fat annoying henchman.
Scarlet: 3/10. Token Seductive femael henchman.
Sephiroth: 7/10.  While he's one of the most overrated villains of all time...I'll give credit where its due at least.  He is one of the first villains with an actual sense of depth for the genre, and deserves props for that.  Furthermore, he has a certain sense of style about him, most notably the infamous Fire Walk, a scene I still think looks cool even in FF7's original outdated Graphics (Crisis Core just makes it look more awesome!)  Can't give him much higher than this beyond that though, at least not without delving into Crisis Core.
Reno: 7/10.  Generally amusing.
Rude: 6.5/10.  Like Reno, only less amusing.
Elena: 5/10. Least amusing of the 3 Turks, mostly gets this score based on association.
Jenova: DNR.  She's technically NOT IN FF7 AT ALL.  Her one line is a mistranslation that was actually said by Sephiroth, and otherwise, she's 100% Plot Device.  This remains true even in later games of the compilation!
Tseng: 3/10. I wanna give him more points for being generally neat in Crisis Core...but I can't based of FF7 proper.  He just sort of fails here.
Hojo: 3/10. I'm evil...FOR SCIENCE!!!! I SOOOOO wanna give him lower due to Dirge of Cerberus, but that isn't fair.
Palmer: 7/10. RATE HIKE RATE HIKE TRA LA LA!
Don Corneo: DNR.  Barely exists, for all that he's funny; this is scraping the barrel for FF7 villains.

Final Fantasy 8:

Edea: DNR.  The Edea as a villain is technically just Ultimecia, so she's more just a plot device than anything else.  Is this an odd reason to DNR?  Yes, but I just can't see rating her based on villain merits when half the game she was NOT a villain, and the other half, she pretty much plainly stated it was Ultimecia.
Ultimecia: 2/10.  Her entire backstory exists in...Ultimania?  Great writing there!  Outside of that?  One scene wonder behind the scenes villain who really wasn't effective at all, and could have been saved if they just spliced her character with Adel, which would have solved the backstory and motivation problems RIGHT THERE.  Pity I can't factor in Dissidia, where she'd get a somewhat higher score due to Style, and actually DOING SHIT.
Seifer: 6/10.  Seifer Clause was named after him for a reason.  He's pathetic, he's an ass, and what not...but that's why he exists.  You're SUPPOSE to face palm at his logic and go "Just what the hell is wrong with him?" so for that, he gets points.  However, he loses points for being completely unthreatening in every sense, which the SEifer Clause does *NOT* cover.
Fujin: 5/10.  RAGE!!!  That's mroe than most FF8 CHARACTERS can say, let alone villains...
Raijin: 4/10. See Fuijin, for the most part, without RAGE!!!, ya know?
Adel: 3/10.  Lots of the same issues as Jenova, except she's an actual character, less a random plot device dressed up as a character...by which I mean she has actual scenes where she's herself.  She would be lower...except she tried to EAT RINOA, which gets bonus points <_<

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja: 8/10.  Magnificent Bastard, when all is said and done.  He successfully played pretty much the entire world like a pawn, and the level of pride is staggering, so when he had that sudden massive break down, it was especially powerful.  The fact that he actually felt threatening, and believable?  Yeah.  
Brahne: 6/10.  A total tool...except the game actually painted her as that, so yeah, she worked for the role.
Thorn/Zorn: 5/10. I found them amusing, so they get the points purely for that, but as actual characters, they fail.
Necron: 1/10. FAIL.
Lani: 2/10.  Meh.
Beatrix: DNR.  Not really a villain as far as I'm concerned; more an Anti-villain who upgrades to ally.  You face her, but that's not enough for me in this case.  Why?  Cause its no different than calling WA2 Kanon or ToS Sheena villains, which I can't find myself doing.  The only difference is they're permanent PCs, but as far as role in the plot goes, they're identical; former enemies who ultimately join your side halfway into the story.
Garland: 4/10.  The guy who was controlling things by Kuja, but ultimately gets usurped by his own creations.  He could have been a lot better, but general lack of existing makes him pretty meh.  Memoria tried to save him, except he got absolutely nothing in the way of development there; just an ominous voice saying "This is what is going to happen!" to Zidane.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2009, 06:33:55 PM by Meeplelard »
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> so Snow...
[21:39] <+Mega_Mettaur> Sonic Chaos
[21:39] <+Hello-NewAgeHipsterDojimaDee> That's -brilliant-.

[17:02] <+Tengu_Man> Raven is a better comic relief PC than A

AAA

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2009, 06:20:17 PM »
Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra 5/10
Rufus 7/10
Heidigger 5/10
Scarlet 5/10
Sephiroth 7/10
Reno 7/10
Rude 5/10
Elena 5/10
Jenova 5/10
Tseng 5/10
Hojo 5/10
Palmer 7/10
Don Corneo 5/10

Final Fantasy 8:

Edea 5/10
Ultimecia 5/10
Seifer 7/10
Fujin 5/10
Raijin 5/10
Adel 5/10

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja 3/10 SHUT. UP.
Brahne 5/10
Thorn/Zorn 5/10
Necron 5/10
Lani 5/10
Beatrix 5/10
Garland 5/10
« Last Edit: July 13, 2009, 06:25:14 PM by AAA »
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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #44 on: July 13, 2009, 06:46:56 PM »
Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra 3/10
Rufus 6/10
Heidigger 4/10
Scarlet 4/10
Sephiroth 6/10
Reno 7/10
Rude 5/10
Elena 5/10
Jenova DNR
Tseng 6/10
Hojo 6/10 - The real main villain or something.
Palmer 4/10
Don Corneo 5/10


Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja 8/10
Brahne 6/10
Thorn/Zorn 4/10
Necron 3/10
Lani 3/10
Beatrix DNR
Garland 6/10
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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #45 on: July 13, 2009, 07:18:10 PM »
Quote
having played FF7 many times and looked at his exact scenes though? No, he was sincere in his speech

Apparently playing the game many times doesn't keep you from completely misinterpreting a scene many times.

I assume you're talking about the scene where he promises to rule the world with fear, and it's a lie. Seriously, look how popular he is later in the game (visit Junon, Kalm in particular). Either you view that as inconsistent writing, or of signs of him being a manipulator, and the latter view is supported by the tabs he keeps on your party (Cait Sith, obviously) throughout the game.

(If, incidentally, you're talking about a different speech, then ignore this rant.)

Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra: 5/10. Y'know what? While he did need more screentime badly, I have to give him at least an average score just for that scene where he watches the destruction of Sector 7 with classical music playing in the background. The guy had style.
Rufus: 8/10. Yeah, I like Rufus a lot. LOL TINY BRONCO aside, he comes accross as exceedingly competent, and a ruler ready to do what is needed to clean up the mess of Sephiroth and solidify his own empire. And I did like the scenes when he expresses his disgust at Heidegger; it seems he doesn't have absolute power and can't get rid of the guy like he'd want to.
Heidigger: 6/10. Memorable scumbag.
Scarlet: 3/10. Kinda tosses away her character worth in that slapping scene.
Sephiroth: 7/10. Eh, sure. The North Crater scenes are very effective. Suffers from the worst effects of FF7's writing and translation otherwise, but... good enough. When in doubt, go with Tonfa. Actually I'll largely be doing that the rest of the way, so...
Reno: 8/10. Is awesome.
Rude: 5/10. Plays off Reno well.
Elena: 5/10. Yep.
Jenova: Bleh. I dunno if this is a DNR or not, I'll think about it.
Tseng: 6/10.
Hojo: 3/10. I really didn't like how they tried to ninja him into this big important role suddenly at the end of Disc 2. Didn't think it worked well, and Hojo himself lacks the charisma needed for said role.
Palmer: 5/10.
Don Corneo: I hate Don Corneo more than 95% of RPG villains, but Tonfa is right. Mmm, abstain.

Final Fantasy 8:

Edea: 6/10. Had stage presence.
Ultimecia: 2/10. Didn't, really.
Seifer: Only has character worth if he's taken in an ironic fashion. I'm not sure if he should be or not? Though we did name the Seifer clause after him, yes. Eh, 5/10.
Fujin: 6/10. Above average for that scene where she drops her gimmick voice, was effective.
Raijin: 5/10.
Adel: 1/10. No.

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja: 9/10. Rant time! First of all, I hated Kuja for two discs (HI, I'M POWERFUL AND ARROGANT), but that doesn't matter since that's not what his character is about, it's all setup. It is about, yes, him being "emo". Except he isn't whining about how his life is pain, but a simple, believable fear of death, one of the most basic, primal motivations out there. This is why his arrogance is needed for his character; when he goes from believeing he is going to rule the world for all eternity to realising that no, he's about to die, it is completely crushing, and coupled with his greatly inflated view of himself, leads him to his logical conclusion that yes, it wouldn't be fair for others to exist without him. Very compelling, chillingly believable (given the implausible basic story of a person created to be a powerful living weapon), and had me buying in like few villains before or since.
Brahne: 3/10. ARROGANT AND ... okay, not so powerful ultimately. Last scene with Garnet may save her juuust a little, I dunno.
Thorn/Zorn: 2/10. They have awesome music.
Necron: 1/10. Zeromus is BACK.
Lani: 3/10. Uh huh.
Beatrix: 6/10. Had style, as a villain. (This score is a rating of her up until mid Disc 2.)
Garland: 6/10. Is named Garland, at least.


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ThePiggyman

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #46 on: July 13, 2009, 07:31:05 PM »
Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra - 3/10
Rufus - 10/10 - Fear-instilling among his population. An excellent president, better than his old man, anyways. Perfect for his role.
Heidigger - 4/10
Scarlet - 2/10
Sephiroth - 6/10
Reno - 9/10 - Sly, clever, but really in it for himself. Good stuff.
Rude - 8/10
Elena - 6/10
Jenova - 4/10
Tseng - 7.5/10
Hojo - 9/10 - Inspirationally crazy.
Palmer - 2/10
Don Corneo - DNR

Final Fantasy 8:

Edea - DNR
Ultimecia - 9/10 - Hey, she is a DEEP villain. Time Compression, childhood torment leading to borderline insanity. I like it. ;p
Seifer - 7/10
Fujin - 5/10
Raijin - 5/10
Adel - 2/10

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja - 2/10
Brahne - 2/10
Thorn/Zorn - DNR
Necron - 5/10
Lani - 4/10
Beatrix - DNR
Garland - 9/10 - The man with the plan.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2009, 05:24:54 PM by ThePiggyman »
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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #47 on: July 13, 2009, 08:10:02 PM »
Darn, should have weighed in on the last round.  Oh well, laziness won that round.

Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra- 5/10 not much to him, but that one scene at least ensures an averge rating.
Rufus- 7/10.  Interesting and works in his own right, but feels so completely overshadowed once he steps in.
Heidigger- 4/10.  Ehhhh, sucks but is supposed to suck.
Scarlet- 5/10.  As above, but more amusing in her way.
Sephiroth- 8/10.  No great shakes as a character but a powerful force as a villain.
Reno- 7/10
Rude- 5/10
Elena- 6/10.  I liked her own gun-ho nature getting her owned.
Jenova- 6/10.  In essence a backstory villain, but said backstory and her role in the story proper (that is, threatening bosses acting as Sephiroth's avatars) adds a lot to Sephiroth's "DESTROY EVERYTHING" credability, so worth at least some points.
Tseng- 3/10.  Screentime.  Get some.
Hojo- 7/10.  The realisation that this oddball, mumbly little mad scientist causes the entire game is worth a couple points over his otherwise bland, average rating.
Palmer- 5/10.  Can't give a sub-par score to someone that makes me smile, but not in the game enough to justify higher.
Don Corneo- DNR (5/10).  Feels too inconsequential to bother with (Palmer is at least part of Shinra, which as a whole is an enemy entity).  That said, self-aware joke character, so see Heiddegar.

Final Fantasy 8:

Edea- DNR (6/10).  Is Ultimecia, as a villain.
Ultimecia- 6/10.  So yeah, giving her credit for her stylish, effective stint as Edea.  Doesn't score higher though because realistically, she's only a force in the plot for less than a third of it (Disc 2, about two scenes in Disc 3...)
Seifer- 6/10.  another self-aware joke, but the best one so far.
Fujin- 5/10.  Has one neat scene, otherwise meh.
Raijin- 4/10.
Adel- 4/10.  Backstory villain... I dunno, without things like "genocided civilization as we know it" in that background it's hard to take her too seriously.  Although the fact that they BLEW HER INTO SPACE to get rid of her is kinda cool.

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja- 8/10.  Neat character, works very well.
Brahne- 3/10.  Well... she's frightening at least.
Thorn/Zorn- 2/10.  Incompetent lackeys, not really funny about it.
Necron- 1/10.  Sub-Zeromus.  At least HE had explicit backstory.
Lani- 3/10.  Almost a little threatening, kinda.
Beatrix- DNR (5/10).  I dunno, all her interesting traits are after her heel/face turn.  So, 5/10 as a villain just for being threatening.
Garland- 6/10.  Sets up the plot, works alright in the scenes he has, but too far into the background.
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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #48 on: July 13, 2009, 08:30:52 PM »
Final Fantasy 7:

President Shinra - 4/10
Rufus - 8/10 - Only Villain actively doing anything.
Heidigger - 3/10
Scarlet - 3/10
Sephiroth - 7/10 - Is somewhat good in places but fails in others.
Reno - 9/10 - Has Corneo killed and overall a likeable guy.
Rude - 5/10 - Doesn't exactly say much.
Elena - 6/10 - +1 for the punch to clouds face.
Jenova - 1/10 One of the worst villains.
Tseng 6/10 - +1 for somehow surviving a fatal blow by Sephiroth and then crawling all the way back to the entrance while suffering from blood loss.
Hojo - 7/10 - Effective for what he is but I hate him quite badly.
Palmer - 4/10 - Better then Heidigger at least.
Don Corneo - 3/10 - Scumbag.

Final Fantasy 8:

Edea - DNR
Ultimecia - 7/10 - While never on the scene herself she does enough.
Seifer - 4/10
Fujin 6/10
Raijin 3/10
Adel - 3/10

Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja - 8/10 - Effective.
Brahne 3/10 - Has nothing beyond being a idiot and evil.
Thorn/Zorn - 3/10
Necron - 1/10 - They should really just write something about this guy (Or is there something?). Some people seem to think he's Soul cage which would give him a higher score but thats unlikely.
Lani - 3/10
Beatrix - DNR
Garland - 7/10

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Re: Rate the bad guys! (Spoilers, duh.)
« Reply #49 on: July 13, 2009, 09:18:46 PM »
Final Fantasy 9:

Kuja - Conceptually sound, I suppose, but the execution failed to impress me.  3/10
Brahne - Completely uninteresting, but at least she did stuff.  2/10
Thorn/Zorn - Were there, but had cool music!  2/10
Necron - RAR I AM SPACE FLEA.  1/10
Lani - Was there.  1/10
Beatrix - Not really sure if I'd consider her a villain or not... leaning no, so DNR, I guess.
Garland - Failed to impress when he made an appearance.  2/10, I guess.